Cowards gear + ?

paul_j

Just wondering what everyone thinks of cowards gear. What sets have you been mixing with it? Any that are fun and effective?

Hexys

You can run this as a backbar set for stamina builds, most run a bow for the dodge roll speed but because this set actually gives you the speed already you could run like a resto staff for the amazing light's champion ultimate!

Biro123

Loving it at the mo on my baby stamplars defensive bar. Just paired with hundings simply because crafted is easier for sub-50

Will probably use 7th legion when levelled.

Araviel2

it does work rather well on supportive magica players too, as we all know how OP Major Protection can be on shields.
run it with Prisoners rags and you will be able to run around and shield stack all day.
if you are DW or sNb you can add infernal guardian too and you will be able to run around and do damage at the same time.

Soleya

+ Jailbreaker for the super speed running, not sure it's all that effective except maybe in CTF Battleground.

Grimhallow

I use cowards on my back-bar quite often, and I've found it to be a very flexible, fun set.

It's all the same 1-4 pc as Eternal Hunt, you just get speed and protection instead of a mine. If you work it into your play style it can be more useful than eternal hunt. It's also incredible to be able to catch up to horses in a way that roll dodge running just can't do.

paul_j

lol I just tried on fjords with cowards and it's absolutely hilarious

ezeepeezee

I'm running Shacklebreaker medium and CG on my Stam DK. It's really nice for repositioning and escaping, and it also serves as a gap closer (it's better than other gap closers because you have more control and get major protection in transit). I was using it with DW, but DW is completely lacking in the tools necessary to compete in PvP. So 2h it is. *sigh*

Anyway, it's a great set. Even paired with heavy armor it's good, but in 5-7 medium, you are super fast with it, and the regen is great. You'll probably want to pair it with a damage set - Hundings, Ravager, w/e.

Synozeer

Grimick wrote: »

I use cowards on my back-bar quite often, and I've found it to be a very flexible, fun set.

It's all the same 1-4 pc as Eternal Hunt, you just get speed and protection instead of a mine. If you work it into your play style it can be more useful than eternal hunt. It's also incredible to be able to catch up to horses in a way that roll dodge running just can't do.

Cowards has a health trait, Eternal has a stamina trait, and both have stam regen traits.

Grimhallow

Haha whoops. I didn't notice that! Exposed.

Mazbt

I like cowards gear with ravager. Cowards gear is on both bars and ravager is on my offensive as dw.

Thogard

I don't know why anyone would use cowards gear. If it were runspeed and proctection that STACKED with major expedition and major protection, it'd be nice... but it's five piece is crappy and already available from many sources. Use runspeed pots, dual wield quick cloak, bow and roll dodge, rapids, etc.

Araviel2

Thogard wrote: »

I don't know why anyone would use cowards gear. If it were runspeed and proctection that STACKED with major expedition and major protection, it'd be nice... but it's five piece is crappy and already available from many sources. Use runspeed pots, dual wield quick cloak, bow and roll dodge, rapids, etc.

Major Protection is not common, afaik the only other sources that are open for all is Pirate Skeleton (with a with a proc chance that is not ideal for all) and Resto staff lights champion ultimate.

nCats

It is one of the relatively few non-crafted stamina back bar sets. The only other useful which comes to mind is werewolf hide. I have my uses for it, paired with some heavy armor and a couple of well fitted traits. Gives mobility for those who lack it, makes it insane for those who have it.

I like Hexys's reasoning too, concerning the resto staff. Been thinking of trying it one day.

ezeepeezee

Thogard wrote: »

I don't know why anyone would use cowards gear. If it were runspeed and proctection that STACKED with major expedition and major protection, it'd be nice... but it's five piece is crappy and already available from many sources. Use runspeed pots, dual wield quick cloak, bow and roll dodge, rapids, etc.

Because it's all on-demand. You spend exactly 0 resources for the ability to reposition and hugely mitigate damage.

Thogard

ezeepeezee wrote: »

Thogard wrote: »

I don't know why anyone would use cowards gear. If it were runspeed and proctection that STACKED with major expedition and major protection, it'd be nice... but it's five piece is crappy and already available from many sources. Use runspeed pots, dual wield quick cloak, bow and roll dodge, rapids, etc.

