What's wrong with Vet Levels? Really?

Robbmrp

Before Champion Points, there wasn't anything wrong with Vet Levels. IMO there still isn't. This is a MMO, your supposed to increase levels with future DLC's. That's pretty standard in any MMO.

That being said, with the addition of Champion Points, they could easily remove the Vet Levels or change them to 65 or 70 max. Once you hit that, you only earn CP. There's no reason for both Levels and Champion Points in future DLC's.

Saint314Louis1985

zornyan wrote: »

What's exp like in wrothgar? Currently running one of my alts through silver, and getting bored of doing it the 6th time, she's vr6 atm.

Quests / mobs better exp? Each silver quest is giving me around 20k exp atm average.

Oh and what's the cp mechanic like? At 160, noticeable faster?

I have around 160cp and last night playing for about 6 hours i got about 8 cps or maybe more. Enough for me to lose count lol. That was doing vet daily dungeon runs and normal maelstrom arena. No exp boost or anything.

willymchilybily

From my point of view the only issue I see for increasing veteran ranks is the daunting task of reaching max level for new players could put some off. Wasn't it originally v10 on pc when introduced? And slowly they have added 2 more veteran ranks each time. If this doesn't change it will discourage alt creation and new players sticking, both important aspects for a games health and longevity

Sublime

DanielWinterborn wrote: »

k2blader wrote: »

Vet levels are fine IF you don't care about PvP.

If all you want to do is quest, craft, buy-n-sell, explore PvE land, etc., I don't think vet leveling would bother you much.

Unfortunately Zeni added the faulty CP system to the game which adds additional reason to have to grind through PvE content regardless of the fact that some aren't interested in grinding PvE content.

To you sir i say : LOL

This is why: I only play mmorpg games for PVP, i did listened to the story until i got to Silver but then i just went all out level up skip stuff run around grind all day. I tell you as a veteran pvp-er i do welcome Vet levels and i do welcome CP system just to weed out little boys out of the big guy leagues. You want power?? GET IT! Don't complain about not having it for free, work for it! You hate vet and CP? Go join Cyro non-veteran weakling love ya tho :X

(i want to clarify that the "You want power?? GET IT!" does not mean you have to go and make a sorc or a NB, these are the OP (overpowered) classes, yes we need a balance please ty)

Do you like grinding PvE? Because I don't, there would be so many different ways to encourage players to pay for content than forcing them to do regular chores. Now, I understand that there are players who enjoy this type of progression, but I think there is a way where both opinions get their way.

BTW, Camelot Unchained doesn't have any PvE so it does exist. This however doesn't mean that it's comparable to ESO as it's a completely different game.

Dixa

My only problem with the vet system is the grind.

So many people I have pulled into this game both at launch and now give up in the vr4-vr6 range, because it is just too grindy. turn in two dozen quests and no level. it's a bit much to ask at a time in a characters life when you have no new abilities to look forward to anymore.

Dixa

zornyan wrote: »

JoseDelgadoCub17_ESO wrote: »

Let's be honest people quit when they see how much of a grind veteran ranks are.

that's why they should be removed.

can't tell you how many times I've heard people enjoy the game to 50 then see this huge boring grind and just leave.


I have every class maxed out in WoW,SWTOR,Destiny,borderlands but guess what not a single character in ESO even though I've had this game since launch. So I have the will to level up it's just that ESO level designed is so toxic...

You haven't played a proper mmo.

Anarchy online, eve online, Ultima online, DOAC, ever quest , a realm reborn etc etc.

Most if not all of these games require weeks and months of grinding, anarchy, eve especially take a minimum of 6 months to get near end game, eve can take years to get everything.

Hell even skyrim took me a few weeks to level up to a high level.

You can get to vr 16 in under a week, without grinding. That's hardly a big grind.

Don't ever use destiny as an example, it took 8 odd hours to do the entire story in that, but some people (myself included) spent 3 months repeating the same raid to get to level 30, that's right 3 MONTHS for ONE LEVEL .

Yeah not grindy at all...

