Vet Maelstrom Arena Needs a Hard Mode

KingYogi415

Vet Maelstrom is amazing end-game content. The time, persistence and dedication it takes to be able to beat it is astronomical compered any other single player content I have ever seen.

The first 10-20 are a rush of what weapon am I going to get, has all this hard work paid off?

After 40 runs you start to remember the definition of insanity: Doing the same thing over and over again expecting different results.

People can put in hundreds of hours to get a single weapon, and still not be deemed "good enough" by the RNG gods.

I have quit running VMA and am using that time to play other games.

Clearly mastering this content was not enough to be reward by ZOS. They need to Add a mode, no matter how difficult that actually rewards players for their work.

I am suggesting a hard mode that gives a player a choice of the weapon they have earned.

One of these or a combination should work fine:

1. A ten percent across the board buff.

2. Going flawless.

3. An un-killable shade that follows your whole arena and does 2k dps to you.

4. Add 1-3 extra adds to every single stage.

5. Casting the same skill more then once in a row, causes 3k damage to you


Interested in hearing your hard mode ideas.

Cheers!

OutLaw_Nynx

Make a new character, use no champion points, make said character a hybrid build.


Seems hard enough.


This is kinda a kick to the face for me. I struggle with this place and you make it seem like it's nothing but I'm guessing you've spent a lot of time there. I found only frustration and disappointment

Izaki

I'd we only need hard mode for the final boss. Frankly what you proposed will just make the arena longer and more unbearable of a grind.
I doubt they will do anything like a hard mode. So if anything I think that we should get the type of weapon we want in a random trait after a flawless run. Like Fa-nuit Hen asking us which type of weapon we wish to wield: SnB, DW, 2H, Bow, Resto or Destro, similar to the Fighters' Guild quest line. That way we can at least get a far better chance at a drop. We'll still have the rubbish traits, but at least we'll have a weapon type that we actually want. It will also push people to actually try to do the flawless run, rather than just sticking with a clear and the Stormproof title.

KingYogi415

IzakiBrotheSs wrote: »

I'd we only need hard mode for the final boss. Frankly what you proposed will just make the arena longer and more unbearable of a grind.
I doubt they will do anything like a hard mode. So if anything I think that we should get the type of weapon we want in a random trait after a flawless run. Like Fa-nuit Hen asking us which type of weapon we wish to wield: SnB, DW, 2H, Bow, Resto or Destro, similar to the Fighters' Guild quest line. That way we can at least get a far better chance at a drop. We'll still have the rubbish traits, but at least we'll have a weapon type that we actually want. It will also push people to actually try to do the flawless run, rather than just sticking with a clear and the Stormproof title.

It would be super hard content with a guaranteed reward.

Compared to people who run the regular arena 300+ times with not sharpened inferno staff, it's the opposite of a grind.

KingYogi415

OutLaw_Nynx wrote: »

Make a new character, use no champion points, make said character a hybrid build.


Seems hard enough.


This is kinda a kick to the face for me. I struggle with this place and you make it seem like it's nothing but I'm guessing you've spent a lot of time there. I found only frustration and disappointment

Your suggestion would be a hard mode that caps CP around 400.

I approve!

OutLaw_Nynx

I was more suggesting no CP at all.

Browiseth

is this the real life?
is this just fantasy?
caught in a landslide
no escape from reality

also i don't think we need a hardmode

azoriangaming

go naked that's fun and a challenge

Nerdman9

Only make HM affect last boss, like trials. HM doubles his health and makes all his skull attacks a one shot even if you try to block, so you have to dodge roll them, or even just add some new mechanics. Maybe instead of just needing to kill 1 clan fear over a pad. Make it all 3 to be able to go up. Something to stop you from being able to just burn through the stage without having to even see a daedroth or worry about killing the summoner dudes that go to center. Like you said,first 20 times were fun, then it just becomes a routine.

HM could reward you with 2 weapons, like hm trials gives 2 gold jewellery. Or a weapon and a token that you would need 50 of to get the weapon of your choice in the trait you want. Just spitballing here.

Vaoh

Try vMA with 0CP.