Because it's all on-demand. You spend exactly 0 resources for the ability to reposition and hugely mitigate damage.

You're getting getting cowards gear mixed up with another set. Coward's gear doesn't decrease the cost of sprint.

Araviel2 wrote: »

Thogard wrote: »

I don't know why anyone would use cowards gear. If it were runspeed and proctection that STACKED with major expedition and major protection, it'd be nice... but it's five piece is crappy and already available from many sources. Use runspeed pots, dual wield quick cloak, bow and roll dodge, rapids, etc.

Major Protection is not common, afaik the only other sources that are open for all is Pirate Skeleton (with a with a proc chance that is not ideal for all) and Resto staff lights champion ultimate.

I guess it really depends on the context. I'm often times a flag runner in PC NA BGs for CTF. I tried this set out for exactly two runs before I realized it was crap. The again, I run speed pots 24/7, am an orc, and usually have at least two resto ults available in my group. And the times I need major protection the most are when we are trying to kill the enemy team that has our flag, not when I'm running back with their flag.

ezeepeezee

Thogard wrote: »

ezeepeezee wrote: »

Thogard wrote: »

I don't know why anyone would use cowards gear. If it were runspeed and proctection that STACKED with major expedition and major protection, it'd be nice... but it's five piece is crappy and already available from many sources. Use runspeed pots, dual wield quick cloak, bow and roll dodge, rapids, etc.

Because it's all on-demand. You spend exactly 0 resources for the ability to reposition and hugely mitigate damage.

You're getting getting cowards gear mixed up with another set. Coward's gear doesn't decrease the cost of sprint.

Araviel2 wrote: »

Thogard wrote: »

I don't know why anyone would use cowards gear. If it were runspeed and proctection that STACKED with major expedition and major protection, it'd be nice... but it's five piece is crappy and already available from many sources. Use runspeed pots, dual wield quick cloak, bow and roll dodge, rapids, etc.

Major Protection is not common, afaik the only other sources that are open for all is Pirate Skeleton (with a with a proc chance that is not ideal for all) and Resto staff lights champion ultimate.

I guess it really depends on the context. I'm often times a flag runner in PC NA BGs for CTF. I tried this set out for exactly two runs before I realized it was crap. The again, I run speed pots 24/7, am an orc, and usually have at least two resto ults available in my group. And the times I need major protection the most are when we are trying to kill the enemy team that has our flag, not when I'm running back with their flag.

It's not a set that's good for BGs, it's a set that's good for Cyrodiil. I didn't say it reduced the cost of sprinting, but as a stam player, unless you're a NB, sprinting is your only means of escape. CG improves upon it greatly.

geonsocal

paul_j wrote: »

lol I just tried on fjords with cowards and it's absolutely hilarious

couldn't wait to equip fiords legacy and coward's gear together on my stam sorc...

took me a while to stop running in to stuff...

in the end though, in regards to cyrodiil - i ended up spending more time running away than fighting

was definitely disappointed with the 30% damage mitigation...didn't really feel like it made much difference, plus - setup hit like a wet noodle...

great set up for farming resource nodes though...

Scyantific

Hexys wrote: »

You can run this as a backbar set for stamina builds, most run a bow for the dodge roll speed but because this set actually gives you the speed already you could run like a resto staff for the amazing light's champion ultimate!

Why tho, you also get major protection from Coward's gear.

Keep_Door

Low damage but pair it with darkstrider for super running fun.

Knootewoot

Coward gear + marksman is nice troll build. Shoot and run away. Also works with hawk eye for a bit more damage (and a little less regen)

Still, eternal is craftable and the traps are more annoying for pursuers imho.

Chilly-McFreeze

Scyantific wrote: »

Hexys wrote: »

You can run this as a backbar set for stamina builds, most run a bow for the dodge roll speed but because this set actually gives you the speed already you could run like a resto staff for the amazing light's champion ultimate!

