How many players were lost due to the IC update?

ACHILLES 343i

This is an honest question that has been bugging me. I played on Xbox and PC, and knew a lot of friends who quit playing due to this update. I actually haven't touched ESO since a week or so after IC update. The no stam regen while blocking castrated my PvE tank build, and the 50% damage reduce in cyrodiil did the same to my Nightblade.

Lastly, the huge distraction known as the Imperial City smack dab in the middle of the Cyrodiil conflict didn't help matters.

Are you guys ever going to undo some of this stuff, because I haven't played in months because of it.

MikeB

Reversing the changes would require good decisions and people that know what they're doing. So, don't hold your breath.

imredneckson

ACHILLES 343i wrote: »

This is an honest question that has been bugging me. I played on Xbox and PC, and knew a lot of friends who quit playing due to this update. I actually haven't touched ESO since a week or so after IC update. The no stam regen while blocking castrated my PvE tank build, and the 50% damage reduce in cyrodiil did the same to my Nightblade.

Lastly, the huge distraction known as the Imperial City smack dab in the middle of the Cyrodiil conflict didn't help matters.

Are you guys ever going to undo some of this stuff, because I haven't played in months because of it.

Sorry to say they're more than likely not going to change back perma blocking and the 50% damage. I've had to swap to a Stam DK thanks to the IC patch I wish I could go back to my magicka DK.

daemonios

If your tank was ruined by that change, I'd say you weren't tanking very well to begin with... I'm not the best tank out there - made mine out of necessity because finding tanks for dungeons always takes longer than any other role - and I'm happily tanking all PvE content. Have you tried it recently? If you don't block ALL the time it's perfectly manageable with a couple of stamina pots for longer fights. Even easier if you have a templar in the group throwing you a spear from time to time.

Nifty2g

32

Sausage

IC was success, you cant say same about the Orsinium, I checked VMSA leaderboards last night and there was only 40 names.

leepalmer95

The TTK in pvp hasn't really changed sure in the beginning people were hitting like wet noodles but once they upgraded gear to v16 and realised v16 jewellery sets exist which can add about 650 unbuffed dmg and people hitting 40k of a dmg stat then all that changed was healing and shields.

People lost 30% dmg through battle spirit then gained 30% through upgrading gear.

aLi3nZ

Both ic and orsininum were great expansions imo. I'm Always keen for more areas and content. I've spent more time in ic then anywhere else. I have the chance to pvp and get into duels without the terrible cyrodil lag. Ic gives me enough gear and trophies to sell to get rank 1 of two top end trading guilds at the same time. Orsininum gave me malestrom arena, more areas to explore and awesome tea that mixes regen with 5k added health for maximum sustain. I haven't really bothered with questing there but I am working towards more champ points and better gear so I can pass vMA. I can't believe the main event in ic, the center Molag bal fight is broken most of the time though.

Magdalina

Sausage wrote: »

IC was success, you cant say same about the Orsinium, I checked VMSA leaderboards last night and there was only 40 names.

Actually Wrothgar seems extremely popular among the solo questing population, which seems to be rather large here. Granted most of them don't go for (v)MSA but they enjoyed that questing at least.

That said even though I don't really PvP I majorly prefer IC. At least mobs there don't die from a stern look. IC definitely needs some changes like an incentive to actually do it other than TV and trophies(because those are obviously not enough and they also don't do anything to encourage the actual PvP) though.

UrQuan

daemonios wrote: »

If your tank was ruined by that change, I'd say you weren't tanking very well to begin with... I'm not the best tank out there - made mine out of necessity because finding tanks for dungeons always takes longer than any other role - and I'm happily tanking all PvE content. Have you tried it recently? If you don't block ALL the time it's perfectly manageable with a couple of stamina pots for longer fights. Even easier if you have a templar in the group throwing you a spear from time to time.

^this. The change to stamina regeneration really only made a difference to the tanks who were perma-blocking. There is no PVE content where a tank actually needs to perma-block. I think it took most tanks just a few vet dungeon runs to get used to the change - especially when people started pointing out that you can pop a damage shield and rely on that for a bit to let your stamina regen instead of blocking during that time (as blocking never did anything to mitigate damage taken by a shield anyway). Heck, my Templar tank is vastly more likely to run out of magicka than stamina...

