Why 2 handed weapon doesn't count as 2 when it come to item set ?

Marktoneth3

SirAndy wrote: »

Marktoneth3 wrote: »

Wait wait wait if it does take hand slot why is not count as 2 when you use 2 hand hold great sword(now 1 hand like staff)
LMAO
and hands don't count for set items ? then all weapons should not count as set items.

I'm pretty sure you completely missed the point i was trying to make. Sigh ...

Sorry bro

STEVIL

KingDuncanVII wrote: »

It makes sense that it only counts as one despite it taking up both slots.

I do, however, wish there was an enchantment or something that allowed you to make Two-Handed Weapons count as two items just so people can have a bit more diversity when it comes to builds. Everyone, for the most part, Dual Wields (or S&S) to get that extra item slot for the armor set benefits - and it's definitely worth it. It just sucks because the majority of people are using the same weapons.

have you seen the threads where they are saying how two-handed weapon line is so good it makes sure nobody plays dw or ss?

They are sure nobody plays dw or ss among the stamina classes bc 2h is so good.

Pomaikai

We know. It's the real proof that Wroebel doesn't actually play the game.

Pepsi2853_ESO

the question isn't why. the real question is "is it fair?" those that use dual wield get an extra slot for items sets, and those that use 2 handed or staffs do not.

Vangy

Pepsi2853_ESO wrote: »

the question isn't why. the real question is "is it fair?" those that use dual wield get an extra slot for items sets, and those that use 2 handed or staffs do not.

It is... 2H provides one of the strongest skill trees for PVP dps. Hard hitting WB with inbuilt CC and self empower, an execute that provides an additional 17% damage for just being slotted when target is low life, a gap closer, and rally (HOT + self heal at the end).... Dw in return provides an additional set slot, more weapon damage and strong AOE execute in the form of steel nado. This is diversity. If you make 2h count as 2 sets, no one would ever use DW at all... (not that they do now anyway.)

Forestd16b14_ESO

TheValkyn wrote: »

Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »

Thinking it's the same reason ZOS took out jewelry crafting.

They don't want players with a bunch of sets active at once.

Most sets used to only have 3 piece set bonuses. Their decision that they made back then made sense but it's not particularly supported anymore.

talking about crafted sets or mix and match crafted and dropped sets..... like can you imagine some one having both VD and law of julions ?

Mcwoods55

But as a sorc I have considered running dw on both bars for the extra dps and not worry about a staff. I don't use much destro anyway because I stay in the main 3 and mages guild for most my spells (I'm a pet sorc).. Just make them hit a bit harder

MarcoPolo

It might be 2 handed but its still 1 sword if you want to complain about it being a 1 or 2 item complain about staves there a 2 handed weapon that only uses one hand to use

Strider_Roshin

The traits on 2H weapons are worth two 1H weapons. It should be the same with item sets.

DocFrost72

Just my two cents, feel free to disagree.

I run DW on my magic builds AND stam builds. I like the way that two handers look and play, but can't bring myself to play with them. Why?

An extra set piece and AoE damage. While the latter is balance, the former is just silly. Let me give you an example:

Player_1 is running 5 piece Hunding's rage (head, chest, legs, boots, gloves), 1 piece molag Kena (shoulder), 3 piece agility (jewelry), and 2/3 piece Night mother's gaze. The reason I say 2/3 is because Player_1 uses DW and a bow.

Now, if the player has DW out, the weapons themselves give more weapon damage than any other weapons in the game, period. On top of that, the player is gaining an additional sum of weapon damage from the set bonus. See the issue? Switching to a two handed weapon like a greatsword would lower the weapon damage by a significant amount, ie imbalance.

Critics may suggest I simply need to have less DMG because it is a tradeoff of using the weapon. I'm not so sure, really. Because the advantages a greatsword has over DW are all the skills in the tree, but let's observe that.

Wrecking blow is a STRONG move, totally understand that. But you cannot weave with that move, or you lose the empowered bonus. With DW, you can weave. Balanced. With the execute on greatsword comes a total lack of AoE, which DW has in abundance (steel tornado, only AoE execute in the game and blade cloak). You may argue that brawler or cleave are AoEs, but they hit poorly, much more heavily centered around survivability or ult gen. Balance. One handed weapons have half the item trait, but there are two of them AND you can choose between two item traits if you so desire. Balanced. Rally (or forward momentum, cause that exists xD) gives you a HoT and a big heal at the end, as well as the major weapon damage buff. Flying blade allows you to attack from range with a reasonably strong attack which snares the target and gives the major weapon buff. As for a self heal, blood craze can actually do the same, if not better, HoT that rally does. And as far as a surge heal, the heal itself is situational and with DW you get range and a snare.

Balanced.

So to be totally blunt, I don't get how letting two handed weapons like a greatsword or staff have inherent balance issues when the skills are already well balanced. Two set traits is not a massive, insane leap.

TL:DR-The skills all have compliments or tradeoffs, leave balance and diversity there instead of in the set bonuses.

WalkingLegacy

You're sacrificing build diversity for more damage.

Talyena

Vangy wrote: »

Pepsi2853_ESO wrote: »

the question isn't why. the real question is "is it fair?" those that use dual wield get an extra slot for items sets, and those that use 2 handed or staffs do not.

It is... 2H provides one of the strongest skill trees for PVP dps. Hard hitting WB with inbuilt CC and self empower, an execute that provides an additional 17% damage for just being slotted when target is low life, a gap closer, and rally (HOT + self heal at the end).... Dw in return provides an additional set slot, more weapon damage and strong AOE execute in the form of steel nado. This is diversity. If you make 2h count as 2 sets, no one would ever use DW at all... (not that they do now anyway.)