I have been playing MUD's and MMORPG's since 1993. I played on and continue to play on the very MUD that Brad McQuaid based Everquest on.

That was then. Today's gamer - and payer - no longer has that kind of patience. Hell that MUD got rid of it's death penalty a few months back as a way to retain players and entice exploration. The death penalty in launch everquest - respawning naked, losing a huge chunk of xp, having to getyour stuff back by a certain time or it's all gone - was created by this MUD 20 years ago, and they have now relented. It was a good change, and took the unnecessary fear out of the game.

That game also has many shortcuts to leveling now. Before it would take real life years to reach level 50. Now, it can be done in a day or two.

The key difference lies in changes to western work culture. In 1999 we worked less for more money. Now due to many economic factors western workers work longer, harder and for less money relative. This means that today, their time has substantially more value than it did in 1999. This is one of the factors that gave rise to and continues to push into profitability the free to play with microtransactions model.

Todays player...no, todays PAYER...simply would not tolerate an EQ or UO. Even Eve is seeing their population decline after over 10 years of a steady but slow rise in overall population.

Yolokin_Swagonborn

Vet levels are a tool for ZOS to steal all of our hard work and make us regrind endgame gear any time they want to launch a new DLC and "motivate" people to buy it by making it the only place to get endgame gear.

That's why all the sets in Orsinium are BOP. Itemization has gone to crap because of this and build diversity has plumeted. There are so many amazing sets we cant use anymore because they are not V16.

Jura23

Dixa wrote: »

My only problem with the vet system is the grind.

So many people I have pulled into this game both at launch and now give up in the vr4-vr6 range, because it is just too grindy. turn in two dozen quests and no level. it's a bit much to ask at a time in a characters life when you have no new abilities to look forward to anymore.

No it's not. 16 v ranks is not grindy. If you think it is, then you have no idea what grind in MMO is. No offense.

Alagras

DanielWinterborn wrote: »

So as the title says, i don't see why people are so upset about Vet levels. This is called evolution, your character evolves, he has a background now, he is evolving with the game and so are you. Don't bash great ideas because you are too lazy to exp, i know is hard as hell to get the levels, i mean i am currently grinding my 2nd char like a machine with member+ambrosia and still takes for ever to get to max level but that's the beauty of it. You put in some work to craft the perfect character, one that has a story, one that has something you can remember. I used to play lineage 2 and even now i remember the days i was a total newb and how long it took me to level my 1st char to max, i was involved in thousands of pvp fights there but the only things i will always rememebr are the times i worked hard to get my levels up.

Bottom line is this : Please add more vet levels, hell add some new General system with Gr16 like stuff or something like that. Just to spite this guys :X love ya tho

well, if it was say 3 times longer, would you still find it cool? probably not, so what is true up to a certain point becomes wrong past it. and this point just isn t the same for all players. it s not just being lazy, it s also about the time you can spend and about the fact leveling alts can be tedious. to me, the first char should be just the way it s now and from 2nd toon there should be faster and funnier leveling.

Uriel_Nocturne

There's nothing at all wrong with Vet Ranks, OP.

My two highest characters are VR6, and both are still in Cadwell's Silver. Every night I log on and happily go Questing.

The people who seem to be the most put-out by the Vet Ranks are the people who want to get to VR16 in the shortest amount of time possible. They can't go from lvl3-VR16 in a day, so they're butt-hurt.

This is an MMO. Questing is part-and-parcel of the genre. I've played many, many, and an absurd amount of MMO's, and I don't know a single one that let's you skip the game and have an Alt Character at max level just so you don't have to go through the story quests again. Not a single one.

This isn't a race. I'm taking my time, and loving my path through the Vet Ranks.

kevlarto_ESO

I think for some people, if they would have kept the leveling curve the same as level 1-50, I doubt there would be much of a problem with vr levels, to some the grind is to much, I really did not have a problem with it as I have played games with a lot more of a grind in the past, I guess it's just what your used to.

