Pelinal's Aptitude Set - can somebody explain to me the 5p bonus?

Seraphayel

Set: http://elderscrollsonline.wiki.fextralife.com/Pelinal's+Aptitude+Set

Bonus: 5p - Your Weapon Damage and Spell Damage both become the highest of the two values.

Can somebody explain this to me? I'm not really understanding what that means for different playstyles. If I have 2000 weapon damage and 1000 spell damage the 5p bonus makes me have 2000 weapon and 2000 spell damage in the end? Or what does that mean?

Would this allow some hybrid stamina / magicka builds? Or is this set trash (maybe nobody tried making builds with it at all)?

IcyDeadPeople

You are correct. It is intended for hybrid builds.

People have come up with some interesting concepts using this set. I know @GottbeardESO @JackDaniell and @lustdog tested it quite a bit.

kongkim

Will be trying to use this on the Warden just to try something new

UrQuan

Seraphayel wrote: »

Set: http://elderscrollsonline.wiki.fextralife.com/Pelinal's+Aptitude+Set

Bonus: 5p - Your Weapon Damage and Spell Damage both become the highest of the two values.

Can somebody explain this to me? I'm not really understanding what that means for different playstyles. If I have 2000 weapon damage and 1000 spell damage the 5p bonus makes me have 2000 weapon and 2000 spell damage in the end? Or what does that mean?

Yes, you've got it exactly. Basically the 5-piece bonus looks at your weapon damage and spell damage, checks to see which one is highest, and boosts the lower one up to match the value of the higher one.

Seraphayel wrote: »

Would this allow some hybrid stamina / magicka builds? Or is this set trash (maybe nobody tried making builds with it at all)?

The idea behind the set is clearly to make hybrid builds more viable. I know there are a couple of people on the forums who say they've had good success with hybrid builds using this set, but I think the general consensus is that it's not really enough to make hybrid builds viable. Having said that, while I've toyed around with the idea, I've never actually tried to do a hybrid build using it so I can't speak from personal experience.

UrQuan

kongkim wrote: »

Will be trying to use this on the Warden just to try something new

Oh, interesting idea. From the descriptions of the Warden skill lines I've been wondering if the class might be a particularly good one for a hybrid build. I might just steal your idea and craft a set of this for my Warden. Now what other crafted set should I pair it with while leveling? Hmm... wheels starting to turn

Dreyloch

What your thinking is correct OP. It makes both those values the same. So if you overload on spell damage, your weapon damage would be the same. Sometimes its not entirely that way, as some buffs and CP's will tweak the numbers a little higher on one stat or the other. But it's typically only a couple hundred points at most

I recall a templar build early on before the sets went live and with Alchemist, Molag Kena, and Pelinal's, some other weapon buffs, he reached close to 6k spell damage. But that was only for a few seconds when everything lined up.

Ilsabet

Would this be a good way for a stamina templar (with all points/enchants/etc pumping stamina) to be able to use their magicka heals effectively?

cjthibs

Ilsabet wrote: »

Would this be a good way for a stamina templar (with all points/enchants/etc pumping stamina) to be able to use their magical heals effectively?

Yes it would. Keep in mind that your magicka pool will still be the same, but it would boost the effectiveness of spells.

Chrlynsch

cjthibs wrote: »

Ilsabet wrote: »

Would this be a good way for a stamina templar (with all points/enchants/etc pumping stamina) to be able to use their magical heals effectively?

Yes it would. Keep in mind that your magicka pool will still be the same, but it would boost the effectiveness of spells.

I use this on my stam templar, in pvp it makes for roughly 8k non crit honor the deads, and in werewolf form 11k hircine heals. Great for tossing out on low health allies. Or countering an enemies strong burst.

WikileaksEU

Wow! I need that set for my hybrid build. Is this set in the game? It means that if you have 2000 spell damage and 500 weapon damage, you instead get 2000 weapon damage.

KochDerDamonen

Yes that is exactly how the set works, and yes the intent is to help hybrid builds work.


