How is siphoning attacks going to work now?

Bloodgharm

I've been combing the forums and haven't really found a good explanation for SA skill. I know it is now an active buff that lasts 15 seconds. Does it still grant magicka and stamina back from all skills? Has this change now ruined my AOE bar? I usually run sap essence in conjunction with siphoning attacks and I could just spam sap all day to take out trash mobs. I realize sap just got a pretty big buff, so will I still need to slot SA on that bar?

Mainly I want to know if it's better or worse and if I should keep it on my bar?

GreenSoup2HoT

It work's exactly the same.

However you will have to applie it like a Buff (15 second's) which has a 2k magicka cost. You don't have the damage decrease as well.

You only need the new SiA on one bar.
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Good new's is drain power got a 20% damage buff. So that combo your talking about will hit 40% harder in PvE (patch 1.7 compared to 1.6).

Bloodgharm

GreenSoup2HoT wrote: »

It work's exactly the same.

However you will have to applie it like a Buff (15 second's) which has a 2k magicka cost. You don't have the damage decrease as well.

You only need the new SiA on one bar.
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.
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Good new's is drain power got a 20% damage buff. So that combo your talking about will hit 40% harder in PvE (patch 1.7 compared to 1.6).

Thanks GreenSoup. That eases my worries about the new patch. About how much magicka does SA give back since it's supposed to return a certain amount for every skill/light/heavy attack? I'm sure it can't be much, but I'm hoping it's a decent amount

GreenSoup2HoT

@Bloodgharm Pretty sure its like 800mag/stam per light and heavy then 15% for ability's.

Not 100% though.

ottobot

It scaled with level like everything else, I believe it returns a very similar amount to the % it was before.

Blackjak-33

Seems to me it won't be the same. Siphoning Attacks currently is a toggle with just one cost to permanently activate it, but now it'll cost 2k magicka every 15 seconds? Seems like I'm going to burn more magicka to constantly activate it than I am in getting the magicka return.

Or it could be that as a siphon tank I'm pissed I'm going to have one more ability to keep an eye on, an ability KEY to my build. I'm sick of spending time setting my build up only for the devs to screw it up.

Bloodgharm

Blackjak-33 wrote: »

Seems to me it won't be the same. Siphoning Attacks currently is a toggle with just one cost to permanently activate it, but now it'll cost 2k magicka every 15 seconds? Seems like I'm going to burn more magicka to constantly activate it than I am in getting the magicka return.

Or it could be that as a siphon tank I'm pissed I'm going to have one more ability to keep an eye on, an ability KEY to my build. I'm sick of spending time setting my build up only for the devs to screw it up.

I hear you. I was just getting into the comfortable stage of my build and now I have to figure it all out again.

GreenSoup2HoT

@Blackjak-33 It still proc's off Caltrop's. So you could tie in Evil Hunter and get additional chance's to proc with some nice stamina gain.

PBpsy

For a decent magicka pve DPS NB with ~30-35k magicka in V14 gear the SA can make you sustain a SAP based aoe bar without ever even thinking of getting at 50% magicka. However to sustain a magicka based NB one didn't need SA since 1.5.

However the problem is the stam regen which was the only reason to use it as magicka since 1.6 You are going to have very little stam for blocking and dodge roiling with or without the new SA. Stam has become even more of an issue for magicka dps even if most complaints come from Stam Tanks and DPS.It also can be included in a single target rotation only using one slot on the AOE bar.

Stam builds of course do not have as much of an use for it since it cost quite a bit and the returns are not as good as before.

In conclusion SA trivializes magicka NB dps sustain even further while not helping much on their stam based survival.
For tanks and stam DPS, SA is not that great since it cost a bunch of magicka and the stam return is not what it used to be .

Stravokov

one morph requires you to cast it every 15 seconds, granting you stam/magic regen with no weapon damage penalty. since you have to use Magicka to cast it every 15 seconds, it is counter productive to being a sustain ability. the other version only returns health, has a 20% weapon/spell damage penalty hit, and only heals for around 200ish health a pop.

they seem both useless to me, not using either currently. a pity, because it was one of my favorite ability's.

willymchilybily

Siphoning Strikes:

• This ability is no longer a toggle.
• Removed the Power and Spell Power debuff; your attacks now do full damage.
• This ability no longer restores a percentage of your Magicka or Stamina. Instead, it restores a fixed amount per hit.
• You will no longer build up extra visual effects on your weapon when this ability is cast multiple times.

does this fixed amount returned scale with your stamina and magicka pools, magicka/spell power, character level or other? that for me is the key question. If the scaling for each value returned was based on the size of that resource pool it might be quite nice, though i suspect it is just spell damage and magicka like most class skills?

