Magicka skills that do physical damage everything understood...

teladoy

Why some skills that need magicka do physical damage?

Is there any stamina skills that does spell damage?

If I concentrate in power up my magicka pool, to do more spell damage, that goes through spell resistance, why, WHY THEY DO PHYSICAL DAMAGE????

Should I improve my physical armor penetration or what?

Someone explain me this illogical procedure.

and by the way... would be too much work for any of zinemax to give us an official explaination of all the attributes/ stats that are in the game, even those that we CAN'T see in the character profile. And explain also why some tooltips are not updated, why if I have more magicka my spell power don't change, but my skills they do... why this and why that?

Please we want a list all ALL the stats, with description, and everything well explained, like armor penetration, spell penetration, all weapon enchant attibutes and what they do... because I could find all this in internet, but most are not updated are theoretical conjectures and who knows if it is the true, because the true can come from only one source, someone of zinemax.

Thank you.

willymchilybily

damage scaling is down to 2 factors (if we simplify)

Resource Pool
an ability uses magicka or stamina to cast. Its damage will scale with the size of the pool. Stamina skills also scale with weapon damage, and magicka also scale with spell damage. the type of damage the skill inflicts has no bearing at this point. Ultimates scale off the larger of your pools.

Champion Points
Champion points (blue ones anyway) can buff your damage. and (red ones) mitigate damage recieved. These buff or mitigate based on the type of damage. elemental, physical, magical, posion, disease.

it gets complex because some classes are not optimized. A stamina night blade has stamina skills like surprise attack that do physical damage. but a stamina dragon knight's unstable flame does elemental damage. yet both are considered physical attacks because they use stamina. likewise the nightblade's ultimate will be magical damage, and the dragon knights dragon leap is physical damage. also on a DK a magicka based skill like stone fist will actually do physical damage even though its a spell. And what happens in short is high Champion points tend to therefore favor certain classes and builds that are optimized (all their skills do physical damage its easier to buff all skills with one CP investment)

Edit:
in terms of magicka/spells and penetration. There is spell penetration and physical penetration, because there is spell and physical resistances. Any ability that uses magicka is a spell attack, any ability that uses stamina is a physical attack. once again its what you use to cast the ability that matters here (This is where i am uncertain, someone more knowledgeable should probably step in about now).

so to improve my spell penetration i want to use the likes of "nirn honed" and debuff with "Major Breach", which reduces Spell Resistance.

so if we now go back to my example stone fist is doing physical damage but it is a spell and spell resistance mattersl. And unstable flame is actually a physical attack (dont ask me how) that does elemental damage.

this is why it is important to know the difference between resistance. and damage reduction in the champion point trees. where physical resistance (eg medium armour focus) would reduce the damage taken by the unstable flame, its elemental damage reduction (elemental defender) champion point that can mitigate the damage further.

TL;DR a spell is cast with magicka, a physical attack with stamina. in terms of resistance and penetration it is what is used to cast the attack that matters irrespective of the type of damage done.

danno8

The reason it is confusing is that when the game launched, anything that was a Heavy Attack, Light Attack or came from the weapon skill lines was considered a "Weapon Attack" and scaled off of Weapon Damage.

This was confusing since Resto and Destro Staves and their skills used weapon damage when thematically they were clearly spells and should have scaled from Spell Damage.

So ZoS has tried to shoehorn in the new system that @willymchilybily has described above, but that of course has lead to the strangeness that you describe.

So, yah a warrior who flexes his muscles really hard (using his Stamina) can apparently shoot fire from his mouth (Burning Breath) or surround themselves in lightning (Thundering Presence), or call for an Aedric spear to jab his foes with (Biting Jabs), or suck the power from their enemies blood (Power Extraction).

From a thematic angle, the game is really broken. The bottom line is the developers didn't think through the combat system well enough before implementing it.

Anilahation

Dk unstable flame.

cost stamina

does fire damage.

Anhedonie

teladoy wrote: »

Why some skills that need magicka do physical damage?

Is there any stamina skills that does spell damage?

If I concentrate in power up my magicka pool, to do more spell damage, that goes through spell resistance, why, WHY THEY DO PHYSICAL DAMAGE????

