How ESO compares to World of Warcraft (From a 10+ year raid veteran from Wow)

sorn55

Okay
So I have been a fan of Elder scrolls in the past, (before Wow as people know it existed). I like Elder Scrolls games. They are a different type of fantasy game (High Fantasy) versus Mcdonalds Fantasy games like what WOW has become ( Welcome to WOW, Can I take your magic spell or blade order)? LOL

Okay so keep in mind ONE THING as I write this.
I am aware that ES ONLINE IS NOT EVEN 3 YEARS OLD YET right? Coming out in 2014. It just turned 2017
World of Warcraft (which is still going on started in 2004) might as well be a whole different era at this point, ah the 00's compared to the 10's.
That means WOW is 13 years old.

Much longer time for WOW to grow then ES ONLINE Yet.

With that said.
Pros of ES ONLINE
A-lot more freedom (eventually as I learned how to build classes in this Elder scrolls game again) in determining how you want your class to be, even between the same class, much more diversity.
Wow actually has diversity in it's classes btw, (However the gaming community in WOW has placed so many social stigmas on creating your own individual build for a class, that unless you want to be socially ostracized by guilds to do end game content, you are basically ordered to build your class a certain way to be most efficient for healing, dps tanking to clear PVP or END GAME RAID CONTENT.

Other Pro's of ES ONLINE:
Graphics wise: The world, characters, outfits, look absolutely beautiful compared to Wow's cartoony graphics which are a bit dated
More Political Diversity in Factions and racial groups: What does this mean? It means that there are more internal politics going on between racial and class groups, for example: Dunmer have three main Houses, had 2 others that are extinct right, and even between these Houses it seems that not everyone always get's along.
More realistic compared to real world politics and life.
Wow politics: Inside factions: Mute?
Horde and Alliance in WOW are basically oligarchies at this point. One main guy at the top directing almost everything, and everyone within a certain main faction group just kind of goes along. Some Diversity in Wow Politics, but not much.
Dungeons: Some very nice crafted dungeons, (though I would prefer one more guy with us like in wow), Veteran Dungeons are the same but slightly different nice touch, fun new entertainment, and what seems to be some nice crafted stories (though I wish sometimes I had time to actually read what they were about) instead of being pressured by other players to just get on with it.

A-lot more Subgroups you can join: Be a good guy/assassin because your working for the dark brotherhood on the side. Be a good guy but a thief at the same time. Thief possibilities in this game are much cooler than being a Rogue in Wow (whom lockpicks special chests sometimes for other players to make some quick gold tips).

Attack citizens (even when you know it's wrong and you know your going to pay for it by being chased) just a slightly different element that makes this game feel more realistic in terms of Fantasy then World of Warcraft.

In WOW, guards from the other main alliance will attack you say in cities for even to dare enter, oh and you can kill the guards, but there really is no stealing goods, though you can attack enemy citizens from the opposite faction.

Group attacks in Craglorn (This was new, didn't expect this the first time I entered this new interesting zone, wow I was shocked). Interesting concept, having to rely on groups to actually complete content that most people would expect to be solo.

Vampires and Werewolves: So Werewolves in WOW exist, and they are cool (called Worgen) but WW's in ES seem to take the old mythology of Werewolves to a different level, they are much more animal in a way then Worgens (who sometimes have top hats). Somehow a ES online Wolf I feel would never wear a Top Hat while frolicking in the woods.
Vampires are very well created in this game. Not a ton of Vampire games I can think of that have the kind of development that exists in ES games.

Trials: I have yet to do a Trial, but I hear they are like raids in WOW. I would love to do some at some point.

Outlaws Refuge: Another cool thing that doesn't exist in WOW in any shape or form. Being able to actually steal in this game, sell your goods is just another cool level of feeling part of this world, and the possibilities that older ES games have provided. Being able to actually be part of a separate sub-faction like the thieves guild to become a better thief continues this immersive process.

Some very cool zones: Again being a WOW crack baby for 10+ years, it was refreshing seeing some cool new places.

Same goes with new professions and slightly different powers to use in the classes available in ES online.

Another SOCIAL ++ Absolutely in a general way. Much nicer community on ES online then WOW crazies, scum, and WOW elites (who think they are the best of the best because they have the best gear of all time (for the moment) and feel they can say with no issues at all, that your whole family as well as yourself deserves to die because you might be a noob in a raid or just not as perfect as the WOW aggressor.


3 Factions at war with each other in PVP, taking keeps, and doing quests in a pvp zone. All new interesting ways that outcompete WOW pvp in some ways.



Cons of ES online:
Yeah well, considering Again how much younger ES ONLINE is, please take these cons as suggestions for possible future development.

Okay, to start out then, in some ways ES online as it exists now is really like how WOW was during Vanilla WOW, when the level cap was 60, not 110 which it currently is today.
With that being said here goes.

