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The Warden Bear Ultimate has to be double-barred... and that's okay!
Transairion
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Some new information has come to light over here, and this stood out for me:
It seems anyone who had hopes and dreams of having the Bear Ultimate active and throwing down Meteors/Eye of the Storm at the same time will be sorely disappointed... but it's going to be okay, we'll live, and the game may be better off for this design decision.
Why? Well, think about it.
If the Warden could have a toggled summon active despite bar swapping (Summon Shade is fire-and-forget and they can't be damaged), then Sorcerer summons would have to be changed to function the same way... lest we have a rather blatant case of "New class OP", having a near-identical mechanic except no downside.
What's the problem of Sorcerers not having to back-bar summons anymore? Simply put, Overload providing another bar + the various Ward morphs. All variations of Ward provide their shields not only to the user, but any summons they have active: even before the armor/magic reset buffs to Sorc summons this meant summons could be effectively immortal outside zerg PvP if you were using Ward regularly as a Sorcerer. After the buffs they shouldn't be dying often, so that's relatively permanent summons just from using Ward.
Slap those onto the Overload bar (giving Sorcs a total of 15 non-Ult skill slots), and you'd have 2 near-permanent summons hidden away on the extra Overload bar while having at least 12 skill slots remaining for any other build you desire (Ward should your main bar/s somewhere). The lack of having to double-bar summons would mean that, yes, pretty much ANY Sorcerer build could have both summons active with 100% uptime and no real downside in sight. Sorcerer with double pets would become the norm, and their "meta" status would only result in them getting nerfed to Summon Shade levels of contribution because every build would be able to use their extra DPS without tradeoff and that would be too strong.
So yes, in my opinion the Bear Ultimate having to be double-barred is ok... because the alternative pretty much destroys the Sorcerer class by making the summons a must-have choice, regardless of build. Having to double bar is annoying sure, but it's far preferable to every single Sorcerer in the game slotting them on the 3rd bar and then forgetting about them simply because it's free damage.
This is just personal opinion of course, I'm no psychic.
- The Warden's bear summon ultimate needs to be on the active bar to be maintained, so be prepared to slot it on both bars.
It seems anyone who had hopes and dreams of having the Bear Ultimate active and throwing down Meteors/Eye of the Storm at the same time will be sorely disappointed... but it's going to be okay, we'll live, and the game may be better off for this design decision.
Why? Well, think about it.
If the Warden could have a toggled summon active despite bar swapping (Summon Shade is fire-and-forget and they can't be damaged), then Sorcerer summons would have to be changed to function the same way... lest we have a rather blatant case of "New class OP", having a near-identical mechanic except no downside.
What's the problem of Sorcerers not having to back-bar summons anymore? Simply put, Overload providing another bar + the various Ward morphs. All variations of Ward provide their shields not only to the user, but any summons they have active: even before the armor/magic reset buffs to Sorc summons this meant summons could be effectively immortal outside zerg PvP if you were using Ward regularly as a Sorcerer. After the buffs they shouldn't be dying often, so that's relatively permanent summons just from using Ward.
Slap those onto the Overload bar (giving Sorcs a total of 15 non-Ult skill slots), and you'd have 2 near-permanent summons hidden away on the extra Overload bar while having at least 12 skill slots remaining for any other build you desire (Ward should your main bar/s somewhere). The lack of having to double-bar summons would mean that, yes, pretty much ANY Sorcerer build could have both summons active with 100% uptime and no real downside in sight. Sorcerer with double pets would become the norm, and their "meta" status would only result in them getting nerfed to Summon Shade levels of contribution because every build would be able to use their extra DPS without tradeoff and that would be too strong.
So yes, in my opinion the Bear Ultimate having to be double-barred is ok... because the alternative pretty much destroys the Sorcerer class by making the summons a must-have choice, regardless of build. Having to double bar is annoying sure, but it's far preferable to every single Sorcerer in the game slotting them on the 3rd bar and then forgetting about them simply because it's free damage.