Should I improve my physical armor penetration or what?

Someone explain me this illogical procedure.

and by the way... would be too much work for any of zinemax to give us an official explaination of all the attributes/ stats that are in the game, even those that we CAN'T see in the character profile. And explain also why some tooltips are not updated, why if I have more magicka my spell power don't change, but my skills they do... why this and why that?

Please we want a list all ALL the stats, with description, and everything well explained, like armor penetration, spell penetration, all weapon enchant attibutes and what they do... because I could find all this in internet, but most are not updated are theoretical conjectures and who knows if it is the true, because the true can come from only one source, someone of zinemax.

Thank you.

Some stuff like Camo Hunter deals magic damage despite scaling off of stamina. That's mostly to avoid oneshots (not really, bc you still can oneshot people with it).

Fellenore_Ewalion

You have a DK, right?

Stone fist does Physical dmg instead of spell dmg.

As now I'm running a stamina DK, I agree.

Easy fix, ZOS.

Fellenore_Ewalion

On a second thought, this might come handy if we could hone viable mixed builds, I'd love that.

All the same, this problem is a very minor one

willymchilybily

Fellenore_Ewalion wrote: »

You have a DK, right?

Stone fist does Physical dmg instead of spell dmg.

As now I'm running a stamina DK, I agree.

Easy fix, ZOS.

This i believe is misleading and boarder line incorrect. There is no damage type known as spell. Stone fist does physical damage instead of Magic damage, or elemental damage, or any other damage type you fancy. but it is still a spell it still scales with spell damage, (still hits harder with spell penetration and is resisted with spell resistance. it just does physical damage)

what ZOS should have done is created a better naming structure. physical damage should be renamed. because its very misleading whilst they talk about physical resistance and spell resistance.

teladoy

JoseDelgadoCub17_ESO wrote: »

Dk unstable flame.

cost stamina

does fire damage.

Ok and fire damage goes through magick resist? Armor resist? Or only fire resistance?

@Fellenore_Ewalion

Yes i have a magick DK and is frustrating how bad is everything, because skills use magicka but do physical, fire, or flame dmg... No one knows

catalyst10e

Fellenore_Ewalion wrote: »

You have a DK, right?

Stone fist does Physical dmg instead of spell dmg.

As now I'm running a stamina DK, I agree.

Easy fix, ZOS.

I could have sworn in the patch notes for the TG update it stated Stone fist was on their list to be switched to magic damage instead of physical, So I think this is happening.

templesus

willymchilybily wrote: »

damage scaling is down to 2 factors (if we simplify)

Resource Pool
an ability uses magicka or stamina to cast. Its damage will scale with the size of the pool. Stamina skills also scale with weapon damage, and magicka also scale with spell damage. the type of damage the skill inflicts has no bearing at this point. Ultimates scale off the larger of your pools.

Champion Points
Champion points (blue ones anyway) can buff your damage. and (red ones) mitigate damage recieved. These buff or mitigate based on the type of damage. elemental, physical, magical, posion, disease.

it gets complex because some classes are not optimized. A stamina night blade has stamina skills like surprise attack that do physical damage. but a stamina dragon knight's unstable flame does elemental damage. yet both are considered physical attacks because they use stamina. likewise the nightblade's ultimate will be magical damage, and the dragon knights dragon leap is physical damage. also on a DK a magicka based skill like stone fist will actually do physical damage even though its a spell. And what happens in short is high Champion points tend to therefore favor certain classes and builds that are optimized (all their skills do physical damage its easier to buff all skills with one CP investment)

Edit:
in terms of magicka/spells and penetration. There is spell penetration and physical penetration, because there is spell and physical resistances. Any ability that uses magicka is a spell attack, any ability that uses stamina is a physical attack. once again its what you use to cast the ability that matters here (This is where i am uncertain, someone more knowledgeable should probably step in about now).

so to improve my spell penetration i want to use the likes of "nirn honed" and debuff with "Major Breach", which reduces Spell Resistance.

so if we now go back to my example stone fist is doing physical damage but it is a spell and spell resistance mattersl. And unstable flame is actually a physical attack (dont ask me how) that does elemental damage.

this is why it is important to know the difference between resistance. and damage reduction in the champion point trees. where physical resistance (eg medium armour focus) would reduce the damage taken by the unstable flame, its elemental damage reduction (elemental defender) champion point that can mitigate the damage further.

