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mats required to craft CP160
Myyth
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hello, I have a CP160 character now and tried to craft some gear.
I was surprised to see that at CP 150 you need around 15/item then it does a super huge increase to around 150/item when you try to craft at CP160.
Even more funny was that when you compared the stats for CP150 and 160 gear there is a very small increase. Now I could understand if there was a huge jump in stats, but the increase in stats from 150 to 160 was so small it really made no sense for the huge increase in mats required.
I ended up just crafting a CP150 set because I don't have enough mats and don't even think I want to waste that many mats for a CP160 set if the stat increase is so minimal.
Why are the mat requirements so high for CP160?
I will need 1000+ just to craft a set.
Is it better to sell the mats for gold and farm/buy a monster set from dungeon drops?
Edited by Myyth on December 17, 2016 8:23PM I was surprised to see that at CP 150 you need around 15/item then it does a super huge increase to around 150/item when you try to craft at CP160.
Even more funny was that when you compared the stats for CP150 and 160 gear there is a very small increase. Now I could understand if there was a huge jump in stats, but the increase in stats from 150 to 160 was so small it really made no sense for the huge increase in mats required.
I ended up just crafting a CP150 set because I don't have enough mats and don't even think I want to waste that many mats for a CP160 set if the stat increase is so minimal.
Why are the mat requirements so high for CP160?
I will need 1000+ just to craft a set.
Is it better to sell the mats for gold and farm/buy a monster set from dungeon drops?
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Bryanonymous✭✭✭✭✭Like gold armor, max level gear is much more expensive for a small boost. Just the way it is. And prices have gone way down since 1t so be grateful for that.0 -
Myyth✭✭✭✭✭Bryanonymous wrote: »Like gold armor, max level gear is much more expensive for a small boost. Just the way it is. And prices have gone way down since 1t so be grateful for that.
ok the only group content I do is random dungeons with group finder and then I do quests.
Is CP150 gear sufficient?
Is there really any point to spend 1000's of material for a small increase to CP160 with the content that I do?
It also seems to give crafters a huge penalty since you can get CP160 monster set drops for free just doing dungeons without spending 1000's of mats.
Edited by Myyth on December 17, 2016 9:05PM0 -
Pandorii✭✭✭✭✭
✭The cost of making CP 160 gear may seem daunting at first, but with a little bit of focused farming, you can get enough materials in no time.
What is your undaunted at? Will you be optimizing with undaunted mettle? 5-1-1? If so, it makes farming that much more efficient, since you can pick up wood, ore, and silks all in one go. It doesn't look so bad if you break it down.
In imperial city, you can double dip by spending tel var stones on materials as well as deconning the drops.
That said, I think investing in 160 gear is worth it because a. you only have to make it once (there's no immediate information about the armor cap increasing), b. you're saving money on purple improvement materials, enchantments, style materials, etc. by going straight to 160 instead of making 150 now and having to spend it again when you go to 160.
Nowadays though, there's better quality DROP gear that you can farm that can be more economical. You can find the pieces sometimes for quite cheap, a fourth of the cost of one stack of crafting mats. They already have enchantments, and they usually are self-upgrading enchantments, meaning if you go purple quality ony our gear, the enchantment has purple quality.
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Bryanonymous✭✭✭✭✭You'll be fine until you have more gold than you need. Then you can just buy the mats.0
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STEVIL✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Before 1T when fewer sets drops at 160, the 10x made still some sort of sense.
now that every set drops at 160, it makes no sense anymore and needs to be fixed when they finish their 1T overhaul on crafting.
My answer is this: if you dont have the mats, 150 is likely just fine. You prolly wont miss anything serious content wise.
After a while you will likely end up with sufficient mats that you will be able to go ahead and do what you want.
Dont buy the mats unless you yourself have identified a key absolute need. just do 150 until you r are flush.
The good news is all those drops at 160 can be deconned. Also, honestly, a lot of drop sets are very worthwhile now so, you can likely farm a set including jewels of one of those you like quicker than you can farm raw mats for a full set of 160 crafteds - and its a lot more fun and gains xp too.Proudly skooma free while talks-when-drunk is in mandatory public housing.
YFMV Your Fun May Vary.
First Law of Nerf-o-Dynamics
"The good way I used to get good kills *with good skill* was good but the way others kill me now is bad."0 -
Myyth✭✭✭✭✭Before 1T when fewer sets drops at 160, the 10x made still some sort of sense.
now that every set drops at 160, it makes no sense anymore and needs to be fixed when they finish their 1T overhaul on crafting.