It's possible, but it's not easy.

Good luck

Meld777

KingYogi415 wrote: »

People can put in hundreds of hours to get a single weapon, and still not be deemed "good enough" by the RNG gods.

If you wanna play a great game with a fair loot system, play Black Desert. If you prefer Tamriel over fair competition, deal with the consequences.

Vaoh wrote: »

Try vMA with 0CP.

It's possible, but it's not easy.

Good luck

I actually ran it with 0 CP for fun once. It sounds tough, but it really isn't. If you know all the spawns, it's not harder. It just takes slightly longer. You gotta endure the toilet mode on round 2 boss, deal with the adds on round 3, round 4 burst worked even without CP, etc. I don't see it as a valid "hard mode" for people like us (somewhere in the area of 500 vMA runs). But hey, if it would finally provide me with a Sharpened Inferno, sure.

mb10

Going flawless with my stam NB was actually up there with getting emporer in terms of sense of achievement.

Bearing in mind I got emporer in the second week of ESO where I was solo-ing and it was legit kill more than anyone else and hope your faction takes every keep - not any guild cheating

Maelstorm difficulty was crazy but somewhat reasonable imo. I do think that rewards needs to get revsmped though.

disintegr8

Come on everyone, the OP is not asking for a hard mode because vMSA is too easy, the OP wants a hard mode as a way to get on the good side of the brutal gods of RNG that will offer you a choice of weapons. I think it is a reasonable suggestion.

If you are happy running vMSA over and over and over and over again and still not getting a decent weapon, then you are against the OP's suggestion. I see a lot of threads complaining about not being able to get a decent weapon, so there must be some people who would welcome this kind of suggestion.

Maybe some of you read the title of this thread and did not fully read the content, assuming it was someone saying it was too easy. This was my first reaction until I took the time to read the thread. Good to see at least there are a couple of people who have read and responded with suitable comments.

bellanca6561n

A huge problem with Maelstrom is that...well....two problems.

1. It's too hard for most players and...

2. Many perceive its rewards as crucial to end game multiplayer builds.

If you're leaving when Maelstrom ceases to be a challenge for you, then the multiplayer part doesn't interest you.

That's okay but this is - at least alleged to be - a multiplayer game. Thus the myriad problems with the multiplayer part should reasonably take priority.

[Edit to remove Advertisement]

Paneross

No thanks

Paneross

Majority population across all platforms still can't beat it. Why make a harder one?

Izaki

KingYogi415 wrote: »

IzakiBrotheSs wrote: »

I'd we only need hard mode for the final boss. Frankly what you proposed will just make the arena longer and more unbearable of a grind.
I doubt they will do anything like a hard mode. So if anything I think that we should get the type of weapon we want in a random trait after a flawless run. Like Fa-nuit Hen asking us which type of weapon we wish to wield: SnB, DW, 2H, Bow, Resto or Destro, similar to the Fighters' Guild quest line. That way we can at least get a far better chance at a drop. We'll still have the rubbish traits, but at least we'll have a weapon type that we actually want. It will also push people to actually try to do the flawless run, rather than just sticking with a clear and the Stormproof title.

It would be super hard content with a guaranteed reward.

Compared to people who run the regular arena 300+ times with not sharpened inferno staff, it's the opposite of a grind.

You're dreaming though, they won't make the arena harder. They stated that they weren't going to alter the difficulty of vMA. So best thing we can hope for is a new achievement that lets you chose your weapon, a hard mode last boss (that gives you a s*** ton of points) with a guaranteed drop of some sort or the token system. I doubt we'll see any of that but we can always try.

Massive_Stain

KingYogi415 wrote: »

Vet Maelstrom is amazing end-game content. The time, persistence and dedication it takes to be able to beat it is astronomical compered any other single player content I have ever seen.

The first 10-20 are a rush of what weapon am I going to get, has all this hard work paid off?

After 40 runs you start to remember the definition of insanity: Doing the same thing over and over again expecting different results.

People can put in hundreds of hours to get a single weapon, and still not be deemed "good enough" by the RNG gods.

I have quit running VMA and am using that time to play other games.

