warden gear set theory crafting

Lynx7386

Warden, to me, seems like a class that is built for hybrid play, at least to a greater extent than any other class. I like hybrid characters, though they've never been all that good in eso, so I'm really hoping to finally have a viable hybrid come morrowind.

A few different approaches to this though, and I'm not sure which way to go. On the one hand I feel like resource management might be an issue, so I first went for the black rose set for a mix of weapon damage, spell power, max stats, and the extra regen from Constitution. I think that would pair well with another set like trainee that boosts all max stats, or even willows path for regen.

On the other hand, I wonder about combining 5 pc rattlecage with 5 piece dreugh king slayer to get a good mix of weapon and spell stats along with the ability to always have both major brutality and major sorcery up at no cost.

Any opinions?

Phatmattfu

I like your ideas and think you could make it work.

Don't have any experience with hybrids, but an idea popped in my head regarding your Dreugh King / Rattlecage setup.

You could pick one set like Dreugh King and pair it with Pelinals Aptitude. Keep about the same Spell / Weapon damage and get a bit more sustain.

If you picked a race like Imperial you could get a hefty amount of health and stamina which would also translate to spell damage if you used Pelinals.

Lynx7386

Well my warden will be a khajiit on principle, just like all my other characters, which unfortunately rules out most passives.

I'd like to try Pelinals, but I haven't gotten 9 trait crafting yet, and with how ridiculous research times are that isn't likely to happen by morrowind release.

Xvorg

Sorc can easily be a hybrid even without pelinals. I have one with 5 WMK, slimecraw and 4 pieces stat set with 2 and 3 max stam and 4 wpn dmg (Hunt leader, Hawk eye, spriggan, essence thief have those stats), spell harm and physical harm glyphs for increasing wpn and spell dmg. Dark deal for keeping stam up and power surge to increase wpn and spell dmg. You can't get more that 3k dmg (wpn and spell) but you can get pretty close.
Problem is that magicka or stamina pool suffer.

Anyway, a decent Hybrid with pelinals should be oriented towards wpn dmg and:

1- Have all res into magicka
2- Have 5 pieces medium armor at least (reinforced)
3- Have 2 pieces light armor (for magicka recovery)
4- Have a set that boost max stam (Draugr Hulk)
5- Have access to major brut (major sorc is not going to work)
6- Maybe 1 or 2 Kena or Slimecraw
7- If it's a sorc, most of the skills should be class skills. Other classes MUST slot FG skills
8- Dampen Magic. If you have the magicka and spell dmg to make it work, not doing it is a big mistake. (except sorcs, which can use hardened)
9- Dunmer. There's no other race for hybrids
10- A way to trade magicka into stamina (or viceversa) or at least use equilibrium and a skill that heals on hit such as strife or punct strikes (I've noticed that those skills heal you despite equilibrium effect)

And even with that, your stam/magicka pool will not be over 30k and your health is gonna be quite small. Though your wpn dmg can get over 3K with major brut active (sorc).

Other option is 5 pelinals and 5 necropotence with everything into magicka and one kena, but you will lack direct dmg increase. Besides it forces you to use at least one pet (that can be OK for sorcs since they have a boost to health for each pet active).

Regarding Warden, IMHO it won't be a better option than sorc. Sorc passives are too good for every playing stye in this game.

Lynx7386

Also, I'm not sure Pelinals would be any better than rattlecage + dreugh king slayer, considering it doesn't effect stamina or magicka. It'd Definitely be worthwhile if it matched attributes as well as weapon damage and spell power

Lynx7386

Xvorg wrote: »

Sorc can easily be a hybrid even without pelinals. I have one with 5 WMK, slimecraw and 4 pieces stat set with 2 and 3 max stam and 4 wpn dmg (Hunt leader, Hawk eye, spriggan, essence thief have those stats), spell harm and physical harm glyphs for increasing wpn and spell dmg. Dark deal for keeping stam up and power surge to increase wpn and spell dmg. You can't get more that 3k dmg (wpn and spell) but you can get pretty close.
Problem is that magicka or stamina pool suffer.