Not Enough Classes yet: The classes in ES online are cool, especially for a somewhat new player, but I would like to see some more classes in the future. I believe in Morrowind you could even create your own class, and it did seem there were more endless possibilities for builds in older ES games.
I do not expect that type of freeform development in ES online, because ES first off has some lore it shouldn't just go away from, and second well if it wants to increase it's player base in the future, possibly too much free form development in terms of classes might create other problems towards goals I am proposing ES moves toward to.

So, maybe another 2-4 more classes to choose from.

Cons of Dungeons: Though it has been very cool to see so many new dungeons for myself, some of these dungeons (especially when your character is at a certain point, my main is CH 249 now) seems way too hard.
Veteran Dungeons (which in WOW are Heroic Dungeons) also seem too hard even after developing your character to a certain point.

Real problem with this: Besides slight frustration, I don't believe players have up to 2-3 hours at a time to do one dungeon.

Wow's development in terms of getting better and better gear which makes this "use to be hard content" easier to the point where Wow players can move on and do harder stuff (aka raids and then heroic, and veteran raids) is at the moment a bit better than ES online's progression

Trials: So I haven't done Trials yet, but from what I garner, doing Trials reminds me of how people in WOW use to do raids. People would meet a summoning stone, and they would have to organize themselves and hope everyone was online at the same time, could be on for a certain period to start and do part of the raid.
In WOW for awhile now, this has been replaced with a Raid quequer, where if you want to do a raid (starting with the easiest type, LFR) you just put yourself in the queue and let the game set up your group.

Also raids in WOW are sometimes very long, so the ability to do part of a raid, and then stop, and do part of the raid later in the week, (before the raid resets) is a nice touch, because unless your with a very powerful and good group, raids sometimes from start to finish in WOW can take up to 8-10 hours).

Again, I haven't done trials yet in ES online, but if this possibility isn't a reality in ES right now, it should be, if some Trials are super long, and people only have so much time per day during a given week to devote to downing bosses for better gear).

Werewolves: In some ways I really like how they are different than Worgens in WOW, in some ways I'm not such a big fan, I haven't played enough though with my wolves in ES yet to determine that.

Vampires: Really like Vampires in ES online.
However two things keep bothering me (though I am living with them). Sometimes I wish like traditional vampires, I could bite people, up close like the movies portray a-lot, instead of sucking from afar.
I definitely like the different stages that a vampire has, and how each one is slightly different from the other, until one is very vampiric versus normal racial tone. Very much like Interview with the Vampire.
However: Absolutely do not like how vampires are somehow in ES online (which is very different than Elder Scrolls games) immune to sunlight.
Almost all if not all depictions of vampires outside of ES online, Vampires either do not like, or absolutely do not like sunlight.

I think this decision was made, because the game has natural day and night cycles, (with night cycles being shorter than day ones) and not knowing when people log into the game every day, would inhibit players who are vampires from playing during certain times, because of sun-damage.

However: The Truth is, I am a vampire besides for the benefits. It is part of my character's persona, even when they are in stage 1 and look the most human. I chose to be a vampire, so I should be fine taking the consequences, even if that limits my ability to play during certain periods. This is also for immersion as well.

In other words, maybe I shouldn't instantly die when my vampire character is out in the sun, but I should either be A. weakened (even if I am in a later stage), or get some sort of damage.
Possibly, perhaps special tent areas throughout Tamriel could be created, so Vampire during sunlight hours could travel to safe zones, and or take special black drawn curtain carriages, but we as a race (regardless of your specific racial choice) should not be immune to sunlight.

In stage 4 though, when I am closer to being the real vampire demon I am, maybe I should suffer more damage than when I am in stage 1.

Also, from what I have seen and read regarding the wider ES lore world, vampires are not liked much in other ES games, so if I am in stage 3 and 4 and it is much more noticeable that I'm not just sick but a vampire, people I talk with should either comment about it, or totally avoid me. They don't all have to, since like the real world, though racists exist, not everyone is a racist, but some should absolutely either feel uncomfortable dealing with me or outright refuse to have anything to do with me.

I wish there was a mod for Vampire players at least to make some or all of these changes for lore reasons. After all, players choose to become vamps, it's a choice, and just like in the real world your choices (good or bad) help determine how your real life goes, so the same should be choosing to be a vampire, live with the consequences.

Again another Con: I wish there were more raids or just the possibility again, to put yourself in a raider queque, instead of what seems to be the old way that WOW players did it, which is meet up, all agree to do a Trial, and make sure you are all on at the same time and have enough time to do it.

Because in WOW now, if someone leaves a raid, that is in progress, at least others can just join the group, so it doesn't stop the whole raid from moving forward or completing it.

One last thing: I really do like the ES community. With that said, one thing that made WOW very popular was the competition for being able to get better and better gear so to outshine even people within your same level bracket. If such a direction was pushed in the future for ES, it is possible that you might bring in people like WOW elites into ES and parts of the end game could become nastier, but I really want ES to succeed, and though I do not like some of the mentality that WOW crazies, elites have, I would be lying if I didn't recognize that part of the appeal of these games is simply for the competition and as ES stands now I don't see enough to push competition between players, and a simple way to do this would be to follow this old WOW gear model.

