BoP is boring

Volrion

I decided to gear my sorc up for pvp so I went to normal COH to get myself a Lich Resto staff.

60+ runs later I have 4 sharpened Lich lightning staves, a bunch of ebon and leviathan junk I don't need (Which would all sell on the open market if BOE). But no Resto.

I get the idea behind BOP. It makes relative sense for monster helms, trials and VMA because it means you have to be able to beat "challenging" content to get your hands on them.

But I can solo these normal dungeon runs while eating lunch and watching Netflix. There's no challenge, it's just boring and monotonous.

If you're going to keep *** us over with patch changes, at least give us a chance to adjust our builds without having to re-hamster wheel some bs content.

Possible solutions to allow people to actually enjoy content they want to play; Add dungeon loot to Cyrodiil vendors (Or the golden) or make them BOE, or guarantee set weapons in decent traits on veteran hard mode versions, or token system etc.

I have max CP, loads of gold, and I've done everything in this game. I've already put in the work!

At this point, I just want to gear up my character and go PVP.

*Edit; For those who aren't aware, you have a 1/624 chance of getting the weapon you want in a dungeon.

dpencil1

Pretty sure the Lich lightning staff is a named drop, so you're going to see that more frequently. I actually use it and like it very much.

But yes, some kind of token system and/or trait changing system should be implemented. I doubt we'll see BoP removed, but there are other ways to make the desired pieces easier to.obtain.

Tasear

I going to agree

Volrion

dpencil1 wrote: »

Pretty sure the Lich lightning staff is a named drop, so you're going to see that more frequently. I actually use it and like it very much.

But yes, some kind of token system and/or trait changing system should be implemented. I doubt we'll see BoP removed, but there are other ways to make the desired pieces easier to.obtain.

I have three named and one regular "lightning staff of Lich".

I agree it's a good drop, but I don't need four of them.

I'm just bored running a dungeon that provides me with no challenge, but I have to do it for the build I want to run.

I'm happy to do the work to get something valuable. If it was hard to achieve, I wouldn't mind.

DRXHarbinger

There is also sharp lich inferno from coh1 zavens doomstaff.

Volrion

DRXHarbinger wrote: »

There is also sharp lich inferno from coh1 zavens doomstaff.

I've been running number II. Do you know where the Resto drops?

Turelus

Volrion wrote: »

dpencil1 wrote: »

Pretty sure the Lich lightning staff is a named drop, so you're going to see that more frequently. I actually use it and like it very much.

But yes, some kind of token system and/or trait changing system should be implemented. I doubt we'll see BoP removed, but there are other ways to make the desired pieces easier to.obtain.

I have three named and one regular "lightning staff of Lich".

I agree it's a good drop, but I don't need four of them.

I'm just bored running a dungeon that provides me with no challenge, but I have to do it for the build I want to run.

I'm happy to do the work to get something valuable. If it was hard to achieve, I wouldn't mind.

Take off all you gear, now it's hard to achieve, now you're happy to farm Crypt.

DreadKnight

I agree that it should be BOE for normal dungeon gear, it would also help the struggling economy in Guild Traders - if you look through the traders they just sell all the same boring stuff.

dpencil1

You should have a chance for a resto on the last boss of either CoH1 or 2, in normal or vet, so might as well run normal.

DreadKnight

....or chests

Volrion

Turelus wrote: »

Volrion wrote: »

dpencil1 wrote: »

Pretty sure the Lich lightning staff is a named drop, so you're going to see that more frequently. I actually use it and like it very much.

But yes, some kind of token system and/or trait changing system should be implemented. I doubt we'll see BoP removed, but there are other ways to make the desired pieces easier to.obtain.

I have three named and one regular "lightning staff of Lich".

I agree it's a good drop, but I don't need four of them.

I'm just bored running a dungeon that provides me with no challenge, but I have to do it for the build I want to run.

I'm happy to do the work to get something valuable. If it was hard to achieve, I wouldn't mind.

Take off all you gear, now it's hard to achieve, now you're happy to farm Crypt.

Haha Why didn't I think of that?

Turelus

DreadKnight wrote: »

I agree that it should be BOE for normal dungeon gear, it would also help the struggling economy in Guild Traders - if you look through the traders they just sell all the same boring stuff.