Korah_Eaglecry

DanielWinterborn wrote: »

Zhoyzu wrote: »

Because its too *** much xp. i want to play multiple classes and enjoy them but its a pain when i have to spend months just getting to a point where the character can do stuff (pledges, trials, pvp) 400k xp a vet level would be fine since its the same xp for a CP but 850k is still too much of a grind to enjoy more than one character. And running the same quests again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again gets old really fast

Not to be a downer but...i created my 2nd char 3 days ago...he is V4 now, v16 in 4 days i hope....just wanted to say this.

Congrats you power leveled. Now explain how someone not interested in grinding on mobs for hours is supposed to enjoy the game? Oh? What was that they have to do what you did to do that? Oh okay.

Korah_Eaglecry

Uriel_Nocturne wrote: »

There's nothing at all wrong with Vet Ranks, OP.

My two highest characters are VR6, and both are still in Cadwell's Silver. Every night I log on and happily go Questing.

The people who seem to be the most put-out by the Vet Ranks are the people who want to get to VR16 in the shortest amount of time possible. They can't go from lvl3-VR16 in a day, so they're butt-hurt.

This is an MMO. Questing is part-and-parcel of the genre. I've played many, many, and an absurd amount of MMO's, and I don't know a single one that let's you skip the game and have an Alt Character at max level just so you don't have to go through the story quests again. Not a single one.

This isn't a race. I'm taking my time, and loving my path through the Vet Ranks.

Ive leveled 3 characters and always burn out around about VR 2. So by all means tell me that Im in some MAD rush to get to top level.

If you enjoy the grind. Theres CP. There is no need for a rank increase beyond level 50. The story is over. Everything else is just side things you can do so you have a reason to log back in.

The only people defending this absurd extra 16 ranks tacked on are people that already mindlessly grinded to top level (so they could be at top level) because they want to feel like special snowflakes and everyone else to tediously work to get up there with them.

Uriel_Nocturne

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Uriel_Nocturne wrote: »

There's nothing at all wrong with Vet Ranks, OP.

My two highest characters are VR6, and both are still in Cadwell's Silver. Every night I log on and happily go Questing.

The people who seem to be the most put-out by the Vet Ranks are the people who want to get to VR16 in the shortest amount of time possible. They can't go from lvl3-VR16 in a day, so they're butt-hurt.

This is an MMO. Questing is part-and-parcel of the genre. I've played many, many, and an absurd amount of MMO's, and I don't know a single one that let's you skip the game and have an Alt Character at max level just so you don't have to go through the story quests again. Not a single one.

This isn't a race. I'm taking my time, and loving my path through the Vet Ranks.

The only people defending this absurd extra 16 ranks tacked on are people that already mindlessly grinded to top level (so they could be at top level) because they want to feel like special snowflakes and everyone else to tediously work to get up there with them.

All the characters listed in my sig are a refutation to this claim.

DanielWinterborn

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

DanielWinterborn wrote: »

Zhoyzu wrote: »

Because its too *** much xp. i want to play multiple classes and enjoy them but its a pain when i have to spend months just getting to a point where the character can do stuff (pledges, trials, pvp) 400k xp a vet level would be fine since its the same xp for a CP but 850k is still too much of a grind to enjoy more than one character. And running the same quests again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again gets old really fast

Not to be a downer but...i created my 2nd char 3 days ago...he is V4 now, v16 in 4 days i hope....just wanted to say this.

Congrats you power leveled. Now explain how someone not interested in grinding on mobs for hours is supposed to enjoy the game? Oh? What was that they have to do what you did to do that? Oh okay.

Wooow take a break, i can afford to powerlevel my 2nd char after i gone with the 1st char the good old fashioned 2 months way. You can enjoy the game due to great voice acting and story, for the people that don't want neighter: though luck.

TequilaFire

I am just an ordinary snowflake.

Uriel_Nocturne

TequilaFire wrote: »

I am just an ordinary snowflake.

icwutudidthar

Prabooo

JoseDelgadoCub17_ESO wrote: »

Let's be honest people quit when they see how much of a grind veteran ranks are.

that's why they should be removed.

can't tell you how many times I've heard people enjoy the game to 50 then see this huge boring grind and just leave.


