because zos dont git it.

Ep1kMalware

YOU kill build diversity with all your freaking nerfs? Want diversity? Give options. Wonder why every stam dps runs spriggans or tfs? Here's some options. Change the *** vma mace nobody will ever use so it works like daggers or axes. add in a medium armour passive for penetration.

???

Hundreds of new builds overnight.

idk

Zos already started homogenizing skills last update, continued this update. The devs have turned their back on build diversity.

Malic

I'm convinced, what a compelling argument.

Ep1kMalware

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

Zos already started homogenizing skills last update, continued this update. The devs have turned their back on build diversity.

Yup. But hey they nerfed bsw for the sake of 'diversity'. cuz zos logic is to take options away instead of give choices. They nerfed heals in the name of build diversity (or warden) but failed to offer diversity by expanding on major defile.

Volrion

I used to love theory crafting... Now I feel more pigeon-holed than ever.

It's getting boring.

Ep1kMalware

Volrion wrote: »

I used to love theory crafting... Now I feel more pigeon-holed than ever.

It's getting boring.

Hell yeh. I'd love to make leviathan viable.

Yolokin_Swagonborn

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

Zos already started homogenizing skills last update, continued this update. The devs have turned their back on build diversity.

I clicked agree. then saw the username and had to do a double take. This is a momentous occasion.

Sigma957

Well you can go against the norm and build something uniquely your own with so many sets out there to choose from

Zvorgin

Sigma957 wrote: »

Well you can go against the norm and build something uniquely your own with so many sets out there to choose from

And 95% of those builds are complete crap like the sets they use.

Turelus

I figured it out... Ep1kMalware is actually WannaCry.

leepalmer95

Zvorgin wrote: »

Sigma957 wrote: »

Well you can go against the norm and build something uniquely your own with so many sets out there to choose from

And 95% of those builds are complete crap like the sets they use.

Yes those builds can do 95% of pve content because its easy.

What exactly do you want with diversity? For end game pve? There will always be Best in slot gear and builds there because its competitive and actually difficult and numbers matter there.

For everything else you can run around naked and do.

Juhasow

Ep1kMalware wrote: »

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

Zos already started homogenizing skills last update, continued this update. The devs have turned their back on build diversity.

Yup. But hey they nerfed bsw for the sake of 'diversity'. cuz zos logic is to take options away instead of give choices. They nerfed heals in the name of build diversity (or warden) but failed to offer diversity by expanding on major defile.

Well They actually gaved diversity. Previously everyone was running BSW. Now You can choose between BSW, silk of sun , Julianos , scathing mage , war maiden, spinner , master architect , moondancer etc because gaps between sets are not that high and new cp distribution allows to create unique build for every class other then same set same CP's for every class (excluding pet sorc) like we had in Homestead. Nerf of BSW is on place.

Doctordarkspawn

We told them, they didn't lisen.

Pull support for the game and get as many to do the same as possible. They only care about the bottom line. Make them care about the loss.

Doctordarkspawn

Sigma957 wrote: »

Well you can go against the norm and build something uniquely your own with so many sets out there to choose from

Most of those outright wont work. Would last update, wont now.

Ep1kMalware

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

We told them, they didn't lisen.

Pull support for the game and get as many to do the same as possible. They only care about the bottom line. Make them care about the loss.

Thats the only potential plus to morrowind.

Narvuntien

BSW nerf created build diversity. Therefore your statment that nerfs don't create build diversity is incorrect.

The correct nerfs can produce diversity.

vamp_emily

I think their solution to lag is:

1: Make everyone use heavy attacks ( reducing information traveling from server to clients )
2. Nerf everything so nobody wants to play

I know it has only been one day, but yesterday was a very bad day for me. I died a little over 20 times and I got a few kills but that was just because I hit them with a siege.

I understand some players had over the top builds before the update, but players like me that only had average builds got ripped to pieces. All my poor little mag NBs are trash now, hate to even look at my templar healers.

Qbiken

Diversity is created by the player, not by ZOS. But at the same time there´s no logic in nerfing stuff just because it´s considered BiS atm.

vyndral13preub18_ESO

Qbiken wrote: »

Diversity is created by the player, not by ZOS. But at the same time there´s no logic in nerfing stuff just because it´s considered BiS atm.