Why tho, you also get major protection from Coward's gear.

Yes, I thought that too, and only when you are sprinting. Resto ult gives 5 (or 10?) sec mP while you can continue to deal damage + the heal. Problem is it's a smart heal, so you probably wont get the full heal when you are in a group.

I tired it on my stam sorc, it's okay but I dearly miss my poison injection. However, the resto HA allows me to streak/ dark deal more often. For what it's worth, the resto HA also doesn't break rune cage, if anyone uses that.
But when you run resto on back + DW on front, you could also get major expedition via quick cloak.

So the cowards set becomes somewhat redundant or at least situational. I'd rather go for impreg as a defensive set on my build.

Biro123

I see cowards as a combined defence(by repositioning) and sustain set. Just needs pairing with a damage set.

Araviel2

i am going to elaborate a little as i actually do think it is best as a magica hybrid set coupled with Prisoners rag.
as people stated here for stamina cowards gear does not really open up allot of new options, but for magica it does.
(and yes i am aware that cowards gear is medium armor, but can still be worked into a light armor setup with the help of jewelry and weapons)
and the 2 set bonus from the both sets allows us to experiment with alternative food such as ghastly eye bowls.
and because magica has wards we can work in more well fitted and reduce the sprint cost quite allot.

Prisoners rags gives a ton of magica sustain, it gives better sustain than lich with no cooldown but not used much on magica since sprinting with light armor is usually slow and too costly. however this combination gives us the speed we need and also a possible surplus of stamina regen that could be used for example stamina support skills like shuffle.

this setup is not going to have allot of max magica, but that is ok since wards will benefit from major protection.
and damage wise we will be alright as we will have more than enough sustain to run 3 spell dmg jewelry.
Keena could also be a option for a bursty hit and run play style.

MurderMostFoul

ezeepeezee wrote: »

Thogard wrote: »

ezeepeezee wrote: »

Thogard wrote: »

I don't know why anyone would use cowards gear. If it were runspeed and proctection that STACKED with major expedition and major protection, it'd be nice... but it's five piece is crappy and already available from many sources. Use runspeed pots, dual wield quick cloak, bow and roll dodge, rapids, etc.

Because it's all on-demand. You spend exactly 0 resources for the ability to reposition and hugely mitigate damage.

You're getting getting cowards gear mixed up with another set. Coward's gear doesn't decrease the cost of sprint.

Araviel2 wrote: »

Thogard wrote: »

I don't know why anyone would use cowards gear. If it were runspeed and proctection that STACKED with major expedition and major protection, it'd be nice... but it's five piece is crappy and already available from many sources. Use runspeed pots, dual wield quick cloak, bow and roll dodge, rapids, etc.

Major Protection is not common, afaik the only other sources that are open for all is Pirate Skeleton (with a with a proc chance that is not ideal for all) and Resto staff lights champion ultimate.

I guess it really depends on the context. I'm often times a flag runner in PC NA BGs for CTF. I tried this set out for exactly two runs before I realized it was crap. The again, I run speed pots 24/7, am an orc, and usually have at least two resto ults available in my group. And the times I need major protection the most are when we are trying to kill the enemy team that has our flag, not when I'm running back with their flag.

It's not a set that's good for BGs, it's a set that's good for Cyrodiil. I didn't say it reduced the cost of sprinting, but as a stam player, unless you're a NB, sprinting is your only means of escape. CG improves upon it greatly.

I like it for BGs as well. And you're spot on. Especially for Stamplar, this set creates a viable escape option that the class otherwise lacks. The gap closer function is nice too if you are running DW.

Xsorus

I might be running this set with my full Well fitted Impregnable set next patch on my Stamina Sorc after viper is nerfed.

Haven't decided on it yet....

Could pair it the same way on a Templar which would be interesting.

MaximillianDiE

Xsorus wrote: »

I might be running this set with my full Well fitted Impregnable set next patch on my Stamina Sorc after viper is nerfed.

Haven't decided on it yet....

Could pair it the same way on a Templar which would be interesting.

