[updated 11/10] Calling all Stam Sorcs! I need help recreating a bug!

Huggalump

The bug

is


still


there.


Updated with new information. Please check the OP.

Bhakura

My stam sorc doesnt get it in PVE, only PVP when getting hit by guards, once got down to 34% it seems to accumulate, scary stuff

Huggalump

Bhakura wrote: »

My stam sorc doesnt get it in PVE, only PVP when getting hit by guards, once got down to 34% it seems to accumulate, scary stuff

Thanks for the info! And Yes, it does accumulate. I have another video where I'm running around under 20% hp and the screen is blinking red. This is a pretty normal thing for me.

Do you use crit surge? What weapon styles do you use? And do you weave light/heavy attacks between your abilities?

CP5

I've taken to capturing resources solo in pvp recently and use my bow almost exclusively. I've had my health down to 50% for a very long time from this bug, with my only bow skills being Focus Aim and Poison Injection. If I had to guess it would be related to snipe, and I have been able to notice after the fact the bug but i'll try to keep a closer eye on my health bar to see when it triggers.

EDIT: Just watched the new video in op and that is exactly what i've seen happen. I will be aiming to kill one of the guards that can cast a full heal and I will see their health bar remain full after taking several snipes, but then they would just drop dead. The only times i've gotten heavy attacks in during these fights is when I need to keep the npcs from healing by attacking me so I don't spot the drop in health as much, but the npc health bar desyncing is happening here.

Huggalump

CP5 wrote: »

I've taken to capturing resources solo in pvp recently and use my bow almost exclusively. I've had my health down to 50% for a very long time from this bug, with my only bow skills being Focus Aim and Poison Injection. If I had to guess it would be related to snipe, and I have been able to notice after the fact the bug but i'll try to keep a closer eye on my health bar to see when it triggers.

EDIT: Just watched the new video in op and that is exactly what i've seen happen. I will be aiming to kill one of the guards that can cast a full heal and I will see their health bar remain full after taking several snipes, but then they would just drop dead. The only times i've gotten heavy attacks in during these fights is when I need to keep the npcs from healing by attacking me so I don't spot the drop in health as much, but the npc health bar desyncing is happening here.

Yeah, that sounds a lot like what's happening with me. Are you a sorc also? Using crit surge?

Thanks for the post

CP5

Huggalump wrote: »

CP5 wrote: »

I've taken to capturing resources solo in pvp recently and use my bow almost exclusively. I've had my health down to 50% for a very long time from this bug, with my only bow skills being Focus Aim and Poison Injection. If I had to guess it would be related to snipe, and I have been able to notice after the fact the bug but i'll try to keep a closer eye on my health bar to see when it triggers.

EDIT: Just watched the new video in op and that is exactly what i've seen happen. I will be aiming to kill one of the guards that can cast a full heal and I will see their health bar remain full after taking several snipes, but then they would just drop dead. The only times i've gotten heavy attacks in during these fights is when I need to keep the npcs from healing by attacking me so I don't spot the drop in health as much, but the npc health bar desyncing is happening here.

Yeah, that sounds a lot like what's happening with me. Are you a sorc also? Using crit surge?

Thanks for the post

Bingo. Sometimes i'm able to end the fights with snipe alone, but those times I need to distract the guards by getting close and apply that bit of pressure with heavy attacks and poison injection, those are the times my health bar goes down.

Huggalump

CP5 wrote: »

Huggalump wrote: »

CP5 wrote: »

I've taken to capturing resources solo in pvp recently and use my bow almost exclusively. I've had my health down to 50% for a very long time from this bug, with my only bow skills being Focus Aim and Poison Injection. If I had to guess it would be related to snipe, and I have been able to notice after the fact the bug but i'll try to keep a closer eye on my health bar to see when it triggers.

EDIT: Just watched the new video in op and that is exactly what i've seen happen. I will be aiming to kill one of the guards that can cast a full heal and I will see their health bar remain full after taking several snipes, but then they would just drop dead. The only times i've gotten heavy attacks in during these fights is when I need to keep the npcs from healing by attacking me so I don't spot the drop in health as much, but the npc health bar desyncing is happening here.