That is the problem. You cant create build diversity. Because something will always be best. And those that want to be 'best' will spend the time getting that set. Then it will get nerfed because statics show that whatever set is being worn by a large percentage of the player base. And the circle continues.

Galwylin

At some point, we've got to accept that diversity is frowned upon. Its hard to balance for one thing. That tells you enough that its going to be discouraged. Its a selling point. A slogan. Wasn't it Wrobel talking about morph or something in the last Live and said "if you make the right choice"? That's your diversity. The right and wrong choices.

Nutshotz

Tbh maybe they should get their ass' s in game and play end game pvp and pve with the *** show they gave us and say well maybe we *** up with the nerfs to this and that and the rework to the CP system which is complete trash when in fact they should of done 2 separate systems. One for pve and one for pvp. People say this is balanced. How ? Cuz we can kill other players easier? More likely the streamers were butt hurt that they couldn't kill certain builds / players last patch so they call for nerfs to this and that. Gtfo with that ***. If you can't beat a certain player figure out that build and it's weakness and branch from there. Don't go and ruin the game for thousands of players so that the streamers can now kill people again.

Rant over on that part.

As for diversity that went out the window when they keep nerfing gear instead of buffing gear to be on par with other gear. That's my PoV

Zvorgin

With increased cost to blocking they should bring back Stam regeneration while blocking. Stamina builds have no chance without the ability to block consistently.

necronomniconb14_ESO

Ep1kMalware wrote: »

Volrion wrote: »

I used to love theory crafting... Now I feel more pigeon-holed than ever.

It's getting boring.

Hell yeh. I'd love to make leviathan viable.

defilers makes leviathan potentially useful if you don't craft night mother or hunding in it's place. or use viper for melee

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

Zos already started homogenizing skills last update, continued this update. The devs have turned their back on build diversity.

I clicked agree. then saw the username and had to do a double take. This is a momentous occasion.

Since there is almost as skimpy an amount of ignore space on the forums as in the game I decided to take him off of the list after that comment.

Juhasow wrote: »

Ep1kMalware wrote: »

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

Zos already started homogenizing skills last update, continued this update. The devs have turned their back on build diversity.

Yup. But hey they nerfed bsw for the sake of 'diversity'. cuz zos logic is to take options away instead of give choices. They nerfed heals in the name of build diversity (or warden) but failed to offer diversity by expanding on major defile.

Well They actually gaved diversity. Previously everyone was running BSW. Now You can choose between BSW, silk of sun , Julianos , scathing mage , war maiden, spinner , master architect , moondancer etc because gaps between sets are not that high and new cp distribution allows to create unique build for every class other then same set same CP's for every class (excluding pet sorc) like we had in Homestead. Nerf of BSW is on place.

spotted an unfamiliar shill


And Final fantasy 14 generally improves things, it doesn't nerf everything into oblivion it makes other classes and builds up to par to make other things equally appealing to encourage diversity. And diversity is good, we all know we want more diversity. Well guess what? Zyngamax is opposed to diversity, and idk about where you guys live but where I live people dislike people who are afraid of diversity. They're generally not good people.

Zvorgin wrote: »

With increased cost to blocking they should bring back Stam regeneration while blocking. Stamina builds have no chance without the ability to block consistently.

Just stop blocking. Blame it on the healer if you die. It will start a chain reaction of blame and frustration that can trend if the players are lucky since it will eventually force zynga's hand on lightening up a little with their discriminatory patches. Resentment and distrust cna lead to a chatoic environment that is unpleasant for everyone, which leads to some quitting and to antisocial behaviors which would make it in zyngamax's best interest to appease the playerbase. That's how you force change from even the most stubborn of dinos. You leave them no choice in the matter if they wish to have anything left to profiteer.

Rohamad_Ali

They had somethings going when they changed some sets to include majika versions of wpn or spell dmg . Some of the sets they added have mixed stats as well . Then they nerfed the trainees set because of too many resources and have been over cautious ever since . I don't know their exact process for creating new sets but I sure would like to . It needs to be done with each class and the three main possible builds in mind . Magic , Stam or hybrid and should have a selling point with five piece for at least two of the three for good balance .

Silver_Strider

I'd argue the game is more diverse now than before.