I like running it in a small group as a stam dk (and its still pretty good in larger groups) as it gives me the ability to run medium armor damage spec with a certain amount of survivabilty as well as giving me the mobility I otherwise lack to reposition when I need to and to get out of trouble when the inevitable gank attempt comes or if I get caught overextending. The two stam regen stats are the icing on the cake for sustain as well. It works quite well on stamplar when paired with a set like ravagers too.

Minno

Araviel2 wrote: »

i am going to elaborate a little as i actually do think it is best as a magica hybrid set coupled with Prisoners rag.
as people stated here for stamina cowards gear does not really open up allot of new options, but for magica it does.
(and yes i am aware that cowards gear is medium armor, but can still be worked into a light armor setup with the help of jewelry and weapons)
and the 2 set bonus from the both sets allows us to experiment with alternative food such as ghastly eye bowls.
and because magica has wards we can work in more well fitted and reduce the sprint cost quite allot.

Prisoners rags gives a ton of magica sustain, it gives better sustain than lich with no cooldown but not used much on magica since sprinting with light armor is usually slow and too costly. however this combination gives us the speed we need and also a possible surplus of stamina regen that could be used for example stamina support skills like shuffle.

this setup is not going to have allot of max magica, but that is ok since wards will benefit from major protection.
and damage wise we will be alright as we will have more than enough sustain to run 3 spell dmg jewelry.
Keena could also be a option for a bursty hit and run play style.

Prisoner set must be in jewels+weapons in order to make up for the lack of mag stats in the 1-5 pieces (it comes with arcane traits). Then run heavy shackle for extra stats+Regen or kags for the extra SD+health.

Otherwise prisoner is lackluster as a LA set; you die too quick to make effective pvp use use of the shift-click Regen despite having extra mag, crit chance, pen and recovery for running LA.

At least in HA you can trigger shift in between combos to Regen some mag while still being alive(shift will lock you out of Stam Regen and skills).

Araviel2

Minno wrote: »

Araviel2 wrote: »

i am going to elaborate a little as i actually do think it is best as a magica hybrid set coupled with Prisoners rag.
as people stated here for stamina cowards gear does not really open up allot of new options, but for magica it does.
(and yes i am aware that cowards gear is medium armor, but can still be worked into a light armor setup with the help of jewelry and weapons)
and the 2 set bonus from the both sets allows us to experiment with alternative food such as ghastly eye bowls.
and because magica has wards we can work in more well fitted and reduce the sprint cost quite allot.

Prisoners rags gives a ton of magica sustain, it gives better sustain than lich with no cooldown but not used much on magica since sprinting with light armor is usually slow and too costly. however this combination gives us the speed we need and also a possible surplus of stamina regen that could be used for example stamina support skills like shuffle.

this setup is not going to have allot of max magica, but that is ok since wards will benefit from major protection.
and damage wise we will be alright as we will have more than enough sustain to run 3 spell dmg jewelry.
Keena could also be a option for a bursty hit and run play style.

Prisoner set must be in jewels+weapons in order to make up for the lack of mag stats in the 1-5 pieces (it comes with arcane traits). Then run heavy shackle for extra stats+Regen or kags for the extra SD+health.

Otherwise prisoner is lackluster as a LA set; you die too quick to make effective pvp use use of the shift-click Regen despite having extra mag, crit chance, pen and recovery for running LA.

At least in HA you can trigger shift in between combos to Regen some mag while still being alive(shift will lock you out of Stam Regen and skills).

yea i think Prisoners + heavy shackle is ok. i know several good stam sorcs who runs that well.
but i was not really talking about prisoners here but cowards gear.
if we should go in on Prisoners gears specific i have allot of other things to say, and i completely agree that it is a lackluster set mainly for reasons i already stated, but also for others like you say.
and normally prisoners is not a set someone should run for their primary resources and better utilized for stamina players who use allot magica utility.
something someone can do to circumvent the issue with having skills locked while sprinting though is using the bunny hop technique where you jump to keep momentum and activate skills while in the air.
but you want to use it as a magica player then prisoners only really works well if you adapt it to a hit and run playstyle, and that playstyle unless you run cowards gear is really only a option for Sorcs.
Running it with heavy armor as you suggest and you will have to rely on regen allot more as you will not have the damage to bring down targets before your magica pool is out. (edit: maybe the new mundos stones in the next patch could make it an option)

for the example with cowards gear i was talking about we have to use 3 pieces of cowards gear jewels that only comes in Robust, and they way we have to compensate for the lack of max magica then is by using 2 stat food + the mage mundos.
and still we are not going have allot of it, but that´s where the hit and run playstyle comes in that we can unlock with cowards gear, note that this is absolutely not something someone should bring to a duel.