Unfortunately it's just not good, it's not well designed or thought out. It completely ignores damage from max resources, splitting regeneration, needing to build more of one damage type to get it to do something, split critical, split champion points. Additionally, for the most part magicka and stamina spells do not synergize with eachother so you will always be losing that odd +x% fire damage on other spells or some penetration or other. Cannot advise it for any role in group PvE, speaking as someone who owns a GOLD pelinal's set...

IF you plan to pvp with this armor set, a lot of that goes out the window and it can be okay. CP offer higher % boons at lower investments, critical isn't as vital to hit degrees on, supporting oneself with various utilities is more important here than in group PvE. I can't speak for how good it is in PvP, but it's certainly more promising there at a glance.

hmsdragonfly

The thing about Pelinal is that you have to be creative.
You see my buffed up spell damage?




PvP Dual Wield/Sword and Shield setup


PvP Dual Wield/Flame Staff setup



Just don't bring this into vet trials. xD

UrQuan

hmsdragonfly wrote: »

The thing about Pelinal is that you have to be creative.
You see my buffed up spell damage?




PvP Dual Wield/Sword and Shield setup


PvP Dual Wield/Flame Staff setup



Just don't bring this into vet trials. xD

Very interesting @hmsdragonfly. I see you're using a lot of prismatic enchants on your gear, and tri-stat food. Your health looks fine for a non-tank, but do you find you have resource issues with this setup, or does it generally work fine for you?

Seraphayel

Mhm so this set seems to be really interesting. I already thought about other problems (resource pools or regeneration) but it could help making spell damage weapons useful for stamina builds or vice versa. Maybe finally a good Magicka DW build with this? Will think about it but the set sounds interesting. But it's quite hard to get, isn't it?

hmsdragonfly

UrQuan wrote: »

hmsdragonfly wrote: »

The thing about Pelinal is that you have to be creative.
You see my buffed up spell damage?




PvP Dual Wield/Sword and Shield setup


PvP Dual Wield/Flame Staff setup



Just don't bring this into vet trials. xD

Very interesting @hmsdragonfly. I see you're using a lot of prismatic enchants on your gear, and tri-stat food. Your health looks fine for a non-tank, but do you find you have resource issues with this setup, or does it generally work fine for you?

As a hybrid I don't need a lot of regen, I sustain ok with pots, heavy attack and ults

hmsdragonfly

Seraphayel wrote: »

Mhm so this set seems to be really interesting. I already thought about other problems (resource pools or regeneration) but it could help making spell damage weapons useful for stamina builds or vice versa. Maybe finally a good Magicka DW build with this? Will think about it but the set sounds interesting. But it's quite hard to get, isn't it?

You will have to be a little bit creative Are you a sorc, or a nb?

Seraphayel

hmsdragonfly wrote: »

Seraphayel wrote: »

Mhm so this set seems to be really interesting. I already thought about other problems (resource pools or regeneration) but it could help making spell damage weapons useful for stamina builds or vice versa. Maybe finally a good Magicka DW build with this? Will think about it but the set sounds interesting. But it's quite hard to get, isn't it?

You will have to be a little bit creative Are you a sorc, or a nb?

Actually I'm a Dragon Knight lol.

Waffennacht

Remember! When this set takes place is after boosts are calculated.

So let's say you have 1000 weapon dmg and 2000 spell dmg, you put on Pelinal your weapon damage becomes 2000. Now let's say you use Werewolf Ability Hiricine's (sp?) Rage that +10% weapon damage (not a named buff) will absolutely do nothing, your weapon damage will remain only 2000. I believe it works the same way with sets that add a flat bonus to only weapon damage or spell damage, they won't change your stats. So using a buff on your weaker stat is rendered useless.

It became a problem for me when trying to make a magicka WW, those buffs in WW do nothing if you have a high spell damage number and Pelinal.

Mivryna

WikileaksEU wrote: »

Wow! I need that set for my hybrid build. Is this set in the game? It means that if you have 2000 spell damage and 500 weapon damage, you instead get 2000 weapon damage.

Most of the time though, you probably wouldn't want to use weapon damage anyway if it's that low. The most effective route is to stack weapon damage since it's so much easier to get a high amount. With full buffs I can get to around 5000 of both at max.

