Question For DK's

oburn

Well I guess this question is more for the DK's on PC because you guys have had Thieves Guild Longer then us Console players. My question is, since Thieves guild, has Magicka DK been better in PvP? With some changes to the Champ points and stuff, have many of you had much time to play around with it to see if it's been better.

I'm Vet16, I love the play style of Magicka DK, but recently switched to Stam for a bit, but my gear is all V15 mostly, before I start crafting V16, I need to make the choice to go Magicka or Stam. I don't care if Magicka Isn't the best of all classes for PvP, just want to be able to at least compete with that build, and since I came back 3 weeks ago I had a hard time with it. Maybe because I can only craft up to 6 trait gear, and no monster set gear, maybe that was holding me back, or maybe I just suck now since I've come back and haven't put in enough time to get used to PvP again, plus it's almost always a big zerg so I get nuked fast.

Any input would be much appreciated.

Morozov

magDK feels a bit more like it did in 1.5 now (kinda)

similar setups and gear....or was it 1.6?

when was it that everyone went to stam DK? wrothgar? I cant remember, need more coffee

oburn

Morozov wrote: »

magDK feels a bit more like it did in 1.5 now (kinda)

similar setups and gear....or was it 1.6?

when was it that everyone went to stam DK? wrothgar? I cant remember, need more coffee

Haha I'm not sure, I played Mag DK right from the start of ESO on console, but left the game prob 2 months before Imp City, and came back about 3 weeks ago now. But I remember doing pretty good as MagDK before Imp City in PvP, I mean I was by no means a PvP god in this game, but I could hold my own a good % of the time. Since I came back, I get slaughtered lol. I'm also only at like 170 Champ points in total which sucks lol.

RoamingRiverElk

It's not what it used to be... but it's a little better now than before with the change to Inhale. Magicka DKs need to be able to block more hits.

Morozov

run more impen. Im in 5-1-1 light SB with 6 impen on my gear (purple). The changes to inhale can keep you alive in a large zerg so long as the heal drain hit its 6 targets, any less and you can easily get focused down. Not as much a need to permablock, but it does help to be able to block a little.

oburn

Morozov wrote: »

run more impen. Im in 5-1-1 light SB with 6 impen on my gear (purple). The changes to inhale can keep you alive in a large zerg so long as the heal drain hit its 6 targets, any less and you can easily get focused down. Not as much a need to permablock, but it does help to be able to block a little.

Oh ok, which inhale morph do you use btw?

Also what do you use as second bar, just before I went stam I was using a build of SB and Resto

Oh_Skrivva

Draw essence morph is the one you want. Also I haven't tested it yet but I hear dks talons cc is kind of bugged right now and is super OP. But you know how rumors are.

oburn

Oh_Skrivva wrote: »

Draw essence morph is the one you want. Also I haven't tested it yet but I hear dks talons cc is kind of bugged right now and is super OP. But you know how rumors are.

Ok yeah I figured it was Draw Essence, I couldn't remember lol.

I can only craft up to 6 trait gear, so what should I craft? 5 piece Law of Julianos?

Oh_Skrivva

Julianos would be good and strong. But for pvp I like the resource management and the red time bonus of kags. But if your the type that mostly solos or in small gang groups most of your time in pvp than julianos may be better. Kags is just so versatile. It's a good all around set

oburn

Oh_Skrivva wrote: »

Julianos would be good and strong. But for pvp I like the resource management and the red time bonus of kags. But if your the type that mostly solos or in small gang groups most of your time in pvp than julianos may be better. Kags is just so versatile. It's a good all around set

Yeah I can't craft 8 trait gear yet unfortantely haha, I think I'll go 5 piece Jul for now.

Oh_Skrivva

If your in any large guilds it's pretty easy to find nice people to craft you the stuff you need. I'm maxed trait crafter and I make stuff for people free of charge if they supply mats of course. But I only do it if I have free time. I have limited gaming time so I try to maximize it lol. Alot of stuff I craft for people (usually people I've made stuff for before and are kind enough to make me not stop what I'm doing to craft there gear right at that moment) just send me a mail with mats and list of what they need made and I mail it back to them when I get chance.

CyrusArya

The critical difference is, Magicka DK you have to either build for extreme tankiness at the cost of damage, or build for burst at the cost of tankiness. Stam DK on the other hand can be extremely tanky while maintaining formidable burst at the same time. Stamina DK is probably the tankiest and most survivable build in the game except for easy mode magicka sorc. And then when it comes to mobility, there is no debate. The big drawback to stam DK is that the DPS is extremely one dimensional. You're either spamming wrecking blow or la/ransack/bash, take flight for burst, and a dot here and there. Literally all there is to it. The DPS options on magicka dk are so much more fun and engaging than on stamina and you have far better tools to control/hold the ground around you. Also, proxy det/shooting star/vicious death are only exploitable on magicka. As such, Magicka DK is extremely powerful in groups and also in duels.

