Levels dont mean a thing

ArchMikem

It really is a beautiful thing when my CP506 Nightblade goes up against a Lvl17 DK and gets utterly wrecked more than once because it was impossible to get through his health pool and mitigation while being CCed over and over.

I did gank his NB friend though.

Im really hoping the new DW and Bow ultimates will help ease my time in PvP even if only a little.

I'm waiting for my L2P's people.

Beardimus

To be fair, I'm surprised to hear a NB talk about endless CCs, these days all I seem to have happen in PvP is constant fear etc CC breaks by FOTM NB's. DK's not so much, they seem almost as rare as Sorcs

Back to helping though, do you think those ultimates will make the difference? What's your gear, what's your rotation etc and a L17 could still have 530CP and awesome gear funded by their main.

Or is your stress with battle leveling / scaling?

Alucardo

lol battle levelling is insane. I had super high damage, regen and health, then when I finally made VR1 I was like WTF. It just all disappeared.

ArchMikem

Beardimus wrote: »

To be fair, I'm surprised to hear a NB talk about endless CCs, these days all I seem to have happen in PvP is constant fear etc CC breaks by FOTM NB's. DK's not so much, they seem almost as rare as Sorcs

Back to helping though, do you think those ultimates will make the difference? What's your gear, what's your rotation etc and a L17 could still have 530CP and awesome gear funded by their main.

Or is your stress with battle leveling / scaling?

It was a combo of Crit charge and those talons whatever. Completely ate my stamina while my attacks barely made a dent, then when i couldnt break free anymore it was over.

On my DW i Ambush > Suprise Attack > Incap Strike, and then thats usually when i start flailing around with normal attacks cause the burst wasnt enough, or the guy immediately breaks free from the stun, CCs me, then bursts me down. If i start with my bow i do a Lethal Arrow > Light Attack > Poison Injection, and then switch to DW and do that combo. Most of the time they can mitigate and heal through it, which usually ends with them teabagging me.

I guess i do have a problem with battle levelling if it makes low levels crazy powerful.

In the end though ive found to be far more useful in PvP as my Templar. I dont know why i bother with anything else.

MalakithAlamahdi

Lol, my mag DK could wreck max levels 1vs3 with ease when it was level 30, now I feel like I'm playing a handicapped goat compared to that.

fred4

Beardimus wrote: »

DK's not so much, they seem almost as rare as Sorcs.

Really? On PC EU there are plenty of DKs in PvP. Having played both stam DK and Magblade, I have to say I actually prefer Fossilize over Fear 1v1. It works at a greater distance and the two-step CC gives me the most breathing room.

The original poster subsequently mentioned talons, which are an immobilise. A mag DK can spam those and you don't get CC immunity for rolling out of them. The possibly best way to counter those is with Forward Momentum, the underrated other morph of Rally. It gives you 8 seconds of immobilise immunity. Combined with a potion you can get total CC immunity for a short time.

You're a Stamblade, right? There are some of those which kill my CP531+ DK all the time. Their typical mode of operation is a fully charged heavy attack, from stealth, from behind, landing simultaneously with Surprise Attack or Incap Strike. Very difficult to recover from when that lands, since the damage is so high. Granted I think these are people who have all damage / no sustain builds.

Waffennacht

Two things OP needs sustain and should list his build

And battle leveling literally can make a lvl 41 have HIGHER stats than a 531.

ArchMikem

Beardimus wrote: »

You're a Stamblade, right? There are some of those which kill my CP531+ DK all the time. Their typical mode of operation is a fully charged heavy attack, from stealth, from behind, landing simultaneously with Surprise Attack or Incap Strike. Very difficult to recover from when that lands, since the damage is so high. Granted I think these are people who have all damage / no sustain builds.

I don't see how practical that can be out in the open with enemy players moving around so much. Guess you could do that when someone is just standing there at a Resource looking at their map, but that's just forcing you to pick your targets then. I'll have to try that instead of opening with an Ambush sometime.

Waffennacht wrote: »

Two things OP needs sustain and should list his build

1,300 Recovery in Cyrodiil and it's still not enough. I could put more Recovery glyphs on my jewelry but I don't want to sacrifice Weapon Damage. I've never been good at 1v1 engagements, I've always preferred doing support damage.

Mayrael

Back to topic. Issue are not the classes but battle leveling. Its true that toons under lvl 50 have better stats than folks with max lvl as you can easly compare your stats in same gear before hitting 50 and after. Something has to be done with that as it breaks principal rule of every RPG/cRPG game: progresion. We all are playing to become stronger but with battle lvling youre strongest not when you reach lvl 50 but when youre lvl 49. You have more hp, stam, magica, you have more mag and stam regen while you can wear just a bit weaker eq. Its awkward. Solutions:

1. While under lvl 50, you cant spend your CPs or...
2. Take base stats of cp10 toon, without any points spent, no gear, simply nothing, and this should be base for battle lvling.

Biro123

I think they've changed something with the scaling with the last patch..

My lvl31 magsorc in BWB lost about 6k magika (31k instead of 37k) and I think about 100ish mag regen since just the patch (I'd just equipped a new crafted set at level 30 and so was carefully checking the stats just before the patch hit).

So it may be better now.

bantad87

I'm not sure a CP 506 should be losing to L17's. Even in the non-champ Cyrodiil, which I prefer on my highest toon, lower levels just don't seem to have the sustain and damage of higher CP characters. This definitely shouldn't be happening in the CP campaign. You've got 500 points to mitigate his damage, increase your damage, and vastly improve each resource points cost/worth. 25% more damage done, 25% less damage taken, and 25% increased/cheaper resource use is a huge deal. Not to mention skill line passive, morphs, and set bonuses.

