Hybrid builds should be possible. Here's how they could be implemented.

Azurephoenix999

All the time, we see enemies in the game using vast combinations of swords and spells, yet if we try to make a build using both we fall behind and end up becoming useless at pretty much anything endgame. I believe that this is something that should be changed. Obviously, core mechanics should remain the same. Spell effectiveness should scale off max magicka, Weapon effectiveness should scale off of max stamina, and attribute points should still function as they always have. I have a way that hybrid builds could become viable without changing any of this.

As for how it could work...maybe a passive that boosts the damage of both spells and weapons based on how close together their max stamina and magicka are? That means that by dividing their attribute points evenly, they'd end up with relatively okay reserves of each attribute, but each of their attacks would do the same amount of damage as if they'd focused all their attribute points into one stat.

Here's an example (numbers used as examples only, not accurate):

Here are three players: A, B, and C.

A is a mage and has invested all of his attribute points in Magicka. His spells do approx. 100 damage each hit.

B is a swordsman and has invested all of his attribute points in Stamina. His weapon abilities do approx. 100 damage each hit.

C is a hybrid of the two and has split his attribute points evenly between Magicka and stamina. Normally, his weapon and spell abilities would do 50 damage on each hit, but as his magicka and stamina are even, the passive boosts the power of both so that his weapon abilities and spells do 100 damage each hit.

Should C's magicka or stamina cease to be even, the passive will get less effective the further apart they are, limiting their potential to boost spells or abilities above 100 damage by focusing their attribute points into one of the stats.

As long as C's magicka and stamina remain even, both his weapon damage and spell damage will benefit.

Advantages to hybrid build in this scenario:

• Increased variety in viable abilities.
• Won't be forced to sacrifice spells or weapon damage to become half-decent at the other.

Disadvantages to hybrid build in this scenario:

• Less Magicka/Stamina reserves, so won't be able to use abilities as often as those who choose to specialise in one of the two.
• Stamina and Magicka must remain in perfect balance for the passive to be at its most effective.

This whole post is just a suggestion. Tell me what you guys think.

Spearshard

My stamplar utilizes both already. I slot reflective light and blazing spear (mostly just to get more dot's to proc skoria), but it does add a bit more dps. Hybrids used to be more prevalent before the removal of soft caps. Now, if you don't stack weapon dmg or spell dmg you fall too far behind. It's a shame really.

Azurephoenix999

Spearshard wrote: »

My stamplar utilizes both already. I slot reflective light and blazing spear (mostly just to get more dot's to proc skoria), but it does add a bit more dps. Hybrids used to be more prevalent before the removal of soft caps. Now, if you don't stack weapon dmg or spell dmg you fall too far behind. It's a shame really.

I thought this would be a good way of making viable hybrid builds.

danno8

You know that Balanced Warrior passive? Do something with that.

Like "Gain bonus weapon damage and spell damage when Max Magicka and Max Stamina are balanced"

Numbers and ranges open to discussion.

Azurephoenix999

danno8 wrote: »

You know that Balanced Warrior passive? Do something with that.

Like "Gain bonus weapon damage and spell damage when Max Magicka and Max Stamina are balanced"

Numbers and ranges open to discussion.

You mean the passive I talked about could replace Balanced Warrior (but keep the name)? I could see that.

Lynnessa

imo, all classes have thematic elements that suggest they should be able to function as stam/magicka hybrids... something which was possible in all other ES games.

The current system is in place for a reason though, and as much as I lament the loss of pre-1.6 builds, I do understand that the current all-or-nothing approach to character stats is 1) easier to balance and 2) easier for players (particularly casual players or players who don't enjoy spreadsheets and math) to implement when it comes to designing their character to perform a certain role

kkampaseb17_ESO

Azurephoenix999 wrote: »

Think about what Templars are. They're holy knights. They're the guys in the old days that would run around with swords and shields, doing random sh*t in the name of the lord.

Now think about how they've been portrayed in fantasy games like ESO. Users of heavenly magic, able to bring the wrath of the gods down on their opponents.

They're essentially supposed to be spellblades, and I think that at least one of their three skill lines should've focused on this. Equally focusing on magicka and stamina, these guys would use both weapons and spells in combat.

As for how it could work...maybe a passive that boosts the damage of both spells and weapons based on how close together their max stamina and magicka are? That means that by dividing their attribute points evenly, they'd end up with relatively okay reserves of each attribute, but each of their attacks would do the same amount of damage as if they'd focused all their attribute points into one stat.

Here's an example (numbers used as examples only, not accurate):

Here are three players: A, B, and C.

