For any class, why Stamina vs Magicka?

gel214thb14_ESO

I'm just starting to explore the game and I'm confused by the Stamina vs Magicka paths.

It seems that Classes are defined by their Class skills, which all use Magicka.

Weapons are tied to Stamina, but any Class can use any Weapon.

So it seems to me that if you focus on Stamina then your Class doesn't matter as much. You would be using your class abilities sparingly due to a reduced Magicka pool, and the majority of your attacks and actions will be based on your Weapons. So your Class abilities will be your heals, and maybe some buffs.

For example let's look at Dragon Knight, an amazing class type that focuses on unique fire breathing and flame attacks. Those are all Magicka based, and if you go Stamina you would instead be using what...a 2H Sword? No flaming whips, and blazing dragon breath attacks..just...Swing swing chop chop stabbity stabbity. Which I could do as a Sorcerer. Or as a Templar.

Question is, why would you pick Stamina over Magicka? Is weapon damage that much higher than Magicka so it would be worth losing your class identity? Are Stamina costs much lower so you get an easier time at it? I'm looking at it from a solo PVE player perspective. I know some abilities can morph to Stamina versions, but these seem to be quite few.

Voxicity

There are many skills throughout all classes that can be morphed to scale off max stamina, weapon damage, weapon crit and physical penetration, such as the Surprise Attack morph of Veiled Strike

aaaand just read your last sentence... oops

But yeah as it is right now, most stamina builds share many skills and their class skills are mostly just buffs

OrphanHelgen

The reason stam DK for example was so good, was because of the maelstrom flurry enchant, which gave 3k additional weaponp dmg on your next single target DOT. This was good with standard of might, since it increase your dmg done by 20%, and the venomous claw is really high dmg and low cost. Other then that, its all weapon skills yes. They dont have any passives that increase their physical dmg like sorcs, or crit dmg like templars.

The single target dps from a stam dk, was one of the best, but it had its downsides. The boss have to stand completely still, and you have to be within 5 meter range all the time.

Right now, magicka classes are back, due to new sets mother sorrow and the monster sets. It can also do sick dmg from range, and have access to shields, which is why I dont understand the nerf of the maelstrom flurry enchant.

Chelo

gel214thb14_ESO wrote: »

I'm just starting to explore the game and I'm confused by the Stamina vs Magicka paths.

It seems that Classes are defined by their Class skills, which all use Magicka.

Weapons are tied to Stamina, but any Class can use any Weapon.

So it seems to me that if you focus on Stamina then your Class doesn't matter as much. You would be using your class abilities sparingly due to a reduced Magicka pool, and the majority of your attacks and actions will be based on your Weapons. So your Class abilities will be your heals, and maybe some buffs.

For example let's look at Dragon Knight, an amazing class type that focuses on unique fire breathing and flame attacks. Those are all Magicka based, and if you go Stamina you would instead be using what...a 2H Sword? No flaming whips, and blazing dragon breath attacks..just...Swing swing chop chop stabbity stabbity. Which I could do as a Sorcerer. Or as a Templar.

Question is, why would you pick Stamina over Magicka? Is weapon damage that much higher than Magicka so it would be worth losing your class identity? Are Stamina costs much lower so you get an easier time at it? I'm looking at it from a solo PVE player perspective. I know some abilities can morph to Stamina versions, but these seem to be quite few.

Because Devs love Stamina and Physical dmg, so right now its almost imposible to be on par with Stamina (and weapon skills) if you are playing Magicka (PVE DPS).

boldscot

You still use class abilities although not as many if you go stamina. You'll be dealing poison damage instead of flame damage though.

Currently Stam DK with MSA DW are capable of pulling the highest sustained DPS in the game.

gel214thb14_ESO

Great responses, and maybe I shouldn't have used a specific class.

I'm looking at overall classes here. I still haven't picked one , I have all four at about level 11 , except the nightblade which is languishing at 7.

For me it's trying to pick a class AND an attribute line, Magicka or Stamina, for that class.

As a PVE Solo player who is starting out, the complexities of end game between the different armor sets and special items seems a long way off.

Because Devs love Stamina and Physical dmg, so right now its almost imposible to be on par with Stamina (and weapon skills) if you are playing Magicka (PVE DPS).

So from these few responses, Weapon damage is much, much higher than Magicka skill lines' damage?

freespirit

I'm not great on what does best damage BUT the one thing I find most important for me is enjoying your characters.

I personally prefer magicka based characters, I have 3 stamina based ones but I struggle with them. Partly because I love throwing spells about but also because I find the lack of stamina class skills to be really, really annoying.

I feel some forethought on where you're wanting to be at endgame is helpful, for one it could save you some Crowns on a race change.

However as far as stamina versus magicka is concerned, it is really easy and not that expensive to swap skills and attributes about, I know I've just done it, I leveled my bow skills from 4 to 50 in no time at all, just by using a bow with training trait.

Try them both make sure you choose the one you like playing!!