Three out of four two handed weapons don't have any of that. On top of that, there is no magic one handed option (just DW and sword and board). Yet magic users are using DW because of one passive and the extra slot bonus. We shouldn't be punishing those who use staves or bows just because WB is over powered.

idk

lolo_01b16_ESO wrote: »

Because then a Torugs Pact staff would be better than a msa restro staff.

vMA master destro would have more spell damage.

Since 2h weapons require both hands (hence the classification) the second hand is tied up so to speak. You should still only get ones piece toward a set bonus because it's only one item.

Marktoneth3

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

lolo_01b16_ESO wrote: »

Because then a Torugs Pact staff would be better than a msa restro staff.

vMA master destro would have more spell damage.

Since 2h weapons require both hands (hence the classification) the second hand is tied up so to speak. You should still only get ones piece toward a set bonus because it's only one item.

should be 2 since all enchant also count as 2

STEVIL

Talyena wrote: »

Three out of four two handed weapons don't have any of that. On top of that, there is no magic one handed option (just DW and sword and board). Yet magic users are using DW because of one passive and the extra slot bonus. We shouldn't be punishing those who use staves or bows just because WB is over powered.

Those "three out of four" have RANGE!!




.

Pr0jektile

It Counts Pieces. You make a choice when you're dual wielding to give up some of the single-strike bonus in exchange for faster attacks and the ability to run one extra set piece.

The same is true for 2H. You give up some of that maneuverability in exchange for the additional damage.

idk

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

lolo_01b16_ESO wrote: »

Because then a Torugs Pact staff would be better than a msa restro staff.

vMA master destro would have more spell damage.

Since 2h weapons require both hands (hence the classification) the second hand is tied up so to speak. You should still only get ones piece toward a set bonus because it's only one item.

Magika is certainly not being punished in this game,'not at all.

Marktoneth3

I still hope ZOS will answer me

Vangy

DocFrost72 wrote: »

Just my two cents, feel free to disagree.

I run DW on my magic builds AND stam builds. I like the way that two handers look and play, but can't bring myself to play with them. Why?

An extra set piece and AoE damage. While the latter is balance, the former is just silly. Let me give you an example:

Player_1 is running 5 piece Hunding's rage (head, chest, legs, boots, gloves), 1 piece molag Kena (shoulder), 3 piece agility (jewelry), and 2/3 piece Night mother's gaze. The reason I say 2/3 is because Player_1 uses DW and a bow.

Now, if the player has DW out, the weapons themselves give more weapon damage than any other weapons in the game, period. On top of that, the player is gaining an additional sum of weapon damage from the set bonus. See the issue? Switching to a two handed weapon like a greatsword would lower the weapon damage by a significant amount, ie imbalance.

Critics may suggest I simply need to have less DMG because it is a tradeoff of using the weapon. I'm not so sure, really. Because the advantages a greatsword has over DW are all the skills in the tree, but let's observe that.

Wrecking blow is a STRONG move, totally understand that. But you cannot weave with that move, or you lose the empowered bonus. With DW, you can weave. Balanced. With the execute on greatsword comes a total lack of AoE, which DW has in abundance (steel tornado, only AoE execute in the game and blade cloak). You may argue that brawler or cleave are AoEs, but they hit poorly, much more heavily centered around survivability or ult gen. Balance. One handed weapons have half the item trait, but there are two of them AND you can choose between two item traits if you so desire. Balanced. Rally (or forward momentum, cause that exists xD) gives you a HoT and a big heal at the end, as well as the major weapon damage buff. Flying blade allows you to attack from range with a reasonably strong attack which snares the target and gives the major weapon buff. As for a self heal, blood craze can actually do the same, if not better, HoT that rally does. And as far as a surge heal, the heal itself is situational and with DW you get range and a snare.

Balanced.

So to be totally blunt, I don't get how letting two handed weapons like a greatsword or staff have inherent balance issues when the skills are already well balanced. Two set traits is not a massive, insane leap.

TL:DR-The skills all have compliments or tradeoffs, leave balance and diversity there instead of in the set bonuses.

@DocFrost72

Pretty well thought out but there are a few things you arent considering;

For stamina builds (2h vs DW);

For PvE, DW is strictly better as you pointed out in great detail. Going 2H would just gimp your dps.
However, in PvP, 2H gets rally. Gets a Gap closer. Gets WB which is a hard CC that empowers itself. No way you're going to run DW over 2H unless you're a batswarm/nado zergling. Now if 2h got a double set bonus, it would be OP as hell in PvP lol. Not that Im complaining, I would LOVE to see that happen.. As it stands, DW and 2H is balanced. DW has better DPS (for both AOE and ST in PVE) and an extra set, but it costs you all the utility you could have gotten from the 2H. (no gap closer, no executioner (for ST exec> steel nado), no hard CC). If 2H got a double set bonus, people would just go 2H even in PVE since it already is better in PvP. No need to craft 2 sets of weapons.

For magicka builds (DW vs destro).

DW nets you better spell power for a huge sustain trade off + losing the ability to weave. You gimp your mag and ultimate regen and effectively lower your dps. (proper weaving with staves gets you better DPS). The only people who run DW in PVE are sorcs during overload. Or, if for some reason you need to burst something down asap. So it is balanced. You're choosing between better burst + extra set VS sustain + better overall DPS.

This is my 2 cents worth and ofcourse, like you pointed out, feel free to disagree.