I'm only at CP 200, I've got 5 piece hundings, 2 piece gladiator 2 piece Leki's OR 3 piece Leki depending on weapon, and 3 piece agility. My daggers are gold, bow purple. I sit at like 4700 weapon damage (with daggers), 24K stam, 25K HP in Cyrodiil with food. A lot of the lower levels have higher attribute lines than I do, but even in the non-CP campaign they melt quickly and do way less damage.

They may have higher attributes, but they're missing the key passives and set bonuses of a Champion toon. Their weapon damage is usually lower than 2.5K as well I think.

How are you specced? Maybe try putting CP points into reducing your dodge roll stam use. It really helps when dealing with immobilizers or high burst characters. Lastly, killing a high HP, heavy armor toon w/ lots of CC, on a high burst build is pretty tough. They're intended to counter burst builds - otherwise why would you build tank?

acw37162

Battle leveling takes into account a lot of information players either don't realize or care about;

Most battle leveled players will not have quite a few passives puchased due to skill points in either class skill lines, weapon skill lines, undaunted, fighters guild or mates guild trees.

In many cases this means extra resources, better resource management, more crit, more raw damage, or access to extremely useful popular abilities like dawnbreaker of smighting.

If your fighting in a CP campaign against a low level, unless it is an alternate character from a max CP player they won have as many champion points (raw stats) and more CP passive boosts.

I really can't stand when players think they should just stomp all over players because of CP or level. If they are a better player with a better build they can win a fight against a player who is not trying or just not playing well or a less skilled PVP player. And if all this means a max CP PVP player actually has to try against lower levels so be it, last time I checked this is a discussion about PVP and actually fighting against other players. Not just dropping a meteor on a level 12 and typing /laugh.

I mean PVP players are actually looking for competition, right.

Not to mention any change that gets more people into Cyrodil more often is better then fewer people in Cyrodil.

Battle leveling is a good thing at least in my opionion.

NoMoreChillies

sounds like he was just a better player than you

it happens

Vangy

1. You have 500+ CP..... That means most likely u have 20+% reduced phy/magical damage taken. + tons of other goodies like more phy damage, more pen etc etc. Just from CP.
2. Your sustain is innately better. You have access to more max level skills which are fully morphed and ready to go as compared to your opponent at lvl 17.
3. Yes, his stats might be marginally better than urs, hell he/she could even have 500 more regen and 1000 more weapon damage but #1 and #2 should more than make up for this difference. In fact you should have the advantage here.

It just seems he was prolly the better player or was using 5 piece CE. Im not sure which until you can post a video of such an encounter. So far all my encounters with sub lvl 20 players resulted in a sound beat-down for the low level player.

Biro123

Took my lvl 31 out into Trueflame last night - partially after this thread got me thinking (but mostly cos BWB was dead).

It felt ok. It felt weaker than may main but was definitely still playable,. Feels like I died about as often - but was playing more 'safely' and taking less risks. Didn't seem to kill as much tho. Seemed about right imho.

ArchMikem

Vangy wrote: »

1. You have 500+ CP..... That means most likely u have 20+% reduced phy/magical damage taken. + tons of other goodies like more phy damage, more pen etc etc. Just from CP.
2. Your sustain is innately better. You have access to more max level skills which are fully morphed and ready to go as compared to your opponent at lvl 17.
3. Yes, his stats might be marginally better than urs, hell he/she could even have 500 more regen and 1000 more weapon damage but #1 and #2 should more than make up for this difference. In fact you should have the advantage here.

It just seems he was prolly the better player or was using 5 piece CE. Im not sure which until you can post a video of such an encounter. So far all my encounters with sub lvl 20 players resulted in a sound beat-down for the low level player.

My damage was being mitigated and i was being immobilized without the means to become immune to it. His NB buddy jumping in from stealth here and there didnt help things. So, recap, i was outnumbered against a magic DK Tank and a ganker. Doesnt matter if hes a better player or not, when all he has to do is cast his shields and buffs and immobilize me.

Vangy

ArchMikem wrote: »

show previous quotes

Vangy wrote: »

1. You have 500+ CP..... That means most likely u have 20+% reduced phy/magical damage taken. + tons of other goodies like more phy damage, more pen etc etc. Just from CP.
2. Your sustain is innately better. You have access to more max level skills which are fully morphed and ready to go as compared to your opponent at lvl 17.
3. Yes, his stats might be marginally better than urs, hell he/she could even have 500 more regen and 1000 more weapon damage but #1 and #2 should more than make up for this difference. In fact you should have the advantage here.

It just seems he was prolly the better player or was using 5 piece CE. Im not sure which until you can post a video of such an encounter. So far all my encounters with sub lvl 20 players resulted in a sound beat-down for the low level player.

My damage was being mitigated and i was being immobilized without the means to become immune to it. His NB buddy jumping in from stealth here and there didnt help things. So, recap, i was outnumbered against a magic DK Tank and a ganker. Doesnt matter if hes a better player or not, when all he has to do is cast his shields and buffs and immobilize me.

So u lost cos it was a 2 v 1. Fair enough. Nothing to do with levels. ESO is one of those games where its REALLLLY hard to win in an outnumbered situation if u are against decent players cos of how the game mechanics work. Being defensive is punished while being offensive is rewarded. Dodge roll/streak = increasing cost. Block = 0 stam regen. Break free = stam lost. etc etc. Basically any situation that requires u to go on defensive very often is putting u in a severe disadvantage.

So i wouldnt attribute ur loss completely to levels.