Yeah, that sounds a lot like what's happening with me. Are you a sorc also? Using crit surge?

Thanks for the post

Bingo. Sometimes i'm able to end the fights with snipe alone, but those times I need to distract the guards by getting close and apply that bit of pressure with heavy attacks and poison injection, those are the times my health bar goes down.

Fantastic! Now we're getting somewhere =D

ZOS_RyanRuzich wrote: »

~ninja smoke~
We'll take a look

+1 Awesome on the video and your investigation thus far, it really does help with the debugging process.

Quoting this again so hopefully someone at zos will see the updated information.

WarrioroftheWind_ESO

Hugga have you been doing this testing on live and during 'prime time' hours for your respective server?

I'd been testing this on Azuras for the past couple days, and I noticed it happen as well against flag NPCS, only thing different with my spec is I use power surge in a stam build. I don't think its specifically critical surge, I think its just surge in general. I've seen it happen twice against a rank 1 resource and a rank 5 resource, and both times it'd happen where my snipe shots go off but don't quite land, and a guard could be recieving heals from 3 different npcs including self then just poof, fall over dead and melt. I run absolutely no addons whatsoever and use the default UI. My health also seemed to get stuck at about 90% at some point just from being hit by the guards projectile abilities. I was running 5/5 heavy, 2/5 light at the time. I have not tried this with my medium set, but I run an unconventional build to begin with so figured I'd see if this was true or not.

Huggalump

WarrioroftheWind_ESO wrote: »

Hugga have you been doing this testing on live and during 'prime time' hours for your respective server?

I'd been testing this on Azuras for the past couple days, and I noticed it happen as well against flag NPCS, only thing different with my spec is I use power surge in a stam build. I don't think its specifically critical surge, I think its just surge in general. I've seen it happen twice against a rank 1 resource and a rank 5 resource, and both times it'd happen where my snipe shots go off but don't quite land, and a guard could be recieving heals from 3 different npcs including self then just poof, fall over dead and melt. I run absolutely no addons whatsoever and use the default UI. My health also seemed to get stuck at about 90% at some point just from being hit by the guards projectile abilities. I was running 5/5 heavy, 2/5 light at the time. I have not tried this with my medium set, but I run an unconventional build to begin with so figured I'd see if this was true or not.

No, I'm definitely not playing during prime time hours. I play on NA server but currently work in Korea. Do you think hours has to do with something?

I agree, you're probably right that it happens with either surge morph. I shouldn't have focused on critical surge. This is just a pure guess based on experience, but I think it has something to do with the surge heal messing up health bars when both the snipe and the animation cancelling heavy attack hit the target at the same time. Again, just a guess.

In fact, come to think of it, now that I understand what sets off the bug, I should go back and test what it does and doesn't proc with to make sure it is specifically surge.

And about the part I bolded at the end, just to be clear, the bug did happen with you? And thanks a ton for testing it, you're awesome

I'm gonna upload another video and link it in this thread when I get home... it shows just how goofy this bug can get, so hopefully you all are prepared for that :P

WarrioroftheWind_ESO

Huggalump wrote: »

WarrioroftheWind_ESO wrote: »

Hugga have you been doing this testing on live and during 'prime time' hours for your respective server?

I'd been testing this on Azuras for the past couple days, and I noticed it happen as well against flag NPCS, only thing different with my spec is I use power surge in a stam build. I don't think its specifically critical surge, I think its just surge in general. I've seen it happen twice against a rank 1 resource and a rank 5 resource, and both times it'd happen where my snipe shots go off but don't quite land, and a guard could be recieving heals from 3 different npcs including self then just poof, fall over dead and melt. I run absolutely no addons whatsoever and use the default UI. My health also seemed to get stuck at about 90% at some point just from being hit by the guards projectile abilities. I was running 5/5 heavy, 2/5 light at the time. I have not tried this with my medium set, but I run an unconventional build to begin with so figured I'd see if this was true or not.

No, I'm definitely not playing during prime time hours. I play on NA server but currently work in Korea. Do you think hours has to do with something?