Milvan

For the eight, this is one huge walltext! Don't do that comrade. If you want to gather people attention you need to be friendly to you reader. Also, comparing ESO and WOW don't usually ends well in these forums. I don't think they end well in WOW forums as well.

jircris11

Only commenting on the vamp part for the rest I agree on. The strain that we have in eso is actually more accurate. It had no weakness to sun and could siphon blood from a distance. Look it up, I'm on my phone or if link ya. Just Google results vampire blood lines.

alephthiago

Thank you for your service sir!!!!!

Keep_Door

Could you compare eso to CoD next beacuse im sure that would be just as relevant.....


Eso and wow are different games get over it

JD2013

Why so many comparisons to WoW lately??

Jimmy

What dungeons are taking you 2-3 hours to complete?
Longest dungeon for me to complete is ICP at about 45 minutes.

Most others are like 20-25 mins.

Cencewolf

F--- WoW..

If i wanted to play wow again, i would..

Quit turning ESO into WOW

andreasranasen

That was like the longest thread ever -.-

Olysja

write less, raid more.

fred4

This comparison was interesting, for me, since I've never played WoW. Thank you!

Wifeaggro13

sorn55 wrote: »

Okay
So I have been a fan of Elder scrolls in the past, (before Wow as people know it existed). I like Elder Scrolls games. They are a different type of fantasy game (High Fantasy) versus Mcdonalds Fantasy games like what WOW has become ( Welcome to WOW, Can I take your magic spell or blade order)? LOL

Okay so keep in mind ONE THING as I write this.
I am aware that ES ONLINE IS NOT EVEN 3 YEARS OLD YET right? Coming out in 2014. It just turned 2017
World of Warcraft (which is still going on started in 2004) might as well be a whole different era at this point, ah the 00's compared to the 10's.
That means WOW is 13 years old.

Much longer time for WOW to grow then ES ONLINE Yet.

With that said.
Pros of ES ONLINE
A-lot more freedom (eventually as I learned how to build classes in this Elder scrolls game again) in determining how you want your class to be, even between the same class, much more diversity.
Wow actually has diversity in it's classes btw, (However the gaming community in WOW has placed so many social stigmas on creating your own individual build for a class, that unless you want to be socially ostracized by guilds to do end game content, you are basically ordered to build your class a certain way to be most efficient for healing, dps tanking to clear PVP or END GAME RAID CONTENT.

Other Pro's of ES ONLINE:
Graphics wise: The world, characters, outfits, look absolutely beautiful compared to Wow's cartoony graphics which are a bit dated
More Political Diversity in Factions and racial groups: What does this mean? It means that there are more internal politics going on between racial and class groups, for example: Dunmer have three main Houses, had 2 others that are extinct right, and even between these Houses it seems that not everyone always get's along.
More realistic compared to real world politics and life.
Wow politics: Inside factions: Mute?
Horde and Alliance in WOW are basically oligarchies at this point. One main guy at the top directing almost everything, and everyone within a certain main faction group just kind of goes along. Some Diversity in Wow Politics, but not much.
Dungeons: Some very nice crafted dungeons, (though I would prefer one more guy with us like in wow), Veteran Dungeons are the same but slightly different nice touch, fun new entertainment, and what seems to be some nice crafted stories (though I wish sometimes I had time to actually read what they were about) instead of being pressured by other players to just get on with it.

A-lot more Subgroups you can join: Be a good guy/assassin because your working for the dark brotherhood on the side. Be a good guy but a thief at the same time. Thief possibilities in this game are much cooler than being a Rogue in Wow (whom lockpicks special chests sometimes for other players to make some quick gold tips).

Attack citizens (even when you know it's wrong and you know your going to pay for it by being chased) just a slightly different element that makes this game feel more realistic in terms of Fantasy then World of Warcraft.

In WOW, guards from the other main alliance will attack you say in cities for even to dare enter, oh and you can kill the guards, but there really is no stealing goods, though you can attack enemy citizens from the opposite faction.

Group attacks in Craglorn (This was new, didn't expect this the first time I entered this new interesting zone, wow I was shocked). Interesting concept, having to rely on groups to actually complete content that most people would expect to be solo.

Vampires and Werewolves: So Werewolves in WOW exist, and they are cool (called Worgen) but WW's in ES seem to take the old mythology of Werewolves to a different level, they are much more animal in a way then Worgens (who sometimes have top hats). Somehow a ES online Wolf I feel would never wear a Top Hat while frolicking in the woods.
Vampires are very well created in this game. Not a ton of Vampire games I can think of that have the kind of development that exists in ES games.

Trials: I have yet to do a Trial, but I hear they are like raids in WOW. I would love to do some at some point.