Magic builds have more diversity than just BSW now, depending on class, and non Templar Healers can now actually compete somewhat better with Orbs offering stamina.

This is more a rant about lack of diversity on Stamina builds, which is very true but that's mostly due to a lack of skills that are viable for use, which could be easily remedied but ZOS is a stubborn lot. Just adding more stamina morphs to class skills would help greatly. The same can be said for Non DK Tanks in general having a lack of tools within their class toolkits to be overly effective. So many dead skills that can be altered for the benefit of Stamina builds and Tanks that it's really shocking to see them go to waste.

In truth, I feel penetration as a stat is overperforming in general and should be looked at (Yes I'm saying to nerf it). Currently, there is a plethora of ways to reduce mitigation (Both Minor and Major Fracture/Breech, Sharpened Trait, Alkosh and other sets, passives) and considering that this exponentially increases your damage more than any other method I'm not sure why it's even allowed to be as high as it is. I mean, let's face it, when the difference between a Sharpened sword and a Precise sword is greater than a 5% decrease in DPS, there is clearly something wrong. Toning down penetration would also lower damage as a whole, which would do much more to tone down the power creep than this sustain nerf ever could.

Next, NERF THE EVER LIVING S*** OUT OF PROC SETS. Free damage via doing NOTHING is beyond busted and should be eviscerated to a point that they become extremely niche for those *** out builds that require the heavens themselves to be in perfect alignment to work. Proc sets that increase your weapon/spell damage, provide a healing benefit or other such benefit aren't a problem but the Proc sets that give guaranteed damage for doing minimal work involved are just awful and ZOS does seem to understand this, to an extent (Nerfing Defiler from 9999 damage to 6000? is a clear sign of that) but clearly don't see them as problematic as what they truly are.

Finally, Poisons need to be adjusted as well as the new Siphoner CP and buffed Defile CP. Reduce Poisons to 15% instead of 30%, reduce Siphoner to 5% instead of 15% and reduce Defiler down to 25%. I mean seriously, people at ZOS must be on some REALLY good s*** for this to even be seen as remotely balanced.

Ep1kMalware

Silver_Strider wrote: »

I'd argue the game is more diverse now than before.

Magic builds have more diversity than just BSW now, depending on class, and non Templar Healers can now actually compete somewhat better with Orbs offering stamina.

This is more a rant about lack of diversity on Stamina builds, which is very true but that's mostly due to a lack of skills that are viable for use, which could be easily remedied but ZOS is a stubborn lot. Just adding more stamina morphs to class skills would help greatly. The same can be said for Non DK Tanks in general having a lack of tools within their class toolkits to be overly effective. So many dead skills that can be altered for the benefit of Stamina builds and Tanks that it's really shocking to see them go to waste.

In truth, I feel penetration as a stat is overperforming in general and should be looked at (Yes I'm saying to nerf it). Currently, there is a plethora of ways to reduce mitigation (Both Minor and Major Fracture/Breech, Sharpened Trait, Alkosh and other sets, passives) and considering that this exponentially increases your damage more than any other method I'm not sure why it's even allowed to be as high as it is. I mean, let's face it, when the difference between a Sharpened sword and a Precise sword is greater than a 5% decrease in DPS, there is clearly something wrong. Toning down penetration would also lower damage as a whole, which would do much more to tone down the power creep than this sustain nerf ever could.

Next, NERF THE EVER LIVING S*** OUT OF PROC SETS. Free damage via doing NOTHING is beyond busted and should be eviscerated to a point that they become extremely niche for those *** out builds that require the heavens themselves to be in perfect alignment to work. Proc sets that increase your weapon/spell damage, provide a healing benefit or other such benefit aren't a problem but the Proc sets that give guaranteed damage for doing minimal work involved are just awful and ZOS does seem to understand this, to an extent (Nerfing Defiler from 9999 damage to 6000? is a clear sign of that) but clearly don't see them as problematic as what they truly are.

Finally, Poisons need to be adjusted as well as the new Siphoner CP and buffed Defile CP. Reduce Poisons to 15% instead of 30%, reduce Siphoner to 5% instead of 15% and reduce Defiler down to 25%. I mean seriously, people at ZOS must be on some REALLY good s*** for this to even be seen as remotely balanced.