The problem is it just becomes too flooded. BoP is sadly an evil required to keep from over flooding a market and making content worth playing.

Other games that have no BoP requirements on gear generally have gear destruction/loss to keep the economy ticking over.

Best way to farm dungeon sets is to get three buddies and play with them, then you have a 4 shots at an item each boss.

Malmai

Volrion wrote: »

I decided to gear my sorc up for pvp so I went to normal COH to get myself a Lich Resto staff.

60+ runs later I have 4 sharpened Lich lightning staves, a bunch of ebon and leviathan junk I don't need (Which would all sell on the open market if BOE). But no Resto.

I get the idea behind BOP. It makes relative sense for monster helms, trials and VMA because it means you have to be able to beat "challenging" content to get your hands on them.

But I can solo these normal dungeon runs while eating lunch and watching Netflix. There's no challenge, it's just boring and monotonous.

If you're going to keep *** us over with patch changes, at least give us a chance to adjust our builds without having to re-hamster wheel some bs content.

Three simple solutions to allow people to actually enjoy content they want to play; Add dungeon loot to Cyrodiil vendors (Or the golden) or make them BOE, or guarantee set weapons in decent traits on veteran hard mode versions.

I have max CP, loads of gold, and I've done everything in this game. I've already put in the work!

I just want to gear up my character and go PVP.

Its called grinding...

Volrion

Turelus wrote: »

DreadKnight wrote: »

I agree that it should be BOE for normal dungeon gear, it would also help the struggling economy in Guild Traders - if you look through the traders they just sell all the same boring stuff.

The problem is it just becomes too flooded. BoP is sadly an evil required to keep from over flooding a market and making content worth playing.

Other games that have no BoP requirements on gear generally have gear destruction/loss to keep the economy ticking over.

Best way to farm dungeon sets is to get three buddies and play with them, then you have a 4 shots at an item each boss.

Most of my friends quit because of RNG... lol

Carbonised

RNG and stupid insane low chances for a drop/trait combo you actually want is the devs' way of making us rehash the same boring, old content over and over and over again ad nauseam.

Instead of, you know, adding more interesting content for you to do.

Skinner boxes with random rewards is the lazy man's solution to keep someone artifically engaged in an activity.

• Remove BoP on almost everything
• Tweak drop chances to an open economy
• Move away from pure RNG Skinner box rewards. Despite what you may think, it's not fun or rewarding when you overuse and abuse it like this
• Move towards fixed progression rewards in some areas instead
• Diversify. The gap between best traits (sharpened, divines, infused, impenetrable) and trash traits is too large.
• Profit

Beesting

I gota defending resto on vet 2 after we failed hardmode because someone nuked the ghost adds with a meteor

Turelus

Volrion wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

DreadKnight wrote: »

I agree that it should be BOE for normal dungeon gear, it would also help the struggling economy in Guild Traders - if you look through the traders they just sell all the same boring stuff.

The problem is it just becomes too flooded. BoP is sadly an evil required to keep from over flooding a market and making content worth playing.

Other games that have no BoP requirements on gear generally have gear destruction/loss to keep the economy ticking over.

Best way to farm dungeon sets is to get three buddies and play with them, then you have a 4 shots at an item each boss.

Most of my friends quit because of RNG... lol

Well if RNG is the problem then ZOS are aware of and looking into that.

They're on record as saying they're aware RNG is a pain point and looking at ways to address it, as well as considering a token system. However rushing this out and not placing something well thought out could do more harm than having people upset they need to grind a dungeon for a week.

Troneon

Ever since they made everything BOP the game has been nothing but a chore and grind fest just to gear a character, heavily based on insane bs RNG that is so bad it literally puts you off playing the game, completely flawed in design.

ZOS are too stubborn to change anything or fix anything lately, only sell fluff and fake expansions.

Volrion

Carbonised wrote: »

RNG and stupid insane low chances for a drop/trait combo you actually want is the devs' way of making us rehash the same boring, old content over and over and over again ad nauseam.

Instead of, you know, adding more interesting content for you to do.

Skinner boxes with random rewards is the lazy man's solution to keep someone artifically engaged in an activity.

