morals over development?

Suter1972

Ive read lots of posts about problems with the Devs, too much maintenance, too little maintence, wrong maintance, the wrong type of maintencie, broken quests/dungeons/grouping, poor value DLC, the infamous loot boxes, etc etc the list goes on.

My question is this…. At what point is it reasonable for the devs to stop investing in the game and just let it die off slowly? Ie at what point does your personal investment in the game become ‘good value’

My view is that once the initial income hit of the game release, which likely pays back the development costs to create the game, they need to find ways to generate income to fund the ongoing development. DLC and crown store is clearly a way to do this but the most lucrative may well be the loot boxes that yes, do take advantage of people willing/happy to gamble on a great drop. At what point do you as players say ‘morals are more important than continued development/updates’

Just a question?

JD2013

The short story is this is the Internet, and people always complain on the Internet, especially on video game forums.

They have an absolute right to voice their opinions, absolutely. But according to every official MMO forum X MMO is dying/was dying/will be dying forever.

ESO has been dying since beta apparently, and yet it's still here and getting quarterly updates.

kevlarto_ESO

Most companies today count on bean counters for projections and trends in their field, once things go south they start cutting back, to make money, when it becomes obvious that the game is going into the red, I am sure all production stops if they have no plans for a last minute save.

The people that make the games like writers and programmers have no real say in the matter, the order to stop comes from higher up the food chain, usually from people that have no clue how games work or what the customers want, if it was up to the people that put their heart into the game to make the best game they could I think it would be a long time before they stopped building the game or until they were just out of ideas.

To many companies today stifle the creative process, it's all about money.

JD2013

kevlarto_ESO wrote: »

Most companies today count on bean counters for projections and trends in their field, once things go south they start cutting back, to make money, when it becomes obvious that the game is going into the red, I am sure all production stops if they have no plans for a last minute save.

The people that make the games like writers and programmers have no real say in the matter, the order to stop comes from higher up the food chain, usually from people that have no clue how games work or what the customers want, if it was up to the people that put their heart into the game to make the best game they could I think it would be a long time before they stopped building the game or until they were just out of ideas.

To many companies today stifle the creative process, it's all about money.

This sadly is also true.

I am sure that ESO is profitable for ZOS. But I'm willing to bet that a manager is saying "yes it's profitable, but how can we make *more* money?

jedtb16_ESO

if the sub only model had stayed would we still be seeing all the sturm und drang over loot bags?

malchior

And that would be lock boxes...

JD2013 wrote: »

kevlarto_ESO wrote: »

Most companies today count on bean counters for projections and trends in their field, once things go south they start cutting back, to make money, when it becomes obvious that the game is going into the red, I am sure all production stops if they have no plans for a last minute save.

The people that make the games like writers and programmers have no real say in the matter, the order to stop comes from higher up the food chain, usually from people that have no clue how games work or what the customers want, if it was up to the people that put their heart into the game to make the best game they could I think it would be a long time before they stopped building the game or until they were just out of ideas.

To many companies today stifle the creative process, it's all about money.

This sadly is also true.

I am sure that ESO is profitable for ZOS. But I'm willing to bet that a manager is saying "yes it's profitable, but how can we make *more* money?

Suter1972

JD2013 wrote: »

kevlarto_ESO wrote: »

Most companies today count on bean counters for projections and trends in their field, once things go south they start cutting back, to make money, when it becomes obvious that the game is going into the red, I am sure all production stops if they have no plans for a last minute save.

The people that make the games like writers and programmers have no real say in the matter, the order to stop comes from higher up the food chain, usually from people that have no clue how games work or what the customers want, if it was up to the people that put their heart into the game to make the best game they could I think it would be a long time before they stopped building the game or until they were just out of ideas.

To many companies today stifle the creative process, it's all about money.

This sadly is also true.

I am sure that ESO is profitable for ZOS. But I'm willing to bet that a manager is saying "yes it's profitable, but how can we make *more* money?

But isn’t that the first rule of business?

Zen as a company aren’t in this for the love of providing everyone with a game then go home on a night feeling all fluffy. It’s a business and it needs to make money. Without cashflow income, they cut costs till they do have income. Its basic business.

So as ZEN try to think of new ways to generate income, morally or not, at what point does that morals issue become more important to a player of a game ie ESO than the game itself.

Another probing question – how many people that point plank refuse to invest in funding development by purchase of crown store items or loot boxes, will continue to be unhappy about reducing investment in development?


There is of course the fact that the funds raised by ESO may actually be funding a new game altogther and not ESO at all!

JD2013

Suter1972 wrote: »

JD2013 wrote: »

kevlarto_ESO wrote: »

Most companies today count on bean counters for projections and trends in their field, once things go south they start cutting back, to make money, when it becomes obvious that the game is going into the red, I am sure all production stops if they have no plans for a last minute save.

The people that make the games like writers and programmers have no real say in the matter, the order to stop comes from higher up the food chain, usually from people that have no clue how games work or what the customers want, if it was up to the people that put their heart into the game to make the best game they could I think it would be a long time before they stopped building the game or until they were just out of ideas.

To many companies today stifle the creative process, it's all about money.

This sadly is also true.

I am sure that ESO is profitable for ZOS. But I'm willing to bet that a manager is saying "yes it's profitable, but how can we make *more* money?

But isn’t that the first rule of business?

Zen as a company aren’t in this for the love of providing everyone with a game then go home on a night feeling all fluffy. It’s a business and it needs to make money. Without cashflow income, they cut costs till they do have income. Its basic business.