A is a mage and has invested all of his attribute points in Magicka. His spells do approx. 100 damage each hit.

B is a swordsman and has invested all of his attribute points in Stamina. His weapon abilities do approx. 100 damage each hit.

C is a hybrid of the two and has split his attribute points evenly between Magicka and stamina. Normally, his weapon and spell abilities would do 50 damage on each hit, but as his magicka and stamina are even, the passive boosts the power of both so that his weapon abilities and spells do 100 damage each hit.

Should C's magicka or stamina cease to be even, the passive will get less effective the further apart they are, limiting their potential to boost spells or abilities above 100 damage by focusing their attribute points into one of the stats.

As long as C's magicka and stamina remain even, both his weapon damage and spell damage will benefit.

Advantages to hybrid build in this scenario:

• Increased variety in viable abilities.
• Won't be forced to sacrifice spells or weapon damage to become half-decent at the other.

Disadvantages to hybrid build in this scenario:

• Less Magicka/Stamina reserves, so won't be able to use abilities as often as those who choose to specialise in one of the two.
• Stamina and Magicka must remain in perfect balance for the passive to be at its most effective.

This whole post is just a suggestion. Tell me what you guys think.

I agree with your assessment that there should be hybrid classes. I 100% disagree that a templar should be it. A spellblade doesn't use divine magic. He uses elemental magic....aka Sorcerer or Dragonknight. If you want to talk about paladins fine...but don't mix a spellblade or bladesinger or swordsage with divine ***....

Azurephoenix999

kkampaseb17_ESO wrote: »

Azurephoenix999 wrote: »

Think about what Templars are. They're holy knights. They're the guys in the old days that would run around with swords and shields, doing random sh*t in the name of the lord.

Now think about how they've been portrayed in fantasy games like ESO. Users of heavenly magic, able to bring the wrath of the gods down on their opponents.

They're essentially supposed to be spellblades, and I think that at least one of their three skill lines should've focused on this. Equally focusing on magicka and stamina, these guys would use both weapons and spells in combat.

As for how it could work...maybe a passive that boosts the damage of both spells and weapons based on how close together their max stamina and magicka are? That means that by dividing their attribute points evenly, they'd end up with relatively okay reserves of each attribute, but each of their attacks would do the same amount of damage as if they'd focused all their attribute points into one stat.

Here's an example (numbers used as examples only, not accurate):

Here are three players: A, B, and C.

A is a mage and has invested all of his attribute points in Magicka. His spells do approx. 100 damage each hit.

B is a swordsman and has invested all of his attribute points in Stamina. His weapon abilities do approx. 100 damage each hit.

C is a hybrid of the two and has split his attribute points evenly between Magicka and stamina. Normally, his weapon and spell abilities would do 50 damage on each hit, but as his magicka and stamina are even, the passive boosts the power of both so that his weapon abilities and spells do 100 damage each hit.

Should C's magicka or stamina cease to be even, the passive will get less effective the further apart they are, limiting their potential to boost spells or abilities above 100 damage by focusing their attribute points into one of the stats.

As long as C's magicka and stamina remain even, both his weapon damage and spell damage will benefit.

Advantages to hybrid build in this scenario:

• Increased variety in viable abilities.
• Won't be forced to sacrifice spells or weapon damage to become half-decent at the other.

Disadvantages to hybrid build in this scenario:

• Less Magicka/Stamina reserves, so won't be able to use abilities as often as those who choose to specialise in one of the two.
• Stamina and Magicka must remain in perfect balance for the passive to be at its most effective.

This whole post is just a suggestion. Tell me what you guys think.

I agree with your assessment that there should be hybrid classes. I 100% disagree that a templar should be it. A spellblade doesn't use divine magic. He uses elemental magic....aka Sorcerer or Dragonknight. If you want to talk about paladins fine...but don't mix a spellblade or bladesinger or swordsage with divine ***....

Yeah, fine. So I called it the wrong thing, so what? All classes should be capable of hybrid builds, this is mostly a suggestion of how it could be done.

Callous2208

I just want them to do something with Templar besides bouncing between the occasional odd nerf and completely ignoring them.

Azurephoenix999

kkampaseb17_ESO wrote: »

Azurephoenix999 wrote: »

Think about what Templars are. They're holy knights. They're the guys in the old days that would run around with swords and shields, doing random sh*t in the name of the lord.

Now think about how they've been portrayed in fantasy games like ESO. Users of heavenly magic, able to bring the wrath of the gods down on their opponents.

