Remove animation canceling

Oompuh

Someone got macrosliced and is now angry

alexj4596b14_ESO

Oompuh wrote: »

Someone got macrosliced and is now angry

No actually nothing to do with marcos, he uses his fingers i seem him do it all the time.

Liofa

After reading your comments I understand that you don't know how animation cancelling works or how it is done . So , just watch this and learn how to to it and try understand how it works .

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BLZzGoPp9Ug

Thank you .

Jitterbug

Now where did I put that dead horse meme... BRB!

ZOS_JohanaB

Several comments have been removed from this conversation. While everyone may not agree with whats been said you are still expected to be civil and constructive.

Dr_Resilient

alexj4596b14_ESO wrote: »

The end.

I do not understand how you can allow a person to do 5 to 1 attacks in a fight. I have just watched someone i know and play with stoping all animations save for 2 as a nb and stop them from going off. You cant duel him and win under optimal circumstances. it is absurd. The only two ways to win is keep him on his back or out heal his damage.

It takes skill to do that. I'm not that good at this, but it never was a problem for me, too childish to cry about it.

If you want/like competitive things, like PvP or Duels, you need to adapt to the enviroment.

Oreyn_Bearclaw

alexj4596b14_ESO wrote: »

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

Oh good another one of these. You dont understand how global cool downs work. There is no possible way to do 5 separate attacks in 1 second. The game does not allow this. Skills cannot be fired faster than once per second. Period!!!

Somebody got hit by a well timed triple proc gank and has gone to the forums to rage. L2P issue.

alexj4596b14_ESO wrote: »

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

alexj4596b14_ESO wrote: »

actually do to intellectual disability i have the inability to do so.

Then play a Templar, and avoid PvP.

why would i play a game where i can only play half of the game, also you have to animation cancel in order to hit 30k dps in PVE so moot point.

FALSE. Sorry but this is not a true statement. On a typical 40k parse, light attacks (the only real AC done in PVE) make up 3-5% of DPS . Now 99% of people pulling 40K plus are weaving, but thats because they are good players. It is certainly not required though. On 30k parse, it will be even less. 30K is perfectly achievable without any kind of AC.

That is false, at anyone time during any fight i never achieve more then 10k, with weaving in light attacks. My counterpart SAME BUILD same everything cept for monster set, does 15k-20k dps depending what happening and he is weaving while bars witching at the same time. But for fact that is false. thank go back to your cave mr. bear

You need to take a science class or three. Way too many variables in that equation to try and compare. Different players and different monster sets. The monster set alone could be 3-5k DPS. I think your buddy is just better than you, sorry to say. If you can only pull 10k DPS, learning to weave is not going to magically make you pull 30k. I have literally hundreds of parses saved in the 30-40k+ range and my light attacks are never more than about 5% of my total DPS. Bar swap cancelling probably saves you a half a second at most out of every 10 seconds. So again, maybe a few percent. I PVE AC is icing on the cake, not the basis for good parses.

TLDR: If you are only pulling 10k without any type of weaving or AC, you have a fundamental problem with your build, rotation, or understanding of mechanics (perhaps all 3). All the AC in the world is not going to change that.

Edit: Re-read that again. So you are pulling 10k while light weaving? And then you said you buddy is 15-20 with weaving and bar switching? So the only difference is bar swapping? Are you only playing on one bar? I am actually a little confused. I would love to help, but starting to think we need to take a look at that build of yours.

alexj4596b14_ESO

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

alexj4596b14_ESO wrote: »

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

Oh good another one of these. You dont understand how global cool downs work. There is no possible way to do 5 separate attacks in 1 second. The game does not allow this. Skills cannot be fired faster than once per second. Period!!!

Somebody got hit by a well timed triple proc gank and has gone to the forums to rage. L2P issue.

alexj4596b14_ESO wrote: »

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

alexj4596b14_ESO wrote: »

actually do to intellectual disability i have the inability to do so.

Then play a Templar, and avoid PvP.

why would i play a game where i can only play half of the game, also you have to animation cancel in order to hit 30k dps in PVE so moot point.

FALSE. Sorry but this is not a true statement. On a typical 40k parse, light attacks (the only real AC done in PVE) make up 3-5% of DPS . Now 99% of people pulling 40K plus are weaving, but thats because they are good players. It is certainly not required though. On 30k parse, it will be even less. 30K is perfectly achievable without any kind of AC.

That is false, at anyone time during any fight i never achieve more then 10k, with weaving in light attacks. My counterpart SAME BUILD same everything cept for monster set, does 15k-20k dps depending what happening and he is weaving while bars witching at the same time. But for fact that is false. thank go back to your cave mr. bear

You need to take a science class or three. Way too many variables in that equation to try and compare. Different players and different monster sets. The monster set alone could be 3-5k DPS. I think your buddy is just better than you, sorry to say. If you can only pull 10k DPS, learning to weave is not going to magically make you pull 30k. I have literally hundreds of parses saved in the 30-40k+ range and my light attacks are never more than about 5% of my total DPS. Bar swap cancelling probably saves you a half a second at most out of every 10 seconds. So again, maybe a few percent. I PVE AC is icing on the cake, not the basis for good parses.

TLDR: If you are only pulling 10k without any type of weaving or AC, you have a fundamental problem with your build, rotation, or understanding of mechanics (perhaps all 3). All the AC in the world is not going to change that.

Edit: Re-read that again. So you are pulling 10k while light weaving? And then you said you buddy is 15-20 with weaving and bar switching? So the only difference is bar swapping? Are you only playing on one bar? I am actually a little confused. I would love to help, but starting to think we need to take a look at that build of yours.

I have almost 3k spell power and 36k magikca for a mage blade and i still dont even brake 10k dps. soo yah continue. Also didnt i say we have the SAME BUILD?

Oreyn_Bearclaw

alexj4596b14_ESO wrote: »

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

alexj4596b14_ESO wrote: »

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

Oh good another one of these. You dont understand how global cool downs work. There is no possible way to do 5 separate attacks in 1 second. The game does not allow this. Skills cannot be fired faster than once per second. Period!!!