I wouldn't say either is better than the other, just different. 1v1 a magicka dk will beat a stam dk of equal skill and gear. In groups, Magicka DK brings much more to the table. For strictly solo play, stam DK is superior. But both can be very powerful and viable builds in any aspect of PvP. It is just my opinion that Magicka DK makes you work harder than any other class for dps and also survivability.

Durham

CyrusArya wrote: »

The critical difference is, Magicka DK you have to either build for extreme tankiness at the cost of damage, or build for burst at the cost of tankiness. Stam DK on the other hand can be extremely tanky while maintaining formidable burst at the same time. Stamina DK is probably the tankiest and most survivable build in the game except for easy mode magicka sorc. And then when it comes to mobility, there is no debate. The big drawback to stam DK is that the DPS is extremely one dimensional. You're either spamming wrecking blow or la/ransack/bash, take flight for burst, and a dot here and there. Literally all there is to it. The DPS options on magicka dk are so much more fun and engaging than on stamina and you have far better tools to control/hold the ground around you. Also, proxy det/shooting star/vicious death are only exploitable on magicka. As such, Magicka DK is extremely powerful in groups and also in duels.

I wouldn't say either is better than the other, just different. 1v1 a magicka dk will beat a stam dk of equal skill and gear. In groups, Magicka DK brings much more to the table. For strictly solo play, stam DK is superior. But both can be very powerful and viable builds in any aspect of PvP. It is just my opinion that Magicka DK makes you work harder than any other class for dps and also survivability.

CyrusArya wrote: »

The critical difference is, Magicka DK you have to either build for extreme tankiness at the cost of damage, or build for burst at the cost of tankiness. Stam DK on the other hand can be extremely tanky while maintaining formidable burst at the same time. Stamina DK is probably the tankiest and most survivable build in the game except for easy mode magicka sorc. And then when it comes to mobility, there is no debate. The big drawback to stam DK is that the DPS is extremely one dimensional. You're either spamming wrecking blow or la/ransack/bash, take flight for burst, and a dot here and there. Literally all there is to it. The DPS options on magicka dk are so much more fun and engaging than on stamina and you have far better tools to control/hold the ground around you. Also, proxy det/shooting star/vicious death are only exploitable on magicka. As such, Magicka DK is extremely powerful in groups and also in duels.

I wouldn't say either is better than the other, just different. 1v1 a magicka dk will beat a stam dk of equal skill and gear. In groups, Magicka DK brings much more to the table. For strictly solo play, stam DK is superior. But both can be very powerful and viable builds in any aspect of PvP. It is just my opinion that Magicka DK makes you work harder than any other class for dps and also survivability.

"The big drawback to stam DK is that the DPS is extremely one dimensional. You're either spamming wrecking blow or la/ransack/bash, take flight for burst, and a dot here and there."

I agree with your assessment but since the patch I would not say we have anywhere near the burst that we once had... Since the patch wreaking blows are hitting me for 4-7k on average before patch 7-10 on average ..... Take flight would aways hit me for 10K -13k+ .. Now take flight is hitting me for 6-9k on average.... My add-ons are telling me Im doing 30% less damage ... Stam DKs can still be successful but it requires someone that very skilled at the class... Someone that is average or plays the class occasionally will have problems.... On the board many DK are telling similar stories .. especially solo oriented DKs that used drinks instead of food... Group oriented (Food) Dk will not see the nerf as much .....

Durham

oburn wrote: »

Well I guess this question is more for the DK's on PC because you guys have had Thieves Guild Longer then us Console players. My question is, since Thieves guild, has Magicka DK been better in PvP? With some changes to the Champ points and stuff, have many of you had much time to play around with it to see if it's been better.

I'm Vet16, I love the play style of Magicka DK, but recently switched to Stam for a bit, but my gear is all V15 mostly, before I start crafting V16, I need to make the choice to go Magicka or Stam. I don't care if Magicka Isn't the best of all classes for PvP, just want to be able to at least compete with that build, and since I came back 3 weeks ago I had a hard time with it. Maybe because I can only craft up to 6 trait gear, and no monster set gear, maybe that was holding me back, or maybe I just suck now since I've come back and haven't put in enough time to get used to PvP again, plus it's almost always a big zerg so I get nuked fast.