Tandor

Sausage wrote: »

IC was success, you cant say same about the Orsinium, I checked VMSA leaderboards last night and there was only 40 names.

I doubt very much if most players do Orsinium for VMSA.

Sallington

Sausage wrote: »

IC was success, you cant say same about the Orsinium, I checked VMSA leaderboards last night and there was only 40 names.

Orsinium made me cancel my sub. I don't need to pay money for a single player update in an MMO, and I'd rather not support any similar ideas from their dev team.

As far as IC is concerned: they took what could have been an amazing PvP-oriented DLC, but added WAYYYY too much PvE and ruined it.

UrQuan

Sausage wrote: »

IC was success, you cant say same about the Orsinium, I checked VMSA leaderboards last night and there was only 40 names.

This is one of the most hilarious things I've seen posted in quite a while. Orsinium not a success? Seriously? I guess everyone raving about what an awesome zone it is must be lying. I guess every time I go there and see that it's vastly more populated than any other zone my eyes must be playing tricks on me. Especially when I can go through IC and do every daily district quest, and return to base through the sewers without ever seeing more than 1 or 2 other players, but I can't go anywhere in Wrothgar (aside from MSA) without tripping over other players.

But I guess if you're only going to judge whether something is a success based on how many people managed to complete the one piece of content in it that's intended to be by far the hardest solo content in the game, and that only the top 1% of players really has a hope of completing, you're going to end up seeing a completely different picture than reality.

Unsent.Soul

Sallington wrote: »

Sausage wrote: »

IC was success, you cant say same about the Orsinium, I checked VMSA leaderboards last night and there was only 40 names.

Orsinium made me cancel my sub. I don't need to pay money for a single player update in an MMO, and I'd rather not support any similar ideas from their dev team.

As far as IC is concerned: they took what could have been an amazing PvP-oriented DLC, but added WAYYYY too much PvE and ruined it.

Lol... try the world bosses in orsinium solo... let's hear how that goes. Orsinium is a huge win in almost every aspect. Great for farming max lvl materials, world bosses that feel like dungeon bosses (was needed) good public dungeons, and much more.

Do what you want and this is your opinion but saying orsinium is solo content is somewhat wrong, the story is solo but grouping up makes everything else much more enjoyable.

UrQuan

Sallington wrote: »

Orsinium made me cancel my sub. I don't need to pay money for a single player update in an MMO, and I'd rather not support any similar ideas from their dev team.

Yeah, it's not like the world bosses and the world boss daily quest system in Orsinium was designed specifically to encourage group play or anything...

Sallington

UrQuan wrote: »

Sallington wrote: »

Orsinium made me cancel my sub. I don't need to pay money for a single player update in an MMO, and I'd rather not support any similar ideas from their dev team.

Yeah, it's not like the world bosses and the world boss daily quest system in Orsinium was designed specifically to encourage group play or anything...

Unsent.Soul wrote: »

Sallington wrote: »

Sausage wrote: »

IC was success, you cant say same about the Orsinium, I checked VMSA leaderboards last night and there was only 40 names.

Orsinium made me cancel my sub. I don't need to pay money for a single player update in an MMO, and I'd rather not support any similar ideas from their dev team.

As far as IC is concerned: they took what could have been an amazing PvP-oriented DLC, but added WAYYYY too much PvE and ruined it.

Lol... try the world bosses in orsinium solo... let's hear how that goes. Orsinium is a huge win in almost every aspect. Great for farming max lvl materials, world bosses that feel like dungeon bosses (was needed) good public dungeons, and much more.

Do what you want and this is your opinion but saying orsinium is solo content is somewhat wrong, the story is solo but grouping up makes everything else much more enjoyable.

Yeah, yeah, I know about the world bosses. I killed them all a bunch of times and got bored of it. Solo'd the public dungeons.

The only end-game PvE content right now is a SOLO arena that I have no interest in. I know it's my opinion, but if there's no group/guild oriented PvE content, then PvE does not interest me.

Acrolas

They're two completely different game packs. You can love both, neither, or one. All valid opinions.

I'm just glad there's no relic hunter quest line in IC. Tired of camping district shards? Here's 14 more places guaranteed to get you gank traffic.

