Dungeon frustrations

Nahtal

Hi all.

ESO is my favo game, serious love it.

But, im getting tired of players that leaves in the middle of a dungeon. Its not the dungeon finder, its that sort of players that make dungeon finder broken.
Why is there not a system like (bad sports (GTAV) or a other system like that. ppl ragging about dungeon finder but most of time they are ruined for other players.

If boss is to difficult they leaves, if it goes not fast enough ppl leaves (pls delete your game)

Sorry for my English but have to say this.

Greetings
Nahtal

redspecter23

Dungeon finder can only do what it's designed to do (when it's working at least) and people will sometimes be bad people. The best course of action is to find yourself some friends and some guilds that run dungeons and use group finder as a last resort instead of your primary method of dungeon completion. You'll have more fun, get faster groups and have fewer headaches. Group finder can't turn horrible people into good people and nothing ZOS does to upgrade that system will help the core issue. Just find better people to group with.

Voxicity

Most of the time, people leave a group not because they find the content too difficult, but because they're put with bad players.

(i personally help people through anything, like vICP HM yesterday with my wife, but some people would rather not waste their time)

Nahtal

KaiVox22 wrote: »

Most of the time, people leave a group not because they find the content too difficult, but because they're put with bad players.

(i personally help people through anything, like vICP HM yesterday with my wife, but some people would rather not waste their time)

Agree that there are players with terrible builds (experience that with my heal char) but for me not a reason to leave a group. Only when it takes to long to kill a boss (but that i will discuss that also in the chat) So, think not bad players but just players whit terrible builds.

zaria

KaiVox22 wrote: »

Most of the time, people leave a group not because they find the content too difficult, but because they're put with bad players.

(i personally help people through anything, like vICP HM yesterday with my wife, but some people would rather not waste their time)

This is an combination.
Yes you should not queue for content you don't feel conferrable with running with an group of your level.
on the other hand using the dungeon finder and expecting an speed run is as idiotic as starting with veteran dungeons
perhaps using the undaunted skill or similar as an restriction. you have to do 20 normal dungeons before you can queue for veteran account bound so you don't have the restriction on alts

runagate

KaiVox22 wrote: »

Most of the time, people leave a group not because they find the content too difficult, but because they're put with bad players.

(i personally help people through anything, like vICP HM yesterday with my wife, but some people would rather not waste their time)

So your wife is bad. Noted.

Vahrokh

It's a common dynamic you'll find in most MMOs.

Sadly there's not a group finder which could put similar experience players together.

If I come in a super-trial setup, where every death of mine costs more than 10 deaths of everybody in the delve group...

If I come in and tell the tank to tank and he just does rubbish...

If the healer goes AFK with no preadvice... again and again...

If nobody got a clue about any of the bosses to kill...

If generally, the less the skill and the knowledge, the more the adversion to LISTEN to whom has done that content 100 times and is patiently trying to explain how to do it...

Those are the situations when... THEY are going to leave. Not me. Usually I stay and try 2-3 runs before I give up. But who won't want to learn are the first to go.

montjie

Dungeon runs are costly. For mostly all in time and for some in resources too (pots, rep kits, gold etc)

And when you have a clearly inexperienced group who doesnt show any effort to improve their way of handling said dungeon, why would you waste your time and resources on that bunch of ....

Basic rule: 3 wipes = I'm out of there

Deep_01

Try spending time forming a permanent group. You'll easily find lots of like-minded friends. Currently doing so, and I it feels better than PuGs for me, since I haven't done a group dungeon yet.

Voxicity

runagate wrote: »

KaiVox22 wrote: »

Most of the time, people leave a group not because they find the content too difficult, but because they're put with bad players.

(i personally help people through anything, like vICP HM yesterday with my wife, but some people would rather not waste their time)

So your wife is bad. Noted.

lol

I meant me and my wife help people

Should have phrased that differently

runagate

KaiVox22 wrote: »

runagate wrote: »

KaiVox22 wrote: »

Most of the time, people leave a group not because they find the content too difficult, but because they're put with bad players.