Any input would be much appreciated.

Your damage is down ... Your leap damage is way off for some reason Stam DKs are struggling ... Most ran around 20k health and used drinks for resource managment (High Weapon Damage builds) 30-32k stamina ........

Non reflectable meteor and Det at the same time and your dead ...

Your burst is much lower against class magicka classes that now run hardy and are running healing ward, and stacking other shields ...

Its not just you....

olivaresdonjuan

5-kragnacs hope light
2-engine guardian heavy
3-will power magic or health depending on your comfort level

S-b (torugs pact)
Burning embers
Talons
Volatile armor
Flame lash
Chains
Standard of might

Destruction staff (anything)
Reflective plate
Ingenious weapons
Igneous shield
Coagulated blood
Flame reach
Shooting star

All points into magic

Cp- your choice, I went for max flame damage, reduce cost, and quick recoveries first.

My first dk was a stamina nord and wb/take flight/execute got old fast. I love my new dark elf dk, I can take sorcs and nbs no problem, anything past 4 enemies I get overwhelmed, but in groups I hardly go down.

Hutch679

olivaresdonjuan wrote: »

5-kragnacs hope light
2-engine guardian heavy
3-will power magic or health depending on your comfort level

S-b
Burning embers
Talons
Volatile armor
Flame lash
Chains
Standard of might

Destruction staff
Reflective plate
Ingenious weapons
Igneous shield
Coagulated blood
Flame reach
Shooting star

All points into magic

Cp- your choice, I went for max flame damage, reduce cost, and quick recoveries first.

My first dk was a stamina nord and wb/take flight/execute got old fast. I love my new dark elf dk, I can take sorcs and nbs no problem, anything past 4 enemies I get overwhelmed, but in groups I hardly go down.

Change out the Coag blood for green dragon blood. The 20% Stam Regen is far more beneficial. Switch igneous weapons to molten armaments morph because the 40% increased heavy attack on destro staff is superior to increased melee damage. Change reflective plate to Dragonfire scale because +35% damage returned is way better than that puny damage shield it gives. Just my opinion though. Depends on play style a little too.

oburn

olivaresdonjuan wrote: »

5-kragnacs hope light
2-engine guardian heavy
3-will power magic or health depending on your comfort level

S-b (torugs pact)
Burning embers
Talons
Volatile armor
Flame lash
Chains
Standard of might

Destruction staff (anything)
Reflective plate
Ingenious weapons
Igneous shield
Coagulated blood
Flame reach
Shooting star

All points into magic

Cp- your choice, I went for max flame damage, reduce cost, and quick recoveries first.

My first dk was a stamina nord and wb/take flight/execute got old fast. I love my new dark elf dk, I can take sorcs and nbs no problem, anything past 4 enemies I get overwhelmed, but in groups I hardly go down.

Are most people running 5 Kags? if I get 5 Kags made, I don't have any monster set at all, so what would I put in it's place?

Morozov

oburn wrote: »

olivaresdonjuan wrote: »

5-kragnacs hope light
2-engine guardian heavy
3-will power magic or health depending on your comfort level

S-b (torugs pact)
Burning embers
Talons
Volatile armor
Flame lash
Chains
Standard of might

Destruction staff (anything)
Reflective plate
Ingenious weapons
Igneous shield
Coagulated blood
Flame reach
Shooting star

All points into magic

Cp- your choice, I went for max flame damage, reduce cost, and quick recoveries first.

My first dk was a stamina nord and wb/take flight/execute got old fast. I love my new dark elf dk, I can take sorcs and nbs no problem, anything past 4 enemies I get overwhelmed, but in groups I hardly go down.

Are most people running 5 Kags? if I get 5 Kags made, I don't have any monster set at all, so what would I put in it's place?

I am running 5kags/3 willpower jewelry/ 4 magnus. Seeing as im in PVP exclusively I get the regen and spell power benefit from the three sets as well as a quick rez which is good when running in the groups im in. All are craftable sets and can easily be obtained.

There are benefits to both morphs of inhale: deep breath adds more dps and an interrupt where you get magicka with draw essence. I personally run deep breath for the dps and interrupt because with the sets/enchants/attributes I run, my magicka rarely drops below 50% spamming abilities.