• Remove BoP on almost everything
• Tweak drop chances to an open economy
• Move away from pure RNG Skinner box rewards. Despite what you may think, it's not fun or rewarding when you overuse and abuse it like this
• Move towards fixed progression rewards in some areas instead
• Diversify. The gap between best traits (sharpened, divines, infused, impenetrable) and trash traits is too large.
• Profit

I'd be happy with something similar to an achievement based reward as seen in the Fighters Guild quest line. (When you finish the quest line you choose a weapon from the earth forge).

Regular RNG as normal is fine, but once you've cleared a dungeon on veteran mode 50 times you get one choice of a set weapon from that dungeon in the trait you want.

There's still a grind, and a chance you could be done earlier with the luck of RNG, but at least there's light at the end of the tunnel.

An overhaul as you suggested sounds nice, but I feel something like this is pretty realistic and easy to implement.

Volrion

Turelus wrote: »

Volrion wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

DreadKnight wrote: »

I agree that it should be BOE for normal dungeon gear, it would also help the struggling economy in Guild Traders - if you look through the traders they just sell all the same boring stuff.

The problem is it just becomes too flooded. BoP is sadly an evil required to keep from over flooding a market and making content worth playing.

Other games that have no BoP requirements on gear generally have gear destruction/loss to keep the economy ticking over.

Best way to farm dungeon sets is to get three buddies and play with them, then you have a 4 shots at an item each boss.

Most of my friends quit because of RNG... lol

Well if RNG is the problem then ZOS are aware of and looking into that.

They're on record as saying they're aware RNG is a pain point and looking at ways to address it, as well as considering a token system. However rushing this out and not placing something well thought out could do more harm than having people upset they need to grind a dungeon for a week.

I've been in COH for much longer than a week.

I did it on vet a few months ago to get purple jewelry for Ebon, Lich, and I even tried Leviathan.

Got all three over the course of a few weeks but only got one decent weapon drop (my first Lich lightning staff).

The 60 I mentioned in the OP were just from normal runs trying to get a Resto!

God knows how many I've actually cleared on both difficulties.

Turelus

Volrion wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

Volrion wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

DreadKnight wrote: »

I agree that it should be BOE for normal dungeon gear, it would also help the struggling economy in Guild Traders - if you look through the traders they just sell all the same boring stuff.

The problem is it just becomes too flooded. BoP is sadly an evil required to keep from over flooding a market and making content worth playing.

Other games that have no BoP requirements on gear generally have gear destruction/loss to keep the economy ticking over.

Best way to farm dungeon sets is to get three buddies and play with them, then you have a 4 shots at an item each boss.

Most of my friends quit because of RNG... lol

Well if RNG is the problem then ZOS are aware of and looking into that.

They're on record as saying they're aware RNG is a pain point and looking at ways to address it, as well as considering a token system. However rushing this out and not placing something well thought out could do more harm than having people upset they need to grind a dungeon for a week.

I've been in COH for much longer than a week.

I did it on vet a few months ago to get purple jewelry for Ebon, Lich, and I even tried Leviathan.

Got all three over the course of a few weeks but only got one decent weapon drop (my first Lich lightning staff).

The 60 I mentioned in the OP were just from normal runs trying to get a Resto!

God knows how many I've actually cleared on both difficulties.

Just to confirm, are you getting few weapons at all, or are you getting weapons and discarding because of bad traits?

Again, they know your pain. They're looking at ways to make it better.

F7sus4

BOP is there to slowly kill you inside while keeping you doing what you're doing.

Volrion

Turelus wrote: »

Volrion wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

Volrion wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

DreadKnight wrote: »

I agree that it should be BOE for normal dungeon gear, it would also help the struggling economy in Guild Traders - if you look through the traders they just sell all the same boring stuff.

The problem is it just becomes too flooded. BoP is sadly an evil required to keep from over flooding a market and making content worth playing.

Other games that have no BoP requirements on gear generally have gear destruction/loss to keep the economy ticking over.

Best way to farm dungeon sets is to get three buddies and play with them, then you have a 4 shots at an item each boss.

Most of my friends quit because of RNG... lol

Well if RNG is the problem then ZOS are aware of and looking into that.

They're on record as saying they're aware RNG is a pain point and looking at ways to address it, as well as considering a token system. However rushing this out and not placing something well thought out could do more harm than having people upset they need to grind a dungeon for a week.

I've been in COH for much longer than a week.