This is just personal opinion of course, I'm no psychic.
2
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brandonv516✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I agree with this requirement. Sorcs have to for pets already.
I wish NB had the option to keep shades up by slotting on both bars.Edited by brandonv516 on February 23, 2017 3:35PM1 -
Zardayne✭✭✭✭✭With the limited amount of skill slots we have I've always thought the double barred skill mechanic is ridiculous.6 -
theher0not✭✭✭✭✭brandonv516 wrote: »I agree with this requirement. Sorcs have to for pets already.
I wish NB had the option to keep shades up by slotting on both bars.
Sorcs doesn't have their pets as an ultimate, so they still have 4 slots per bar.1 -
olsborg✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Sorcs can summon the atronach on offbar and switch back, it will still last the full duration, im sure the other morph of bear will work the same way. (the dmg morph) The permanent morph however, yea im fine with it needing doublebarred.
PC EU
PvP only2 -
Vaoh✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Well we know the morphs.
One allows the bear to deal more damage with a certain attack, while the other respawns it on death.
Probably going to be really strong if double-barred! I think right now it sounds cool tbh
Edited by Vaoh on February 23, 2017 3:46PM0 -
SFDB✭✭✭✭✭
✭With the limited amount of skill slots we have I've always thought the double barred skill mechanic is ridiculous.
Very much agreed. I called my sorc a Togglemancer since she only had two abilities per bar that she could actually use thanks to this backwards system.0 -
Lynx7386✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Sorcs can summon the atronach on offbar and switch back, it will still last the full duration, im sure the other morph of bear will work the same way. (the dmg morph) The permanent morph however, yea im fine with it needing doublebarred.
Both bear morphs are "permanent". Both will require double bar slotting.
One bear morph auto revives itself if it dies. This saves you having to regain ultimate to recast the bear, and saves time in combat.
The other bear morph deals more damage, and allows you to keep gaining ultimate while it's out. You can recast the ultimate to cause the bear to enrage, dealing extra damage and gaining an execute bonus.
PS4 / NA
M'asad - Khajiit Nightblade - Healer
Pakhet - Khajiit Dragonknight - Tank
Raksha - Khajiit Sorcerer - Stamina DPS
Bastet - Khajiit Templar - Healer
Leonin - Khajiit Warden - Tank1 -
Phatmattfu✭✭✭Sorcs can summon the atronach on offbar and switch back, it will still last the full duration, im sure the other morph of bear will work the same way. (the dmg morph) The permanent morph however, yea im fine with it needing doublebarred.
Both bear morphs are "permanent". Both will require double bar slotting.
One bear morph auto revives itself if it dies. This saves you having to regain ultimate to recast the bear, and saves time in combat.
The other bear morph deals more damage, and allows you to keep gaining ultimate while it's out. You can recast the ultimate to cause the bear to enrage, dealing extra damage and gaining an execute bonus.
I was under the impression the enrage bear only had a fixed duration. This has made my choice much easier
0 -
Lynx7386✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Phatmattfu wrote: »Sorcs can summon the atronach on offbar and switch back, it will still last the full duration, im sure the other morph of bear will work the same way. (the dmg morph) The permanent morph however, yea im fine with it needing doublebarred.
Both bear morphs are "permanent". Both will require double bar slotting.
One bear morph auto revives itself if it dies. This saves you having to regain ultimate to recast the bear, and saves time in combat.
The other bear morph deals more damage, and allows you to keep gaining ultimate while it's out. You can recast the ultimate to cause the bear to enrage, dealing extra damage and gaining an execute bonus.
I was under the impression the enrage bear only had a fixed duration. This has made my choice much easier
Nope, both morphs and the base ability work like the familiar/twilight - toggle permanent summons until killed.PS4 / NA
M'asad - Khajiit Nightblade - Healer
Pakhet - Khajiit Dragonknight - Tank
Raksha - Khajiit Sorcerer - Stamina DPS
Bastet - Khajiit Templar - Healer
Leonin - Khajiit Warden - Tank0 -
Phatmattfu✭✭✭Phatmattfu wrote: »Sorcs can summon the atronach on offbar and switch back, it will still last the full duration, im sure the other morph of bear will work the same way. (the dmg morph) The permanent morph however, yea im fine with it needing doublebarred.
