Should get Ap for Damaging Keeps with Siege

leepalmer95

With the coming siege changes, i'm guessing people will actually begin the use siege (they should of anyway but...).

Though i've always thought you should gain ap of damaging a keep with siege, it should be proportional to the damage you do, so a stone siege would give more ap than a fire which would give more than oil etc....

Maybe something like using the entire durability of a siege on a keep would give 50% of the siege cost? So using a full stone treb would give around 900 ap if you used it all.

Also hoping with this that people would actually notice that hitting a postern door does 0 dmg.... 2 year game and people still haven't figured this out...

Anyway with all the improvements to Ap gain i figured this could fit in nicely, it's not game breaking ap but it's nice to feel as if your not wasting Ap on siege, your getting some back if you use it well as well as leveling your alliance rank with it.

What does everyone think?

Egonieser

No, we have enough wall-repair emperors and PvDoor guilds, without the need to encourage even more of it.
Players should be rewarded AP for doing meaningful things, not flinging stones at walls. The fact that you help get a keep flipped quicker thus slowing your enemies movement and gain points for your alliance and thus for yourself is a reward on its own.

leepalmer95

Egonieser wrote: »

No, we have enough wall-repair emperors and PvDoor guilds, without the need to encourage even more of it.
Players should be rewarded AP for doing meaningful things, not flinging stones at walls. The fact that you help get a keep flipped quicker thus slowing your enemies movement and gain points for your alliance and thus for yourself is a reward on its own.

So siegeing a keep is meaningless, it's one of the most important part of pvp, why shoudn't be earn ap for it? They earn ap by spamming mutagen.

Using siege costs you as a player ap, if your going to help your alliance by smashing a wall down using a siege which you payed for you should earn ap, You earn ap for repairing it.

AshTal

I think something should be done to encourage sieges rather than groups spamming AOE's running round in circles ignoring the actual keep and winning the war

Curtdogg47

I'm all for earning AP for this. Using a treb is boring as hell I think.

Alorier

Really we would have every one running around just hitting keeps sorry but this would just be abused

Molag_Crow

Agreed. It only MAKES SENSE to earn AP from contributing to knocking down a keep/outpost wall/door.

Egonieser wrote: »

No, we have enough wall-repair emperors and PvDoor guilds, without the need to encourage even more of it.
Players should be rewarded AP for doing meaningful things, not flinging stones at walls. The fact that you help get a keep flipped quicker thus slowing your enemies movement and gain points for your alliance and thus for yourself is a reward on its own.

Who even cares about Emperorship these days? they'll always find ways to exploit/get easy AP - earning a bit of AP from knocking down a wall (which is the objective of Cyrodiil) won't exactly make the next noob an emperor - they still have to work hard, in fact harder to get Emperor if they just sat at keeps/outposts all day knocking down walls because, guess what? we could be talking about small AP gains here, nothing too huge.

Egonieser wrote: »

Players should be rewarded AP for doing meaningful things, not flinging stones at walls.

I'm sorry but what is Cyrodiil's main objective? to fling rocks at walls. /TheEnd

leepalmer95

davidtxr wrote: »

Really we would have every one running around just hitting keeps sorry but this would just be abused

Did you read the OP?

A full stone treb would give half of the amount it costs.

You can't do it indefinitely. The ap gains wouldn't be large so even if you say there for an hour with 3x siege up constantly siegeing walls with no one coming to kill you you'd get less ap than if you would of just pvp normally.

Isn't the basis of pvp just to run around hitting keeps. About it being abused 99.9% won't, the 0.01% may, but they abuse everything, resource exploit, gate exploit, tick exploiting.

Kelleton

soon you would see keeps with no walls...why fight another player when you can siege down every wall of a keep and become emp

leepalmer95

Kelleton wrote: »

soon you would see keeps with no walls...why fight another player when you can siege down every wall of a keep and become emp

Because one, if you siege a keep, a group will eventually come and kill you.

Two the ap wouldn't be that great, it would be faster to go and kill a few people.

Next patch you'll get 1700 for a kill, using a entire stone treb from full durability would give you 900 ap.

Doubt you'd get more than 7k ap an hour.

Inarre

You do get AP for seiging a keep.

There are offensive ticks when you take the keep over...

Anything you would get simply for seiging and losing would be easily exploitable.

Forestd16b14_ESO

Egonieser wrote: »

No, we have enough wall-repair emperors and PvDoor guilds, without the need to encourage even more of it.
Players should be rewarded AP for doing meaningful things, not flinging stones at walls. The fact that you help get a keep flipped quicker thus slowing your enemies movement and gain points for your alliance and thus for yourself is a reward on its own.

Kinda have to agree with what this guy said bad enough players have become Emperor by repairing walls but AP for damaging keeps would just straight up take away what ever meaning the Emperor title has left cause any Emperor farmer will do is just go around keep to keep and get the walls down to half HP and move on to the next keep farming up massive amount of AP.