Unfortunately this also limits the max magicka/stamina you can stack since you're stacking so much weapon damage. It ultimately balances out, but leaves you with poorer spell crit.

If the set copied crit over as well, I'd consider using it in a serious fashion.

t3hdubzy

This is a fun set, especially fun in heavy armor. Will be interested on console in using it with some of the imperial city sets getting jewlery.

Prismatic enchants are highly suggested.

I would focus on high weapon damage, and penetration, crit unfortunately will be low. You can use fighters guild to further increase. Also you dont need pelinial on both bars. You could for instance do clever alchemist on your back bar and pelinal on your front bar.

The best way to use this probably is as a magika tank to simply boost your light and heavy attacks, and be able to heal using stamina or magika.

Also its possible to simply build for magika by using weapon damage sets to again get high spell dmg but also enough weapon dmg for light and heavy attacks to mean something.

Lots of other builds that are fun and offer utility mostly tanks, but hard to pull off as a dps.

Seraphayel

Mhm so the set has some major flaws in practice?

How does it not affect buffs and skills when it comes to the calculation of spell / weapon damage?

hmsdragonfly

Seraphayel wrote: »

Mhm so the set has some major flaws in practice?

How does it not affect buffs and skills when it comes to the calculation of spell / weapon damage?

Not really, @Waffennacht meant something else. If you want to take advantage of WW's weapon damage bonus, or Major Brutality, or any weapon damage buff, you will have to stack weapon damage, not spell damage.

If you want to use Major Sorcery (or any other spell damage buff), stack spell damage.
If you want to use Major Brutality (or any other weapon damage buff), stack weapon damage.

Don't stack spell damage then use weapon damage buff.

Chrlynsch

Personally I like running this set in heavy, because you gain resources back with both pools, increasing overall healing received, damage, resistance, heavy attack restore gain.

UrQuan

This thread is giving me all kinds of ideas for trying out a (possibly viable, possibly not) hybrid build... Thanks to everyone for contributing!

MakoFore

would it be possible to use this set to make a 2hand / destro staff build viable? and on which class? anyone got suggestions ideas? I've always wanted to do this- probably on my stam DK or stam sorc- but never been able to figure it out

so what i would want is a typical 2hand skill bar- rally/slice/crit/dizzy/ streak + dawn breaker with a vanilla mag sorc bar- pulse/frags/curse/ crit surge/ vigor - destro ulti. obviously it never works cos the mag pool is always too low to make the dmg tool tip on the magicka skills work. but maybe with this set and tri enchants?

only time I've seen it done succeffuly was fengrush when he got emp.

hmsdragonfly

MakoFore wrote: »

would it be possible to use this set to make a 2hand / destro staff build viable? and on which class? anyone got suggestions ideas? I've always wanted to do this- probably on my stam DK or stam sorc- but never been able to figure it out

so what i would want is a typical 2hand skill bar- rally/slice/crit/dizzy/ streak + dawn breaker with a vanilla mag sorc bar- pulse/frags/curse/ crit surge/ vigor - destro ulti. obviously it never works cos the mag pool is always too low to make the dmg tool tip on the magicka skills work. but maybe with this set and tri enchants?

only time I've seen it done succeffuly was fengrush when he got emp.

Yes.

Front bar: Crystal Frag - Streak - Force Pulse - Hardened Ward - Pet/Mages Light/Bound Armour | Ult: Destro ult
Back bar: Rally - Crit Charge - Dark Conversion - Mages Wrath - Pet/Boundless Storm/Bound Armour | Ult: Overload (put utilities on your overload bar)

It's based on this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L0ChCZeY0g4

You will be able to spam Streak like there's no tomorrow. I say it's OP.

Knootewoot

UrQuan wrote: »

Seraphayel wrote: »

Set: http://elderscrollsonline.wiki.fextralife.com/Pelinal's+Aptitude+Set

Bonus: 5p - Your Weapon Damage and Spell Damage both become the highest of the two values.