Didgerion

ACHILLES 343i wrote: »

This is an honest question that has been bugging me. I played on Xbox and PC, and knew a lot of friends who quit playing due to this update. I actually haven't touched ESO since a week or so after IC update. The no stam regen while blocking castrated my PvE tank build, and the 50% damage reduce in cyrodiil did the same to my Nightblade.

Lastly, the huge distraction known as the Imperial City smack dab in the middle of the Cyrodiil conflict didn't help matters.

Are you guys ever going to undo some of this stuff, because I haven't played in months because of it.

They will not undo things - expect further nerfs such as blocking will de-generate stamina and even more damage reduction in cyrodiil.

Just think about it they constantly add new gear sets which make more OP builds and the next champion system unlock will create even more OP builds etc. They have to adjust numbers or otherwise everything will be one shot-able or too survivable.

I don't mind the changes it is always fun to find new builds that work.
But what I really mind is gear grinding and mats grinding. I just want to have fun with the game - not continuously grind for things - I don't have time for that.
And that's my friend why many players'd left the game - they don't have time for boring grinding.

Kryank

leepalmer95 wrote: »

The TTK in pvp hasn't really changed sure in the beginning people were hitting like wet noodles but once they upgraded gear to v16 and realised v16 jewellery sets exist which can add about 650 unbuffed dmg and people hitting 40k of a dmg stat then all that changed was healing and shields.

People lost 30% dmg through battle spirit then gained 30% through upgrading gear.

^^ this^^
Through out the life of an MMO there will be changes and when level caps increases and new gear progressions come in people always cry doom and gloom after the update, if you would have stayed around like the rest of us and learned to adapt then you would have realised that things aren't that bad.

You can still be more or less 1 shot by NB, or even worst DK with a bow heavy attack hitting for over 20k in pvp. There are still tank builds out there in PvP that make players almost unkillable and Socerers can still be a real handful.

Long and short of it still the same as ever just with different gear.

Artjuh90

UrQuan wrote: »

daemonios wrote: »

If your tank was ruined by that change, I'd say you weren't tanking very well to begin with... I'm not the best tank out there - made mine out of necessity because finding tanks for dungeons always takes longer than any other role - and I'm happily tanking all PvE content. Have you tried it recently? If you don't block ALL the time it's perfectly manageable with a couple of stamina pots for longer fights. Even easier if you have a templar in the group throwing you a spear from time to time.

^this. The change to stamina regeneration really only made a difference to the tanks who were perma-blocking. There is no PVE content where a tank actually needs to perma-block. I think it took most tanks just a few vet dungeon runs to get used to the change - especially when people started pointing out that you can pop a damage shield and rely on that for a bit to let your stamina regen instead of blocking during that time (as blocking never did anything to mitigate damage taken by a shield anyway). Heck, my Templar tank is vastly more likely to run out of magicka than stamina...

even my dk tank runs out of magicka hell alot sooner (and faster) then out of stamina

Heindrich

Seeing as the record daily and weekly sales of any trade guild in EU took place in the 2nd week of IC release, I'd say IC brought back many more old players and brought in many more new players than ragequit cos permablock and permaroll nerf.

TheBull

More were lost with Orsinium. The shine wore real fast.

Sallington

Heindrich wrote: »

Seeing as the record daily and weekly sales of any trade guild in EU took place in the 2nd week of IC release, I'd say IC brought back many more old players and brought in many more new players than ragequit cos permablock and permaroll nerf.

That's because of the useful BoE sets.

Cut to Orsinium, where sales dropped off big time since every single piece of new gear is BoP.

Heindrich

Sallington wrote: »

That's because of the useful BoE sets.

Cut to Orsinium, where sales dropped off big time since every single piece of new gear is BoP.

@Sallington No, of course new stuff to be traded always provides a gold boom, we even had a small boom for Orsinium, but activity levels were generally much higher as well. My guild regularly hit 240 or 250 members online at peak times in the first few weeks of IC. Now it's about 200-220 at peak times cos obviously people are waiting for new content.

Leandor

None, I'd say. Compared to before IC, server is still way more populated, even comparing pre-IC to pre-Wrothgar

Didgerion

Sallington wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

Sallington wrote: »

Orsinium made me cancel my sub. I don't need to pay money for a single player update in an MMO, and I'd rather not support any similar ideas from their dev team.