Somebody got hit by a well timed triple proc gank and has gone to the forums to rage. L2P issue.

alexj4596b14_ESO wrote: »

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

alexj4596b14_ESO wrote: »

actually do to intellectual disability i have the inability to do so.

Then play a Templar, and avoid PvP.

why would i play a game where i can only play half of the game, also you have to animation cancel in order to hit 30k dps in PVE so moot point.

FALSE. Sorry but this is not a true statement. On a typical 40k parse, light attacks (the only real AC done in PVE) make up 3-5% of DPS . Now 99% of people pulling 40K plus are weaving, but thats because they are good players. It is certainly not required though. On 30k parse, it will be even less. 30K is perfectly achievable without any kind of AC.

That is false, at anyone time during any fight i never achieve more then 10k, with weaving in light attacks. My counterpart SAME BUILD same everything cept for monster set, does 15k-20k dps depending what happening and he is weaving while bars witching at the same time. But for fact that is false. thank go back to your cave mr. bear

You need to take a science class or three. Way too many variables in that equation to try and compare. Different players and different monster sets. The monster set alone could be 3-5k DPS. I think your buddy is just better than you, sorry to say. If you can only pull 10k DPS, learning to weave is not going to magically make you pull 30k. I have literally hundreds of parses saved in the 30-40k+ range and my light attacks are never more than about 5% of my total DPS. Bar swap cancelling probably saves you a half a second at most out of every 10 seconds. So again, maybe a few percent. I PVE AC is icing on the cake, not the basis for good parses.

TLDR: If you are only pulling 10k without any type of weaving or AC, you have a fundamental problem with your build, rotation, or understanding of mechanics (perhaps all 3). All the AC in the world is not going to change that.

Edit: Re-read that again. So you are pulling 10k while light weaving? And then you said you buddy is 15-20 with weaving and bar switching? So the only difference is bar swapping? Are you only playing on one bar? I am actually a little confused. I would love to help, but starting to think we need to take a look at that build of yours.

I have almost 3k spell power and 36k magikca for a mage blade and i still dont even brake 10k dps. soo yah continue. Also didnt i say we have the SAME BUILD?

You have a L2P issue. Its okay, most people do at first. Might I ask what skills/gear you are running? with those stats if you kept up 2-3 DOTS and spammed funnel health, you would be over 10k.

alexj4596b14_ESO

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

alexj4596b14_ESO wrote: »

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

alexj4596b14_ESO wrote: »

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

Oh good another one of these. You dont understand how global cool downs work. There is no possible way to do 5 separate attacks in 1 second. The game does not allow this. Skills cannot be fired faster than once per second. Period!!!

Somebody got hit by a well timed triple proc gank and has gone to the forums to rage. L2P issue.

alexj4596b14_ESO wrote: »

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

alexj4596b14_ESO wrote: »

actually do to intellectual disability i have the inability to do so.

Then play a Templar, and avoid PvP.

why would i play a game where i can only play half of the game, also you have to animation cancel in order to hit 30k dps in PVE so moot point.

FALSE. Sorry but this is not a true statement. On a typical 40k parse, light attacks (the only real AC done in PVE) make up 3-5% of DPS . Now 99% of people pulling 40K plus are weaving, but thats because they are good players. It is certainly not required though. On 30k parse, it will be even less. 30K is perfectly achievable without any kind of AC.

That is false, at anyone time during any fight i never achieve more then 10k, with weaving in light attacks. My counterpart SAME BUILD same everything cept for monster set, does 15k-20k dps depending what happening and he is weaving while bars witching at the same time. But for fact that is false. thank go back to your cave mr. bear

You need to take a science class or three. Way too many variables in that equation to try and compare. Different players and different monster sets. The monster set alone could be 3-5k DPS. I think your buddy is just better than you, sorry to say. If you can only pull 10k DPS, learning to weave is not going to magically make you pull 30k. I have literally hundreds of parses saved in the 30-40k+ range and my light attacks are never more than about 5% of my total DPS. Bar swap cancelling probably saves you a half a second at most out of every 10 seconds. So again, maybe a few percent. I PVE AC is icing on the cake, not the basis for good parses.

TLDR: If you are only pulling 10k without any type of weaving or AC, you have a fundamental problem with your build, rotation, or understanding of mechanics (perhaps all 3). All the AC in the world is not going to change that.

Edit: Re-read that again. So you are pulling 10k while light weaving? And then you said you buddy is 15-20 with weaving and bar switching? So the only difference is bar swapping? Are you only playing on one bar? I am actually a little confused. I would love to help, but starting to think we need to take a look at that build of yours.

I have almost 3k spell power and 36k magikca for a mage blade and i still dont even brake 10k dps. soo yah continue. Also didnt i say we have the SAME BUILD?

You have a L2P issue. Its okay, most people do at first. Might I ask what skills/gear you are running? with those stats if you kept up 2-3 DOTS and spammed funnel health, you would be over 10k.

Depends on whats going on and group composition as i change based on that. generally speaking i have wall of flames down, refreshing path, and using either funnel health or force pulse as my spam-able. For boss fights i use all of the above and cripple.

As far as sets go, Im running 5 piece jul, 4 piece rattle-cage(because im heaving trouble get the other bounce) and 2 piece monster which is either valkins or kena.

With everything up my stuff alone i'm at 3.2 spell power, without the buff i'm at like 2.6 or something like that. 35k magikca and 17k health, 8k stamina. Crit is at 71%(not all my pieces are mundus because i cant find the traits in mundus with full mundus id be at 80% crit or something closes to it).

masterbroodub17_ESO

Animation canceling is a defect, I would be totally ok with it going away. Rather than focusing on skillfully using your attacks and skills it's a contest of how much you can spam buttons in rapid succession.

Lythandra

I have to agree, AC is a defect. I do it but I do not like it. I'm playing the game now because there isn't anything new but as soon as something interesting comes out I am gone to a more balanced game hopefully.

FriedEggSandwich

masterbroodub17_ESO wrote: »

Animation canceling is a defect, I would be totally ok with it going away. Rather than focusing on skillfully using your attacks and skills it's a contest of how much you can spam buttons in rapid succession.