Izaki

OrphanHelgen wrote: »

The reason stam DK for example was so good, was because of the maelstrom flurry enchant, which gave 3k additional weaponp dmg on your next single target DOT. This was good with standard of might, since it increase your dmg done by 20%, and the venomous claw is really high dmg and low cost. Other then that, its all weapon skills yes. They dont have any passives that increase their physical dmg like sorcs, or crit dmg like templars.

The single target dps from a stam dk, was one of the best, but it had its downsides. The boss have to stand completely still, and you have to be within 5 meter range all the time.

Right now, magicka classes are back, due to new sets mother sorrow and the monster sets. It can also do sick dmg from range, and have access to shields, which is why I dont understand the nerf of the maelstrom flurry enchant.

Hey I agree with everything and all... but Mother's Sorrow is worse than TBS or even Julianos... Like by A LOT. I have a thread on that. If anything its Ilambris that brings them up along with a good rotation.

Izaki

Chelo wrote: »

gel214thb14_ESO wrote: »

I'm just starting to explore the game and I'm confused by the Stamina vs Magicka paths.

It seems that Classes are defined by their Class skills, which all use Magicka.

Weapons are tied to Stamina, but any Class can use any Weapon.

So it seems to me that if you focus on Stamina then your Class doesn't matter as much. You would be using your class abilities sparingly due to a reduced Magicka pool, and the majority of your attacks and actions will be based on your Weapons. So your Class abilities will be your heals, and maybe some buffs.

For example let's look at Dragon Knight, an amazing class type that focuses on unique fire breathing and flame attacks. Those are all Magicka based, and if you go Stamina you would instead be using what...a 2H Sword? No flaming whips, and blazing dragon breath attacks..just...Swing swing chop chop stabbity stabbity. Which I could do as a Sorcerer. Or as a Templar.

Question is, why would you pick Stamina over Magicka? Is weapon damage that much higher than Magicka so it would be worth losing your class identity? Are Stamina costs much lower so you get an easier time at it? I'm looking at it from a solo PVE player perspective. I know some abilities can morph to Stamina versions, but these seem to be quite few.

Because Devs love Stamina and Physical dmg, so right now its almost imposible to be on par with Stamina (and weapon skills) if you are playing Magicka (PVE DPS).

And that is a lie/myth/whateveryouwanttocallit.

Asmael

The only reason to play stamina this patch is higher single target DPS in a melee situation. Magicka basically has twice the AoE and ranged DPS of stamina builds. Problem is: people look at single target DPS and use it as a way to balance everything.

Which is also why stamina is pretty much RIP in most competitive setups, since 98% of the fights involve using AoEs.

Takes-No-Prisoner

The Class abilities have some great ulity to them-- but some cost Stamina some cost Magic. Surprise attack reduces armor, and increases yours thanks to a passive buff in the same skill tree. Inside of the Night blades Siphon tree Siphoning Attacks returns resources on LA/HA and stacks with other sources. Hurricane is an AoE dot for a Stam Sorc and a Stam Sorc can run Critical Surge which uses magic to activate.

So the thing with Stamina vs Magic well the biggest thing is playstyle. I naturally do better up close and into someones face because I PvP a lot. I do the same for PvE too, though to a much lesser aggressive extent. Other people like to play keep away, Magic naturally is a better keep away option since there is a lot more ranged magic to choose from.

Oreyn_Bearclaw

Most classes only have a handful of stamina skills, but some can be really powerful. You are correct that as a general rule, Stamina builds are going to rely more on weapon skills than class skills. The difference between most stamina builds (at least in PVE) are just 1-2 class skills that get interchanged. Also remember that your Destro and Resto (weapon skills) scale of magic and spell damage.

As for the differences, well there are pros and cons to both. There is a lot of rage about how stamina is wildly OP right now, but I think most of it is overstated. From an elite PVE perspective, most groups pushing fro VMOL and VMOL HM completions, only have 1-2 stamina players in group, which will be apparent as to why in a sec.

Stamina:
Pros
-Potential for highest single Target DPS.
-Better resource management
-Higher Mitigation (armor/spell resist values)
-More Stamina for Blocking/Dodging/etc., and generally more mobile
-Access to AOE group Heal and Dodge Chance (different skills)
-Better access to group Debuff sets like Nightmothers, etc.
Cons
-VMA weapon dependent to pull really good numbers
-Must be at melee range, and most trial bosses dont allow 8 melee DPS at one time
-Despite increased mitigation values, generally less survivable (Shields are better than vigor)
-Rotation is generally considered to be most difficult
-Dependent on Non-Class skills for most of your bars.
-Non class stam shield is relatively weak

Magic:
Pros
-Potential for highest AOE DPS.
-VMA weapons not necessary for competitive end game DPS.
-3 of the 4 classes can play very effectively at range
-Lots of utility skills
-Access to a powerful non class damage shield
Cons
- Lower Boss DPS on most fights than stamina.
- Resource management is tougher, and takes good support
- Smaller resource pool for blocking, rolling, etc.


Sure I am missing some things, but they both of strengths and weaknesses. I would generally encourage people to start magic until they are comfortable.