Both bear morphs are "permanent". Both will require double bar slotting.
One bear morph auto revives itself if it dies. This saves you having to regain ultimate to recast the bear, and saves time in combat.
The other bear morph deals more damage, and allows you to keep gaining ultimate while it's out. You can recast the ultimate to cause the bear to enrage, dealing extra damage and gaining an execute bonus.
I was under the impression the enrage bear only had a fixed duration. This has made my choice much easier
Nope, both morphs and the base ability work like the familiar/twilight - toggle permanent summons until killed.
Awesome, now the only question I have left is whether the bear will do physical or if there will be a cold damage morph so magjicka chars can get as much out of him.0 -
psychotic13✭✭✭✭✭
✭Phatmattfu wrote: »Phatmattfu wrote: »Sorcs can summon the atronach on offbar and switch back, it will still last the full duration, im sure the other morph of bear will work the same way. (the dmg morph) The permanent morph however, yea im fine with it needing doublebarred.
Both bear morphs are "permanent". Both will require double bar slotting.
One bear morph auto revives itself if it dies. This saves you having to regain ultimate to recast the bear, and saves time in combat.
The other bear morph deals more damage, and allows you to keep gaining ultimate while it's out. You can recast the ultimate to cause the bear to enrage, dealing extra damage and gaining an execute bonus.
I was under the impression the enrage bear only had a fixed duration. This has made my choice much easier
Nope, both morphs and the base ability work like the familiar/twilight - toggle permanent summons until killed.
Awesome, now the only question I have left is whether the bear will do physical or if there will be a cold damage morph so magjicka chars can get as much out of him.
Now that's a good question, I hadn't even considered that it'll be physical only... hope not0 -
Lynx7386✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Phatmattfu wrote: »Phatmattfu wrote: »Sorcs can summon the atronach on offbar and switch back, it will still last the full duration, im sure the other morph of bear will work the same way. (the dmg morph) The permanent morph however, yea im fine with it needing doublebarred.
Both bear morphs are "permanent". Both will require double bar slotting.
One bear morph auto revives itself if it dies. This saves you having to regain ultimate to recast the bear, and saves time in combat.
The other bear morph deals more damage, and allows you to keep gaining ultimate while it's out. You can recast the ultimate to cause the bear to enrage, dealing extra damage and gaining an execute bonus.
I was under the impression the enrage bear only had a fixed duration. This has made my choice much easier
Nope, both morphs and the base ability work like the familiar/twilight - toggle permanent summons until killed.
Awesome, now the only question I have left is whether the bear will do physical or if there will be a cold damage morph so magjicka chars can get as much out of him.
Probably physical only, however ultimates scale based on your highest stats.PS4 / NA
M'asad - Khajiit Nightblade - Healer
Pakhet - Khajiit Dragonknight - Tank
Raksha - Khajiit Sorcerer - Stamina DPS
Bastet - Khajiit Templar - Healer
Leonin - Khajiit Warden - Tank0 -
psychotic13✭✭✭✭✭
✭Phatmattfu wrote: »Phatmattfu wrote: »Sorcs can summon the atronach on offbar and switch back, it will still last the full duration, im sure the other morph of bear will work the same way. (the dmg morph) The permanent morph however, yea im fine with it needing doublebarred.
Both bear morphs are "permanent". Both will require double bar slotting.
One bear morph auto revives itself if it dies. This saves you having to regain ultimate to recast the bear, and saves time in combat.
The other bear morph deals more damage, and allows you to keep gaining ultimate while it's out. You can recast the ultimate to cause the bear to enrage, dealing extra damage and gaining an execute bonus.