It really isn't, which is why people get so frustrated with comments like this. Try spamming all the buttons as fast as you can to see where that gets you. Animation cancelling is all about rhythm and timing and gently tapping buttons, nothing to do with streetfighter-style button mashing.

masterbroodub17_ESO

FriedEggSandwich wrote: »

masterbroodub17_ESO wrote: »

Animation canceling is a defect, I would be totally ok with it going away. Rather than focusing on skillfully using your attacks and skills it's a contest of how much you can spam buttons in rapid succession.

It really isn't, which is why people get so frustrated with comments like this. Try spamming all the buttons as fast as you can to see where that gets you. Animation cancelling is all about rhythm and timing and gently tapping buttons, nothing to do with streetfighter-style button mashing.

Pretty sure all the guides specifically tell you "Press X buttons rapidly" and "Always be doing this" Which equates to "always be rapidly hitting buttons"

FriedEggSandwich

masterbroodub17_ESO wrote: »

FriedEggSandwich wrote: »

masterbroodub17_ESO wrote: »

Animation canceling is a defect, I would be totally ok with it going away. Rather than focusing on skillfully using your attacks and skills it's a contest of how much you can spam buttons in rapid succession.

It really isn't, which is why people get so frustrated with comments like this. Try spamming all the buttons as fast as you can to see where that gets you. Animation cancelling is all about rhythm and timing and gently tapping buttons, nothing to do with streetfighter-style button mashing.

Pretty sure all the guides specifically tell you "Press X buttons rapidly" and "Always be doing this" Which equates to "always be rapidly hitting buttons"

No lol

Oreyn_Bearclaw

You gear is not wonderful, but will certainly work. I am gonna give you some advice, and I encourage you to give it a try.

Gear:
Again, not my favorite setup, but it should give decent stats. Do not mess with Kena. It is a set that was designed with weaving in mind. It is very difficult to keep the buff up and even more difficult to sustain. On a NB, I would run Skoria, Grothdarr or even Llambris. When learning, Skoria is great because it will give some extra health. Purple gear is fine, but you really want gold weapons if you can. You want a flames staff front bar and either a second staff or DW swords back bar. Most people have moved to a 2 staff build on NB.

3 Important things:
-1. Try for as much divines as possible (using the Thief Mundus).
-2. Make sure your weapons are the sharp trait. It is far and away the most DPS. This is way more important than your armor traits. I cannot stress this point enough, SHARP IS OP. With your crit, it looks like you are running precise, and precise simply blows. It will blow harder next patch.
-3. Make sure you are wearing 5 light pieces of armor. The passives you get from 5 light are very strong. If you arent wearing 5 light, your DPS is not going to be good. With your gear, I am assuming you have rattlecage jewelry and one armor piece, and Julianos armor x4 and weapons, with monster head and shoulders. To get 5 light, all your Julianos and one of your monster pieces need to be light.

Enchants

You want magic on all your armor, spell damage on your jewelry, and Spell power on one or both of your weapons.


Attributes, Food, CP

Your attributes are touch low, so you might be struggling somewhere in here. If you are wearing skoria and rattlecage, you are getting 2 Health buffs. You should be able to go 64 in magic, but this is where you can adjust for more health if you need. I would try to get to about 18k. Better to adjust health with Attributes instead of glyphs. It is much cheaper to make adjustments. Always run Blue Health+Magic Food. As for CP, the blue tree is what affects DPS. Max out ele expert, then go about 2 to 1 in elfborn and thaumaturge. Plenty of threads if if you want to get more specific.

Skills

There are many ways to set up your skill bars. I suggest running Inner Light on both bars for the crit and magic buff, which leaves 8 Skills to mess with (not counting ultimates): Funnel Health, Sap Essence, Impale, Crippling Grasp, Elemental Blockade, Twisting/Refreshing Path, Merciless resolve, Siphoning Strikes.

Spam: Nightblades have two spam skills. Funnel Health, and Sap essence. The first is single target, the second is AOE. That should be pretty self explanatory on when to use what (3 or more bad guys, use sap). Remember, you only spam your spammable when all your DOTS and buffs are ticking. Dont mess with force pulse unless you are in a proper raid group. Its more DPS, but Funnel will keep you alive. In a pure single target boss fight, you can replace sap essence with a shield for protection or Rearming trap for more DPS.

DOTs: Try to get a rotation where you cast all your DOTS in a row. All three of these skills below have close to the same duration. Much easier to do it in a pattern. Cast the longest duration first and shortest duration last. The number one place people screw up is over casting their DOTs. They are only worth casting if you let them run their full course, my guess is you have issues here. The three big ones are Elemental Blackade, Twising Path, and crippling grasp. Cast all three in a row and let them tick. NEVER re-cast them before they have run their course.

Buffs: There are two buffs worth talking about. Merciless resolve, Siphoning strikes. I would not mess with the spectral bow proc from merciless until you get comfortable. Again, this is a skill designed with animation canceling in mind. Just cast it every 20 seconds for the damage buff. Siphoning is all about sustain. I suggest casting this every time your magic hits about 50%. It is also a good idea to cast both of these skills before you pull a fight.

You also need to get your spell power buff (major Sorcery) from somewhere. Sap essence gives it to you, but the most reliable way is to run spell power potions on cooldown.

Execute: Nightblades have a powerful execute with Impale. This skill is garbage if the boss has 26% or more health. Once they hit 25%, this becomes your spammable. You still want to keep up your DOTS, but spam away when the boss hits 25%.

I really do encourage you to look through this. I know it can be daunting and its frustrating when you are only pulling 10k and you see others doing way more. I promise you, AC is not the issue here, bud. My guess is there is a lot of stuff above that you simply havent considered or arent doing. Keep your rotation simple and consistent at first, as you get more comfortable, you can get more nuanced.

FriedEggSandwich

masterbroodub17_ESO wrote: »

FriedEggSandwich wrote: »

masterbroodub17_ESO wrote: »

Animation canceling is a defect, I would be totally ok with it going away. Rather than focusing on skillfully using your attacks and skills it's a contest of how much you can spam buttons in rapid succession.