They're essentially supposed to be spellblades, and I think that at least one of their three skill lines should've focused on this. Equally focusing on magicka and stamina, these guys would use both weapons and spells in combat.

As for how it could work...maybe a passive that boosts the damage of both spells and weapons based on how close together their max stamina and magicka are? That means that by dividing their attribute points evenly, they'd end up with relatively okay reserves of each attribute, but each of their attacks would do the same amount of damage as if they'd focused all their attribute points into one stat.

Here's an example (numbers used as examples only, not accurate):

Here are three players: A, B, and C.

A is a mage and has invested all of his attribute points in Magicka. His spells do approx. 100 damage each hit.

B is a swordsman and has invested all of his attribute points in Stamina. His weapon abilities do approx. 100 damage each hit.

C is a hybrid of the two and has split his attribute points evenly between Magicka and stamina. Normally, his weapon and spell abilities would do 50 damage on each hit, but as his magicka and stamina are even, the passive boosts the power of both so that his weapon abilities and spells do 100 damage each hit.

Should C's magicka or stamina cease to be even, the passive will get less effective the further apart they are, limiting their potential to boost spells or abilities above 100 damage by focusing their attribute points into one of the stats.

As long as C's magicka and stamina remain even, both his weapon damage and spell damage will benefit.

Advantages to hybrid build in this scenario:

• Increased variety in viable abilities.
• Won't be forced to sacrifice spells or weapon damage to become half-decent at the other.

Disadvantages to hybrid build in this scenario:

• Less Magicka/Stamina reserves, so won't be able to use abilities as often as those who choose to specialise in one of the two.
• Stamina and Magicka must remain in perfect balance for the passive to be at its most effective.

This whole post is just a suggestion. Tell me what you guys think.

I agree with your assessment that there should be hybrid classes. I 100% disagree that a templar should be it. A spellblade doesn't use divine magic. He uses elemental magic....aka Sorcerer or Dragonknight. If you want to talk about paladins fine...but don't mix a spellblade or bladesinger or swordsage with divine ***....

There we go, I changed it. Happy?

Brrrofski

Thing is, imagine how many powerful skills people would have to utilise.

It might be a bit too much.

laksikus

against hybrids.
imagine a hybrid sorc: WB-WB-WB-frag procs-WB-Wb

LadyNalcarya

Brrrofski wrote: »

Thing is, imagine how many powerful skills people would have to utilise.

It might be a bit too much.

Yeah, getting all advantages from both stamina and magicka would create stupidly op combos.
And it doesnt make much sense tbh. Imo being able to do everything at once is just as stupid as being archmage-grey fox-battle master-savior of the world-Sheogorath and listener of dark brotherhood in single-player ES games.

Azurephoenix999

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Brrrofski wrote: »

Thing is, imagine how many powerful skills people would have to utilise.

It might be a bit too much.

Yeah, getting all advantages from both stamina and magicka would create stupidly op combos.
And it doesnt make much sense tbh. Imo being able to do everything at once is just as stupid as being archmage-grey fox-battle master-savior of the world-Sheogorath and listener of dark brotherhood in single-player ES games.

Hey, we already have regular enemies that can use both spells and weapons. What about those guys that can summon lightning by smacking their battleaxes into the ground?

LadyNalcarya

Azurephoenix999 wrote: »

KoshkaMurka wrote: »

Brrrofski wrote: »

Thing is, imagine how many powerful skills people would have to utilise.

It might be a bit too much.

Yeah, getting all advantages from both stamina and magicka would create stupidly op combos.
And it doesnt make much sense tbh. Imo being able to do everything at once is just as stupid as being archmage-grey fox-battle master-savior of the world-Sheogorath and listener of dark brotherhood in single-player ES games.

Hey, we already have regular enemies that can use both spells and weapons. What about those guys that can summon lightning by smacking their battleaxes into the ground?

There are some "magical" abilities that scale off stamina. Dk's fire breath or sorc lightning form. So I assume it just stam morphs

LadyNalcarya

Also, if hybrids could use all the best abilities from both magicka and stamina, pure magicka and stamina builds would be useless.

Emma_Overload

I welcome ANY solution to make hybrid builds viable.... as long is it doesn't involve bringing back soft caps!

UltimaJoe777

Some people define something as useless when it cannot do a speed run aka take something down super fast but is still able to hold its own so it really depends on what you mean by "useless". Sometimes you just need to find the right setup to get by. Personally I find hybrid play isn't so bad, and I have a few hybrid alts myself. Got a hybrid DK that was able to complete the Fighter's Guild questline at Lv20 in fact!