I don't think it's overperforming, I think it's too mandatory. remember mag classes aquire a huge chunk of their pen from light armour passive, stamina does not. So it becomes very, very important inthe decision you make with your 5 piece item sets. Magica dps, they jist get that inhouse.mleaving room for sets like bsw/scathing mage, etc.

Now remember that dw passive? Twin blade and blunt? That doesn't give flat penetration, it gives a %. That percent may ot may not be helpful considering the circumstance ane I think it only gives you a maximum of 3600 pen anyway so you'd still need sharp weps. I could use sharpened leki's dw maces amd easilly hit 33k dpw on my templar. But I could use other choices to get higher dps AS LONG AS I WEAR SPRIGGANS OR TFS.

Is tfs over performing? Hell no! I HAVE to weae tfs because there are just no other ways to claim that buff through a passive, like light armour provides. If you mag classes did not have that passive you would all be wearing spinners. Would spinners be overperforming because you suddenly had a passive taken away? HELL NO. Then what if spinners was taken awy because everyone was using it?

Zos is eliminating competition im builds by systematically taking options away. Creating fewer choicers to get tomwhere you were. I am stating that for stam to have diversity we need the pemetration buff to not come from our gear, so that we can add sustain or other sets. Leviathan would be an amaaing set IF I DID NOT NEED TO WEAR SPRIGGANS OR TFS. Hellm I could wear tfs anyway and run precise dw if that were the case. Vma farm hell solved! 2-3 more viable choices in weapon traits right ofbthe batt. Hell add magnus in. There would be so many more ways to be where you are at now.

Saying nerfs give diversity is like saying *** gave diversity after nerfing the jews. Classes need to be on a level playingfield, and yes sometimes it needs buffs. But when the playing field is tilted sometimes you need to lift thenlower side rather than lower the upper half, as that just progressively lowers everything as a whole.

kratier

i agree as stam blade, there is no viability for diverse builds. there is no survivability

MLGProPlayer

Volrion wrote: »

I used to love theory crafting... Now I feel more pigeon-holed than ever.

It's getting boring.

Theory crafting doesn't really exist in any RPG. There is always a single best build.

As long as stats are numerical, there will be a combination of stats that outperform all others.

starkerealm

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

We told them, they didn't lisen.

Pull support for the game and get as many to do the same as possible. They only care about the bottom line. Make them care about the loss.

This is the thing that cracks me up about the guys in the, "burn it all down," crowd.

Angry poster: "I hate what Morrowind has done to the game!"

Happy or ambivalent poster: "Okay."

Angry poster: "I'm not going to support them anymore!'

Other posters: "kay, whatever."

Angry poster: "You should stop too, because I don't like this release."

Other posters: "Shut up, dude. Please. We've got a game here to play."

S1ipperyJim

Juhasow wrote: »

Well They actually gaved diversity. Previously everyone was running BSW. Now You can choose between BSW, silk of sun , Julianos , scathing mage , war maiden, spinner , master architect , moondancer etc because gaps between sets are not that high and new cp distribution allows to create unique build for every class other then same set same CP's for every class

When it comes to DPS which is arguably the role 90% of players choose, there will only ever be 1-2 best in slot meta sets for Magicka and 1-2 best in slots for stamina by definition.

The exception being role players and people who are new and don't know anything about the game.

It doesn't matter whether ZOS nerf one set or the other to make another set BIS, even if it's only slightly different people will work it out and pass on the meta and you will not increase build diversity at all. Especially when abilities scale of either max magicka or stamina pool.

The only thing close to build diversity is that forced upon us due to rarity or difficulty of obtaining BIS sets.

Vapirko

vamp_emily wrote: »

I think their solution to lag is:

1: Make everyone use heavy attacks ( reducing information traveling from server to clients )
2. Nerf everything so nobody wants to play

I know it has only been one day, but yesterday was a very bad day for me. I died a little over 20 times and I got a few kills but that was just because I hit them with a siege.

I understand some players had over the top builds before the update, but players like me that only had average builds got ripped to pieces. All my poor little mag NBs are trash now, hate to even look at my templar healers.

I cant agree with this enough. I play from SE Asia so I normally have a tough time, the one thing saving me was the tankiness and damage of heavy armor. Now I have nothing. I get ripped to shreds in medium.