Alliance point gains, rewarding different builds.

NeillMcAttack

It appears to me that alliance point distribution in Cyrodiil is hugely unbalanced in favour of strictly DPSing or healing (or of course 'waiting' for a tick and spamming mutagen everywhere, not the most fun playstyle IMO).

It only recently came to my attention when I started playing a Magicka DK in Cyro and sewers. You see my build mostly consists of disable/control/support skills. Now, while I'm finding it tons of fun to play, it's quite obvious that the system isn't set up to reward this style of play the same way it rewards others.
It's frustrating to know that while my well timed stun, revealing flare, or root was paramount in securing a kill, that 17 radius AP reward just doesn't feel right.

Perhaps this may be a cause for why only very few groups or players find any value in playing more of a tanky/support role that doesn't solely consist of heal spam.

So what I'm asking is to please set the system up to take into account 'control' in fights, along with raw DPS and healing.

Has anyone else felt this to be an issue for them? Would others like to see these particular builds rewarded the same? Discuss.

Teridaxus

Problem is, a cc build doesn't look awesome in a twitch or you tube stream then someone who kills 20 newbies in a row.

( I'm a tank who pvp often too, but i got used to barely any ap )

r.jan_emailb16_ESO

If you group up with someone doing the damage, you get basically the same AP. Being tanky on its own does not contribute anything to a fight, that's why you don't get much AP when not grouped.

M_TeK_9

r.jan_emailb16_ESO wrote: »

If you group up with someone doing the damage, you get basically the same AP. Being tanky on its own does not contribute anything to a fight, that's why you don't get much AP when not grouped.

When Im outnumbered 1:4 and have no choice but to fight, I can invasion 4 dudes on their back in 4 seconds and then talons another 8 all while snaring the group so they can hardly walk so the dps can walk in and wipe them, not to mention applying major defuffs it's pretty safe to say that we won that fight primarily because they were unable to attack back. A proper pvp tank can be and is most of the time actually, the deciding factor in big fights.

NeillMcAttack

r.jan_emailb16_ESO wrote: »

If you group up with someone doing the damage, you get basically the same AP. Being tanky on its own does not contribute anything to a fight, that's why you don't get much AP when not grouped.

It's true that I will get a better split of the AP if I'm grouped and in the vicinity of the main DPS'r but that is situational with regards to how Cyrodiil and the sewers work. I can't control who of my alliance will be nearby when I reveal someone from stealth, chain them to me and root them. This would actually account for a very small share of the AP givin the overwhelming effort in securing that kill. You see what I mean. Control, support, detection, distraction and being a right pain in the enemies... behind, isn't rewarded the same as other roles.

And being tanky does nothing sure, IF the enemy ignores you. But if you can make it so they simply can't, then you are contributing greatly.

Rune_Relic

I see no difference between a player wasting their resoruces on tactical or direct combat play.
Its still costing me the same and using my time to do so.
Arguably being the deciding factor on succes or not is also a very good point.
Shouldnt be penalised for that OP.

Should be encouraged for using brains over brawn

NeillMcAttack

Rune_Relic wrote: »

I see no difference between a player wasting their resoruces on tactical or direct combat play.
Its still costing me the same and using my time to do so.
Arguably being the deciding factor on succes or not is also a very good point.
Shouldnt be penalised for that OP.

Should be encouraged for using brains over brawn

Precisely my point.

Currently I am disincentivized to run the build I'm planning on running, which is S+B and destro, because the game seems to think im offering 'too much' control!?

So if I want to ever run for Emporer (doubtful of course), or just simply earn AP at the same rate I do on other characters and builds, I'm going to have to bite the bullet and and equip a resto staff. It's just not right. And it's not something that I ever intend on doing, I'll run my build regardless but come on @ZOS_BrianWheeler, why so many control spells with such little reward. Maybe this could be the change needed to help people embrace their inner Magicka DK?!

TheDarkShadow

In game like RIFT, tank and cc actually work in Arena pvp. You have different type of match, so for example in "flag holder" or "flag capture" the longer you keep the flag, the more points your team get, and points tick every few seconds, and tank can carry the "flag" while taking flag's DoT and enemy team focus, while crown controler try to stop the enemy chasing the tank or cc the enemy flag runer, dps try to kill the enemy , and healer heal the crap out of everyone. Or in "point capture", to capture a point you need to "use" the banner there, while enemy tank or cc can interrupt you. I once hold a capture point on my own as a tank, against 3 other enemies for a minutes, interrupt anyone touch the banner. Not only the points keep ticking every few sec, but also there are other banners, and while 3 of them focus on me, it's mean lesser enemy on other banners for my team to deal with. Every role have a place in pvp and the points you earn not only base on how many dps or heal you do, but also how many enemy you actually kill, how many banner you capture, how long you hold the flag...

Now I'm not praising RIFT. They have their problem too. The classes are not balance and usually the strongest is the newest and you have to buy them. The gap between gear is too big and it's no fun grinding, but how convenient, you can buy gear in the store (lol). Lore and graphics also not my type. But they do have a fun Arena system (if you have good gear).

sphane

NeillMcAttack wrote: »

It only recently came to my attention when I started playing a Magicka DK in Cyro and sewers.

That's why...

Just by curiosity, couple days Before end of trueflame eu Pc, i checked top 100 leaderboard (all alliances), there were 11 dk (stam and magica) while 7 nb, 2 sorcs, 1 templar in top 10.

You want to make ap ? go nb

You want to be called noob, bad player, or anything by tryharders , just go solo magica dk...

But we have no right to complain, we are dk.

Master_Kas

sphane wrote: »

NeillMcAttack wrote: »

It only recently came to my attention when I started playing a Magicka DK in Cyro and sewers.

That's why...

Just by curiosity, couple days Before end of trueflame eu Pc, i checked top 100 leaderboard (all alliances), there were 11 dk (stam and magica) while 7 nb, 2 sorcs, 1 templar in top 10.

You want to make ap ? go nb

You want to be called noob, bad player, or anything by tryharders , just go solo magica dk...

But we have no right to complain, we are dk.

#1 for each alliance last cycle was 3 magicka bomber nbs. I wonder why

No-lifing also played a part but still.

NeillMcAttack

sphane wrote: »

NeillMcAttack wrote: »

It only recently came to my attention when I started playing a Magicka DK in Cyro and sewers.

That's why...

Just by curiosity, couple days Before end of trueflame eu Pc, i checked top 100 leaderboard (all alliances), there were 11 dk (stam and magica) while 7 nb, 2 sorcs, 1 templar in top 10.

You want to make ap ? go nb

You want to be called noob, bad player, or anything by tryharders , just go solo magica dk...

But we have no right to complain, we are dk.

I have no issue with the fact that different classes are more proficient at different things when it comes to PvP. In fact that is one of the things I love about this game. It keeps things fresh for me. What my concern is is that with so many different playstyles, in particular 'the control spamming, flame lashing, fire demon' I plan on running, isn't being rewarded fairly with regards combat contribution.

My main is a MagBlade, I'm just a bit bored of him now and want run something different. I guess that is one of the reasons I'm noticing such a difference in AP gain.