Outlaws Refuge: Another cool thing that doesn't exist in WOW in any shape or form. Being able to actually steal in this game, sell your goods is just another cool level of feeling part of this world, and the possibilities that older ES games have provided. Being able to actually be part of a separate sub-faction like the thieves guild to become a better thief continues this immersive process.

Some very cool zones: Again being a WOW crack baby for 10+ years, it was refreshing seeing some cool new places.

Same goes with new professions and slightly different powers to use in the classes available in ES online.

Another SOCIAL ++ Absolutely in a general way. Much nicer community on ES online then WOW crazies, scum, and WOW elites (who think they are the best of the best because they have the best gear of all time (for the moment) and feel they can say with no issues at all, that your whole family as well as yourself deserves to die because you might be a noob in a raid or just not as perfect as the WOW aggressor.


3 Factions at war with each other in PVP, taking keeps, and doing quests in a pvp zone. All new interesting ways that outcompete WOW pvp in some ways.



Cons of ES online:
Yeah well, considering Again how much younger ES ONLINE is, please take these cons as suggestions for possible future development.

Okay, to start out then, in some ways ES online as it exists now is really like how WOW was during Vanilla WOW, when the level cap was 60, not 110 which it currently is today.
With that being said here goes.

Not Enough Classes yet: The classes in ES online are cool, especially for a somewhat new player, but I would like to see some more classes in the future. I believe in Morrowind you could even create your own class, and it did seem there were more endless possibilities for builds in older ES games.
I do not expect that type of freeform development in ES online, because ES first off has some lore it shouldn't just go away from, and second well if it wants to increase it's player base in the future, possibly too much free form development in terms of classes might create other problems towards goals I am proposing ES moves toward to.

So, maybe another 2-4 more classes to choose from.

Cons of Dungeons: Though it has been very cool to see so many new dungeons for myself, some of these dungeons (especially when your character is at a certain point, my main is CH 249 now) seems way too hard.
Veteran Dungeons (which in WOW are Heroic Dungeons) also seem too hard even after developing your character to a certain point.

Real problem with this: Besides slight frustration, I don't believe players have up to 2-3 hours at a time to do one dungeon.

Wow's development in terms of getting better and better gear which makes this "use to be hard content" easier to the point where Wow players can move on and do harder stuff (aka raids and then heroic, and veteran raids) is at the moment a bit better than ES online's progression

Trials: So I haven't done Trials yet, but from what I garner, doing Trials reminds me of how people in WOW use to do raids. People would meet a summoning stone, and they would have to organize themselves and hope everyone was online at the same time, could be on for a certain period to start and do part of the raid.
In WOW for awhile now, this has been replaced with a Raid quequer, where if you want to do a raid (starting with the easiest type, LFR) you just put yourself in the queue and let the game set up your group.

Also raids in WOW are sometimes very long, so the ability to do part of a raid, and then stop, and do part of the raid later in the week, (before the raid resets) is a nice touch, because unless your with a very powerful and good group, raids sometimes from start to finish in WOW can take up to 8-10 hours).

Again, I haven't done trials yet in ES online, but if this possibility isn't a reality in ES right now, it should be, if some Trials are super long, and people only have so much time per day during a given week to devote to downing bosses for better gear).

Werewolves: In some ways I really like how they are different than Worgens in WOW, in some ways I'm not such a big fan, I haven't played enough though with my wolves in ES yet to determine that.

Vampires: Really like Vampires in ES online.
However two things keep bothering me (though I am living with them). Sometimes I wish like traditional vampires, I could bite people, up close like the movies portray a-lot, instead of sucking from afar.
I definitely like the different stages that a vampire has, and how each one is slightly different from the other, until one is very vampiric versus normal racial tone. Very much like Interview with the Vampire.
However: Absolutely do not like how vampires are somehow in ES online (which is very different than Elder Scrolls games) immune to sunlight.
Almost all if not all depictions of vampires outside of ES online, Vampires either do not like, or absolutely do not like sunlight.

I think this decision was made, because the game has natural day and night cycles, (with night cycles being shorter than day ones) and not knowing when people log into the game every day, would inhibit players who are vampires from playing during certain times, because of sun-damage.

However: The Truth is, I am a vampire besides for the benefits. It is part of my character's persona, even when they are in stage 1 and look the most human. I chose to be a vampire, so I should be fine taking the consequences, even if that limits my ability to play during certain periods. This is also for immersion as well.

In other words, maybe I shouldn't instantly die when my vampire character is out in the sun, but I should either be A. weakened (even if I am in a later stage), or get some sort of damage.
Possibly, perhaps special tent areas throughout Tamriel could be created, so Vampire during sunlight hours could travel to safe zones, and or take special black drawn curtain carriages, but we as a race (regardless of your specific racial choice) should not be immune to sunlight.

In stage 4 though, when I am closer to being the real vampire demon I am, maybe I should suffer more damage than when I am in stage 1.