It really isn't, which is why people get so frustrated with comments like this. Try spamming all the buttons as fast as you can to see where that gets you. Animation cancelling is all about rhythm and timing and gently tapping buttons, nothing to do with streetfighter-style button mashing.

Pretty sure all the guides specifically tell you "Press X buttons rapidly" and "Always be doing this" Which equates to "always be rapidly hitting buttons"

Sorry, I'll try to be more constructive. Animation canceling isn't pressing the buttons as fast as you can, it's pressing the buttons as fast as the game will let you. There's a difference there; to push the buttons as fast as the game will let you you first need to learn how fast that is, because pushing them too fast will freeze up your controls and you won't do any damage.

I will try to convey the specific rhythm for light attack weaving with a block cancel.
It's "tap - taptap, tap - taptap, tap - taptap" etc, where the first "tap" is your light attack, the " - " is a ~0.4s pause, the first tap of "taptap" is your instant cast skill, and the second tap of "taptap" is block. If you do this too fast then either your light attack doesn't fire, or your skill doesn't fire and you lose damage. You need to do it slowly enough that the actions register.

You don't even need to block cancel, in fact doing so can actually be bad if you're also taking damage because you will just drain your stamina. To do a simple light attack weave you just tap light attack, wait ~0.4s, tap skill and immediately tap light attack again, wait ~0.4s, tap skill and immediately tap light attack again etc. That's literally all light attack weaving is.

Oreyn_Bearclaw

masterbroodub17_ESO wrote: »

FriedEggSandwich wrote: »

masterbroodub17_ESO wrote: »

Animation canceling is a defect, I would be totally ok with it going away. Rather than focusing on skillfully using your attacks and skills it's a contest of how much you can spam buttons in rapid succession.

It really isn't, which is why people get so frustrated with comments like this. Try spamming all the buttons as fast as you can to see where that gets you. Animation cancelling is all about rhythm and timing and gently tapping buttons, nothing to do with streetfighter-style button mashing.

Pretty sure all the guides specifically tell you "Press X buttons rapidly" and "Always be doing this" Which equates to "always be rapidly hitting buttons"

Please show me the guides. What we are talking her primarily about is OP struggling to pull competitive DPS in PVE. I sound like a broken record, but even if you were able to press a skill 10 times a second, it will not fire faster than once a second. Global Cooldowns prevent this.

In PVE, there are two ways we can animation cancel to help our DPS, neither of which is earth shattering.

First, as skills can only fire once per second, what we want to do is sneak in another bit of damage on top of that. This is called weaving. We light attack and then quickly follow with a skill. So in a simple example: in 10 seconds, you can cast Funnel health 10 times. This is true whether you press the skill button 10 times or 10000 times in that window. It is impossible to cast it more than that. If you think differently, you are wrong, sorry to say.

What we can do however, is add in 10 light attacks if you weave properly. So in that same 10 second window, now you have 10 light attacks AND 10 Funnel Health (Light attack >Skill, Light Attack>Skill, Etc). This is weaving 101. It absolutely adds DPS, but not to the extreme people are suggesting. I try to weave every skill, and my light attacks are normally about 5% of my DPS. It will not take you from 10k to 30k. But it might take you from 35 to 40.

Second, we can swap cancel skills. Most people do this without realizing. You cast a skill and then immediately swap. It doesnt do anything to your global cooldowns. The next skill you cast is still going to be 1 second later, but it effectively takes away the time it takes you to do the bar swap itself because the previous Animation was cut short. Same thing happens when you block. The most aggressive rotations have you bar swap every 10 seconds or so. Does this help DPS, yes, but again, it might save you a half a second every 10-15 seconds.

That's it. Button mashing does not get around global cooldowns on skills.

In PVP, there are some skill combos that can be timed to hit all at once for PVP. For example, I can cast snipe followed by ambush and they will both hit at the same time. That's because snipe takes a while to travel. You can also weave an attack in with ambush. If you are wearing 3 proc sets that all happen to fire, it can feel like someone cast 5-6 skills at once, but in reality they did not. I will fully admit that there are some skill combos that probably need to be looked at and adjusted, which they have already done and I am sure they will continue to do. But please dont confuse this with PVE weaving and bar swapping. They are not even close to the same thing.

FriedEggSandwich

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

masterbroodub17_ESO wrote: »

FriedEggSandwich wrote: »

masterbroodub17_ESO wrote: »

Animation canceling is a defect, I would be totally ok with it going away. Rather than focusing on skillfully using your attacks and skills it's a contest of how much you can spam buttons in rapid succession.

It really isn't, which is why people get so frustrated with comments like this. Try spamming all the buttons as fast as you can to see where that gets you. Animation cancelling is all about rhythm and timing and gently tapping buttons, nothing to do with streetfighter-style button mashing.

Pretty sure all the guides specifically tell you "Press X buttons rapidly" and "Always be doing this" Which equates to "always be rapidly hitting buttons"

Please show me the guides. What we are talking her primarily about is OP struggling to pull competitive DPS in PVE. I sound like a broken record, but even if you were able to press a skill 10 times a second, it will not fire faster than once a second. Global Cooldowns prevent this.

In PVE, there are two ways we can animation cancel to help our DPS, neither of which is earth shattering.

First, as skills can only fire once per second, what we want to do is sneak in another bit of damage on top of that. This is called weaving. We light attack and then quickly follow with a skill. So in a simple example: in 10 seconds, you can cast Funnel health 10 times. This is true whether you press the skill button 10 times or 10000 times in that window. It is impossible to cast it more than that. If you think differently, you are wrong, sorry to say.

What we can do however, is add in 10 light attacks if you weave properly. So in that same 10 second window, now you have 10 light attacks AND 10 Funnel Health (Light attack >Skill, Light Attack>Skill, Etc). This is weaving 101. It absolutely adds DPS, but not to the extreme people are suggesting. I try to weave every skill, and my light attacks are normally about 5% of my DPS. It will not take you from 10k to 30k. But it might take you from 35 to 40.