My answer is this: if you dont have the mats, 150 is likely just fine. You prolly wont miss anything serious content wise.
.
Ok that explains why there is a 10x increase in mats.
But now that I understand its an outdated mechanic that doesn't apply anymore, it makes me even less want to craft a CP160 set.
I am sure eventually I will farm the mats needed, but is there any point when you can get dropped sets of equal or even better value in some cases?
I do see that a CP160 crafted set is like an investment because you don't have to replace it. So there is some value in that to counter the expense of the mats.
But over all, it just seems better to forget crafting and get a dropped monster set. I don't think there is any crafted set bonus that is so good that it beats the many different monster set bonuses or justifies spending so much on mats. I understand now why people feel that crafting is useless at max level.
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STEVIL✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Before 1T when fewer sets drops at 160, the 10x made still some sort of sense.
now that every set drops at 160, it makes no sense anymore and needs to be fixed when they finish their 1T overhaul on crafting.
My answer is this: if you dont have the mats, 150 is likely just fine. You prolly wont miss anything serious content wise.
.
Ok that explains why there is a 10x increase in mats.
But now that I understand its an outdated mechanic that doesn't apply anymore, it makes me even less want to craft a CP160 set.
I am sure eventually I will farm the mats needed, but is there any point when you can get dropped sets of equal or even better value in some cases?
I do see that a CP160 crafted set is like an investment because you don't have to replace it. So there is some value in that to counter the expense of the mats.
But over all, it just seems better to forget crafting and get a dropped monster set. I don't think there is any crafted set bonus that is so good that it beats the many different monster set bonuses or justifies spending so much on mats. I understand now why people feel that crafting is useless at max level.
Also, to be frank, there is a balance update in the near future - and that will likely include trait changes, set changes skill changes and i suspect even sustain changes - so i would NOT recommend any major investments in gear that you dont see as "casual throwaway pocket change" loss until then - unless you have a compelling need.
You run the risk of having your new toy become obsolete overnight.
I am setting on over 3k rubedite and more of the other tier-10 mats and i wont be crafting anything serious until i see the update... there are just too many old sets and drops at 160 for me to see doing that spend before update, even with it being "disposable income mats" for me.
But again, if i get an itch that i have to scratch, i will. fun is more important than efficiency.
Proudly skooma free while talks-when-drunk is in mandatory public housing.
YFMV Your Fun May Vary.
First Law of Nerf-o-Dynamics
"The good way I used to get good kills *with good skill* was good but the way others kill me now is bad."0 -
helediron✭✭✭✭✭
✭ZOS made the cp160 mats requirements in IC DLC to "make crafted sets equally hard to acquire as drop sets". Now drop sets drop like candy and with brushed-up stats. Crafted sets are mostly outdated and still have the silly mats requirement from days of IC.
ZOS should change this so that we can use any material. Only amount selects the level. Put e.g. one for level 1 gear and 40 for cp160. The material only affects the visual look. That way we could use the early blue motif looks at cp160 and NOT have red swords at cp160. And maybe birch staff has light tone and nightwood black? And we could actually harvest birch in the Rift!On hiatus. PC,EU,AD - crafting completionist - @helediron 900+ cp, @helestor 1000+ cp, @helestar 800+ cp, @helester 700+ cp - Dragonborn Z Suomikilta, Harrods, Master Crafter. - Blog - Crafthouse: all stations, all munduses, all dummies, open to everyone2 -
Bryanonymous✭✭✭✭✭A lot of you are making the wrong assumptions. The 10x cost was anticipated for the release of 1t to compensate for the fact that max level players would flood the market with max level mats, and kill their price. And it's playing out exactly like that. Just buy the mats you need. The mechanic is working perfectly fine. And I think I have the most qualified opinion of most players, as I have probably sold more custom max level set pieces than almost anyone.Edited by Bryanonymous on December 18, 2016 10:28AM0
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FoolishHuman✭✭✭✭✭Bryanonymous wrote: »And I think I have the most qualified opinion of most players[...]
The official motto of these forums.3 -
Bryanonymous✭✭✭✭✭FoolishHuman wrote: »Bryanonymous wrote: »And I think I have the most qualified opinion of most players[...]
The official motto of these forums.