Also, from what I have seen and read regarding the wider ES lore world, vampires are not liked much in other ES games, so if I am in stage 3 and 4 and it is much more noticeable that I'm not just sick but a vampire, people I talk with should either comment about it, or totally avoid me. They don't all have to, since like the real world, though racists exist, not everyone is a racist, but some should absolutely either feel uncomfortable dealing with me or outright refuse to have anything to do with me.

I wish there was a mod for Vampire players at least to make some or all of these changes for lore reasons. After all, players choose to become vamps, it's a choice, and just like in the real world your choices (good or bad) help determine how your real life goes, so the same should be choosing to be a vampire, live with the consequences.

Again another Con: I wish there were more raids or just the possibility again, to put yourself in a raider queque, instead of what seems to be the old way that WOW players did it, which is meet up, all agree to do a Trial, and make sure you are all on at the same time and have enough time to do it.

Because in WOW now, if someone leaves a raid, that is in progress, at least others can just join the group, so it doesn't stop the whole raid from moving forward or completing it.

One last thing: I really do like the ES community. With that said, one thing that made WOW very popular was the competition for being able to get better and better gear so to outshine even people within your same level bracket. If such a direction was pushed in the future for ES, it is possible that you might bring in people like WOW elites into ES and parts of the end game could become nastier, but I really want ES to succeed, and though I do not like some of the mentality that WOW crazies, elites have, I would be lying if I didn't recognize that part of the appeal of these games is simply for the competition and as ES stands now I don't see enough to push competition between players, and a simple way to do this would be to follow this old WOW gear model.

thank you for your post. it has some very interesting points in comparison. But just comparing products of the earlier games at their 3 year mark ESO does not even come close to even smaller games.WOW was slower at first but when they did add it was massive. ESo DLC's are really just what they had said was the 12 month plan for ESO prior to launch.the only thing really new was orsinium. The guilds and IC were post launch plans and were already deep in development when the game launched. They canned them to make more money of their DLC plans for the console launch. not because eso was suffering they had a stable sub base more then 50% retention off sales which is pretty good. they switched buisness models to get the game on console. microsoft was giving them a hard time about having subscriptions . Plus the console crowd was losing their mind over having to pay 10 bucks to microsoft and pay a subscription. It was gonna cost them more in lost console sales then it would in PC subs to go B2P.

The reality is this , smaller Games were able to accomplish this in the same 3 year time. realse 2 to 3 full blown expansions, increase the level cap, add 3x the single group dungeons , 3x times the raid content, Exapnd and enrich the AA sytems with several layers including class specfic layers and the ability to take abilities from other classes in the trees,new races , new class abilities, new staring zones, 3 x the solo quests with multiple quests that had item rewards that grew as you completed Group and raid content,a plethora of QOL and social content, housing and such, multiple tiers of crafting.

Games like EQ2 with much smaller sales then ESO and WOW, Rift, hell even AOC. all were able to expand and enrich their game systems while managing 3 x the classes and balance issues. all with a smaller budget ,smaller ,development teams, smaller subscripo\itions and now shady cash shops in the first 3 years post launch.

IronCrystal

Wifeaggro13 wrote: »

sorn55 wrote: »

Snipe

Snipe

Did you have to quote the whole book? Think about vertical scrolling man.

RazorCaltrops

Nice comparison from a player who came from another MMO.

However, some of these suggestions can not (and will not) be valid here like trial grouo finder. ESO's dungeon group finder is already horrible for players who aren't in a PVE guild and have to use that tool because of the long waiting times and players who don't know what they are doing etc. I can't even imagine a group finder for trials, no one would use that anyway (except normal modes maybe)

Unlike WOW, our trials are very short. 3 trials require 33 and 1 trial requires 40 minutes to get the speed run achievement.

As for end-game gear, i don't agree that there should be a competition because things work different in ESO, having BİS gear will not guarantee your place in an organized trial group. You need to grind for certain gear and weapons yes, but (except dagger, axe and bow for stamina classes) you can still craft your own gear and be competitive which is good, there are so many players with RNG luck and get the BİS weapons/gear earlier and still fail to deal decent damage, and die frequently etc. WOW's gearing model will not work here, and (based on the information, didn't play myself) it shouldn't imo.

mb10

Honestly couldnt care less about what WoW does. Something Wow will never be is an Elder Scrolls game making ESO automatically superior.

mvffins

JD2013 wrote: »

Why so many comparisons to WoW lately??

Maybe a lot of people are leaving it for ESO

kylewwefan

my son started playing wow. It looks like poo compared to elder scrolls online.

sorn55

Here's another idea based on what I originally wrote when I started this thread.


So for example: In World of Warcraft, one of the classes you can choose is being a Priest.

Then within the Priest class, there are three types of Priests you can be. You can be a Shadow Priest, a something priest I forgot (for speed) and or a Holy Priest.