I agree, you're probably right that it happens with either surge morph. I shouldn't have focused on critical surge. This is just a pure guess based on experience, but I think it has something to do with the surge heal messing up health bars when both the snipe and the animation cancelling heavy attack hit the target at the same time. Again, just a guess.

In fact, come to think of it, now that I understand what sets off the bug, I should go back and test what it does and doesn't proc with to make sure it is specifically surge.

And about the part I bolded at the end, just to be clear, the bug did happen with you? And thanks a ton for testing it, you're awesome

I'm gonna upload another video and link it in this thread when I get home... it shows just how goofy this bug can get, so hopefully you all are prepared for that :P

I wasn't thinking so much hours as I was traffic. Primetime for NA usually all 3 factions are poplocked, though the amount of people present on the field is not always indicated on the pop meter. I've experienced various instances of lag, and when this bug happened it did not feel like lag. My bow did not stutter. I would see the shots fire, arc, then land on the target but no damage was dealt. For several seconds the target would cast and recieve heals without their bar moving. Then for a brief moment my character would not shoot even though I still saw the mob and it was targetable. Instant later: boom, gooey corpse. My DPS is by no means stellar for my build, and with the amount of bonuses rank 5 guards get, soloing nodes is a chore, but I'm wondering if its more of a client-side issue where the shots don't quite match up, similar to the uppercut bug where a mob will fly into the air before your character actually swings. It's very similar also to the one desync bug were your character loses all resources seconds before you actually show up dead.

Huggalump

WarrioroftheWind_ESO wrote: »

Huggalump wrote: »

WarrioroftheWind_ESO wrote: »

Hugga have you been doing this testing on live and during 'prime time' hours for your respective server?

I'd been testing this on Azuras for the past couple days, and I noticed it happen as well against flag NPCS, only thing different with my spec is I use power surge in a stam build. I don't think its specifically critical surge, I think its just surge in general. I've seen it happen twice against a rank 1 resource and a rank 5 resource, and both times it'd happen where my snipe shots go off but don't quite land, and a guard could be recieving heals from 3 different npcs including self then just poof, fall over dead and melt. I run absolutely no addons whatsoever and use the default UI. My health also seemed to get stuck at about 90% at some point just from being hit by the guards projectile abilities. I was running 5/5 heavy, 2/5 light at the time. I have not tried this with my medium set, but I run an unconventional build to begin with so figured I'd see if this was true or not.

No, I'm definitely not playing during prime time hours. I play on NA server but currently work in Korea. Do you think hours has to do with something?

I agree, you're probably right that it happens with either surge morph. I shouldn't have focused on critical surge. This is just a pure guess based on experience, but I think it has something to do with the surge heal messing up health bars when both the snipe and the animation cancelling heavy attack hit the target at the same time. Again, just a guess.

In fact, come to think of it, now that I understand what sets off the bug, I should go back and test what it does and doesn't proc with to make sure it is specifically surge.

And about the part I bolded at the end, just to be clear, the bug did happen with you? And thanks a ton for testing it, you're awesome

I'm gonna upload another video and link it in this thread when I get home... it shows just how goofy this bug can get, so hopefully you all are prepared for that :P

I wasn't thinking so much hours as I was traffic. Primetime for NA usually all 3 factions are poplocked, though the amount of people present on the field is not always indicated on the pop meter. I've experienced various instances of lag, and when this bug happened it did not feel like lag. My bow did not stutter. I would see the shots fire, arc, then land on the target but no damage was dealt. For several seconds the target would cast and recieve heals without their bar moving. Then for a brief moment my character would not shoot even though I still saw the mob and it was targetable. Instant later: boom, gooey corpse. My DPS is by no means stellar for my build, and with the amount of bonuses rank 5 guards get, soloing nodes is a chore, but I'm wondering if its more of a client-side issue where the shots don't quite match up, similar to the uppercut bug where a mob will fly into the air before your character actually swings. It's very similar also to the one desync bug were your character loses all resources seconds before you actually show up dead.

