Final Thoughts before Thieves Guild hits on Console

Lord-Otto

Hello!
With TG DLC nearly at hand, I wanna take the time to summarize on comment on what I consider problems in the current state of the game. Some might be fixed with the DLC, many won't. I'm doing this to actually HELP ZoS in improving their game, as I genuinely want it to succeed. Now, grab some popcorn, go to the toilet or nearest bush, this is gonna be a long read. Enjoy!



1. Wrecking Blow
I chose this as my first entry because it is just such a hot topic that people encounter daily, every minute in PvP. Right now, it is an easy 1-Button-Win, because it does so much in one skill. Whereas other builds, like magicka DKs, have to slot Fossilize+Lash+Destro Staff+Destructive Reach+Entropy (MotG) to perform similar, and still don't achive the same results, Wrecking Blow does it all in one button press. This is by definition the most overpowered thing in a game which revolves around efficient usage of your skill slots and combat timing.
I hear the well-needed change to CPs significantly reduced the impact of this skill. Thi might make things better, but the sheer utility in a DPS+burst skill like this is still very questionable to me.

2. Stamina
2015 was the year of stamina, no doubt. Thanks to CP and some ridiculous armor/weapon/skill passives, stamina builds got all the mobility, cc immunity and damage. Even outshining magicka healers more often than not. It was time for a change, desperately time. I think more ultimates should scale with physical damage. But as long as Flawless Dawnbreaker gives you 8 whopping percent on your damage, break free requires stamina, medium armor gives more proteczion than light and Harness Magicka still ignores physical damage, I say the upcoming balancing between magicka and stamina builds is much fairer. Not perfect, but competitive. Hold onto your builds, people! Don't switch because other FotM builds look easier! It's what's getting us into this whole balancing mess!

3. Shield Breaker and Shield Stacking
Still absolutely unacceptable, this set. Let me tell you a secret:
Shield Stacking does NOT exist!
Yeah, you can activate Hardened and Harness pre-fight. But so can you Rally and Vigor. And in-fight? Sorcs have to actively activate shields to survive, consuming an action. Whereas HoTs just tick passively. So, an action turn for a 10k shield, which is immediately crushed by WB+Heavy or Surprise+Light. Harness completely ignores physical. Healing Ward can be strong in 1v1, but very unreliable in normal PvP encounters with many people around. Regardless, it is easily broken by one powerful blow. You can stack your 20k of shields if you hide, only. Guess what? That's 20k of damage absorbed, give or take a bit. That's two attacks in the current meta! You know how much damage a Nightblade "absorbs" when hitting Cloak? INFINNITE amounts! So how are Sorcs not allowed to survive, while Nightblades to it very frequently? I have never survived 5 people whacking me with shield stacking. Nightblades just cloak away and giggle.
Now, i know you can deal with one person using this set, but it is difficult and not on even ground. if it's two people (and there always are), you're screwed. Alo, why is it stamina only, whereas magicka builds are struggling thanks to Harness? as it stands, this set is not fair. If ZoS have to introduce a magic bullet to counter mechanics, than the only fair consequence is to introduce one for EVERY defensive mechanic. I want
Stealth Breaker: Reveals hidden enemies 40 around you. Your light attacks deal 2000 irresistible damage to cloaked targets.
Scale Breaker: Your light attacks cannot be reflected and deal 2000 irresistible damage to enemies affected by Dragon Scales and its morphs and Defensive Stance and its morphs.
Heal Breaker: Your light attacks afflict an enemy with Major Plague, reducing healing taken by healing skills by 100%.
That's balancing, people! You know what else this is? Pok'emon. Rock, paper, scissors. The designer of Shield Breaker was inspired by frikkin' POK'EMON! Don't know about you, chaps, but I don't want Pok'emon in my Elder Scrolls games. This set has to go, period. Maybe with Dark Brotherhoood... Hopefully, earlier!

4. Zergs
I don't know what to say. Vicious Death FTW? Another questionable concept. Sorry, but we need AoE cap removed. We need USEFUL AoE. When I'm engaged by two people, what am i supposed to do? Focus one one, so that the other kills me? Use AoE that hits both but deals only half the damage so that they heal it off? IMO, we need more AoE, but with a penalty. Looking at Destro Staffs, Force Pulse (single target) hits roughly twice as hard as AoE Impulse. Just make Impulse as strong as single-target attacks, but triple the cost! That would give me a chance at fighting back, but the two attackers still have the upper hand, that is, until reinforcements arrive. I know AoE causes server stress, but come on! Remove NPCs instead?