Yeah, it's not like the world bosses and the world boss daily quest system in Orsinium was designed specifically to encourage group play or anything...

Unsent.Soul wrote: »

Sallington wrote: »

Sausage wrote: »

IC was success, you cant say same about the Orsinium, I checked VMSA leaderboards last night and there was only 40 names.

Orsinium made me cancel my sub. I don't need to pay money for a single player update in an MMO, and I'd rather not support any similar ideas from their dev team.

As far as IC is concerned: they took what could have been an amazing PvP-oriented DLC, but added WAYYYY too much PvE and ruined it.

Lol... try the world bosses in orsinium solo... let's hear how that goes. Orsinium is a huge win in almost every aspect. Great for farming max lvl materials, world bosses that feel like dungeon bosses (was needed) good public dungeons, and much more.

Do what you want and this is your opinion but saying orsinium is solo content is somewhat wrong, the story is solo but grouping up makes everything else much more enjoyable.

Yeah, yeah, I know about the world bosses. I killed them all a bunch of times and got bored of it. Solo'd the public dungeons.

The only end-game PvE content right now is a SOLO arena that I have no interest in. I know it's my opinion, but if there's no group/guild oriented PvE content, then PvE does not interest me.

There should be no such thing as PvE end game content. It is a wrong old-school design.
Now they fixed it partially by adding level scaling. All they have to do now is it to make gear level upgrade-able and people will stop rushing to VR16 cap but will enjoy all PVE content instead.

Now players shortcut all pve content and whine for end game content (akaVR16 content that brings VR16 gear).

JD2013

42!

Oh, no. Wait. That's a different thing.

Carry on!

Kryank

JD2013 wrote: »

42!

Oh, no. Wait. That's a different thing.

Carry on!

Haha I so nearly put that earlier too! Good taste my little space whale!

OdinForge

IC was a failure for me, and a turning point in my desire to PvP in this game with the same motivation I used to have.

Sallington

avid_mdb16_ESO wrote: »

Sallington wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

Sallington wrote: »

Orsinium made me cancel my sub. I don't need to pay money for a single player update in an MMO, and I'd rather not support any similar ideas from their dev team.

Yeah, it's not like the world bosses and the world boss daily quest system in Orsinium was designed specifically to encourage group play or anything...

Unsent.Soul wrote: »

Sallington wrote: »

Sausage wrote: »

IC was success, you cant say same about the Orsinium, I checked VMSA leaderboards last night and there was only 40 names.

Orsinium made me cancel my sub. I don't need to pay money for a single player update in an MMO, and I'd rather not support any similar ideas from their dev team.

As far as IC is concerned: they took what could have been an amazing PvP-oriented DLC, but added WAYYYY too much PvE and ruined it.

Lol... try the world bosses in orsinium solo... let's hear how that goes. Orsinium is a huge win in almost every aspect. Great for farming max lvl materials, world bosses that feel like dungeon bosses (was needed) good public dungeons, and much more.

Do what you want and this is your opinion but saying orsinium is solo content is somewhat wrong, the story is solo but grouping up makes everything else much more enjoyable.

Yeah, yeah, I know about the world bosses. I killed them all a bunch of times and got bored of it. Solo'd the public dungeons.

The only end-game PvE content right now is a SOLO arena that I have no interest in. I know it's my opinion, but if there's no group/guild oriented PvE content, then PvE does not interest me.

There should be no such thing as PvE end game content. It is a wrong old-school design.
Now they fixed it partially by adding level scaling. All they have to do now is it to make gear level upgrade-able and people will stop rushing to VR16 cap but will enjoy all PVE content instead.

Now players shortcut all pve content and whine for end game content (akaVR16 content that brings VR16 gear).

That's a great way for your long-time players to get extremely bored, extremely quickly once they finish all of the under-VR16 content. If you've been playing for a couple months, sure there's plenty to do for you now.

How is having repeatable PvE content that you can progress through as a guild a wrong design? Your logic is basically "we don't need end-game content because there's already non end-game content." That doesn't make any sense.

UrQuan

JD2013 wrote: »

42!

Oh, no. Wait. That's a different thing.

Carry on!

That's always my default answer to everything. Since I started working in data analysis I've had to self-moderate and really cut back on using it