Well, in this case, I deal with max level mats daily, and resell them in crafted sets quite often. Just based on the frequency that my individual pieces sell, I can clearly vouch that many many players have no problem paying 50k+ for a max level purple set. See, at end game, gold becomes abundant with very few things to actually spend it on.0 -
helediron✭✭✭✭✭
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About that 1T opinion: you are one year too late. The mats costs came in IC to balance crafting with scarcity of drops. After Orsinium, TG and DB and their scaling, 1T meant very little.Bryanonymous wrote: »FoolishHuman wrote: »Bryanonymous wrote: »And I think I have the most qualified opinion of most players[...]
The official motto of these forums.
Well, in this case, I deal with max level mats daily, and resell them in crafted sets quite often. Just based on the frequency that my individual pieces sell, I can clearly vouch that many many players have no problem paying 50k+ for a max level purple set. See, at end game, gold becomes abundant with very few things to actually spend it on.
On hiatus. PC,EU,AD - crafting completionist - @helediron 900+ cp, @helestor 1000+ cp, @helestar 800+ cp, @helester 700+ cp - Dragonborn Z Suomikilta, Harrods, Master Crafter. - Blog - Crafthouse: all stations, all munduses, all dummies, open to everyone1 -
Bryanonymous✭✭✭✭✭
About that 1T opinion: you are one year too late. The mats costs came in IC to balance crafting with scarcity of drops. After Orsinium, TG and DB and their scaling, 1T meant very little.Bryanonymous wrote: »FoolishHuman wrote: »Bryanonymous wrote: »And I think I have the most qualified opinion of most players[...]
The official motto of these forums.
Well, in this case, I deal with max level mats daily, and resell them in crafted sets quite often. Just based on the frequency that my individual pieces sell, I can clearly vouch that many many players have no problem paying 50k+ for a max level purple set. See, at end game, gold becomes abundant with very few things to actually spend it on.
How long do you think they had planned ahead for 1t? You think they just snap their fingers and poof, things happen overnight? No. These things are anticipated far in advance. The mat cost was clearly a part of the plan.0 -
helediron✭✭✭✭✭
✭
I am developer myself, and the answer is yes and no. It's grayer than you think. And there is that part that ZOS made acquiring drop gear so easy. The balance is favouring too much dropsets, regardless about that 1T opinion.Bryanonymous wrote: »
About that 1T opinion: you are one year too late. The mats costs came in IC to balance crafting with scarcity of drops. After Orsinium, TG and DB and their scaling, 1T meant very little.Bryanonymous wrote: »FoolishHuman wrote: »Bryanonymous wrote: »And I think I have the most qualified opinion of most players[...]
The official motto of these forums.
Well, in this case, I deal with max level mats daily, and resell them in crafted sets quite often. Just based on the frequency that my individual pieces sell, I can clearly vouch that many many players have no problem paying 50k+ for a max level purple set. See, at end game, gold becomes abundant with very few things to actually spend it on.
How long do you think they had planned ahead for 1t? You think they just snap their fingers and poof, things happen overnight? No. These things are anticipated far in advance. The mat cost was clearly a part of the plan.
On hiatus. PC,EU,AD - crafting completionist - @helediron 900+ cp, @helestor 1000+ cp, @helestar 800+ cp, @helester 700+ cp - Dragonborn Z Suomikilta, Harrods, Master Crafter. - Blog - Crafthouse: all stations, all munduses, all dummies, open to everyone0 -
Bryanonymous✭✭✭✭✭
I am developer myself, and the answer is yes and no. It's grayer than you think. And there is that part that ZOS made acquiring drop gear so easy. The balance is favouring too much dropsets, regardless about that 1T opinion.Bryanonymous wrote: »
About that 1T opinion: you are one year too late. The mats costs came in IC to balance crafting with scarcity of drops. After Orsinium, TG and DB and their scaling, 1T meant very little.Bryanonymous wrote: »FoolishHuman wrote: »Bryanonymous wrote: »And I think I have the most qualified opinion of most players[...]
The official motto of these forums.
Well, in this case, I deal with max level mats daily, and resell them in crafted sets quite often. Just based on the frequency that my individual pieces sell, I can clearly vouch that many many players have no problem paying 50k+ for a max level purple set. See, at end game, gold becomes abundant with very few things to actually spend it on.
How long do you think they had planned ahead for 1t? You think they just snap their fingers and poof, things happen overnight? No. These things are anticipated far in advance. The mat cost was clearly a part of the plan.