TL;DR a spell is cast with magicka, a physical attack with stamina. in terms of resistance and penetration it is what is used to cast the attack that matters irrespective of the type of damage done.

Not killers blade, uses stamina does magic damage

cyx54tc

so.......nobody mentioned fighter's guild's skill line actually does magic damage???

Refuse2GrowUp

For what it is worth, ZOS made two claims in a recent ESO Live that might make ya happy:

1: They know stam did not get much love this update (Thieves Guild), but they will give stamina its due diligence in the next update (Dark Brotherhood)

2: For Stam DKs specifically, they are considering giving stam morphs a poison damage type vice flame so that a) stam DKs retain some class identity and feel, and b) poison will scale off mighty (where as flame scales off elemental dmg) so that the passives will synergize better with a stamina/wpn dmg build.

Fellenore_Ewalion

cyx54tc wrote: »

so.......nobody mentioned fighter's guild's skill line actually does magic damage???

Those with Physical dmg in their tooltip as well?

Fellenore_Ewalion

teladoy wrote: »

JoseDelgadoCub17_ESO wrote: »

Ok and fire damage goes through magick resist? Armor resist? Or only fire resistance?

@Fellenore_Ewalion

Yes i have a magick DK and is frustrating how bad is everything, because skills use magicka but do physical, fire, or flame dmg... No one knows

Fire damage goes through magicka resist, but if specifically the fire resistance is raised for whatever reason, it blocks the fire damage in addition.

Acsvf

teladoy wrote: »

why if I have more magicka my spell power don't change, but my skills they do... why this and why that?

Have you ever looked at a stamina morph? "this ability now scales off stamina and weapon damage" Yes, they mean it when they say that and the opposite is true for stamina.
Magicka doesn't effect spell power. Skills scale off both, however.

teladoy

Fellenore_Ewalion wrote: »

teladoy wrote: »

JoseDelgadoCub17_ESO wrote: »

Ok and fire damage goes through magick resist? Armor resist? Or only fire resistance?

@Fellenore_Ewalion

Yes i have a magick DK and is frustrating how bad is everything, because skills use magicka but do physical, fire, or flame dmg... No one knows

Fire damage goes through magicka resist, but if specifically the fire resistance is raised for whatever reason, it blocks the fire damage in addition.

Ok so how to understand this? If I'm a DK most of my skills do fire or physical damage, I think in 2.3.0 they will change everything to Flame and still physical damage... but the question is: Is a class that uses elemental skills in disadvantge compared with some other class that does pure magic or stamina damage?

I don't see this very clear and well planed by zinemax, I think this game needs a lot more of patchs in the furture...

Fellenore_Ewalion

teladoy wrote: »

Fellenore_Ewalion wrote: »

teladoy wrote: »

JoseDelgadoCub17_ESO wrote: »

Ok and fire damage goes through magick resist? Armor resist? Or only fire resistance?

@Fellenore_Ewalion

Yes i have a magick DK and is frustrating how bad is everything, because skills use magicka but do physical, fire, or flame dmg... No one knows

Fire damage goes through magicka resist, but if specifically the fire resistance is raised for whatever reason, it blocks the fire damage in addition.

Ok so how to understand this? If I'm a DK most of my skills do fire or physical damage, I think in 2.3.0 they will change everything to Flame and still physical damage... but the question is: Is a class that uses elemental skills in disadvantge compared with some other class that does pure magic or stamina damage?

I don't see this very clear and well planed by zinemax, I think this game needs a lot more of patchs in the furture...

Well it depends.

Altmer have elemental mastery, and Dunmer have fire expertise as racial passives. A Dunmer with a sun set can build up +12% flame damage, whereas noone can do that with general spell damage.

Stuff CPs for elemental mastery with your magicka DK, and be careful picking up skills and that's gonna be alright.