Minno

Araviel2 wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

Araviel2 wrote: »

i am going to elaborate a little as i actually do think it is best as a magica hybrid set coupled with Prisoners rag.
as people stated here for stamina cowards gear does not really open up allot of new options, but for magica it does.
(and yes i am aware that cowards gear is medium armor, but can still be worked into a light armor setup with the help of jewelry and weapons)
and the 2 set bonus from the both sets allows us to experiment with alternative food such as ghastly eye bowls.
and because magica has wards we can work in more well fitted and reduce the sprint cost quite allot.

Prisoners rags gives a ton of magica sustain, it gives better sustain than lich with no cooldown but not used much on magica since sprinting with light armor is usually slow and too costly. however this combination gives us the speed we need and also a possible surplus of stamina regen that could be used for example stamina support skills like shuffle.

this setup is not going to have allot of max magica, but that is ok since wards will benefit from major protection.
and damage wise we will be alright as we will have more than enough sustain to run 3 spell dmg jewelry.
Keena could also be a option for a bursty hit and run play style.

Prisoner set must be in jewels+weapons in order to make up for the lack of mag stats in the 1-5 pieces (it comes with arcane traits). Then run heavy shackle for extra stats+Regen or kags for the extra SD+health.

Otherwise prisoner is lackluster as a LA set; you die too quick to make effective pvp use use of the shift-click Regen despite having extra mag, crit chance, pen and recovery for running LA.

At least in HA you can trigger shift in between combos to Regen some mag while still being alive(shift will lock you out of Stam Regen and skills).

yea i think Prisoners + heavy shackle is ok. i know several good stam sorcs who runs that well.
but i was not really talking about prisoners here but cowards gear.
if we should go in on Prisoners gears specific i have allot of other things to say, and i completely agree that it is a lackluster set mainly for reasons i already stated, but also for others like you say.
and normally prisoners is not a set someone should run for their primary resources and better utilized for stamina players who use allot magica utility.
something someone can do to circumvent the issue with having skills locked while sprinting though is using the bunny hop technique where you jump to keep momentum and activate skills while in the air.
but you want to use it as a magica player then prisoners only really works well if you adapt it to a hit and run playstyle, and that playstyle unless you run cowards gear is really only a option for Sorcs.
Running it with heavy armor as you suggest and you will have to rely on regen allot more as you will not have the damage to bring down targets before your magica pool is out. (edit: maybe the new mundos stones in the next patch could make it an option)

for the example with cowards gear i was talking about we have to use 3 pieces of cowards gear jewels that only comes in Robust, and they way we have to compensate for the lack of max magica then is by using 2 stat food + the mage mundos.
and still we are not going have allot of it, but that´s where the hit and run playstyle comes in that we can unlock with cowards gear, note that this is absolutely not something someone should bring to a duel.

Yea but where prisoners excels for mag builds over Stam, is in the jewels traits and the fact prisoners isn't Regen but return. So a passive like windrunner will give you 10% extra mag recovery on Sprint with 983 mag return you get for holding shift. It takes more management than anything, because prisoners procs regardless if you move or not (due to the way sprint works). If you front bar prisoners, you can add mag return combos (LA-skill-LA-skill-Shift run to Target). So if that Sprint took 3 seconds, you got around 3k mag for 600 Stam. And with the way Stam Regen works, that Sprint could have costed nothing since in 2 seconds you'll get 1k Stam back. Of course this only works if you don't use agap closer and you need to survive longer than a few seconds in order to make use of the return. It just needs a snare immunity stat or the max Stam replaced with mag , health or resistances.