I have every class maxed out in WoW,SWTOR,Destiny,borderlands but guess what not a single character in ESO even though I've had this game since launch. So I have the will to level up it's just that ESO level designed is so toxic...

breh... you lazy...

Justice31st

Because the veteran level grinding is way to slow, and doing the same quests for the 8th time is more boring than watching paint dry.

Artemisshrikes

Justice31st wrote: »

Because the veteran level grinding is way to slow, and doing the same quests for the 8th time is more boring than watching paint dry.

so basicly you would rather everything in life be given to you with no effort

Justice31st

Artemisshrikes wrote: »

Justice31st wrote: »

Because the veteran level grinding is way to slow, and doing the same quests for the 8th time is more boring than watching paint dry.

so basicly you would rather everything in life be given to you with no effort

Well, I wouldn't compare playing a game to life.

Artemisshrikes

Justice31st wrote: »

Artemisshrikes wrote: »

Justice31st wrote: »

Because the veteran level grinding is way to slow, and doing the same quests for the 8th time is more boring than watching paint dry.

so basicly you would rather everything in life be given to you with no effort

Well, I wouldn't compare playing a game to life dummy.

life is life, game or not

Justice31st

Artemisshrikes wrote: »

Justice31st wrote: »

Artemisshrikes wrote: »

Justice31st wrote: »

Because the veteran level grinding is way to slow, and doing the same quests for the 8th time is more boring than watching paint dry.

so basicly you would rather everything in life be given to you with no effort

Well, I wouldn't compare playing a game to life dummy.

life is life, game or not

For many of us an MMO is suppose to be an escape from reality, not a second job.

Artemisshrikes

Justice31st wrote: »

Artemisshrikes wrote: »

Justice31st wrote: »

Artemisshrikes wrote: »

Justice31st wrote: »

Because the veteran level grinding is way to slow, and doing the same quests for the 8th time is more boring than watching paint dry.

so basicly you would rather everything in life be given to you with no effort

Well, I wouldn't compare playing a game to life dummy.

life is life, game or not

For many of us an MMO is suppose to be an escape from reality, not a second job.

it would not be fun if everything was just given to us

zornyan

Dixa wrote: »

zornyan wrote: »

JoseDelgadoCub17_ESO wrote: »

Let's be honest people quit when they see how much of a grind veteran ranks are.

that's why they should be removed.

can't tell you how many times I've heard people enjoy the game to 50 then see this huge boring grind and just leave.


I have every class maxed out in WoW,SWTOR,Destiny,borderlands but guess what not a single character in ESO even though I've had this game since launch. So I have the will to level up it's just that ESO level designed is so toxic...

You haven't played a proper mmo.

Anarchy online, eve online, Ultima online, DOAC, ever quest , a realm reborn etc etc.

Most if not all of these games require weeks and months of grinding, anarchy, eve especially take a minimum of 6 months to get near end game, eve can take years to get everything.

Hell even skyrim took me a few weeks to level up to a high level.

You can get to vr 16 in under a week, without grinding. That's hardly a big grind.

Don't ever use destiny as an example, it took 8 odd hours to do the entire story in that, but some people (myself included) spent 3 months repeating the same raid to get to level 30, that's right 3 MONTHS for ONE LEVEL .

Yeah not grindy at all...

I have been playing MUD's and MMORPG's since 1993. I played on and continue to play on the very MUD that Brad McQuaid based Everquest on.

That was then. Today's gamer - and payer - no longer has that kind of patience. Hell that MUD got rid of it's death penalty a few months back as a way to retain players and entice exploration. The death penalty in launch everquest - respawning naked, losing a huge chunk of xp, having to getyour stuff back by a certain time or it's all gone - was created by this MUD 20 years ago, and they have now relented. It was a good change, and took the unnecessary fear out of the game.

That game also has many shortcuts to leveling now. Before it would take real life years to reach level 50. Now, it can be done in a day or two.