Can somebody explain this to me? I'm not really understanding what that means for different playstyles. If I have 2000 weapon damage and 1000 spell damage the 5p bonus makes me have 2000 weapon and 2000 spell damage in the end? Or what does that mean?

Yes, you've got it exactly. Basically the 5-piece bonus looks at your weapon damage and spell damage, checks to see which one is highest, and boosts the lower one up to match the value of the higher one.

Seraphayel wrote: »

Would this allow some hybrid stamina / magicka builds? Or is this set trash (maybe nobody tried making builds with it at all)?

The idea behind the set is clearly to make hybrid builds more viable. I know there are a couple of people on the forums who say they've had good success with hybrid builds using this set, but I think the general consensus is that it's not really enough to make hybrid builds viable. Having said that, while I've toyed around with the idea, I've never actually tried to do a hybrid build using it so I can't speak from personal experience.

It works well, but if you pump all attributes into magicka for example it is still better to use magickal attacks. You can spent on both attributes but as a hybrid you are always weaker then one who maxes out one of the two,

I played hybrid until 1.6. But it didn't work well after 1.5. I wish I could do it as I loved my magblade wielding a bow. That, or I wish we had magical bows.

hmsdragonfly

Knootewoot wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

Seraphayel wrote: »

Set: http://elderscrollsonline.wiki.fextralife.com/Pelinal's+Aptitude+Set

Bonus: 5p - Your Weapon Damage and Spell Damage both become the highest of the two values.

Can somebody explain this to me? I'm not really understanding what that means for different playstyles. If I have 2000 weapon damage and 1000 spell damage the 5p bonus makes me have 2000 weapon and 2000 spell damage in the end? Or what does that mean?

Yes, you've got it exactly. Basically the 5-piece bonus looks at your weapon damage and spell damage, checks to see which one is highest, and boosts the lower one up to match the value of the higher one.

Seraphayel wrote: »

Would this allow some hybrid stamina / magicka builds? Or is this set trash (maybe nobody tried making builds with it at all)?

The idea behind the set is clearly to make hybrid builds more viable. I know there are a couple of people on the forums who say they've had good success with hybrid builds using this set, but I think the general consensus is that it's not really enough to make hybrid builds viable. Having said that, while I've toyed around with the idea, I've never actually tried to do a hybrid build using it so I can't speak from personal experience.

It works well, but if you pump all attributes into magicka for example it is still better to use magickal attacks. You can spent on both attributes but as a hybrid you are always weaker then one who maxes out one of the two,

I played hybrid until 1.6. But it didn't work well after 1.5. I wish I could do it as I loved my magblade wielding a bow. That, or I wish we had magical bows.

@Knootewoot
I have what you need.

2x Velidreth + 4x Pelinals + 1x Pelinal one-handed + 1x Pelinal Bow + 4x Swarm Raider + 1x Swarm Raider one-handed.
5 Medium 1 Light 1 Heavy. Full tri-stat on gear, Full weapon damage on jewelry.

PvP:
Front bar DW: Relentless Focus, Lotus Fan, Power Extraction (or Surprise Attack if you want to use Weapon damage pots), Killer's Blade, Mass Hysteria | Ult: Incap
Back bar Bow: Shadowy Disguise, Siphoning Attacks, Poison Injection, Debilitate/Crippling Grasp/Swallow Soul, Vigor |Ult: An Ult of your choice.

Rotation: Relentless Focus -> Siphoning Attacks -> Shadowy Disguise -> Lotus Fan -> LA -> Power Extraction/Surprise Attack -> Mass Hysteria if they are not stunned -> LA -> Incap -> LA -> Killer's Blade spam. If they run away somehow, Debilitate/Swallow Soul -> Cloak -> HA -> Poison Injection -> Lotus Fan -> spam Killer Blade.

You still have a lot of magicka to cloak like there's no tomorrow.

Try it xD

As for CPs,
100 in Mighty, 5 in Thaumaturge, 15 in Piercing, 30 in Precise Strikes, 20 in Melee Weapon Expert
25 in Elemental Expert, 5 in Blessed

---

Damn, you made me to go farm veli. Screw you.