(i personally help people through anything, like vICP HM yesterday with my wife, but some people would rather not waste their time)

So your wife is bad. Noted.

lol

I meant me and my wife help people

Should have phrased that differently

Well, if it doesn't work out and you like people who cruelly twist your words to get you in trouble, look me up

Or I'll start a toon on the EU server and come be ya'll's personal dungeon helper in penance for teasing you.

mariskaas

I just run with guildies. They know my build (however not terrible or crazy) is not perfect since the best gear comes from trials and maelstrom and having a hard time completing that on my main (time to finish leveling my sorc xD). But they are nice and patient, and I do listen to their suggestions if they have any.

If someone leaves immediately just at one ffing wipe i'm thinking, get over yourself. If you want a speedrunning extremely experienced dungeongroup that's fine but don't expect that in random dungeon finder or even if you decide to join ppl in your guild you don't know.

SHADOW2KK

I only run with people I know and work well with most times, or guildies.

Each to their own I guess

SickDuck

Sometimes I leave because the remaining ones are REALLY bad. Sometimes it is obvious that it ain't gonna happen. Sometimes I just can't find the will to do a specific dungeon thrown on me by RNG (hello DLCs!).

But when I leave I make sure I project all my frustrations from the broken GF tool to the other people.

MercTheMage

Nahtal wrote: »

Hi all.

ESO is my favo game, serious love it.

But, im getting tired of players that leaves in the middle of a dungeon. Its not the dungeon finder, its that sort of players that make dungeon finder broken.
Why is there not a system like (bad sports (GTAV) or a other system like that. ppl ragging about dungeon finder but most of time they are ruined for other players.

If boss is to difficult they leaves, if it goes not fast enough ppl leaves (pls delete your game)

Sorry for my English but have to say this.

Greetings
Nahtal

As a player who walked out of a dungeon just yesterday, I'd like to respond to this issue.

If people knew what they were doing, this problem wouldn't occur.
I always ask "Does everyone know this fight" if it's a dungeon with a crappy boss, I have never had any issues with explaining a fight and teaching people.
The problem arises when people don't speak up, they don't do their part, or they just *** around in general.

On a separate, yet related issue, low CP players queuing for vet dungeons. If I get queued into vWGT with a CP 24 who queued for it specifically, IM *** LEAVING. I'm not gonna be one of those elitist pricks who v2k a player when they get queued in and they don't meet the requirements.

Then there's the issue of people marking themselves as roles they clearly aren't capable of filling. Like a dps who has breath of life unlocked and thinks "oh hey, I'm a healer now, imma check that box too"

@axbom always tells me "Mercer, do not queue us for this dungeon!" and this^ is exactly why. Everyone has their limits, we end up reaching ours, walking out and being the *** in the story.

The dungeon finder needs to have a notice that shows before you queue "Just because you can queue for a vet dungeon doesn't mean you should."

Nahtal

Im just think the problem is bigger.

For vet dungeons you need a good build with epic armor, and think most people have no idea how that works. play lot of hours daily, and also in public dungeons ppl walk out whit 10 enemy's behind them. they want fast, loot, gold and up to next.

its the same whit delve,s, get Skyshard, boss, walking out with 10 enemy's behind.

Maybe i gonna do dungeons more with my guild, but still do not think Group finder is the problem of this.

ESOUser0x00

It would be great if the group finder track the first few players who leave their groups and group them all together the next time they queue. Everybody wins, the leavers group can queue and leave and the stayers group will complete the dungeon.

Zypheran

As many people alluded to, the reverse view point here is that many players get put into groups and realise after 10-20mins that the other players don't have a high enough level to finish a particular dungeon.
As an example, I queued for a random normal over the weekend with my tank. I got Imperial Prison. Both DDs were under level 20, didn't speak English and didn't know the mechanics for the bosses. After 20mins I had to give up.
I think its wrong to kick players because they are low level or inexperienced so I leave rather than kicking because I think it is equally wrong that somebody should have to spend an hour completing a dungeon that should only take 20mins, especially if you don't have that much online time.

Jitterbug

You can do most non dlc vet dungeons in purple crafted gear even when you're there the first time.
The trick is to listen to the others in your group and be humble and nice.
And be patient because the DPS of puggers may not be high.

Merlin13KAGL

MercTheMage wrote: »

Nahtal wrote: »

Hi all.

ESO is my favo game, serious love it.