Each type of priest is different than the other (Shadow looks the best).

Well Priests exist in ES, so why can't one new class in ES Online be Priests.

Another example:
In World of Warcraft, there are warlock classes.

Again, there are three types of warlocks you can be.

In some ways, ES online already has this possibility, for sorcerers, but why couldn't there be another new class

Where players specifically focus on being a Warlock.

Another possibility?
Though there seems to be a-lot of social stigmas against these people, Necromancers exist. Why couldn't in the future a special faction group of Necromancers become an available class.

Just like how I read there are many varieties of vampires in Tamriel, why couldn't there be at least one small sub-group of Necromancers (if not liked tolerated at least?)

Another class from WOW that might be a future ES class because it might possibly find itself as a candidate with some of the lore.

In Wow they have death knights.

Isn't it possible than, like vampires, who are undead, a special new class of undead are available to become their own class?

Just ideas I am throwing out here.

Another idea that comes from Morrowind I think.

What about racial classes, for example:

If you choose being a Dunmer, could you choose to be an Ordinater?

gbaker42

I never played WOW but some of my friends have. They like ESO gameplay. I just wanted to tell ya to keep at the dungeons. Most dungeons on hard mode can be done in about 30 min . Watch some up to date youtube videos to learn the mechanics. I have even been soloing some of them on normal vet setting for fun and loot. So many players know the dungeons now that the group usually just steamrolls everything.

JD2013

mvffins wrote: »

JD2013 wrote: »

Why so many comparisons to WoW lately??

Maybe a lot of people are leaving it for ESO

Ehh they're quite welcome to. The game is archaic, combat is like a stand and spam typing test, the lore of Azeroth is interesting but the quests are deathly dull, and the community are pretty toxic. And I actually recently played free to level 20, and the levelling now is so mind numbing and you can basically do half of each zone before you outlevel it.

WoW pre cataclysm was great. Now? It's a cartoony mess.

skiptomyluau

The reason there are so few classes is so you arent put in a preset mold cookie cutter of what you have to be. ES is always about freedom to do whatever. Its why i love the series

Wifeaggro13

IronCrystal wrote: »

Wifeaggro13 wrote: »

sorn55 wrote: »

Snipe

Snipe

Did you have to quote the whole book? Think about vertical scrolling man.

apologies i do that quite a bit ill correct it.

Wifeaggro13

skiptomyluau wrote: »

The reason there are so few classes is so you arent put in a preset mold cookie cutter of what you have to be. ES is always about freedom to do whatever. Its why i love the series

i wish that were the case but honestly the game is cookie cutter , DPS spec for the win in 95% of the group content. It seems its very open but its not the Game mechanics and design are DPS centric.

Pirhana7_ESO

Kinda silly to compare a game designed for PVE endgame raiding to another game that is designed mainly for Alliance vs alliance seige warfare endgame

SteveCampsOut

Why?

Panomania

Well....lets see. I can be a valid, operating NB tank. I can easily be a solid templar tank. Hell, I've even run with some ungodly good sorc tanks. I've seen stam DK tank well, pure HP DK tank well, and even magicka DK tank well. Hell, I've seen templars geared right do ungodly DPS....I've even done a trial or two with DK healers.

Doesnt sound too cookie cutter to me.

On the subject of WoW....not trying to pick on you, but please....dont. I hate that game....hated it since day one. Stuck around because my long term EQ guild moved there in a guild invite from Blizzard, and I didnt want to leave my friends....but slowly we all left because the game wasnt to our tastes. If I wanted to play a crappy WoW like game, I hear Blizzard makes one thats pretty close. But I dont. I like ESO. So PLEASE.....buy a clue, and figure out that if you genuinely enjoyed what WarCrap had to offer, you'd still be playing there, and not here. Please do not try and get devs to change this game to more closely resemble the craptastic game you got bored with and left.

And this statement here:

Wow's development in terms of getting better and better gear which makes this "use to be hard content" easier to the point where Wow players can move on and do harder stuff (aka raids and then heroic, and veteran raids) is at the moment a bit better than ES online's progression

This shows why ZoS should never, EVER listen to your ideas for game development. You take one of the five biggest things wrong with "modern" MMO's and point to it as a virtue?? Something ESO THANKFULLY found a way around (granted, 1T still needs work, but its promising)?? Sorry, but I think you may be functionally insane

Pops_ND_Irish

JD2013 wrote: »

Why so many comparisons to WoW lately??

Not sure, they sure dont need anything to complain about !

Elsonso

I was a player of WoW for many years, as well. Not from the beginning, though.

Warning: Almost the entire post is quoted. I had to do this, and format it as I went, to make sure I got all of what was said. I present the formatted version for anyone who cares.