And this is just my thoughts but I think AP for repairs should go away too just to stop Emperors of wall repairs.

leepalmer95

I'm sure zos can think of something to stop this, make the ap gain small enough the people won't be able to get emp, limit the amount of ap you can get by siegeing a keep on a per keep basis. Make it so you can only get a max amount based on the fact the fact your expected to be with other people. Maybe 900 ap a keep?

900 ap a keep, would give actually pvp players a boost to ap, if someone wants to try and exploit this they'll get what? 6k an hour. While costing them 12k an hour. Going from keep to keep isn't exactly fast, then the time actually spent siegeing it, using a full durability worth of siegeing isn't exactly fast. This is also assuming they don't get ganked/killed running from a keep, don't run into a zerg or a group runs out and kills them while there siegeing. Which would drop the ap an hour.

Forestd16b14_ESO

leepalmer95 wrote: »

I'm sure zos can think of something to stop this, make the ap gain small enough the people won't be able to get emp, limit the amount of ap you can get by siegeing a keep on a per keep basis. Make it so you can only get a max amount based on the fact the fact your expected to be with other people. Maybe 900 ap a keep?

900 ap a keep, would give actually pvp players a boost to ap, if someone wants to try and exploit this they'll get what? 6k an hour. While costing them 12k an hour. Going from keep to keep isn't exactly fast, then the time actually spent siegeing it, using a full durability worth of siegeing isn't exactly fast. This is also assuming they don't get ganked/killed running from a keep, don't run into a zerg or a group runs out and kills them while there siegeing. Which would drop the ap an hour.

No wall repairs only grant like 15 or 20 AP and players became emp that way and last time I checked their were multiple walls at a keep and useless corner walls. Players would easily exploit this to rack in massive amounts of AP. Sorry no to the idea just no.

leepalmer95

Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »

leepalmer95 wrote: »

I'm sure zos can think of something to stop this, make the ap gain small enough the people won't be able to get emp, limit the amount of ap you can get by siegeing a keep on a per keep basis. Make it so you can only get a max amount based on the fact the fact your expected to be with other people. Maybe 900 ap a keep?

900 ap a keep, would give actually pvp players a boost to ap, if someone wants to try and exploit this they'll get what? 6k an hour. While costing them 12k an hour. Going from keep to keep isn't exactly fast, then the time actually spent siegeing it, using a full durability worth of siegeing isn't exactly fast. This is also assuming they don't get ganked/killed running from a keep, don't run into a zerg or a group runs out and kills them while there siegeing. Which would drop the ap an hour.

No wall repairs only grant like 15 or 20 AP and players became emp that way and last time I checked their were multiple walls at a keep and useless corner walls. Players would easily exploit this to rack in massive amounts of AP. Sorry no to the idea just no.

Completely forgot to read this thread.

Like i said limit the amount per keep, doesn't matter what wall you siege, inner or outet. 900 ap limit per keep. Resets when the keep changes alliances.

Even if someone wanted to exploit this and assuming no one runs into them, they really wouldn't get more than a few thousand ap an hour.

NeillMcAttack

I would totally support this change. I'm sick of nobody stocking siege weapons and just running to and from the same keep for 2 hours gets boring.

The only problem is that you would likely have guilds trading AP all day by knocking a wall, rebuilding a wall and so on......
I suppose a cooldown could work just like with killing players now.

Regardless, incentive to actually siege that wall people will stand beside all day is a must IMO. Considering that new merchant will be round soon I actually see the only people buying siege will soon only be those on top of the leaderboard.

Resipsa131

Egonieser wrote: »

No, we have enough wall-repair emperors and PvDoor guilds, without the need to encourage even more of it.
Players should be rewarded AP for doing meaningful things, not flinging stones at walls. The fact that you help get a keep flipped quicker thus slowing your enemies movement and gain points for your alliance and thus for yourself is a reward on its own.

Kappa, I routinely cut off reinforcements by solo flagging Beaker and other outposts and then hiding cutting off reinforcements. Once three minutes is up you flag it again and then hide. My actions give me 0 AP but helps the EP push and capture keeps. I am a combat multiplier.

Teridaxus

Awesome idea!
I'm sick to be only the guy who siege the keep while the ther 30 people just sit around and then we get whiped 10 minutes later by enemy reinforcements.

idk

leepalmer95 wrote: »

Egonieser wrote: »

No, we have enough wall-repair emperors and PvDoor guilds, without the need to encourage even more of it.
Players should be rewarded AP for doing meaningful things, not flinging stones at walls. The fact that you help get a keep flipped quicker thus slowing your enemies movement and gain points for your alliance and thus for yourself is a reward on its own.

So siegeing a keep is meaningless, it's one of the most important part of pvp, why shoudn't be earn ap for it? They earn ap by spamming mutagen.

Using siege costs you as a player ap, if your going to help your alliance by smashing a wall down using a siege which you payed for you should earn ap, You earn ap for repairing it.

Unless something has changed for the bad, healers do not earn AP for spamming mutagen. They only get AP if that mutagen does significant effective healing while actual PvP combat is engaged.

To say someone gets AP for simply applying Mutagen is like saying someone gets AP for spamming WB. Doesn't work that way.

Krist

Ah the things we can argue over, when nothing else is going on. This is fun.