Anyway, a decent Hybrid with pelinals should be oriented towards wpn dmg and:

1- Have all res into magicka
2- Have 5 pieces medium armor at least (reinforced)
3- Have 2 pieces light armor (for magicka recovery)
4- Have a set that boost max stam (Draugr Hulk)
5- Have access to major brut (major sorc is not going to work)
6- Maybe 1 or 2 Kena or Slimecraw
7- If it's a sorc, most of the skills should be class skills. Other classes MUST slot FG skills
8- Dampen Magic. If you have the magicka and spell dmg to make it work, not doing it is a big mistake. (except sorcs, which can use hardened)
9- Dunmer. There's no other race for hybrids
10- A way to trade magicka into stamina (or viceversa) or at least use equilibrium and a skill that heals on hit such as strife or punct strikes (I've noticed that those skills heal you despite equilibrium effect)

And even with that, your stam/magicka pool will not be over 30k and your health is gonna be quite small. Though your wpn dmg can get over 3K with major brut active (sorc).

Other option is 5 pelinals and 5 necropotence with everything into magicka and one kena, but you will lack direct dmg increase. Besides it forces you to use at least one pet (that can be OK for sorcs since they have a boost to health for each pet active).

Regarding Warden, IMHO it won't be a better option than sorc. Sorc passives are too good for every playing stye in this game.

I'm looking more at a tank character, so the medium and light setup won't work all that well. My goal is to make a character that is tough enough to tank well, can readily utilize both resource pools, and still Solos well enough to not feel like your typical wet noodle tank

Xvorg

Lynx7386 wrote: »

Also, I'm not sure Pelinals would be any better than rattlecage + dreugh king slayer, considering it doesn't effect stamina or magicka. It'd Definitely be worthwhile if it matched attributes as well as weapon damage and spell power

It's a bad combo. No penetration, no resources, no crit, Just raw wpn and spell dmg

Xvorg

Lynx7386 wrote: »

Xvorg wrote: »

Sorc can easily be a hybrid even without pelinals. I have one with 5 WMK, slimecraw and 4 pieces stat set with 2 and 3 max stam and 4 wpn dmg (Hunt leader, Hawk eye, spriggan, essence thief have those stats), spell harm and physical harm glyphs for increasing wpn and spell dmg. Dark deal for keeping stam up and power surge to increase wpn and spell dmg. You can't get more that 3k dmg (wpn and spell) but you can get pretty close.
Problem is that magicka or stamina pool suffer.

Anyway, a decent Hybrid with pelinals should be oriented towards wpn dmg and:

1- Have all res into magicka
2- Have 5 pieces medium armor at least (reinforced)
3- Have 2 pieces light armor (for magicka recovery)
4- Have a set that boost max stam (Draugr Hulk)
5- Have access to major brut (major sorc is not going to work)
6- Maybe 1 or 2 Kena or Slimecraw
7- If it's a sorc, most of the skills should be class skills. Other classes MUST slot FG skills
8- Dampen Magic. If you have the magicka and spell dmg to make it work, not doing it is a big mistake. (except sorcs, which can use hardened)
9- Dunmer. There's no other race for hybrids
10- A way to trade magicka into stamina (or viceversa) or at least use equilibrium and a skill that heals on hit such as strife or punct strikes (I've noticed that those skills heal you despite equilibrium effect)

And even with that, your stam/magicka pool will not be over 30k and your health is gonna be quite small. Though your wpn dmg can get over 3K with major brut active (sorc).

Other option is 5 pelinals and 5 necropotence with everything into magicka and one kena, but you will lack direct dmg increase. Besides it forces you to use at least one pet (that can be OK for sorcs since they have a boost to health for each pet active).

Regarding Warden, IMHO it won't be a better option than sorc. Sorc passives are too good for every playing stye in this game.

I'm looking more at a tank character, so the medium and light setup won't work all that well. My goal is to make a character that is tough enough to tank well, can readily utilize both resource pools, and still Solos well enough to not feel like your typical wet noodle tank

Well, these are the best stats I got for Rattle and dreugh kingslayer:





They don't look bad at all.

austinwalter87ub17_ESO

The flaw you guys are making is in assuming that the Warden will be best served as a DPS Hybrid.