Cowards, felt like it burned stamina in exchange for protection and speed. Stats that seem to work for Stam players looking to replace dodge roll.

MaximillianDiE

Minno wrote: »

Araviel2 wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

Araviel2 wrote: »

i am going to elaborate a little as i actually do think it is best as a magica hybrid set coupled with Prisoners rag.
as people stated here for stamina cowards gear does not really open up allot of new options, but for magica it does.
(and yes i am aware that cowards gear is medium armor, but can still be worked into a light armor setup with the help of jewelry and weapons)
and the 2 set bonus from the both sets allows us to experiment with alternative food such as ghastly eye bowls.
and because magica has wards we can work in more well fitted and reduce the sprint cost quite allot.

Prisoners rags gives a ton of magica sustain, it gives better sustain than lich with no cooldown but not used much on magica since sprinting with light armor is usually slow and too costly. however this combination gives us the speed we need and also a possible surplus of stamina regen that could be used for example stamina support skills like shuffle.

this setup is not going to have allot of max magica, but that is ok since wards will benefit from major protection.
and damage wise we will be alright as we will have more than enough sustain to run 3 spell dmg jewelry.
Keena could also be a option for a bursty hit and run play style.

Prisoner set must be in jewels+weapons in order to make up for the lack of mag stats in the 1-5 pieces (it comes with arcane traits). Then run heavy shackle for extra stats+Regen or kags for the extra SD+health.

Otherwise prisoner is lackluster as a LA set; you die too quick to make effective pvp use use of the shift-click Regen despite having extra mag, crit chance, pen and recovery for running LA.

At least in HA you can trigger shift in between combos to Regen some mag while still being alive(shift will lock you out of Stam Regen and skills).

yea i think Prisoners + heavy shackle is ok. i know several good stam sorcs who runs that well.
but i was not really talking about prisoners here but cowards gear.
if we should go in on Prisoners gears specific i have allot of other things to say, and i completely agree that it is a lackluster set mainly for reasons i already stated, but also for others like you say.
and normally prisoners is not a set someone should run for their primary resources and better utilized for stamina players who use allot magica utility.
something someone can do to circumvent the issue with having skills locked while sprinting though is using the bunny hop technique where you jump to keep momentum and activate skills while in the air.
but you want to use it as a magica player then prisoners only really works well if you adapt it to a hit and run playstyle, and that playstyle unless you run cowards gear is really only a option for Sorcs.
Running it with heavy armor as you suggest and you will have to rely on regen allot more as you will not have the damage to bring down targets before your magica pool is out. (edit: maybe the new mundos stones in the next patch could make it an option)

for the example with cowards gear i was talking about we have to use 3 pieces of cowards gear jewels that only comes in Robust, and they way we have to compensate for the lack of max magica then is by using 2 stat food + the mage mundos.
and still we are not going have allot of it, but that´s where the hit and run playstyle comes in that we can unlock with cowards gear, note that this is absolutely not something someone should bring to a duel.

Yea but where prisoners excels for mag builds over Stam, is in the jewels traits and the fact prisoners isn't Regen but return. So a passive like windrunner will give you 10% extra mag recovery on Sprint with 983 mag return you get for holding shift. It takes more management than anything, because prisoners procs regardless if you move or not (due to the way sprint works). If you front bar prisoners, you can add mag return combos (LA-skill-LA-skill-Shift run to Target). So if that Sprint took 3 seconds, you got around 3k mag for 600 Stam. And with the way Stam Regen works, that Sprint could have costed nothing since in 2 seconds you'll get 1k Stam back. Of course this only works if you don't use agap closer and you need to survive longer than a few seconds in order to make use of the return. It just needs a snare immunity stat or the max Stam replaced with mag , health or resistances.

Cowards, felt like it burned stamina in exchange for protection and speed. Stats that seem to work for Stam players looking to replace dodge roll.

It gives you a chance of running out of range of the constant flocks of birds flying at you from every orifice of a pursing zerg too in this meta if there is no LoS easily available.