Second, we can swap cancel skills. Most people do this without realizing. You cast a skill and then immediately swap. It doesnt do anything to your global cooldowns. The next skill you cast is still going to be 1 second later, but it effectively takes away the time it takes you to do the bar swap itself because the previous Animation was cut short. Same thing happens when you block. The most aggressive rotations have you bar swap every 10 seconds or so. Does this help DPS, yes, but again, it might save you a half a second every 10-15 seconds.

That's it. Button mashing does not get around global cooldowns on skills.

In PVP, there are some skill combos that can be timed to hit all at once for PVP. For example, I can cast snipe followed by ambush and they will both hit at the same time. That's because snipe takes a while to travel. You can also weave an attack in with ambush. If you are wearing 3 proc sets that all happen to fire, it can feel like someone cast 5-6 skills at once, but in reality they did not. I will fully admit that there are some skill combos that probably need to be looked at and adjusted, which they have already done and I am sure they will continue to do. But please dont confuse this with PVE weaving and bar swapping. They are not even close to the same thing.

Well done, you explained better than I did

QahnaarinDynar

alexj4596b14_ESO wrote: »

The end.

I do not understand how you can allow a person to do 5 to 1 attacks in a fight. I have just watched someone i know and play with stopping all animations save for 2 as a nb and stop them from going off. You cant duel him and win under optimal circumstances. it is absurd. The only two ways to win is keep him on his back or out heal his damage.

No. Not the end. Threads like these always come and go, and they're always from the same stock. I'll be straight about it and say I suck at animation cancelling but lately with a bit of time I've been able to get the hang of it. This is a L2P issue, and whenever I get my ass handed to me by someone who actually knows what they're doing I'm quite happy taking it from a skilled player. Why? Because it gives me an incentive to become better at the game.

Also you might want to ask your friend if he's using macro's. Getting hit by that many a time is not something that you could really do using normal animation cancelling techniques.

Fortunately getting rid of animation cancelling would mean completely overhauling the combat system, and I'm glad ZoS won't be considering that any time in the near future.

alexj4596b14_ESO

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

You gear is not wonderful, but will certainly work. I am gonna give you some advice, and I encourage you to give it a try.

Gear:
Again, not my favorite setup, but it should give decent stats. Do not mess with Kena. It is a set that was designed with weaving in mind. It is very difficult to keep the buff up and even more difficult to sustain. On a NB, I would run Skoria, Grothdarr or even Llambris. When learning, Skoria is great because it will give some extra health. Purple gear is fine, but you really want gold weapons if you can. You want a flames staff front bar and either a second staff or DW swords back bar. Most people have moved to a 2 staff build on NB.

3 Important things:
-1. Try for as much divines as possible (using the Thief Mundus).
-2. Make sure your weapons are the sharp trait. It is far and away the most DPS. This is way more important than your armor traits. I cannot stress this point enough, SHARP IS OP. With your crit, it looks like you are running precise, and precise simply blows. It will blow harder next patch.
-3. Make sure you are wearing 5 light pieces of armor. The passives you get from 5 light are very strong. If you arent wearing 5 light, your DPS is not going to be good. With your gear, I am assuming you have rattlecage jewelry and one armor piece, and Julianos armor x4 and weapons, with monster head and shoulders. To get 5 light, all your Julianos and one of your monster pieces need to be light.

Enchants

You want magic on all your armor, spell damage on your jewelry, and Spell power on one or both of your weapons.


Attributes, Food, CP

Your attributes are touch low, so you might be struggling somewhere in here. If you are wearing skoria and rattlecage, you are getting 2 Health buffs. You should be able to go 64 in magic, but this is where you can adjust for more health if you need. I would try to get to about 18k. Better to adjust health with Attributes instead of glyphs. It is much cheaper to make adjustments. Always run Blue Health+Magic Food. As for CP, the blue tree is what affects DPS. Max out ele expert, then go about 2 to 1 in elfborn and thaumaturge. Plenty of threads if if you want to get more specific.

Skills

There are many ways to set up your skill bars. I suggest running Inner Light on both bars for the crit and magic buff, which leaves 8 Skills to mess with (not counting ultimates): Funnel Health, Sap Essence, Impale, Crippling Grasp, Elemental Blockade, Twisting/Refreshing Path, Merciless resolve, Siphoning Strikes.

Spam: Nightblades have two spam skills. Funnel Health, and Sap essence. The first is single target, the second is AOE. That should be pretty self explanatory on when to use what (3 or more bad guys, use sap). Remember, you only spam your spammable when all your DOTS and buffs are ticking. Dont mess with force pulse unless you are in a proper raid group. Its more DPS, but Funnel will keep you alive. In a pure single target boss fight, you can replace sap essence with a shield for protection or Rearming trap for more DPS.

DOTs: Try to get a rotation where you cast all your DOTS in a row. All three of these skills below have close to the same duration. Much easier to do it in a pattern. Cast the longest duration first and shortest duration last. The number one place people screw up is over casting their DOTs. They are only worth casting if you let them run their full course, my guess is you have issues here. The three big ones are Elemental Blackade, Twising Path, and crippling grasp. Cast all three in a row and let them tick. NEVER re-cast them before they have run their course.

Buffs: There are two buffs worth talking about. Merciless resolve, Siphoning strikes. I would not mess with the spectral bow proc from merciless until you get comfortable. Again, this is a skill designed with animation canceling in mind. Just cast it every 20 seconds for the damage buff. Siphoning is all about sustain. I suggest casting this every time your magic hits about 50%. It is also a good idea to cast both of these skills before you pull a fight.

You also need to get your spell power buff (major Sorcery) from somewhere. Sap essence gives it to you, but the most reliable way is to run spell power potions on cooldown.

Execute: Nightblades have a powerful execute with Impale. This skill is garbage if the boss has 26% or more health. Once they hit 25%, this becomes your spammable. You still want to keep up your DOTS, but spam away when the boss hits 25%.

I really do encourage you to look through this. I know it can be daunting and its frustrating when you are only pulling 10k and you see others doing way more. I promise you, AC is not the issue here, bud. My guess is there is a lot of stuff above that you simply havent considered or arent doing. Keep your rotation simple and consistent at first, as you get more comfortable, you can get more nuanced.