Dragon blood is a tricky beast. GDB is a good stam regen but coag blood adds additional healing. Coag with inhale makes it pretty tricky to take you down. Add on top of that the stage 4 vamp debuff which reduces damage done when at low health; unless you are getting focused you can remain pretty tanky even in light armor with the impen and CP

edit; this is without a monster set, but EG, VS, MAL, are all decent options to use. 5Kags however is hard to say no to in PVP

Hutch679

Morozov wrote: »

oburn wrote: »

olivaresdonjuan wrote: »

5-kragnacs hope light
2-engine guardian heavy
3-will power magic or health depending on your comfort level

S-b (torugs pact)
Burning embers
Talons
Volatile armor
Flame lash
Chains
Standard of might

Destruction staff (anything)
Reflective plate
Ingenious weapons
Igneous shield
Coagulated blood
Flame reach
Shooting star

All points into magic

Cp- your choice, I went for max flame damage, reduce cost, and quick recoveries first.

My first dk was a stamina nord and wb/take flight/execute got old fast. I love my new dark elf dk, I can take sorcs and nbs no problem, anything past 4 enemies I get overwhelmed, but in groups I hardly go down.

Are most people running 5 Kags? if I get 5 Kags made, I don't have any monster set at all, so what would I put in it's place?

I am running 5kags/3 willpower jewelry/ 4 magnus. Seeing as im in PVP exclusively I get the regen and spell power benefit from the three sets as well as a quick rez which is good when running in the groups im in. All are craftable sets and can easily be obtained.

There are benefits to both morphs of inhale: deep breath adds more dps and an interrupt where you get magicka with draw essence. I personally run deep breath for the dps and interrupt because with the sets/enchants/attributes I run, my magicka rarely drops below 50% spamming abilities.

Dragon blood is a tricky beast. GDB is a good stam regen but coag blood adds additional healing. Coag with inhale makes it pretty tricky to take you down. Add on top of that the stage 4 vamp debuff which reduces damage done when at low health; unless you are getting focused you can remain pretty tanky even in light armor with the impen and CP

edit; this is without a monster set, but EG, VS, MAL, are all decent options to use. 5Kags however is hard to say no to in PVP

Kags is pretty darn good. If not Kags, other options are twice born star or julianos. I agree with the deep breath morph over draw essence as well.

oburn

Morozov wrote: »

oburn wrote: »

olivaresdonjuan wrote: »

5-kragnacs hope light
2-engine guardian heavy
3-will power magic or health depending on your comfort level

S-b (torugs pact)
Burning embers
Talons
Volatile armor
Flame lash
Chains
Standard of might

Destruction staff (anything)
Reflective plate
Ingenious weapons
Igneous shield
Coagulated blood
Flame reach
Shooting star

All points into magic

Cp- your choice, I went for max flame damage, reduce cost, and quick recoveries first.

My first dk was a stamina nord and wb/take flight/execute got old fast. I love my new dark elf dk, I can take sorcs and nbs no problem, anything past 4 enemies I get overwhelmed, but in groups I hardly go down.

Are most people running 5 Kags? if I get 5 Kags made, I don't have any monster set at all, so what would I put in it's place?

I am running 5kags/3 willpower jewelry/ 4 magnus. Seeing as im in PVP exclusively I get the regen and spell power benefit from the three sets as well as a quick rez which is good when running in the groups im in. All are craftable sets and can easily be obtained.

There are benefits to both morphs of inhale: deep breath adds more dps and an interrupt where you get magicka with draw essence. I personally run deep breath for the dps and interrupt because with the sets/enchants/attributes I run, my magicka rarely drops below 50% spamming abilities.

Dragon blood is a tricky beast. GDB is a good stam regen but coag blood adds additional healing. Coag with inhale makes it pretty tricky to take you down. Add on top of that the stage 4 vamp debuff which reduces damage done when at low health; unless you are getting focused you can remain pretty tanky even in light armor with the impen and CP

edit; this is without a monster set, but EG, VS, MAL, are all decent options to use. 5Kags however is hard to say no to in PVP

Good points, now do you run any Nirn on your sets? What enchants do you put on your gear? I'm limited on CP, I only have 210 CP, so I'm struggling where to put them. Although I am considering going to the Non CP PvP Campaign

olivaresdonjuan

I forgot the names changes on some of the new morphs but yeah the one that gives me more spell damage and 40% heavy attacks on my staff. Traits... I use sharpened on my weapons, 4 divines and 4 infused (shield). Spell damage mundus, kuta magic glyphs on all armor, kuta reduce cost on jewelry, and kuta fire glyphs on weapons.

oburn

olivaresdonjuan wrote: »

I forgot the names changes on some of the new morphs but yeah the one that gives me more spell damage and 40% heavy attacks on my staff. Traits... I use sharpened on my weapons, 4 divines and 4 infused (shield). Spell damage mundus, kuta magic glyphs on all armor, kuta reduce cost on jewelry, and kuta fire glyphs on weapons.