I did it on vet a few months ago to get purple jewelry for Ebon, Lich, and I even tried Leviathan.

Got all three over the course of a few weeks but only got one decent weapon drop (my first Lich lightning staff).

The 60 I mentioned in the OP were just from normal runs trying to get a Resto!

God knows how many I've actually cleared on both difficulties.

Just to confirm, are you getting few weapons at all, or are you getting weapons and discarding because of bad traits?

Again, they know your pain. They're looking at ways to make it better.

I have two weapons that are worth keeping. (Four lightning staves in sharpened and a Lich 1h axe).

Haven't seen a Resto and I've been offering 15 to 20k to anyone who gets one each run. No luck as yet.

I'm ok with a good grind. I've spent hours helping many friends through sky reach. I'll do the material farm when I want to gold items out, and of course the set item grind.

But things definitely need to be addressed when I have a 1/624 chance of getting the weapon I need.

mewcatus

The more you look for something, the less it seems to come. Just keep doing the same, but hold no expectations. It makes it less painful.

Volrion

mewcatus wrote: »

The more you look for something, the less it seems to come. Just keep doing the same, but hold no expectations. It makes it less painful.

Agreed. I went and did vet Fungal Grotto I yesterday quickly as it was the daily. Got a Viper Shield from the trash mob right before the second boss. Was a nice surprise.

I haven't played stamina in months though lol

But still, I want ma damn resto staff!

Ep1kMalware

Volrion wrote: »

I decided to gear my sorc up for pvp so I went to normal COH to get myself a Lich Resto staff.

60+ runs later I have 4 sharpened Lich lightning staves, a bunch of ebon and leviathan junk I don't need (Which would all sell on the open market if BOE). But no Resto.

I get the idea behind BOP. It makes relative sense for monster helms, trials and VMA because it means you have to be able to beat "challenging" content to get your hands on them.

But I can solo these normal dungeon runs while eating lunch and watching Netflix. There's no challenge, it's just boring and monotonous.

If you're going to keep *** us over with patch changes, at least give us a chance to adjust our builds without having to re-hamster wheel some bs content.

Three simple solutions to allow people to actually enjoy content they want to play; Add dungeon loot to Cyrodiil vendors (Or the golden) or make them BOE, or guarantee set weapons in decent traits on veteran hard mode versions.

I have max CP, loads of gold, and I've done everything in this game. I've already put in the work!

I just want to gear up my character and go PVP.

*Edit; For those who aren't aware, you have a 1/624 chance of getting the weapon you want in a dungeon.

I miss mmos with a good raiding system where you put alot of work in to grind raids for great gear and sell it for good coin. It was good for the gamw's economy. Pvpers didn't miss out, they could biy the gear they needes, and pve'ers werent like, 'well, ***, what do I do with al these gold mokndancer rings, y'know?

DRXHarbinger

Volrion wrote: »

DRXHarbinger wrote: »

There is also sharp lich inferno from coh1 zavens doomstaff.

I've been running number II. Do you know where the Resto drops?

There isn't a unique resto, Nerenith drops the Lit Staff (Forsaken Staff) and the twins on COH1 drop the Inferno. Any of the last two can drop the Resto, I have never seen one though. Given there are Jewlery & 11 normal Weapon types in 8 traits that drop and the unique weapons take up a large % of the loot table you'll struggle hard to get it.

If you get lucky, and I mean extremely lucky, depends on platform, Spam major trade zone chat asking for a "Dylora's Staff" These are BOE, someone may have one in purple still and not upgraded it to gold, if you give them 8 rosin when they upgrade it, it becomes BOE again and can be sold. This staff comes in charged only, But if you want it for your escape / back bar option it won't be that bad tbh. Be warned, Pre 1 Tamriel this staff was the single most expensive item in game.

Merlin13KAGL

Volrion wrote: »

*Edit; For those who aren't aware, you have a 1/624 chance of getting the weapon you want in a dungeon.

Wouldn't it be 1/316? Not that that rate sucks much less... (3 sets * 8 traits * 13 possibilities (12 weapons, 1 shield) + 2 possible jewelry)

Volrion wrote: »

I've been running number II. Do you know where the Resto drops?

Restro can drop at end boss on either I or II. Can also potentially come from chests.