Clearly mastering this content was not enough to be reward by ZOS. They need to Add a mode, no matter how difficult that actually rewards players for their work.

I am suggesting a hard mode that gives a player a choice of the weapon they have earned.

One of these or a combination should work fine:

1. A ten percent across the board buff.

2. Going flawless.

3. An un-killable shade that follows your whole arena and does 2k dps to you.

4. Add 1-3 extra adds to every single stage.

5. Casting the same skill more then once in a row, causes 3k damage to you


Interested in hearing your hard mode ideas.

Cheers!

Right there with ya. My mag sorc has outfitted all 7 of my stam toons with sharpened bows, sword n board, daggers, axes, mauls, and greatswords... But not ONE staff! Not ONE for the toon putting in the work.

Doctordarkspawn

Yes, because lets pour gasoline on a tire fire.

I'm sorry, are you insane? Do you just want to watch the world burn, Mr. Joker?

Surak73

Actually, I have run vMA only seven times (four with double rewards, three with single), and I got useful (= no *** traits) weapons for all of my four main characters: precise inferno staff for my magblade, nirhoned lightning staff for my sorcerer, defending resto staff for my healer and sharpened 2h axe and nirhoned bow for my stamblade.

OK, I would like a sharpened lightning staff and a sharpened bow instead of the nirhoned ones, and a 2h mace instead of the axe, but with only seven runs I can't really complain, and I'm feeling pretty lucky.

Now, however, the problem is that I haven't enough motivation for running it again: I have no need to get a weapons since I have them already, chances of getting something better are ridiculous (less the one out of ten, I suppose), and doing the content is still more than an hour of hard work for me...

Yep, I think some sort of mechanics with granted reward is needed. However, ZOS clearly wants we continue to run the arena, so I don't think this hard mode solution has many chances to be implemented: once learned, it would not be really more difficult than the actual one, so you would have your weapons in a short time and you would stop playing this content. Perhaps a ticket solution has more chances.

Banana

You must be on some good drugs

KingYogi415

People need to read the first sentance.

40 runs after I knew how do VMA and not a single sharpened weapon.

It's not great for the game when devs think a 300 hour hamster wheel for one weapon is right.

A hard mode with a 100% to get your weapon is the best way they can fix this trash.

Im all ready level 55 in ark (pvp server) from one weekend of play. Being rewarded for my play time is what any gamer wants.

S1ipperyJim

Starvation mode - no food or potions
Aquilarios mode - you leave your armor with Repairius at the start before entering the arena, and get it back when you finish
Apprentice mode - no CP
The Ultimate Challenge - no ultimate abilities

FriedEggSandwich

I'm surprised at the amount of disagreement in this thread tbh, when I saw the title I imagined more of a positive response. A hard mode wouldn't have to affect the current vma or its rewards. I'd be up for a hard mode and that's from someone with no flawless and a high score of only 550k.

NewBlacksmurf

Ya know it's another thread about the drops in VMA

I know ppl like solo stuff but no one likes how the loot works
Mdefinately time for changes....wonder if any will come

Jeremy

FriedEggSandwich wrote: »

I'm surprised at the amount of disagreement in this thread tbh, when I saw the title I imagined more of a positive response. A hard mode wouldn't have to affect the current vma or its rewards. I'd be up for a hard mode and that's from someone with no flawless and a high score of only 550k.

Anything that even remotely suggest that Veteran Maelstrom should be made harder is likely to get a negative response.

It's plenty difficult as it is. The last thing I want to see is more incentives to torture myself with even a more frustrating version of it.

f047ys3v3n

So, I get what your saying. The rng is infuriating, unfair, forum thread inspiring, rage quit inducing, garbage. 1/144 for a sharpened inferno or shock is just plain wrong. Your also thinking your so bloody good at this content you would be willing to have it bumped up another notch to get what you want (I might add that making the weekly board is kinda another notch since only very competitive runs make this anymore.) So you reason that this next level of difficulty should be enough to get you your bloody weapon.