The warden has huge potential to exist as an effective tank/healer hybrid. Maybe not for trials, but for pvp and everything else, absolutely.

I'm thinking...

Engine Guardian 2 piece. (sustain)
Imperium Heavy 5 piece set from WGT (large absorb shields)
Desert Rose 5 piece (1h and shield and resto staff, losing 5 piece bonus when on resto staff) (sustain)

Run Harness Magicka on tank bar.
Harness Magicka, Healing Ward, and the Support Abs Shield Ultimate

A few tank skills. Tri-enchants with Infused large pieces, purple tri food, Stat allocation getting you as close to 30k health, 35k magicka, and 20k stamina as possible.

Wardens have lots of HOT's. Your absorb shields soak up damage while your HOT'S heal you and your group.

Thinking 75ish points into Hardy/Elemental Defender, 75 into Bastion, the rest into Quick Recovery

100 Blessing, some Elf Born.

SirDopey

Necropotence and because of the incoming nerf to resources mix it with either Magicka Furnace/Lich/Warlock/Argonian Clever Alchemist

Lynx7386

SirDopey wrote: »

Necropotence and because of the incoming nerf to resources mix it with either Magicka Furnace/Lich/Warlock/Argonian Clever Alchemist

I really don't think necropotence is going to be effective on wardens, they only have one actual pet, maybe two if the netch counts for the 20 seconds it's out

austinwalter87ub17_ESO

Lynx7386 wrote: »

SirDopey wrote: »

Necropotence and because of the incoming nerf to resources mix it with either Magicka Furnace/Lich/Warlock/Argonian Clever Alchemist

I really don't think necropotence is going to be effective on wardens, they only have one actual pet, maybe two if the netch counts for the 20 seconds it's out

The Netch is considered a pet and it is confirmed to work with Necropotence. Necropotence will become BIS with Magicka DPS Wardens

Xvorg

austinwalter87ub17_ESO wrote: »

Lynx7386 wrote: »

SirDopey wrote: »

Necropotence and because of the incoming nerf to resources mix it with either Magicka Furnace/Lich/Warlock/Argonian Clever Alchemist

I really don't think necropotence is going to be effective on wardens, they only have one actual pet, maybe two if the netch counts for the 20 seconds it's out

The Netch is considered a pet and it is confirmed to work with Necropotence. Necropotence will become BIS with Magicka DPS Wardens

That will depend also in the new sets.

Imho, winterborn and ysgramor make a good combo with a frost based class, and why not Ice Furnace too?

Lynx7386

Xvorg wrote: »

austinwalter87ub17_ESO wrote: »

Lynx7386 wrote: »

SirDopey wrote: »

Necropotence and because of the incoming nerf to resources mix it with either Magicka Furnace/Lich/Warlock/Argonian Clever Alchemist

I really don't think necropotence is going to be effective on wardens, they only have one actual pet, maybe two if the netch counts for the 20 seconds it's out

The Netch is considered a pet and it is confirmed to work with Necropotence. Necropotence will become BIS with Magicka DPS Wardens

That will depend also in the new sets.

Imho, winterborn and ysgramor make a good combo with a frost based class, and why not Ice Furnace too?

Only three of the frost abilities deal damage, and they're intended as tanking aids rather than offensive spells. Frost mage is a no go

Xvorg

Lynx7386 wrote: »

Xvorg wrote: »

austinwalter87ub17_ESO wrote: »

Lynx7386 wrote: »

SirDopey wrote: »

Necropotence and because of the incoming nerf to resources mix it with either Magicka Furnace/Lich/Warlock/Argonian Clever Alchemist

I really don't think necropotence is going to be effective on wardens, they only have one actual pet, maybe two if the netch counts for the 20 seconds it's out

The Netch is considered a pet and it is confirmed to work with Necropotence. Necropotence will become BIS with Magicka DPS Wardens

That will depend also in the new sets.

Imho, winterborn and ysgramor make a good combo with a frost based class, and why not Ice Furnace too?

Only three of the frost abilities deal damage, and they're intended as tanking aids rather than offensive spells. Frost mage is a no go

One is more than enough if you slot a frost staff too. Three is a good number.