Pros:

sorn55 wrote: »

Pros of ES ONLINE

• A-lot more freedom (eventually as I learned how to build classes in this Elder scrolls game again) in determining how you want your class to be, even between the same class, much more diversity.
• Graphics wise: The world, characters, outfits, look absolutely beautiful compared to Wow's cartoony graphics which are a bit dated
• More Political Diversity in Factions and racial groups: What does this mean? It means that there are more internal politics going on between racial and class groups, for example: Dunmer have three main Houses, had 2 others that are extinct right, and even between these Houses it seems that not everyone always get's along.
• More realistic compared to real world politics and life.
• Dungeons: Some very nice crafted dungeons, (though I would prefer one more guy with us like in wow), Veteran Dungeons are the same but slightly different nice touch, fun new entertainment, and what seems to be some nice crafted stories (though I wish sometimes I had time to actually read what they were about) instead of being pressured by other players to just get on with it.
• A-lot more Subgroups you can join: Be a good guy/assassin because your working for the dark brotherhood on the side. Be a good guy but a thief at the same time. Thief possibilities in this game are much cooler than being a Rogue in Wow (whom lockpicks special chests sometimes for other players to make some quick gold tips).
• Attack citizens (even when you know it's wrong and you know your going to pay for it by being chased) just a slightly different element that makes this game feel more realistic in terms of Fantasy then World of Warcraft.
• Group attacks in Craglorn (This was new, didn't expect this the first time I entered this new interesting zone, wow I was shocked). Interesting concept, having to rely on groups to actually complete content that most people would expect to be solo.
• Vampires and Werewolves: So Werewolves in WOW exist, and they are cool (called Worgen) but WW's in ES seem to take the old mythology of Werewolves to a different level, they are much more animal in a way then Worgens (who sometimes have top hats). Somehow a ES online Wolf I feel would never wear a Top Hat while frolicking in the woods.
• Vampires are very well created in this game. Not a ton of Vampire games I can think of that have the kind of development that exists in ES games.
• Trials: I have yet to do a Trial, but I hear they are like raids in WOW. I would love to do some at some point.
• Outlaws Refuge: Another cool thing that doesn't exist in WOW in any shape or form. Being able to actually steal in this game, sell your goods is just another cool level of feeling part of this world, and the possibilities that older ES games have provided. Being able to actually be part of a separate sub-faction like the thieves guild to become a better thief continues this immersive process.
• Some very cool zones: Again being a WOW crack baby for 10+ years, it was refreshing seeing some cool new places.
• Same goes with new professions and slightly different powers to use in the classes available in ES online.
• Another SOCIAL ++ Absolutely in a general way. Much nicer community on ES online then WOW crazies, scum, and WOW elites (who think they are the best of the best because they have the best gear of all time (for the moment) and feel they can say with no issues at all, that your whole family as well as yourself deserves to die because you might be a noob in a raid or just not as perfect as the WOW aggressor.
• 3 Factions at war with each other in PVP, taking keeps, and doing quests in a pvp zone. All new interesting ways that outcompete WOW pvp in some ways.

I agree with a lot of those things, however, I find that there is just as much elitism in ESO as there is in WoW, with the emphasis on proper builds, etiquette, and expectations of conformity. ESO did not start out that way, but it has evolved over time. If it is not exactly to the degree of WoW, it is just because ESO is still a youngling.


Cons:

sorn55 wrote: »

Cons of ES online:

• Not Enough Classes yet: The classes in ES online are cool, especially for a somewhat new player, but I would like to see some more classes in the future. I believe in Morrowind you could even create your own class, and it did seem there were more endless possibilities for builds in older ES games.
  
  I do not expect that type of freeform development in ES online, because ES first off has some lore it shouldn't just go away from, and second well if it wants to increase it's player base in the future, possibly too much free form development in terms of classes might create other problems towards goals I am proposing ES moves toward to.
  
  So, maybe another 2-4 more classes to choose from.
  
• Cons of Dungeons: Though it has been very cool to see so many new dungeons for myself, some of these dungeons (especially when your character is at a certain point, my main is CH 249 now) seems way too hard. Veteran Dungeons (which in WOW are Heroic Dungeons) also seem too hard even after developing your character to a certain point.
  
  Real problem with this: Besides slight frustration, I don't believe players have up to 2-3 hours at a time to do one dungeon.
  
  Wow's development in terms of getting better and better gear which makes this "use to be hard content" easier to the point where Wow players can move on and do harder stuff (aka raids and then heroic, and veteran raids) is at the moment a bit better than ES online's progression
  
• Trials: So I haven't done Trials yet, but from what I garner, doing Trials reminds me of how people in WOW use to do raids. People would meet a summoning stone, and they would have to organize themselves and hope everyone was online at the same time, could be on for a certain period to start and do part of the raid. In WOW, for awhile now, this has been replaced with a Raid quequer, where if you want to do a raid (starting with the easiest type, LFR) you just put yourself in the queue and let the game set up your group.
  
  Raids in WOW are sometimes very long, so the ability to do part of a raid, and then stop, and do part of the raid later in the week, (before the raid resets) is a nice touch, because unless your with a very powerful and good group, raids sometimes from start to finish in WOW can take up to 8-10 hours).
  