So as ZEN try to think of new ways to generate income, morally or not, at what point does that morals issue become more important to a player of a game ie ESO than the game itself.

Another probing question – how many people that point plank refuse to invest in funding development by purchase of crown store items or loot boxes, will continue to be unhappy about reducing investment in development?


There is of course the fact that the funds raised by ESO may actually be funding a new game altogther and not ESO at all!

Oh no of course it's basic business. They need to make money to put money into development etc.

I think ESO is ZOS's only game at the minute and will be for a few more years. However that's not to say they won't develop another game ever. Fallout Online, anyone??

jedtb16_ESO

JD2013 wrote: »

Suter1972 wrote: »

JD2013 wrote: »

kevlarto_ESO wrote: »

Most companies today count on bean counters for projections and trends in their field, once things go south they start cutting back, to make money, when it becomes obvious that the game is going into the red, I am sure all production stops if they have no plans for a last minute save.

The people that make the games like writers and programmers have no real say in the matter, the order to stop comes from higher up the food chain, usually from people that have no clue how games work or what the customers want, if it was up to the people that put their heart into the game to make the best game they could I think it would be a long time before they stopped building the game or until they were just out of ideas.

To many companies today stifle the creative process, it's all about money.

This sadly is also true.

I am sure that ESO is profitable for ZOS. But I'm willing to bet that a manager is saying "yes it's profitable, but how can we make *more* money?

But isn’t that the first rule of business?

Zen as a company aren’t in this for the love of providing everyone with a game then go home on a night feeling all fluffy. It’s a business and it needs to make money. Without cashflow income, they cut costs till they do have income. Its basic business.

So as ZEN try to think of new ways to generate income, morally or not, at what point does that morals issue become more important to a player of a game ie ESO than the game itself.

Another probing question – how many people that point plank refuse to invest in funding development by purchase of crown store items or loot boxes, will continue to be unhappy about reducing investment in development?


There is of course the fact that the funds raised by ESO may actually be funding a new game altogther and not ESO at all!

Oh no of course it's basic business. They need to make money to put money into development etc.

I think ESO is ZOS's only game at the minute and will be for a few more years. However that's not to say they won't develop another game ever. Fallout Online, anyone??

fallout online??????

where do i sign?

Suter1972

JD2013 wrote: »

Suter1972 wrote: »

JD2013 wrote: »

kevlarto_ESO wrote: »

Most companies today count on bean counters for projections and trends in their field, once things go south they start cutting back, to make money, when it becomes obvious that the game is going into the red, I am sure all production stops if they have no plans for a last minute save.

The people that make the games like writers and programmers have no real say in the matter, the order to stop comes from higher up the food chain, usually from people that have no clue how games work or what the customers want, if it was up to the people that put their heart into the game to make the best game they could I think it would be a long time before they stopped building the game or until they were just out of ideas.

To many companies today stifle the creative process, it's all about money.

This sadly is also true.

I am sure that ESO is profitable for ZOS. But I'm willing to bet that a manager is saying "yes it's profitable, but how can we make *more* money?

But isn’t that the first rule of business?

Zen as a company aren’t in this for the love of providing everyone with a game then go home on a night feeling all fluffy. It’s a business and it needs to make money. Without cashflow income, they cut costs till they do have income. Its basic business.

So as ZEN try to think of new ways to generate income, morally or not, at what point does that morals issue become more important to a player of a game ie ESO than the game itself.

Another probing question – how many people that point plank refuse to invest in funding development by purchase of crown store items or loot boxes, will continue to be unhappy about reducing investment in development?


There is of course the fact that the funds raised by ESO may actually be funding a new game altogther and not ESO at all!

Oh no of course it's basic business. They need to make money to put money into development etc.

I think ESO is ZOS's only game at the minute and will be for a few more years. However that's not to say they won't develop another game ever. Fallout Online, anyone??

Just a quick google online about zenimax and im pretty sure ZON is literally just one of a few subsidiary cash cows for ZEN as a whole. If that cash cow stops producing enough milk to fund Zenimax’s bigger picture and development going forward then they will pull the plug. Lets be honest, the games Zen produces through its subsidiaries are pretty much AAA titles with huge budgets and huge expectations. That demands a lot of income and cashflow is king.

I assume Lootboxes and DLC (and ESO+) provide that.

EZgoin76

I understand ZOS needs to make money but should they do it at the cost of losing customers. I guess it's really about finding a happy medium between the two but with so many differing opinions, it would probably be nearly impossible.

GreenhaloX

When something dies, it leaves behind a piece of itself to this world. ESO will never, ever die. It will haunt your mind forever. Be careful.. you will be walking and will always be watching your back and thinking someone is about to blade of woe you.

NewBlacksmurf

Players don't decide this.

Customers who spend individually decide to buy or not to buy but as for development, the two would not likely be linked as one never interacts with the other.

I get your idea that revenue generated and impacts development however, most content should've been in development and past the drawing board 24 months ago for us to see anything soon.

Consider these new systems are only for 2019 and beyond as far as development that would release. Consider it takes them 3-9 months to create content and another 6-9 months of testing per ESO live for PvE and that's jaunt for one dungeon or trial.

idk

First, the initial launch likely came short of paying for developement of the game but did cover a big chunk.

Second, the core of keeping the game lucrative is keeping players interested and that comes in the form of actual playable content such as the new trial and dungeons and zones.

While the crown store is lucrative ans in this day and time an expected part of an MMO, it is secondary since not everyone sulk buy crowns and Zos needs to keep players on the game to keep the crown store customer base.

As far as those complaining about maintenance and whatever, the official forums is more of a complaint and rage forum. Good entertainment value though.