The key difference lies in changes to western work culture. In 1999 we worked less for more money. Now due to many economic factors western workers work longer, harder and for less money relative. This means that today, their time has substantially more value than it did in 1999. This is one of the factors that gave rise to and continues to push into profitability the free to play with microtransactions model.

Todays player...no, todays PAYER...simply would not tolerate an EQ or UO. Even Eve is seeing their population decline after over 10 years of a steady but slow rise in overall population.

But as I ans others have said, and has been proven before, vet 1-16 can be done in 2 days, 1 if you actually try really hard. Or less than 5 with a laid back pace.

How's that too long? Giving it to people for free would barely be any better.

Artemisshrikes

zornyan wrote: »

Dixa wrote: »

zornyan wrote: »

JoseDelgadoCub17_ESO wrote: »

Let's be honest people quit when they see how much of a grind veteran ranks are.

that's why they should be removed.

can't tell you how many times I've heard people enjoy the game to 50 then see this huge boring grind and just leave.


I have every class maxed out in WoW,SWTOR,Destiny,borderlands but guess what not a single character in ESO even though I've had this game since launch. So I have the will to level up it's just that ESO level designed is so toxic...

You haven't played a proper mmo.

Anarchy online, eve online, Ultima online, DOAC, ever quest , a realm reborn etc etc.

Most if not all of these games require weeks and months of grinding, anarchy, eve especially take a minimum of 6 months to get near end game, eve can take years to get everything.

Hell even skyrim took me a few weeks to level up to a high level.

You can get to vr 16 in under a week, without grinding. That's hardly a big grind.

Don't ever use destiny as an example, it took 8 odd hours to do the entire story in that, but some people (myself included) spent 3 months repeating the same raid to get to level 30, that's right 3 MONTHS for ONE LEVEL .

Yeah not grindy at all...

I have been playing MUD's and MMORPG's since 1993. I played on and continue to play on the very MUD that Brad McQuaid based Everquest on.

That was then. Today's gamer - and payer - no longer has that kind of patience. Hell that MUD got rid of it's death penalty a few months back as a way to retain players and entice exploration. The death penalty in launch everquest - respawning naked, losing a huge chunk of xp, having to getyour stuff back by a certain time or it's all gone - was created by this MUD 20 years ago, and they have now relented. It was a good change, and took the unnecessary fear out of the game.

That game also has many shortcuts to leveling now. Before it would take real life years to reach level 50. Now, it can be done in a day or two.

The key difference lies in changes to western work culture. In 1999 we worked less for more money. Now due to many economic factors western workers work longer, harder and for less money relative. This means that today, their time has substantially more value than it did in 1999. This is one of the factors that gave rise to and continues to push into profitability the free to play with microtransactions model.

Todays player...no, todays PAYER...simply would not tolerate an EQ or UO. Even Eve is seeing their population decline after over 10 years of a steady but slow rise in overall population.

But as I ans others have said, and has been proven before, vet 1-16 can be done in 2 days, 1 if you actually try really hard. Or less than 5 with a laid back pace.

How's that too long? Giving it to people for free would barely be any better.

exactly

Justice31st

Artemisshrikes wrote: »

Justice31st wrote: »

Artemisshrikes wrote: »

Justice31st wrote: »

Artemisshrikes wrote: »

Justice31st wrote: »

Because the veteran level grinding is way to slow, and doing the same quests for the 8th time is more boring than watching paint dry.

so basicly you would rather everything in life be given to you with no effort

Well, I wouldn't compare playing a game to life dummy.

life is life, game or not

For many of us an MMO is suppose to be an escape from reality, not a second job.

it would not be fun if everything was just given to us

The fact that you are correlating people who are against the veteran level ranks in an MMO as people who always want things given in life is pretty disturbing.

Justice31st

I am sure many would be happy to have veteran ranks in this MMO if there was more entertaining ways to level up your character. For the last year+ it was repeating Caldwells quests and doing the same grinding rotation. After all, we should be playing this game for entertainment right?

Justice31st

zornyan wrote: »

Dixa wrote: »

zornyan wrote: »

JoseDelgadoCub17_ESO wrote: »

Let's be honest people quit when they see how much of a grind veteran ranks are.

that's why they should be removed.

can't tell you how many times I've heard people enjoy the game to 50 then see this huge boring grind and just leave.