I was under the impression the enrage bear only had a fixed duration. This has made my choice much easier
Nope, both morphs and the base ability work like the familiar/twilight - toggle permanent summons until killed.
Awesome, now the only question I have left is whether the bear will do physical or if there will be a cold damage morph so magjicka chars can get as much out of him.
Probably physical only, however ultimates scale based on your highest stats.
But won't scale with CP if you're magicka0 -
Lynx7386✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭psychotic13 wrote: »Phatmattfu wrote: »Phatmattfu wrote: »Sorcs can summon the atronach on offbar and switch back, it will still last the full duration, im sure the other morph of bear will work the same way. (the dmg morph) The permanent morph however, yea im fine with it needing doublebarred.
Both bear morphs are "permanent". Both will require double bar slotting.
One bear morph auto revives itself if it dies. This saves you having to regain ultimate to recast the bear, and saves time in combat.
The other bear morph deals more damage, and allows you to keep gaining ultimate while it's out. You can recast the ultimate to cause the bear to enrage, dealing extra damage and gaining an execute bonus.
I was under the impression the enrage bear only had a fixed duration. This has made my choice much easier
Nope, both morphs and the base ability work like the familiar/twilight - toggle permanent summons until killed.
Awesome, now the only question I have left is whether the bear will do physical or if there will be a cold damage morph so magjicka chars can get as much out of him.
Probably physical only, however ultimates scale based on your highest stats.
But won't scale with CP if you're magicka
True enough, but the frost ultimate won't scale with cp for stamina characters, it's all give and take.PS4 / NA
M'asad - Khajiit Nightblade - Healer
Pakhet - Khajiit Dragonknight - Tank
Raksha - Khajiit Sorcerer - Stamina DPS
Bastet - Khajiit Templar - Healer
Leonin - Khajiit Warden - Tank0 -
Rickter✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭well this makes more sense than the sorc pets having to be double barred.
the Bear is an ULTIMATE to activate it, then switch to your off bar and meteor someone is like having two ultimates active at a time.
sorc pets are regular skills, and it should be just like you can pop vigor and switch to a bar that doesnt have vigor, yet still have the affect of vigor.RickterESO
PC | NA | DC
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Guilds: PvP:Bloodletter | StamDK | Alliance Rank 46 | Former Emperor of Shor (2018) | Former Emperor of Thornblade #4terms (2015)PvE:vAA HM | vHRC HM | vSO HM | vMA | vDSA | vMoL | ALL Vet 4 Man Dungeons4 -
Phatmattfu✭✭✭Really hope there is a cold dmg option (polar bear?), was heavily leaning towards a majicka warden but want bear to be my prime focus.0
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psychotic13✭✭✭✭✭
✭psychotic13 wrote: »Phatmattfu wrote: »Phatmattfu wrote: »Sorcs can summon the atronach on offbar and switch back, it will still last the full duration, im sure the other morph of bear will work the same way. (the dmg morph) The permanent morph however, yea im fine with it needing doublebarred.
Both bear morphs are "permanent". Both will require double bar slotting.
One bear morph auto revives itself if it dies. This saves you having to regain ultimate to recast the bear, and saves time in combat.
The other bear morph deals more damage, and allows you to keep gaining ultimate while it's out. You can recast the ultimate to cause the bear to enrage, dealing extra damage and gaining an execute bonus.
I was under the impression the enrage bear only had a fixed duration. This has made my choice much easier
Nope, both morphs and the base ability work like the familiar/twilight - toggle permanent summons until killed.
Awesome, now the only question I have left is whether the bear will do physical or if there will be a cold damage morph so magjicka chars can get as much out of him.
Probably physical only, however ultimates scale based on your highest stats.
But won't scale with CP if you're magicka
True enough, but the frost ultimate won't scale with cp for stamina characters, it's all give and take.
I understand that, but the summon line looks to be the DPS line. Is this going to be on the PTS or not cause it's an expansion? When do we get more info? lol I need to figure out a build0