So i have every ability on my bar that you spoke about already also i am aware if you dont let the dots do their job its pretty much worthless to use them. With both Wall of Elements and Path, along with crippling grasp. and funnel health on single target i do not exceed 10k. Even light weaving (i can manage most of the time if im not running away from some damage on the ground or something in PvE in pvp i cant even being to try.)

This is what i run for skills thus far.What I Run
Along with the monster sets.

Oreyn_Bearclaw

alexj4596b14_ESO wrote: »

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

You gear is not wonderful, but will certainly work. I am gonna give you some advice, and I encourage you to give it a try.

Gear:
Again, not my favorite setup, but it should give decent stats. Do not mess with Kena. It is a set that was designed with weaving in mind. It is very difficult to keep the buff up and even more difficult to sustain. On a NB, I would run Skoria, Grothdarr or even Llambris. When learning, Skoria is great because it will give some extra health. Purple gear is fine, but you really want gold weapons if you can. You want a flames staff front bar and either a second staff or DW swords back bar. Most people have moved to a 2 staff build on NB.

3 Important things:
-1. Try for as much divines as possible (using the Thief Mundus).
-2. Make sure your weapons are the sharp trait. It is far and away the most DPS. This is way more important than your armor traits. I cannot stress this point enough, SHARP IS OP. With your crit, it looks like you are running precise, and precise simply blows. It will blow harder next patch.
-3. Make sure you are wearing 5 light pieces of armor. The passives you get from 5 light are very strong. If you arent wearing 5 light, your DPS is not going to be good. With your gear, I am assuming you have rattlecage jewelry and one armor piece, and Julianos armor x4 and weapons, with monster head and shoulders. To get 5 light, all your Julianos and one of your monster pieces need to be light.

Enchants

You want magic on all your armor, spell damage on your jewelry, and Spell power on one or both of your weapons.


Attributes, Food, CP

Your attributes are touch low, so you might be struggling somewhere in here. If you are wearing skoria and rattlecage, you are getting 2 Health buffs. You should be able to go 64 in magic, but this is where you can adjust for more health if you need. I would try to get to about 18k. Better to adjust health with Attributes instead of glyphs. It is much cheaper to make adjustments. Always run Blue Health+Magic Food. As for CP, the blue tree is what affects DPS. Max out ele expert, then go about 2 to 1 in elfborn and thaumaturge. Plenty of threads if if you want to get more specific.

Skills

There are many ways to set up your skill bars. I suggest running Inner Light on both bars for the crit and magic buff, which leaves 8 Skills to mess with (not counting ultimates): Funnel Health, Sap Essence, Impale, Crippling Grasp, Elemental Blockade, Twisting/Refreshing Path, Merciless resolve, Siphoning Strikes.

Spam: Nightblades have two spam skills. Funnel Health, and Sap essence. The first is single target, the second is AOE. That should be pretty self explanatory on when to use what (3 or more bad guys, use sap). Remember, you only spam your spammable when all your DOTS and buffs are ticking. Dont mess with force pulse unless you are in a proper raid group. Its more DPS, but Funnel will keep you alive. In a pure single target boss fight, you can replace sap essence with a shield for protection or Rearming trap for more DPS.

DOTs: Try to get a rotation where you cast all your DOTS in a row. All three of these skills below have close to the same duration. Much easier to do it in a pattern. Cast the longest duration first and shortest duration last. The number one place people screw up is over casting their DOTs. They are only worth casting if you let them run their full course, my guess is you have issues here. The three big ones are Elemental Blackade, Twising Path, and crippling grasp. Cast all three in a row and let them tick. NEVER re-cast them before they have run their course.

Buffs: There are two buffs worth talking about. Merciless resolve, Siphoning strikes. I would not mess with the spectral bow proc from merciless until you get comfortable. Again, this is a skill designed with animation canceling in mind. Just cast it every 20 seconds for the damage buff. Siphoning is all about sustain. I suggest casting this every time your magic hits about 50%. It is also a good idea to cast both of these skills before you pull a fight.

You also need to get your spell power buff (major Sorcery) from somewhere. Sap essence gives it to you, but the most reliable way is to run spell power potions on cooldown.

Execute: Nightblades have a powerful execute with Impale. This skill is garbage if the boss has 26% or more health. Once they hit 25%, this becomes your spammable. You still want to keep up your DOTS, but spam away when the boss hits 25%.

I really do encourage you to look through this. I know it can be daunting and its frustrating when you are only pulling 10k and you see others doing way more. I promise you, AC is not the issue here, bud. My guess is there is a lot of stuff above that you simply havent considered or arent doing. Keep your rotation simple and consistent at first, as you get more comfortable, you can get more nuanced.

So i have every ability on my bar that you spoke about already also i am aware if you dont let the dots do their job its pretty much worthless to use them. With both Wall of Elements and Path, along with crippling grasp. and funnel health on single target i do not exceed 10k. Even light weaving (i can manage most of the time if im not running away from some damage on the ground or something in PvE in pvp i cant even being to try.)

This is what i run for skills thus far.What I Run
Along with the monster sets.

If you are doing EVERYTHING above, you have rotation problem somewhere. Are you on PC? I would get an addon called combat metrics and try a few boss fights and post some parses. It might become clear where you are messing up. If on console, then I would suggest posting a video. Simply put, you should be pulling well above 10k with that setup and rotation, with or without animation canceling.

alexj4596b14_ESO

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

alexj4596b14_ESO wrote: »

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

You gear is not wonderful, but will certainly work. I am gonna give you some advice, and I encourage you to give it a try.

Gear:
Again, not my favorite setup, but it should give decent stats. Do not mess with Kena. It is a set that was designed with weaving in mind. It is very difficult to keep the buff up and even more difficult to sustain. On a NB, I would run Skoria, Grothdarr or even Llambris. When learning, Skoria is great because it will give some extra health. Purple gear is fine, but you really want gold weapons if you can. You want a flames staff front bar and either a second staff or DW swords back bar. Most people have moved to a 2 staff build on NB.