Turelus wrote: »

DreadKnight wrote: »

I agree that it should be BOE for normal dungeon gear, it would also help the struggling economy in Guild Traders - if you look through the traders they just sell all the same boring stuff.

The problem is it just becomes too flooded. BoP is sadly an evil required to keep from over flooding a market and making content worth playing.

Other games that have no BoP requirements on gear generally have gear destruction/loss to keep the economy ticking over.

Best way to farm dungeon sets is to get three buddies and play with them, then you have a 4 shots at an item each boss.

While great in principle, I think this has the opposite effect, vice making content worth playing. It causes people to despise it, and once gear is attained, some never want to set foot inside ever again.

BoP is an inventory and time sink. So much time and space is sucked up shuffling items, determining if a set piece finishes off a build at all (right piece, let alone right trait), and that's for the sets you know you want.

The drop rate is so attrocious, you feel compelled to hang on to anything (weapon/jewelry) decently traited in case it may actually be of use sometime.

I don't think they implemented BoP to save the market. I think it's there to make an artificial need for more inventory space, leading the way for crown store storage in housing. That's my personal conspiracy theory.

mewcatus wrote: »

The more you look for something, the less it seems to come. Just keep doing the same, but hold no expectations. It makes it less painful.

@mewcatus dead on. I figured the way to 'trick' the system is to have multiple styles (stam/mag) and multiple roles among characters.

Sadly, RNG one-up's this by simply dropping the 3rd set that works for none of the above...

Even if they made lower level/quality weapons have a drop chance from standard bosses, it would be something. I'm sure you wouldn't be opposed to getting a CP140 blue staff if your chances of receiving one tripled... It would at least fill in until the right one eventually dropped.

Tokens would be best, or an increasing percentage chance for certain items after so many runs. Right now it's just painful.

Insandros

Volrion wrote: »

I decided to gear my sorc up for pvp so I went to normal COH to get myself a Lich Resto staff.

60+ runs later I have 4 sharpened Lich lightning staves, a bunch of ebon and leviathan junk I don't need (Which would all sell on the open market if BOE). But no Resto.

I get the idea behind BOP. It makes relative sense for monster helms, trials and VMA because it means you have to be able to beat "challenging" content to get your hands on them.

But I can solo these normal dungeon runs while eating lunch and watching Netflix. There's no challenge, it's just boring and monotonous.

If you're going to keep *** us over with patch changes, at least give us a chance to adjust our builds without having to re-hamster wheel some bs content.

Three simple solutions to allow people to actually enjoy content they want to play; Add dungeon loot to Cyrodiil vendors (Or the golden) or make them BOE, or guarantee set weapons in decent traits on veteran hard mode versions.

I have max CP, loads of gold, and I've done everything in this game. I've already put in the work!

I just want to gear up my character and go PVP.

*Edit; For those who aren't aware, you have a 1/624 chance of getting the weapon you want in a dungeon.

I don't wanna sound mean man, but i totaly agree, they should fix this,making totaly PvP gear, like taking off impen from PvE gear found out of Cyrodil, so you won't have to grind PvE dungeons and find it monotenous and use PvE stuff, agreed, there should be only PvP gear bought with alliance points, thats should fix your boredom S you want BOE stuff to get all your gear in 10 minutes, and get bored after 1 weeks of the game since you'Re already gearded up, then post a thread to whine there is missing content and gets monotonous. Makes sens. So, i presume you're the kind of guy that gets to a new job as janitor, and wish to be President the day after? Yep chances of loots are low, but i tell you, the day i've seen my BSW Inferno Sharpend droped, i was happy. ZoS should fix all your issues, by making normal dungeons harder, or, get back like all otehr mmos, a single loot for all the group, i presume you would like it most, instead of having 4 or 12 chances or gettign something, only 1 chances and sharing that single chance with 4 or 12 other people and then crying out load at Ninja's? I guess MMO players gets to be like kids, you give them an inch or their leash and they want 10 more

Balamoor

Ever notice it's the kids who play ESO like WoW who are the unhappiest?

Just an observation.

brandonv516

If you can still get Dyloras Staff from the dolmen when she spawns, there's your resto. It's charged but still a resto.

I don't even want to think about the time I put into cyrodiil dolmens for that set.

I almost felt like I was cheating when one tamriel came out and every other enemy was dropping lich.