I disagree with part of this. vMA is already very difficult content. Yes, like you I now do it pretty smoothy and have the flawless title though, being a mNB my score is not quite 550k. We should remember, there are still very very few players who can complete this much less run it with no deaths. I know many players who are good but still can't quite get it and often can't even get to the later rounds to know how hard it really gets. What I am saying is that I don't think that there needs to be another, harder, mode to gate better RNG for gear. The RNG should just be better for everyone completing it. It should be 1/10 or better on what you want or, better yet, have a token system. It is that simple.

As for a harder mode. I actually think a harder mode, especially for the last boss, might be kinda interesting perhaps for a higher score bonus for the leaderboards. I'm not sure if I would like just more health, more incoming damage, more adds, or more actual mechanics. It might be interesting to have pads that could be activated for instance to spawn large monsters rewarding more points for each killed so a player could choose how many and when to pull them in. I am not opposed to adding more difficult modes to this though, with non-vet, vet, and dynamic difficultly adjustments though sigils I am also not dissatisfied with the number of levels of difficulty the content can currently be scaled to. I also would not add anything to the lower arena bosses or trash pulls as they already take too long as far as I am concerned. The final boss has the high number of mechanics and has less RNG related death (is better designed than say boss 7) it is just him that I think having a hard mode might be fun for.

The biggest issues with vMA is that the RNG is terrible and the reward beside the weapon you want is non-existant (you loose money dropping 30 pots to run content that barely pays for gear repairs.)

Meld777

This was a pretty cool suggestion from some thread about new possible sets:

LegendaryArcher wrote: »

Sharpened Conqueror (dropped in Veteran Maelstrom Arena)

(2 items) Max Health is decreased by 50%
(3 items) Max Magicka is decreased by 50%
(4 items) Max Stamina is decreased by 50%
(5 items) Your movement speed is decreased by 10%. When worn through a whole Veteran Maelstrom Arena run without breaks, every chest has a 5% chance to drop a Maelstrom weapon; the Theater of Despair Chest of Champions drops a guaranteed Maelstrom weapon with the Sharpened trait.

It could be realized in a way that whenever a vMA run starts, you receive a "Sharpened Conqueror" buff, which you lose when you lose the 5-set bonus. This buff affects your drops. And the only way to regain the buff is to start a new run.

FriedEggSandwich

Jeremy wrote: »

FriedEggSandwich wrote: »

I'm surprised at the amount of disagreement in this thread tbh, when I saw the title I imagined more of a positive response. A hard mode wouldn't have to affect the current vma or its rewards. I'd be up for a hard mode and that's from someone with no flawless and a high score of only 550k.

Anything that even remotely suggest that Veteran Maelstrom should be made harder is likely to get a negative response.

It's plenty difficult as it is. The last thing I want to see is more incentives to torture myself with even a more frustrating version of it.

Fair point. I admit I would rather a duo arena to come before a hard mode on vma, but a hard mode wouldn't have to be compulsory in the same way that many people see vma as compulsory. The reward could just be a slightly higher chance at a decent reward, and yellow quality drops maybe. Also a request for a hard mode doesn't have to suggest that the requester finds vma too easy; it's possible to get bored with something before you master it completely. I haven't completely mastered vma even slightly but I would try a hard mode all the same.

S1ipperyJim

f047ys3v3n wrote: »

As for a harder mode. I actually think a harder mode, especially for the last boss, might be kinda interesting perhaps for a higher score bonus for the leaderboards. I'm not sure if I would like just more health, more incoming damage, more adds, or more actual mechanics.

If ZOS were to go with their standard old skool method of hard mode, hard mode would probably be to not use any of the gold ghosts, you would really have to burn the boss hard before he gets the 3 ghosts himself to complete it, or alternatively (not as hard though) collect them and not use the synergy.

IronCrystal

I agree we need something more difficult. I'm not sure though that having the entire run be more difficult. Maybe the final boss or each boss is made more difficult.

Something needs to be rewarding for doing more difficult content but I don't have the answer as to what that should be.

Right now vMA and vDSA as it stands are the only things in the game that requires the vet version to get the gear. I think there needs to be more like that or add more difficult versions to help get the gear more easily