The 1t update took massive work to make the necessary changes. It's likely the update was in development for a year, and it's not hard to believe the fine details were planned before the development of the update ever began.
The mechanic is just too convenient to not have been planned. Max level players end up farming max level mats which likely flood the market with around 10x more than other craft mats, so the 10x cost balances the price really well. This was not a mistake, it was a clever way to control the flood of max level mats, and just not understood by players who got use to spending ridiculous amounts on max level gear until now, when max level mats are becoming dirt cheap.0 -
helediron✭✭✭✭✭
✭
It all was already in Orsinium, TG and DB. 1T brought silly easy drop gear. The imbalance is there and it does not fit. It looks convenient only on surface.Bryanonymous wrote: »
I am developer myself, and the answer is yes and no. It's grayer than you think. And there is that part that ZOS made acquiring drop gear so easy. The balance is favouring too much dropsets, regardless about that 1T opinion.Bryanonymous wrote: »
About that 1T opinion: you are one year too late. The mats costs came in IC to balance crafting with scarcity of drops. After Orsinium, TG and DB and their scaling, 1T meant very little.Bryanonymous wrote: »FoolishHuman wrote: »Bryanonymous wrote: »And I think I have the most qualified opinion of most players[...]
The official motto of these forums.
Well, in this case, I deal with max level mats daily, and resell them in crafted sets quite often. Just based on the frequency that my individual pieces sell, I can clearly vouch that many many players have no problem paying 50k+ for a max level purple set. See, at end game, gold becomes abundant with very few things to actually spend it on.
How long do you think they had planned ahead for 1t? You think they just snap their fingers and poof, things happen overnight? No. These things are anticipated far in advance. The mat cost was clearly a part of the plan.
The 1t update took massive work to make the necessary changes. It's likely the update was in development for a year, and it's not hard to believe the fine details were planned before the development of the update ever began.
The mechanic is just too convenient to not have been planned. Max level players end up farming max level mats which likely flood the market with around 10x more than other craft mats, so the 10x cost balances the price really well. This was not a mistake, it was a clever way to control the flood of max level mats, and just not understood by players who got use to spending ridiculous amounts on max level gear until now, when max level mats are becoming dirt cheap.
On hiatus. PC,EU,AD - crafting completionist - @helediron 900+ cp, @helestor 1000+ cp, @helestar 800+ cp, @helester 700+ cp - Dragonborn Z Suomikilta, Harrods, Master Crafter. - Blog - Crafthouse: all stations, all munduses, all dummies, open to everyone0 -
STEVIL✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭ZOS made the cp160 mats requirements in IC DLC to "make crafted sets equally hard to acquire as drop sets". Now drop sets drop like candy and with brushed-up stats. Crafted sets are mostly outdated and still have the silly mats requirement from days of IC.
ZOS should change this so that we can use any material. Only amount selects the level. Put e.g. one for level 1 gear and 40 for cp160. The material only affects the visual look. That way we could use the early blue motif looks at cp160 and NOT have red swords at cp160. And maybe birch staff has light tone and nightwood black? And we could actually harvest birch in the Rift!
RE the bold you and i agree in principle here but my implementation would be different but only slightly.
i would let you use any mat to craft its current cap or lower but not higher and let you select the "level style" regardless of what material was used.
In both cases, things advance as you level your skills but after max you basically have "one mat" for each craft that is in use.
The difference is you would not be forced to maintain separate stockpiles of 30 different mats in order to have access to the styles.
IE, For me i could gather rubedite and make any level any style using just one inventory slot and one tally... but in yours you would nee to gather different inventories and different tallies for every style.
i just dont see benefit in having to maintain ten times the material slots/tallies for style when gathering is scaled.
Also, level is a combat effect - has impact on performance - while looks are not.
Your way having a lvl 6 char gathering iron jute maple is just as good as having a lvl 50 cp 160 gather rubedite, ancsilk, ruby ash. In the scaled 1T thats not as off as it once was but its still off to me. the gold gains, xp gains and value of drops for those lvl 6ers are all lower but if iron can craft cp160 then the nodes are mismatched to the other rewards.
So no to iron makes any level gear (the actual game mechanics combat bonus - value) but yes to letting you select appearance separate from material (the cosmetic effect just for fun) with the added bonus of fewer inventory slots needed.
Tons of freedom with the cosmetic fun stuff makes sense.
limitations on the actual combat effect stuff that make leveling good also makes sense.