ExaltedNade

willymchilybily wrote: »

Siphoning Strikes:

• This ability is no longer a toggle.
• Removed the Power and Spell Power debuff; your attacks now do full damage.
• This ability no longer restores a percentage of your Magicka or Stamina. Instead, it restores a fixed amount per hit.
• You will no longer build up extra visual effects on your weapon when this ability is cast multiple times.

does this fixed amount returned scale with your stamina and magicka pools, magicka/spell power, character level or other? that for me is the key question. If the scaling for each value returned was based on the size of that resource pool it might be quite nice, though i suspect it is just spell damage and magicka like most class skills?

It scales with Magicka, Spell Power shouldn't be affecting it, I know that much, don't think it scales with Stamina

Bloodgharm

PBpsy wrote: »

For a decent magicka pve DPS NB with ~30-35k magicka in V14 gear the SA can make you sustain a SAP based aoe bar without ever even thinking of getting at 50% magicka. However to sustain a magicka based NB one didn't need SA since 1.5.

However the problem is the stam regen which was the only reason to use it as magicka since 1.6 You are going to have very little stam for blocking and dodge roiling with or without the new SA. Stam has become even more of an issue for magicka dps even if most complaints come from Stam Tanks and DPS.It also can be included in a single target rotation only using one slot on the AOE bar.

Stam builds of course do not have as much of an use for it since it cost quite a bit and the returns are not as good as before.

In conclusion SA trivializes magicka NB dps sustain even further while not helping much on their stam based survival.
For tanks and stam DPS, SA is not that great since it cost a bunch of magicka and the stam return is not what it used to be .

The only reason I have it on my AOE bar is because I'm using dual swords for the added spell damage. Of course, I can't just use a HA to regain magicka, so it's my only way to sustain...short of switching bars (a dps loss)

Tdroid

PBpsy wrote: »

For a decent magicka pve DPS NB with ~30-35k magicka in V14 gear the SA can make you sustain a SAP based aoe bar without ever even thinking of getting at 50% magicka. However to sustain a magicka based NB one didn't need SA since 1.5.

However the problem is the stam regen which was the only reason to use it as magicka since 1.6 You are going to have very little stam for blocking and dodge roiling with or without the new SA. Stam has become even more of an issue for magicka dps even if most complaints come from Stam Tanks and DPS.It also can be included in a single target rotation only using one slot on the AOE bar.

Stam builds of course do not have as much of an use for it since it cost quite a bit and the returns are not as good as before.

In conclusion SA trivializes magicka NB dps sustain even further while not helping much on their stam based survival.
For tanks and stam DPS, SA is not that great since it cost a bunch of magicka and the stam return is not what it used to be .

Having played a bit with Siphoning Attacks as a stamina nightblade in PvE, it takes me 3 light attacks(not counting my magicka regen) to get back what I used to cast is, while it gives me back 70% or so of the cost of Surprise Attack in stamina or at least half of my Brawler. I basically never go below 75% stamina even against large groups unless I forget to reapply Siphoning Attacks. So I'd say it seems to be pretty good in PvE, at least.

Blackjak-33

GreenSoup2HoT wrote: »

@Blackjak-33 It still proc's off Caltrop's. So you could tie in Evil Hunter and get additional chance's to proc with some nice stamina gain.

I don't have caltrops yet and even if i did I'm not sure my build after this dlc will even be able to support that skill. It seems like the build I've been working towards and running this entire time without an issue, is going to be destroyed. Magicka siphon tank with only jewelry glyphs for stamina and I was fine, only utilizing SA to generate resources. Now, that's going to be boned, and the main skill involved in my build just got shot to s#%t!

Why did they screw with SA? It's not overpowered? It has an offensive debuff attached to it!

Blackjak-33

Jesus they also screwed with the stamina recovery passive, knocking it from 30% stamina to 15% to all resources. The fact that the devs just decide to make major alterations to classes like this is ridiculous.