But, im getting tired of players that leaves in the middle of a dungeon. Its not the dungeon finder, its that sort of players that make dungeon finder broken.
Why is there not a system like (bad sports (GTAV) or a other system like that. ppl ragging about dungeon finder but most of time they are ruined for other players.

If boss is to difficult they leaves, if it goes not fast enough ppl leaves (pls delete your game)

Sorry for my English but have to say this.

Greetings
Nahtal

As a player who walked out of a dungeon just yesterday, I'd like to respond to this issue.

If people knew what they were doing, this problem wouldn't occur.
I always ask "Does everyone know this fight" if it's a dungeon with a crappy boss, I have never had any issues with explaining a fight and teaching people.
The problem arises when people don't speak up, they don't do their part, or they just *** around in general.

On a separate, yet related issue, low CP players queuing for vet dungeons. If I get queued into vWGT with a CP 24 who queued for it specifically, IM *** LEAVING. I'm not gonna be one of those elitist pricks who v2k a player when they get queued in and they don't meet the requirements.

Then there's the issue of people marking themselves as roles they clearly aren't capable of filling. Like a dps who has breath of life unlocked and thinks "oh hey, I'm a healer now, imma check that box too"

@axbom always tells me "Mercer, do not queue us for this dungeon!" and this^ is exactly why. Everyone has their limits, we end up reaching ours, walking out and being the *** in the story.

The dungeon finder needs to have a notice that shows before you queue "Just because you can queue for a vet dungeon doesn't mean you should."

OP, sounds like there are some detail missing. There are a number of reasons why it can get to the point where "it's time to go," as @MercTheMage already mentioned.

First off, if you whisper the person, they'll usually be straight up about why they departed. Just make sure you're willing to hear the answer if you ask the question.

New, or new to the dungeon, by itself is fine. However, once you've run these enough times ("enough" is a number that varies for a handful of reasons), you will know whether or not it's going to work, long before the end boss.

Low/High CP's are not the end-all-be-all determining factor of content success, either. Most experienced people (which Merc sounds like he/she is) will give things a reasonable try if there is possibility (perhaps sometimes even when there is not), but it reaches a point where the group needs to call it, or if they aren't willing to, individuals must exit.

It would be nice if there was some kind of background 'experience' check that took place in group finder, whether based on achieves, actual clears, or something (account wide, so 'new' characters that are far from new don't get excluded) that would help group similar experience levels together.

This, of course, would make it more difficult for new characters to queue with experienced characters, but I suspect this could be remedied by some kind of daily bonus (as with randoms) for assisting those less familiar with the dungeons, etc.

I don't know what your experience level is, OP. What I do know, regardless, is that you will reach a point where you are able to make a reasonable judgement call based on your experience in the same way Merc did. Most have been on the receiving end of many of things listed above (the no-taunt-bow-(we don't really need a tank for this dungeon)-tank may be my personal favorite.)

If help was offered, suggestions made (assuming someone spoke up), it sounds like Merc did his part. Continuing to beat one's head against the wall over and over doesn't benefit the individual nor the group.

Sometimes it's better to know when to stop than to cause heartache and unnecessary frustration that only leaves a bad taste in everyone's mouth, even more so when some of the group members are new.

Nahtal

Merlin13KAGL wrote: »

MercTheMage wrote: »

Nahtal wrote: »

Hi all.

ESO is my favo game, serious love it.

But, im getting tired of players that leaves in the middle of a dungeon. Its not the dungeon finder, its that sort of players that make dungeon finder broken.
Why is there not a system like (bad sports (GTAV) or a other system like that. ppl ragging about dungeon finder but most of time they are ruined for other players.

If boss is to difficult they leaves, if it goes not fast enough ppl leaves (pls delete your game)

Sorry for my English but have to say this.

Greetings
Nahtal

As a player who walked out of a dungeon just yesterday, I'd like to respond to this issue.

If people knew what they were doing, this problem wouldn't occur.
I always ask "Does everyone know this fight" if it's a dungeon with a crappy boss, I have never had any issues with explaining a fight and teaching people.
The problem arises when people don't speak up, they don't do their part, or they just *** around in general.

On a separate, yet related issue, low CP players queuing for vet dungeons. If I get queued into vWGT with a CP 24 who queued for it specifically, IM *** LEAVING. I'm not gonna be one of those elitist pricks who v2k a player when they get queued in and they don't meet the requirements.