IMO
Proudly skooma free while talks-when-drunk is in mandatory public housing.
YFMV Your Fun May Vary.
First Law of Nerf-o-Dynamics
"The good way I used to get good kills *with good skill* was good but the way others kill me now is bad."0 -
Bryanonymous✭✭✭✭✭
It all was already in Orsinium, TG and DB. 1T brought silly easy drop gear. The imbalance is there and it does not fit. It looks convenient only on surface.Bryanonymous wrote: »
I am developer myself, and the answer is yes and no. It's grayer than you think. And there is that part that ZOS made acquiring drop gear so easy. The balance is favouring too much dropsets, regardless about that 1T opinion.Bryanonymous wrote: »
About that 1T opinion: you are one year too late. The mats costs came in IC to balance crafting with scarcity of drops. After Orsinium, TG and DB and their scaling, 1T meant very little.Bryanonymous wrote: »FoolishHuman wrote: »Bryanonymous wrote: »And I think I have the most qualified opinion of most players[...]
The official motto of these forums.
Well, in this case, I deal with max level mats daily, and resell them in crafted sets quite often. Just based on the frequency that my individual pieces sell, I can clearly vouch that many many players have no problem paying 50k+ for a max level purple set. See, at end game, gold becomes abundant with very few things to actually spend it on.
How long do you think they had planned ahead for 1t? You think they just snap their fingers and poof, things happen overnight? No. These things are anticipated far in advance. The mat cost was clearly a part of the plan.
The 1t update took massive work to make the necessary changes. It's likely the update was in development for a year, and it's not hard to believe the fine details were planned before the development of the update ever began.
The mechanic is just too convenient to not have been planned. Max level players end up farming max level mats which likely flood the market with around 10x more than other craft mats, so the 10x cost balances the price really well. This was not a mistake, it was a clever way to control the flood of max level mats, and just not understood by players who got use to spending ridiculous amounts on max level gear until now, when max level mats are becoming dirt cheap.
Or 1t was planned around the time of the champion system as the eventual next stage, which is why every dlc since was battle leveled, not end game like Craglorn.0 -
nodulo✭✭✭Getting back to the OP's question another fairly substantial bonus to cp160 level armor is the difference in enchantment bonuses on legendary quality. It adds up to quite a bit if all armor pieces are yellow and enchanted accordingly.
With that said if you are just running solo and doing some daily 4 man's (no hardmodes) I'm sure cp150 armor will be just fine.
Weapons should absolutely be cp160 as there is a big difference from the cp150 versions.0 -
Getting back to the OP's question another fairly substantial bonus to cp160 level armor is the difference in enchantment bonuses on legendary quality. It adds up to quite a bit if all armor pieces are yellow and enchanted accordingly.
With that said if you are just running solo and doing some daily 4 man's (no hardmodes) I'm sure cp150 armor will be just fine.
Weapons should absolutely be cp160 as there is a big difference from the cp150 versions.
How much would you say the differences are? I was thinking of crafting a CP160 set like OP but now i´m not at all sure. Should I craft armor in CP150 and weapons at CP160?0 -
cwy✭✭HrolleifTheUnbroken wrote: »Getting back to the OP's question another fairly substantial bonus to cp160 level armor is the difference in enchantment bonuses on legendary quality. It adds up to quite a bit if all armor pieces are yellow and enchanted accordingly.
With that said if you are just running solo and doing some daily 4 man's (no hardmodes) I'm sure cp150 armor will be just fine.
Weapons should absolutely be cp160 as there is a big difference from the cp150 versions.
How much would you say the differences are? I was thinking of crafting a CP160 set like OP but now i´m not at all sure. Should I craft armor in CP150 and weapons at CP160?
You can take a look at this weapon damage chart. Low-level weapons give you 2-3% increase in damage per temper used. But gold temper for CP150 gives you 10% increase (1120 to 1235 dmg), while CP160 gold temper gives you *17%* increase (1144 to 1335). So both CP150 and CP160 gold tempers give you big increase, but CP160 is even more rewarding with that 17%. Hence, the big material cost for crafting CP160 weapons. Note that this isn't true for armor, as tempers only add 2-3% armor across the abroad. Maybe ESO should really lower the cost of CP160 armor instead.
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Juponen✭✭✭
Crafting needs to be free of the artificial CP160 tariff since good CP160 sets drop everywhere and crafting has been sidelined enough as it is.1