• Werewolves: In some ways I really like how they are different than Worgens in WOW, in some ways I'm not such a big fan, I haven't played enough though with my wolves in ES yet to determine that.
  
• Vampires: Really like Vampires in ES online, however two things keep bothering me (though I am living with them).
  
  1. Sometimes I wish like traditional vampires, I could bite people, up close like the movies portray a-lot, instead of sucking from afar. 2. Absolutely do not like how vampires are somehow in ES online (which is very different than Elder Scrolls games) immune to sunlight. Almost all if not all depictions of vampires outside of ES online, Vampires either do not like, or absolutely do not like sunlight. I think this decision was made, because the game has natural day and night cycles, (with night cycles being shorter than day ones) and not knowing when people log into the game every day, would inhibit players who are vampires from playing during certain times, because of sun-damage. However: The Truth is, I am a vampire besides for the benefits. It is part of my character's persona, even when they are in stage 1 and look the most human. I chose to be a vampire, so I should be fine taking the consequences, even if that limits my ability to play during certain periods. This is also for immersion as well. In other words, maybe I shouldn't instantly die when my vampire character is out in the sun, but I should either be A. weakened (even if I am in a later stage), or get some sort of damage. Perhaps special tent areas throughout Tamriel could be created, so Vampire during sunlight hours could travel to safe zones, and or take special black drawn curtain carriages, but we as a race (regardless of your specific racial choice) should not be immune to sunlight. In stage 4 though, when I am closer to being the real vampire demon I am, maybe I should suffer more damage than when I am in stage 1. 3. from what I have seen and read regarding the wider ES lore world, vampires are not liked much in other ES games, so if I am in stage 3 and 4 and it is much more noticeable that I'm not just sick but a vampire, people I talk with should either comment about it, or totally avoid me. They don't all have to, since like the real world, though racists exist, not everyone is a racist, but some should absolutely either feel uncomfortable dealing with me or outright refuse to have anything to do with me.
  
  I wish there was a mod for Vampire players at least to make some or all of these changes for lore reasons. After all, players choose to become vamps, it's a choice, and just like in the real world your choices (good or bad) help determine how your real life goes, so the same should be choosing to be a vampire, live with the consequences.
  
• Again another Con: I wish there were more raids or just the possibility again, to put yourself in a raider queque, instead of what seems to be the old way that WOW players did it, which is meet up, all agree to do a Trial, and make sure you are all on at the same time and have enough time to do it.
  
  Because in WOW now, if someone leaves a raid, that is in progress, at least others can just join the group, so it doesn't stop the whole raid from moving forward or completing it.
  
• One last thing: I really do like the ES community. With that said, one thing that made WOW very popular was the competition for being able to get better and better gear so to outshine even people within your same level bracket. If such a direction was pushed in the future for ES, it is possible that you might bring in people like WOW elites into ES and parts of the end game could become nastier, but I really want ES to succeed, and though I do not like some of the mentality that WOW crazies, elites have, I would be lying if I didn't recognize that part of the appeal of these games is simply for the competition and as ES stands now I don't see enough to push competition between players, and a simple way to do this would be to follow this old WOW gear model.
  

I am not a fan of the class system. I prefer a skill system with archetypes that lend preference to certain skills, or start the character with certain skills. MMO people want to see that class to more easily identify the build. It is admittedly harder to create a character when you have more than 4 possible choices, so a skill+archetype system is quite the hurdle for new players. That said, I am more interested in class skill reform than I am in new classes. I don't like that the classes are all based in magicka. If ZOS is not willing to refactor the classes to bring stamina into the classes at the base level, they should just leave it alone. I should also add that I am not in favor of PVP uniformity across all classes in terms of stamina and magicka. For PVP, it is OK if certain class combinations are more robust than others, so long as they all fit on the same battlefield.

I have to agree about Vampires. Part of the problem with Vampires is that they aren't really as good as the ones in other Elder Scrolls games. That said, it seems that Vampires change from game to game, anyway. Morrowind had the whole sunlight thing and fire was bad, not to mention a certain negative social aspect. Oblivion added stages with benefits and softened the social stigma. Skyrim was more deviant, allowing vampires to pass through the world largely unchallenged and sunlight was more of an excuse to use potions than a problem. ESO continued that trend by removing the sunlight aspect and pretty much all the remained of the social stigma. ZOS should have retained more of the negative aspects of being a vampire from other Elder Scrolls titles.

bulbousb16_ESO

Don't forget... WoW is a joke.

FLuFFyxMuFFiN

Maybe next we should make "How ESO compares to Runescape" threads

idk

@sorn55

Tl;dr

Just glanced a few things. Dungeons are difficult until one gets used to the mechanics and uses a good functioning build. At CP250 your still new to the game.

Glad you escaped the dinosaur of WoW.