5. NPCs
Why are there even NPCs in a PvP area? Huh? Except for spamming CCs to help the already major group, they don't do much. They never helped me in outnumbered situations. Might as well get removed. Or, more desirable, could receive a buff if outnumbered. You know, at night, when 200 people of one alliance crush the twenty on the other? Why not make NPCs ten times as strong to compensate and keep the battlefield even?

6. Patches in general
Please, ZoS, do balancing more often, and more openly! It took you one year to make magicka DKs competitive again. That is too long! WAY too long! =(


That's it for now, have a good day and see you in Thieves Guild! (^^)
Whoa, what's that? ( oo)/
*grabs your purse and sneaks away*
(^~^)

Buffler

You lost me in fits of laughter at your "shield stacking doesnt exist"

RebornV3x

Yeah Wreaking Blow is a problem if they would just fix the lag it wouldn't be a issue. The rest I kinda agree with more or less.

Lord-Otto

Buffler wrote: »

You lost me in fits of laughter at your "shield stacking doesnt exist"

That's cute. Laughing is good.
But I'll elaborate.
Casting a shield takes an action. During that action, your opponent can load a Wrecking Blow or Surprise Attack or whatever, with a light or heavy attack weaved. So it boils down to being able to put out as much damage in that action (or second) as the shield. 10k for a strong Hardened Ward. Tell me WB and SA can't crack that!
So, by doing silly things, you actually ALLOW your opponent to cast another shield. I could have hit you for 10k instead in that action, maybe even killing you that way. Is that what you prefer?

Lord-Otto

RebornV3x wrote: »

Yeah Wreaking Blow is a problem if they would just fix the lag it wouldn't be a issue. The rest I kinda agree with more or less.

Yup, lag-free environment would do wonders to this game! (^_^)

MaxwellC

You must be a sorc and therefore I'll say nope Wrecking blow is fine where it's at. If you're not wearing impen in PvP that's your fault; you guys shield stack all day and claim that to be your only defence when you're able to provide the resistance needed to survive in a fight but instead dump everything into divines.

If I have to WB you 4+ times because all you do is stack shields, that in it's self is unacceptable and what I call easy street gameplay for sorcs. I play both PC and console (XB1), unfortunately I play consoles more since most of my friends are on here but the new CP doesn't really start to help you until you invest a good amount (like 10-20 CP).

As a solo player I don't care for VD but one thing that does irritate me is when other groups or random Pugs decide to jump on the target I'm killing then some random easy street mag blade runs up behind someone and nukes them resulting in my death thanks to all those explosions.

I've got both Magicka and stamina class and it took them over 1 year to balance stamina DK... oh wait that hasn't been balanced yet as they removed the original Flames of Oblivion and removed my molt execute that was fun to use in PvP for stealth attacks. On top of the only two stamina related abilities in our class which are DoTs LoL?

2015 wasn't the year of stamina 2015 was the year of Mag NB and Mag Sorcs and guess what now it's become elder robes online. Thanks to all the QQ about magicka classes needing physical resistance CP since we have a magicka one, now you have one. Now you get to far cast with high amounts of damage while I have to get close to you to smack you down but oh wait... shield stacking still a problem.

Stamina is used for our abilities so we have to micro manage our resources so we can dodge roll, CC break, block,etc. While Magicka players can block cast and claim to only be able to block 4 hits at the max even though they can have CC regain stamina and go at it again; GG balance.

Lord-Otto

@Maxwell:
The stamina-magicka debate has been decided by people more competent than you or me. To cut it short, there is a reason why we saw so many STAMblades and people have been moaning about spamBUSH and Wrecking Blow and Surprise Attack. Not spamFAN nor Concealed Weapon nor Flame Lash.
I say it again, if you allow me to cast a second shield after the first one, the joke's on YOU. WB immediately crushes a shield AND can knock back and stun and drain stamina and regain resources (heavy attack weaving). this is exactly why people defend their WB o much. Without that crutch, you really would have to put some thought into your gameplay instead of mashing that one button wonder, just like everyone else.
No, blockcasting isn't in the game anymore after we can't regen stamina while blocking. I would happily break free with my main resource, which I have higher regen of, less cost, and more CPs into. Also, Flappy Wings and Cloak still have no scaling with spell damage. i might have a second bar to "blockcast", but you have one to reflect or cloak away. What do you think is stronger, hm?
About the DK... I still have no proper magicka execute on my magicka DK. I have a useless Flame Lash. Healing requires me to lot a resto staff, as opposed to Vigor. How many magicka DKs have you senn in Cyro last year, especially after the Imperial City debacle? I'm willing to bet I found more perfect roe than I've seen mag DKs... And I spent most of my time in PvP.
Just switch to magicka builds, buddy, if you really feel they are so much stronger. In the end, that just proves you're one of the people who want EZ mode in Cyrodiil.