Ah, I see. I don't think it's lag. When I'm playing, there's virtually no one on. I live in Korea, but my ping is usually around 250-300, which isn't bad. And the bug happens when I weave heavy attacks with snipe with surge active, not when ping spikes

WarrioroftheWind_ESO

I did not try the heavy attack weaving. This just seemed to happen while spamming lethal arrow with power surge active. Usually if I see rubberbanding that's indicative of severe lag, but there was no delay in my snipes casting or the animation going off. The sound seemed a bit disjointed though, like you wouldn't hear the THUNK of it landing, but you still see the mobs healing as if they had taken damage when their bars didn't show any discrepancies.

Huggalump

How to add tension to farming in IC:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RajDnb4gOgs&feature=youtu.be

@Zos @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_RyanRuzich

Huggalump

I just updated the OP with new info. I think it's very important, so please check it out @ZOS @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_RyanRuzich

Also, @CP5 and @WarrioroftheWind_ESO can you guys see if the new video is consistent with what you experience?


Thanks

CP5

Sorry Huggalump, can't give you another insightful for that post. I will try to add a few more heavy attacks into my fights to see how frequent I can get this bug, haven't been using them a whole lot lately for some reason. But again nice work finding this.

Huggalump

CP5 wrote: »

Sorry Huggalump, can't give you another insightful for that post. I will try to add a few more heavy attacks into my fights to see how frequent I can get this bug, haven't been using them a whole lot lately for some reason. But again nice work finding this.

Thanks!

If you do try and see that it fits with what I found, let me know... or if you find something different, definitely let me know

MrDerrikk

Hey guys, I've actually had this bug once or twice with my Destro/Resto staff Sorc and Power Surge. I haven't been able to replicate it though and it was very rare so I'm still not sure what the combination of things was that caused it. I won't be much help in saying what caused it, but as I've never used a bow I can let you know that it is somehow achievable without using Snipe or other bow skills.

Hope you find an answer and/or ZOS can fix it!

Malnutrition

I've experienced this bug a few times but only in Cyrodiil on my Magicka NB, using Destro and class skills. Relogging fixed it for me each time. Hope you get it figured out!

olsborg

This happens with magicka sorcs aswell. I cant play my magicka sorc because of this with surge and weaving hardcasted crystal fragments with light attacks and animation canceling etc. Also happens when I fight other sorcs on my nb...health desync. Thanks for posting this as its the very thing that happens to me. I havent been able to play my sorc since Imperial city came.

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JasonLeavey @ZOS_JessicaFolsom

Huggalump

Malnutrition wrote: »

I've experienced this bug a few times but only in Cyrodiil on my Magicka NB, using Destro and class skills. Relogging fixed it for me each time. Hope you get it figured out!

olsborg wrote: »

This happens with magicka sorcs aswell. I cant play my magicka sorc because of this with surge and weaving hardcasted crystal fragments with light attacks and animation canceling etc. Also happens when I fight other sorcs on my nb...health desync. Thanks for posting this as its the very thing that happens to me. I havent been able to play my sorc since Imperial city came.

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JasonLeavey @ZOS_JessicaFolsom

wow, that's pretty big. Thanks for the posts!

So the issue is with hardcasting ranged abilities while weaving heavy attacks with Surge heals up

CP5

Question for those who noticed this bug on things other than the bow, were you always using projectile skills with a long travel time? I'm thinking the desync can happen if you get a critical hit with a light/heavy attack before the skill lands.

Jar_Ek

I have seen both the noted effects on my stamina sorcerer (both npc health desync where it appears to have been unaffected by my snipes/heavy attacks and then suddenly drops dead, and my own health bar desync where it simply stops providing any feedback on my actual health). This was using critical surge, lethal arrow and heavy attacks on cryodiil resource guards - including one instance where the NPC stayed up through the whole capture but was actually dead.
I am running heavy armour , 2k weapon damage and do not see my own healthbar desync very often - the npc desync occurs regularly.

My nightblade has only ever seen the Npc health desync, but sees it all the time. This occurs with snipe, heavy attack, shiponing strikes and grim focus running (so no healing). My night blade has never seen their own health bar desync.

So I am wondering if these are unrelated bugs, one down to snipe + heavy attack desyncing Npc health bars, and the other to do with the amount of healing provided by the surge heal off a double-heal or a damage+heal. The hypothesis being that a snipe and heavy attack can hit close together in time and potentially provide a large pair of heals at nearly the same time. If these occur and you are on full health? Basically similar to the bug mentioned by our Templars friend?