3 Important things:
-1. Try for as much divines as possible (using the Thief Mundus).
-2. Make sure your weapons are the sharp trait. It is far and away the most DPS. This is way more important than your armor traits. I cannot stress this point enough, SHARP IS OP. With your crit, it looks like you are running precise, and precise simply blows. It will blow harder next patch.
-3. Make sure you are wearing 5 light pieces of armor. The passives you get from 5 light are very strong. If you arent wearing 5 light, your DPS is not going to be good. With your gear, I am assuming you have rattlecage jewelry and one armor piece, and Julianos armor x4 and weapons, with monster head and shoulders. To get 5 light, all your Julianos and one of your monster pieces need to be light.

Enchants

You want magic on all your armor, spell damage on your jewelry, and Spell power on one or both of your weapons.


Attributes, Food, CP

Your attributes are touch low, so you might be struggling somewhere in here. If you are wearing skoria and rattlecage, you are getting 2 Health buffs. You should be able to go 64 in magic, but this is where you can adjust for more health if you need. I would try to get to about 18k. Better to adjust health with Attributes instead of glyphs. It is much cheaper to make adjustments. Always run Blue Health+Magic Food. As for CP, the blue tree is what affects DPS. Max out ele expert, then go about 2 to 1 in elfborn and thaumaturge. Plenty of threads if if you want to get more specific.

Skills

There are many ways to set up your skill bars. I suggest running Inner Light on both bars for the crit and magic buff, which leaves 8 Skills to mess with (not counting ultimates): Funnel Health, Sap Essence, Impale, Crippling Grasp, Elemental Blockade, Twisting/Refreshing Path, Merciless resolve, Siphoning Strikes.

Spam: Nightblades have two spam skills. Funnel Health, and Sap essence. The first is single target, the second is AOE. That should be pretty self explanatory on when to use what (3 or more bad guys, use sap). Remember, you only spam your spammable when all your DOTS and buffs are ticking. Dont mess with force pulse unless you are in a proper raid group. Its more DPS, but Funnel will keep you alive. In a pure single target boss fight, you can replace sap essence with a shield for protection or Rearming trap for more DPS.

DOTs: Try to get a rotation where you cast all your DOTS in a row. All three of these skills below have close to the same duration. Much easier to do it in a pattern. Cast the longest duration first and shortest duration last. The number one place people screw up is over casting their DOTs. They are only worth casting if you let them run their full course, my guess is you have issues here. The three big ones are Elemental Blackade, Twising Path, and crippling grasp. Cast all three in a row and let them tick. NEVER re-cast them before they have run their course.

Buffs: There are two buffs worth talking about. Merciless resolve, Siphoning strikes. I would not mess with the spectral bow proc from merciless until you get comfortable. Again, this is a skill designed with animation canceling in mind. Just cast it every 20 seconds for the damage buff. Siphoning is all about sustain. I suggest casting this every time your magic hits about 50%. It is also a good idea to cast both of these skills before you pull a fight.

You also need to get your spell power buff (major Sorcery) from somewhere. Sap essence gives it to you, but the most reliable way is to run spell power potions on cooldown.

Execute: Nightblades have a powerful execute with Impale. This skill is garbage if the boss has 26% or more health. Once they hit 25%, this becomes your spammable. You still want to keep up your DOTS, but spam away when the boss hits 25%.

I really do encourage you to look through this. I know it can be daunting and its frustrating when you are only pulling 10k and you see others doing way more. I promise you, AC is not the issue here, bud. My guess is there is a lot of stuff above that you simply havent considered or arent doing. Keep your rotation simple and consistent at first, as you get more comfortable, you can get more nuanced.

So i have every ability on my bar that you spoke about already also i am aware if you dont let the dots do their job its pretty much worthless to use them. With both Wall of Elements and Path, along with crippling grasp. and funnel health on single target i do not exceed 10k. Even light weaving (i can manage most of the time if im not running away from some damage on the ground or something in PvE in pvp i cant even being to try.)

This is what i run for skills thus far.What I Run
Along with the monster sets.

If you are doing EVERYTHING above, you have rotation problem somewhere. Are you on PC? I would get an addon called combat metrics and try a few boss fights and post some parses. It might become clear where you are messing up. If on console, then I would suggest posting a video. Simply put, you should be pulling well above 10k with that setup and rotation, with or without animation canceling.

Yes im on PC, and i have been useing FTC for my dps counter as i didnt really need another

Druwe

Wow there's always sooooo much hate when it comes to these issues.

Animation cancelling is a fact of the game hate it or love it. It is not magic though - you still cant be hit with say 5 jabs in the time it takes to do one. That's magic ( or CE or a macro) not AC. If that kind of thing that's going on then it is right to call shenanigans. If someone is AC light attacks etc it will show on your toggle report too. Obviously block cancelling etc won't.

It does take skills to be best in slot. And those skills include learning to AC. But you can be quite acceptable not using AC. U probably wont be asked to do VMoL though and for a reason. U can of course easily do most of the other vet trials though and also pvp with an amount of success but u will never achieve Jedi's kind of skill level without AC. It's another skill people learn like choosing the right gear and rotation and theory crafting. These skills may not be obvious in game but they are still valuable skills to have.

Good luck - little ones - may you go forth and have fun - that's all we all really want to do in a game isn't it?

Oreyn_Bearclaw

alexj4596b14_ESO wrote: »

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

alexj4596b14_ESO wrote: »

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

You gear is not wonderful, but will certainly work. I am gonna give you some advice, and I encourage you to give it a try.

Gear:
Again, not my favorite setup, but it should give decent stats. Do not mess with Kena. It is a set that was designed with weaving in mind. It is very difficult to keep the buff up and even more difficult to sustain. On a NB, I would run Skoria, Grothdarr or even Llambris. When learning, Skoria is great because it will give some extra health. Purple gear is fine, but you really want gold weapons if you can. You want a flames staff front bar and either a second staff or DW swords back bar. Most people have moved to a 2 staff build on NB.