I have every class maxed out in WoW,SWTOR,Destiny,borderlands but guess what not a single character in ESO even though I've had this game since launch. So I have the will to level up it's just that ESO level designed is so toxic...

You haven't played a proper mmo.

Anarchy online, eve online, Ultima online, DOAC, ever quest , a realm reborn etc etc.

Most if not all of these games require weeks and months of grinding, anarchy, eve especially take a minimum of 6 months to get near end game, eve can take years to get everything.

Hell even skyrim took me a few weeks to level up to a high level.

You can get to vr 16 in under a week, without grinding. That's hardly a big grind.

Don't ever use destiny as an example, it took 8 odd hours to do the entire story in that, but some people (myself included) spent 3 months repeating the same raid to get to level 30, that's right 3 MONTHS for ONE LEVEL .

Yeah not grindy at all...

I have been playing MUD's and MMORPG's since 1993. I played on and continue to play on the very MUD that Brad McQuaid based Everquest on.

That was then. Today's gamer - and payer - no longer has that kind of patience. Hell that MUD got rid of it's death penalty a few months back as a way to retain players and entice exploration. The death penalty in launch everquest - respawning naked, losing a huge chunk of xp, having to getyour stuff back by a certain time or it's all gone - was created by this MUD 20 years ago, and they have now relented. It was a good change, and took the unnecessary fear out of the game.

That game also has many shortcuts to leveling now. Before it would take real life years to reach level 50. Now, it can be done in a day or two.

The key difference lies in changes to western work culture. In 1999 we worked less for more money. Now due to many economic factors western workers work longer, harder and for less money relative. This means that today, their time has substantially more value than it did in 1999. This is one of the factors that gave rise to and continues to push into profitability the free to play with microtransactions model.

Todays player...no, todays PAYER...simply would not tolerate an EQ or UO. Even Eve is seeing their population decline after over 10 years of a steady but slow rise in overall population.

But as I ans others have said, and has been proven before, vet 1-16 can be done in 2 days, 1 if you actually try really hard. Or less than 5 with a laid back pace.

How's that too long? Giving it to people for free would barely be any better.

How about showing the proof of grinding vet levels 1 to 16 in two days instead of just saying there is some?

JaJaLuka

Jura23 wrote: »

Dixa wrote: »

My only problem with the vet system is the grind.

So many people I have pulled into this game both at launch and now give up in the vr4-vr6 range, because it is just too grindy. turn in two dozen quests and no level. it's a bit much to ask at a time in a characters life when you have no new abilities to look forward to anymore.

No it's not. 16 v ranks is not grindy. If you think it is, then you have no idea what grind in MMO is. No offense.

It's not that it takes all that long to get to v16, it's the lack of things to do on the way. You hit v1, then rinse and repeat the story over again (sorry, but following a quest marker for another 10 zones sucks) or go to craglorn where the xp rate is absolutely terrible (that's if you can even find a group). Now with Orsinium, yes that zone is far more immersive, but one zone won't get you far in terms of levelling, which leaves grinding to v16, then grinding AT v16 to get the gear (whether it's materials or otherwise), then grinding Alliance ranks or emperorship, then grinding one of the Arena's for gear, the sewers for Tel Var stones... the list goes on, but the actual end game doesn't exist, hence why it all just feels like a grind.

Note: I haven't listed Orsinium's Maelstrom Arena as endgame or any of the other content because it doesn't really reward you. The drop rate is terrible and most players can't even complete it. You don't get to the end and think to yourself "holy ***, that was awesome!!! Look at the new thing I got as a reward!", you get there and think "thank *** that's over, another piece of gear I'll never use, but at least I have a new title"....
The normal mode is fun for what it is but doesn't give top tier rewards (it shouldn't), and while the veteran mode certainly has its place in being the hardest content in game, it just isn't fun on the whole and gives nothing for the massive time and effort put into it, hence it feels like a grind (and is essentially).