Lord-Otto

Oh, and ranged combat. Good one. Does not exist in Cyrodiil. Because gap closers. No such thing as gap openers, I should put that on the list.

GreenSoup2HoT

1: Wrecking Blow - Should not empower itself. The new physical damage star should fix your issues though. IMO, i do not have issues with this ability. Very easily countered by all classes. Its strong yes but if you are trying to 1vX, gl the game is anti 1vX.

2: I disagree. Magicka Sorcs and Templars had Immortal sustain if they were good. Cloak was so easily countered that both magicka and stam nb was not that big of an issue, they had amazing burst but were very squishy.

3: Cloak easily countered. Shields were over the top since not crit-able. Hardly anyone uses shield breaker. The game after IC was just anti 1vX. No a big deal. Play with friends.

4: Nothing you can do against them. New siege will help a lot. You got to bottle neck and wipe next dlc. In a open field, the swarm always wins.

A lot of your issues are not issues. Just dynamics of the game you dont like. TG dlc fixes a lot of these issues. Magicka got an edge with proxi. Stamina stayed the same but can now mitigate physical damage which helps everyone really. More defence but a little less offence.

Oldmanlawlor

Looked for a satyrical tag.. Did not find..

Silver_Strider

I agree with Wrecking blow and patches, don't agree with anything else.

2015 wasn't year of the stamina. Sure we got some nice buffs but nothing major or game breaking. Magic users got plenty of buffs as well, you even got a craftable Hunding's Rage set. When I get a craftable Seducer or Torag's Pact set for stamina user, then I'll be satisfied.

Shield Breaker only grants any benefit if you fight against people that actually use shields, which is practically only Sorcs. You lose a lot of damage using Shield Breaker just to counter 1 class.
As for your "suggestions" for other breaker sets, those are all laughable. Stealth isn't hard to break. Any AoE breaks stealth and then there are plenty of bugs when you try to go back into stealth that if you have trouble with Stealth players, then there's just something wrong with your build. Reflective scales is also easy to work around, just don't use projectile attacks, not really hard to do. Throw some Disease Damage on your weapon and invest into the Befoul CP to screw healing. Sounds like a lot of L2P issues to me.

Zergs are always a problem. Siege can help. So can being ORGANIZED. A good organized group of 20 people can hold a keep from a Zerg any day.

I solo defended a keep against 10-12 enemy players, ranging from as low as level 35 to VR16. How? NPCs.
Removing them would just make capturing keeps/resources a cakewalk. On the flipside of that, buffing NPCs would just make everything in PvP more tedious. Why should normal NPCs be god tier in strength just because an alliance in out numbered? How would you even start to regulate those kind of numbers, without causing even more lag issues in PvP?
I say they are fine as is.

Didaco

Is this thread really here?
This is so sorc biased, so 1.6ish that... that... I don't know.
Still the nb-witch-hunting, after the buff to RM.
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Wreckin blow.
Seriously? As a sorc, the only moment I'm sure a can take more than just a breather is against a WB spammer.
It's by far the most counterable skill in the game, with that more than just 1 sec wind-up, that feels literally like an eternity, in which you can do ANYTHING.
You say you lose an action by casting an INSTANT skill (hardened ward) yet you don't even consider the time it takes for WB to charge. Seems fair.
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How are you supposed to survive a 5 person gank? It's simple.
You're not even supposed to.
See, the whole mentality behind the concept of "how am I supposed to survive a 1vX" it's a clear sign of how sorcs have been overpowered for all this time.
Sorcs have transcended the need to actually think about a viable way to be competitive in a 1v1 scenario, where you get to see and compare the REAL class balance.
For how things currently run, a sorc power is determined by how many enemies they can face, and actually kill, AT THE SAME TIME.

Gap opener.
You're a sorc. You have Streak. You ask for a gap opener.
Don't you smell something illogic?
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Shield stacking does not exist.
My god, the only reason why shield stacking is not FotM it's because it's been Flavor of the Friggin Year.
Consider I'm on console, so it may be an even longer lapse.

DjSolJAH

I'd like to know what happens to Azuras star (current campaign) since its going CP free halfway through campaign. Do we still get rewards? Reset?