Anyone care to test? I will try to test as well of course.

Huggalump

Jar_Ek wrote: »

I have seen both the noted effects on my stamina sorcerer (both npc health desync where it appears to have been unaffected by my snipes/heavy attacks and then suddenly drops dead, and my own health bar desync where it simply stops providing any feedback on my actual health). This was using critical surge, lethal arrow and heavy attacks on cryodiil resource guards - including one instance where the NPC stayed up through the whole capture but was actually dead.
I am running heavy armour , 2k weapon damage and do not see my own healthbar desync very often - the npc desync occurs regularly.

My nightblade has only ever seen the Npc health desync, but sees it all the time. This occurs with snipe, heavy attack, shiponing strikes and grim focus running (so no healing). My night blade has never seen their own health bar desync.

So I am wondering if these are unrelated bugs, one down to snipe + heavy attack desyncing Npc health bars, and the other to do with the amount of healing provided by the surge heal off a double-heal or a damage+heal. The hypothesis being that a snipe and heavy attack can hit close together in time and potentially provide a large pair of heals at nearly the same time. If these occur and you are on full health? Basically similar to the bug mentioned by our Templars friend?

Anyone care to test? I will try to test as well of course.

That's basically what I'm thinking... that it's two bugs.

Or rather, one bug, but applied in two different ways. As @CP5 mentioned, the enemy health desync (I like that term) seems to happen when a cast time+travel time projectile is woven with a heavy attack.

What I THINK is happening, is that when we sorcs use critical sure, that same bug is applied to the healing we receive, and then desyncs our own health. It's a guess, but it seems to fit perfectly with everything we see.


maaaaaaaan this thread is really picking up. We're figuring this thing out! It's getting exciting. Now let's hope ZOS can fix the bug now that we've got it so extremely narrowed down.

CP5

For surge procing this bug, could it be the crit heal from the heavy attack being applied before the crit heal from snipe, despite snipe having been fired first? I would check to see if the bug only triggers when both the snipe and the heavy attack crit together.

WarrioroftheWind_ESO

I'll get around to testing it at some point. Just a crapton of crappy crap going on (mostly due to a tropical front).

I tried testing this in the morning/non-primetime for NA Azura a couple days ago. I wasn't able to get the crit bug to go off but that might've had to do with enemies being more vigilant about their resources. I did get the desync bug several times though, and I'm not sure if it was because I was using surge for the heal or if it was from that attack the flag guards do. The flashy fireball one.

OrphanHelgen

I was using bow on my khajiit sorc along time, and my first bug report was actually the day after update 7. It have been like this ever since. Thank you for this post. I will make sure to bump it every day, maybe even every hour.

OrphanHelgen

Any stam sorcs out there struggled with the health bug in todays pledge, where range is needed? :-)

ZOS_RyanRuzich

We've reproduced the bug internally, and believe we have a fix. The fix was a bit more involved than normal, and thus missed the Orsinium patch. But we're aiming to have it in an incremental shortly thereafter, subject to the will of Sheogorath..

@Huggalump The second video was the key to a consistent reproduction case. Awesome job at nailing it down :-)

Huggalump

ZOS_RyanRuzich wrote: »

We've reproduced the bug internally, and believe we have a fix. The fix was a bit more involved than normal, and thus missed the Orsinium patch. But we're aiming to have it in an incremental shortly thereafter, subject to the will of Sheogorath..

@Huggalump The second video was the key to a consistent reproduction case. Awesome job at nailing it down :-)

oh my god, christmas came early

GTech_1

ZOS_RyanRuzich wrote: »

We've reproduced the bug internally, and believe we have a fix. The fix was a bit more involved than normal, and thus missed the Orsinium patch. But we're aiming to have it in an incremental shortly thereafter, subject to the will of Sheogorath..

@Huggalump The second video was the key to a consistent reproduction case. Awesome job at nailing it down :-)

Credit where credit is due, and a fix on the way. I love it.
Well done Ryan.

Good job, Huggalump. Kudos.