Phatmattfu

I've been having fun with Iceheart on my Stam Sorc as part of my prosperous gear set. (I also use it to tank normal dungeons as a DPS but shhh lol)

I think it would be awesome on Warden tank, maybe try squeezing that in. Constant damage debuff without having to worry about it and damage shield is awesome.

Lynx7386

Yea I'm thinking:
Dreugh king jewelry + 1h/shield
Rattlecage 5 pc chest/belt/hands/legs/feet
2pc Monster set
Nonset frost staff

That way on the frost staff bar I'll still have major sorcery active, but brutality will be up when on the 1h/sh bar. Ice heart might work for the monster set, also thinking selenes for the bear thing, or engine guardian for resource aid.

Phatmattfu

Molag Kena is also an option for a more dpsy setup. Nice and hybridy

Lynx7386

Yea was thinking at least kena shoulders for the weapon and spell damage boost

Stannum

If warden DPS pet-line will have stamina morphs maybe i will think of inverted PvP dps\tank. Stamina dps build on class skills with frost staff for (perma?)blocking on magika. Now the only class that has efficient class stamina spam skills is NB (templar's jabs are channel, so no blocking).

Lynx7386

I'm really hoping they go through with the change to make 2h items count for two set bonuses would really open up options for that frost staff on the back bar

Lughlongarm

For the hybrid tank(frost staff/1h/shield) option, you can try to do something with "Tremorscale" for nice frost staff heavy attack. Doesn't sure it's worth the bother.

Lynx7386

Thought about it but I was a little underwhelmed by tremorscale on my other characters. Also not sure I'd ever use the heavy attack intentionally for taunting, but I suppose it would add some decent burst damage

Xvorg

Lynx7386 wrote: »

Thought about it but I was a little underwhelmed by tremorscale on my other characters. Also not sure I'd ever use the heavy attack intentionally for taunting, but I suppose it would add some decent burst damage

Full heavy Ice has an interesting effecto on the shield casted. It can be combined with permafrost.

In fact, permafrost + ice heart synergy is great

Lynx7386

Interesting but would that every equate to much healing?

Lughlongarm

Lynx7386 wrote: »

Thought about it but I was a little underwhelmed by tremorscale on my other characters. Also not sure I'd ever use the heavy attack intentionally for taunting, but I suppose it would add some decent burst damage

Ya, I understand now you were talking PVE, I thought of it as a PvP thing. It's free with long distance its great single target burst with aoe damage and snare which returns magica. Good deal if you can make an hybrid tank build.

Xvorg

Lynx7386 wrote: »

Interesting but would that every equate to much healing?

I use it with orgnum's. While shielded my health regen gets to almost 2.4K.

Let me show you some SS:

Normal

Orgnum's

Permafrost

Orgnum's+permafrost

Each light attack makes me recover 3% max health, at 22k health it reaches 660 healing per light attack, 904 magicka and 330 stam.

And you have strife too with a 5k tooltip and a 31% hot (1550) each 2 secs.

Mostly I use harness magicka for the shield effect, though I'm considering healing staff and slotting ward ally as a extra shield or force syphon for lifesteal and magickasteal.

Aprox, health regen and healing combined (strife while weaving) should give me 2.5K health back each second, 904 magicka and 330 stam

And that's not everything.

Besides strife for dmg, I use refreshing path and elemental blockade. Path gives me some extra healing and major exp, while blockade snares the enemy and gives inmo. Finally I use destro ulti.

IDK if it's a good set up for a tank, though I had some good xp against craglorn bosses.

ascan7

Xvorg wrote: »

Where i can find this calculator?

SirDopey

Lynx7386 wrote: »

SirDopey wrote: »

Necropotence and because of the incoming nerf to resources mix it with either Magicka Furnace/Lich/Warlock/Argonian Clever Alchemist

I really don't think necropotence is going to be effective on wardens, they only have one actual pet, maybe two if the netch counts for the 20 seconds it's out

You only need on pet to make necropotence effective, it doesn't multiple with additional pets....

psychotic13

ascan7 wrote: »

Xvorg wrote: »

Where i can find this calculator?

Search uesp in google, should come up there's a build calculator on there. I'll link it later just can't use it on my phone so can't link it