Then there's the issue of people marking themselves as roles they clearly aren't capable of filling. Like a dps who has breath of life unlocked and thinks "oh hey, I'm a healer now, imma check that box too"

@axbom always tells me "Mercer, do not queue us for this dungeon!" and this^ is exactly why. Everyone has their limits, we end up reaching ours, walking out and being the *** in the story.

The dungeon finder needs to have a notice that shows before you queue "Just because you can queue for a vet dungeon doesn't mean you should."

OP, sounds like there are some detail missing. There are a number of reasons why it can get to the point where "it's time to go," as @MercTheMage already mentioned.


I don't know what your experience level is, OP. What I do know, regardless, is that you will reach a point where you are able to make a reasonable judgement call based on your experience in the same way Merc did. Most have been on the receiving end of many of things listed above (the no-taunt-bow-(we don't really need a tank for this dungeon)-tank may be my personal favorite.)

If help was offered, suggestions made (assuming someone spoke up), it sounds like Merc did his part. Continuing to beat one's head against the wall over and over doesn't benefit the individual nor the group.

Sometimes it's better to know when to stop than to cause heartache and unnecessary frustration that only leaves a bad taste in everyone's mouth, even more so when some of the group members are new.

Hi thx for your reply

My experience (is not perfect) but i can also feel when a dungeon is gonna fail. Playing with 3 chars (now at cp329) in all different factions. Heal/Tank/dps (playing best with healing) i understand and i have also notice that ppl say (we don, t need a tank) even if they are a high lvl CP, its just unbelievable because the boss attacks the healer, and then you know how it ends. Maybe i do not explain it right, but yes its like the same as merc,s reaction.

Nahtal

MercTheMage wrote: »

Nahtal wrote: »

Hi all.

ESO is my favo game, serious love it.

But, im getting tired of players that leaves in the middle of a dungeon. Its not the dungeon finder, its that sort of players that make dungeon finder broken.
Why is there not a system like (bad sports (GTAV) or a other system like that. ppl ragging about dungeon finder but most of time they are ruined for other players.

If boss is to difficult they leaves, if it goes not fast enough ppl leaves (pls delete your game)

Sorry for my English but have to say this.

Greetings
Nahtal

As a player who walked out of a dungeon just yesterday, I'd like to respond to this issue.

If people knew what they were doing, this problem wouldn't occur.
I always ask "Does everyone know this fight" if it's a dungeon with a crappy boss, I have never had any issues with explaining a fight and teaching people.
The problem arises when people don't speak up, they don't do their part, or they just *** around in general.

On a separate, yet related issue, low CP players queuing for vet dungeons. If I get queued into vWGT with a CP 24 who queued for it specifically, IM *** LEAVING. I'm not gonna be one of those elitist pricks who v2k a player when they get queued in and they don't meet the requirements.

Then there's the issue of people marking themselves as roles they clearly aren't capable of filling. Like a dps who has breath of life unlocked and thinks "oh hey, I'm a healer now, imma check that box too"

@axbom always tells me "Mercer, do not queue us for this dungeon!" and this^ is exactly why. Everyone has their limits, we end up reaching ours, walking out and being the *** in the story.

The dungeon finder needs to have a notice that shows before you queue "Just because you can queue for a vet dungeon doesn't mean you should."

Thanks for your reaction, that is what i feel but not good can write.

Merlin13KAGL

No problem, @Nahtal . It sounds like you're open to suggestion and that will help.

One other thing to keep in mind is that sometimes the groups just don't work - I've been in max CP runs with experienced players in fights we've done 100's of times, and some days, for whatever reason, it's just not happening.

No harm, no foul. Just try again another day.

Good luck, and keep at it.

Jitterbug

The group finder should have an "elitist" check box it sounds like ;-) jk

visionality

Group finder shouldn't put you in just ANY dungeon with just ANY group but only into dungeons you're qualified for. Like you've done it on normal before you can queue for vet. And you have to have done some of the easier vet dungeons before you can queue for a tough one. Also difficulty descriptions for vet dungeons would be really helpful. Many players have no idea what they get themselves into when they queue for vRoM.

As for the leaving: Sometimes players leave because they are not up for the dungeon they got stuck with. Sometimes they leave because their group is not up for the task. Both are legit reasons in my eyes.