Oh ok cool, you don't use any Impen enchants? Or is your set up for PVE?

DKsUnite

Oh_Skrivva wrote: »

Draw essence morph is the one you want. Also I haven't tested it yet but I hear dks talons cc is kind of bugged right now and is super OP. But you know how rumors are.

yeh thats definetly wrong. The interrupt > magicka return. You shouldnt have magicka problems in the first place to warrant using draw essence. You will die to a RD templar everytime if you dont go with deep breath.

oburn

I Appreciate all the advice guys, thanks

Forestd16b14_ESO

Eh what I seen alot better but not quiet up there with OP magicka night blade and OP magicka sorcerer.

oburn

Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »

Eh what I seen alot better but not quiet up there with OP magicka night blade and OP magicka sorcerer.

What makes Magicka Sorcs so OP? I have a Vet 3 Sorc, but stam, only just got thieves update on ps4 so I havent been following up on Sorc changes

Forestd16b14_ESO

oburn wrote: »

Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »

Eh what I seen alot better but not quiet up there with OP magicka night blade and OP magicka sorcerer.

What makes Magicka Sorcs so OP? I have a Vet 3 Sorc, but stam, only just got thieves update on ps4 so I havent been following up on Sorc changes

You serious ?

Let us see starters damage shields, magicka users can get 5k+ spell damage now, bolt escape still annoying, OP meteor, over load light attacks that aren't reflected, burst healing, vicious death set, proxy det, the new hardy CP.

Sure there more but you get the idea.

Chadwikid

I'm in love with the magicka dk changes. It's a whole new ballgame. Without knit picking about skills that are still useless that most people didn't use anyway (inferno anyone), I would say the only thing that didn't get done that should have was a fix for dragons blood.

I am finally able to run without a resto staff and have some insane survivabilty in light armor. The changes to inhale and its morphs and the heal with burning embers along with the cp changes have made a huge difference. Damage is way up survivabilty is way up. You can play a dk the way it should be played, In your face fire breathing face melting warrior.


I was very effective with my mag dk pre TG now...its game on.

Currently running 5/1/1 light s/b s/b

5 kags
4 Magnus
3 willpower

I'm switching up a bit with the new monster vendor around to

5 kags impen
1 Kenna
1 bloods pawn
2 torugs (s/b)
3 willpower

oburn

Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »

oburn wrote: »

Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »

Eh what I seen alot better but not quiet up there with OP magicka night blade and OP magicka sorcerer.

What makes Magicka Sorcs so OP? I have a Vet 3 Sorc, but stam, only just got thieves update on ps4 so I havent been following up on Sorc changes

You serious ?

Let us see starters damage shields, magicka users can get 5k+ spell damage now, bolt escape still annoying, OP meteor, over load light attacks that aren't reflected, burst healing, vicious death set, proxy det, the new hardy CP.

Sure there more but you get the idea.

Oh ok I got ya, like I said we only got the new patch yesterday I've been on my DK so I havent checked out anything with my sorc

olivaresdonjuan

oburn wrote: »

olivaresdonjuan wrote: »

I forgot the names changes on some of the new morphs but yeah the one that gives me more spell damage and 40% heavy attacks on my staff. Traits... I use sharpened on my weapons, 4 divines and 4 infused (shield). Spell damage mundus, kuta magic glyphs on all armor, kuta reduce cost on jewelry, and kuta fire glyphs on weapons.

Oh ok cool, you don't use any Impen enchants? Or is your set up for PVE?

my magic DK isn't vet 16 yet so I'm using training glyphs but I don't feel too much of a difference, yes impen would be nice but I'm going for a build that can manage resources better than other magic builds and hold its own against sorcs, so far as a lvl 45 I'm doing good, been noticing that the one hit wonders run out of magic when they start doing heavy attacks. My only problem is "oh *** heal". I used run restoration but I didn't like the self heals it provided, spamming coagulated blood is sadly faster but leaves me open for an attack.

RoamingRiverElk

The 20% stam regen from Green Dragon Blood is only beneficial if you don't use tripots or other potions that give the same exact buff. Thus, my choice is clearly Coagulating, if I choose to have it on my bars. It needs buffing for pvp though.

I too tend to think that the Deep Breath (interrupt) morph is often more useful now than Draw Essence. It's superior when you're just forced to spam it in the middle of enemies as they're focusing on you, since you don't have time to benefit from the magicka return that only comes with exhale. In the no-CP campaign Draw Essence may be more useful than Deep Breath since resource management matters more there and the enemies may be hitting you for less and thus you may be able to wait for the second phase of it.