3 Important things:
-1. Try for as much divines as possible (using the Thief Mundus).
-2. Make sure your weapons are the sharp trait. It is far and away the most DPS. This is way more important than your armor traits. I cannot stress this point enough, SHARP IS OP. With your crit, it looks like you are running precise, and precise simply blows. It will blow harder next patch.
-3. Make sure you are wearing 5 light pieces of armor. The passives you get from 5 light are very strong. If you arent wearing 5 light, your DPS is not going to be good. With your gear, I am assuming you have rattlecage jewelry and one armor piece, and Julianos armor x4 and weapons, with monster head and shoulders. To get 5 light, all your Julianos and one of your monster pieces need to be light.

Enchants

You want magic on all your armor, spell damage on your jewelry, and Spell power on one or both of your weapons.


Attributes, Food, CP

Your attributes are touch low, so you might be struggling somewhere in here. If you are wearing skoria and rattlecage, you are getting 2 Health buffs. You should be able to go 64 in magic, but this is where you can adjust for more health if you need. I would try to get to about 18k. Better to adjust health with Attributes instead of glyphs. It is much cheaper to make adjustments. Always run Blue Health+Magic Food. As for CP, the blue tree is what affects DPS. Max out ele expert, then go about 2 to 1 in elfborn and thaumaturge. Plenty of threads if if you want to get more specific.

Skills

There are many ways to set up your skill bars. I suggest running Inner Light on both bars for the crit and magic buff, which leaves 8 Skills to mess with (not counting ultimates): Funnel Health, Sap Essence, Impale, Crippling Grasp, Elemental Blockade, Twisting/Refreshing Path, Merciless resolve, Siphoning Strikes.

Spam: Nightblades have two spam skills. Funnel Health, and Sap essence. The first is single target, the second is AOE. That should be pretty self explanatory on when to use what (3 or more bad guys, use sap). Remember, you only spam your spammable when all your DOTS and buffs are ticking. Dont mess with force pulse unless you are in a proper raid group. Its more DPS, but Funnel will keep you alive. In a pure single target boss fight, you can replace sap essence with a shield for protection or Rearming trap for more DPS.

DOTs: Try to get a rotation where you cast all your DOTS in a row. All three of these skills below have close to the same duration. Much easier to do it in a pattern. Cast the longest duration first and shortest duration last. The number one place people screw up is over casting their DOTs. They are only worth casting if you let them run their full course, my guess is you have issues here. The three big ones are Elemental Blackade, Twising Path, and crippling grasp. Cast all three in a row and let them tick. NEVER re-cast them before they have run their course.

Buffs: There are two buffs worth talking about. Merciless resolve, Siphoning strikes. I would not mess with the spectral bow proc from merciless until you get comfortable. Again, this is a skill designed with animation canceling in mind. Just cast it every 20 seconds for the damage buff. Siphoning is all about sustain. I suggest casting this every time your magic hits about 50%. It is also a good idea to cast both of these skills before you pull a fight.

You also need to get your spell power buff (major Sorcery) from somewhere. Sap essence gives it to you, but the most reliable way is to run spell power potions on cooldown.

Execute: Nightblades have a powerful execute with Impale. This skill is garbage if the boss has 26% or more health. Once they hit 25%, this becomes your spammable. You still want to keep up your DOTS, but spam away when the boss hits 25%.

I really do encourage you to look through this. I know it can be daunting and its frustrating when you are only pulling 10k and you see others doing way more. I promise you, AC is not the issue here, bud. My guess is there is a lot of stuff above that you simply havent considered or arent doing. Keep your rotation simple and consistent at first, as you get more comfortable, you can get more nuanced.

So i have every ability on my bar that you spoke about already also i am aware if you dont let the dots do their job its pretty much worthless to use them. With both Wall of Elements and Path, along with crippling grasp. and funnel health on single target i do not exceed 10k. Even light weaving (i can manage most of the time if im not running away from some damage on the ground or something in PvE in pvp i cant even being to try.)

This is what i run for skills thus far.What I Run
Along with the monster sets.

If you are doing EVERYTHING above, you have rotation problem somewhere. Are you on PC? I would get an addon called combat metrics and try a few boss fights and post some parses. It might become clear where you are messing up. If on console, then I would suggest posting a video. Simply put, you should be pulling well above 10k with that setup and rotation, with or without animation canceling.

Yes im on PC, and i have been useing FTC for my dps counter as i didnt really need another

Look into Combat Metrics. It is a much more in depth post fight recap. It will show you how often you are keeping buffs up, and that sort of things. For analyzing DPS, it is far superior. It really helped me a lot to spot the flaws in my rotation (of which there were many).

Lord_Wrath

L2P? Y'all work at McDonalds or something? What kind of pathetic logic is this? Reminds me of the quickscoping from call of duty back in the day when it was worth a play.

Animation cancelling takes skill to learn- correct, and is required to be competitive. But when you insta-die in a split second to 3-4 attacks you couldn't possibly have a chance to counter, do you stop and think "woah that guy is good" or "wow what a cheap player? I cant take anyone seriously that thinks this mechanic is great, yea great for whoever uses it but youll never see me patting myself on the back for it.

Izaki

1. Light attack
2. Use an instant cast skill
3. Block for a split second
4. ????
5. Congratulations you've animation cancelled a skill.

ShimmerDoll

ZOS_JohanaB wrote: »

Several comments have been removed from this conversation. While everyone may not agree with whats been said you are still expected to be civil and constructive.

I'm playing an mmorpg not street fighter competitive fighting game. Someone put effort into the animations and making the world immersive and this animation cancelling really kills the vibe when you see people's character's looking like they're having seizures while fighting.

Mrtoobyy

ShimmerDoll wrote: »

ZOS_JohanaB wrote: »

Several comments have been removed from this conversation. While everyone may not agree with whats been said you are still expected to be civil and constructive.

I'm playing an mmorpg not street fighter competitive fighting game. Someone put effort into the animations and making the world immersive and this animation cancelling really kills the vibe when you see people's character's looking like they're having seizures while fighting.

I totally agree with you. I use AC but it makes the game look really bad. Even in PVE when you see other players fighting mobs using AC. It looks like it's lagging or something. If the devs were to remove it I wouldnt complain.