Guild Membership Fees

Ch4mpTW

I just wanted to ask if this was a normal occurrence or not in the Elder Scrolls Online community. I recently had a situation where as I joined a particular guild that had its trader setup in Grahtwood, and was informed that every Friday, they charge every single member 5,000 gold. If you don't pay-up, they but you on "probation", and remove your ability to sell in their guild. If you don't pay-up by Sunday, then they'd remove you. The way the recruiter explained it, I could somewhat understand their point as to why a fee was setup to begin with. So I said whatever, and figured I'd join. Upon joining, I sent the leader the 5,000 gold as they requested. Just because I wanted be apart of a "serious trading guild". The guild leader then tries to tell me that they didn't receive the gold. Which was why they didn't give me permission to sell. That is the second red flag that popped up. The first being that the guild has a 5,000 gold weekly membership fee. Keep in mind, I hadn't even been a member of this guild for 24hrs. And already these red flags are showing. So the leader ends up saying how they'll give me the benefit of the doubt, and will allow me to sell. But, I'd had best come up with the gold required by Monday. Nope. Absolutely not. So I then proceed with leaving the guild immediately, and telling the leader to not even worry about it. I also told the recruiter that I felt something was fishy and seemed like a scam. So is this a normal thing, everyone? Or rather is this a normal thing on PC at the moment? As this apparently (according to the recruiter) has been transpiring a lot on console. I however, feel like I've been scammed 5,000 gold (which is my own fault). And, I think that the whole membership fee requirements of a guild are a scam in of itself.

Zorrashi

Actually, many trading guilds (usually in major cities like Grahtwood) actually do require member fees to help pay for their prime kiosk location. It actually became a common practice on PC to maintain top trading locations like Rawl'kha or Mournhold.

So it doesn't surprise me that they would ask for 5,000g. It also wouldn't surprise me if certain guilds took the scamming route but I can't say for certain if that was the case here....for all intents and purposes, the guild leader seemed reasonable. They already had a guild kiosk already set up in Grahtwood so its not like they are a floppy temporary guild. It could really just be a system error.

But of course, I could be wrong.

J2JMC

Wouldn't even be an issue if ZOS let everyone trade on the markets and had guilds collect the taxes. I guess that's not innovative enough though.

Arkadius

A forced member fee is pretty uncommon (at least on PC/EU). Most trading guilds I know try to motivate their members to donate in other ways (raffles/higher ranks/bank access und such things). Also, 5k per member and week for a trader in Elden Root sounds way too much. What are they gonna do with all that money? To be honest, I don't think this guild will survive with this practice. Forcing people to pay a fee (especially for a trader at that location) will more likely drive them away to other guilds.

CGPsaint

I will NEVER join a Guild that charges required fees. I was in one recently that sent out a notice saying that effective immediately, all members would be required to take part in raffles. I left the guild. Simple as that. I can understand guilds wanting you to be an active member and do your part to sell in the guild market to bring in revenue, but charging a membership fee or a making raffles mandatory is just ridiculous in my opinion.

Xendyn

PC/NA here and as far as I know it's not the norm. We do have weekly raffles (but at least you have a chance at getting something back on those. I've won several times) and some have a minimum weekly sales rule, which I won't go for.

Any guild that wanted to charge some kind of "dues" on a weekly basis isn't one I'd care to join. The guild I'm in, that does raffles, has a regular trader in Rawhl so there's really no excuse for those flat fees.

Lordklinger

A good guild will have you deposit your guild fee directly into the bank so you have proof of your donation. The guild I am in currently charges 2k a week and has a weekly kiosk in Daggerfall. If you would like an invite, then send me a message. I have been with them since the beginning on XB1.

Krayor

I was in a guild that attempted to do the "weekly sales rule". I decided to experiment by deliberately not selling anything in that guild store. I was never kicked from the guild or even given warning. As I suspected, some "genius" came up with the idea but no one wanted to tackle the logistical nightmare of tracking member sales. The guild eventually disbanded due to inactivity of leadership.

Guilds resorting to member fees, and the thing above, is just another symptom of a broken system. It detracts from the fun in the game.

Ch4mpTW

From what I've gathered from a lot of these responses, is that it is primarily not a normal practice to have mandatory weekly fees. I figured as much. Not to mention 5,000 gold. Mathematically it just didn't seem to add up. Even if you have certain trader spots bidding at 1,000,000 gold. That's still far too much of a fee. Over 400 members, with them all paying 5k week in membership fees? That's not even including the house cuts when putting something up to sell. No way.

SirAndy

I am in 5 guilds and not one of them charges fees ...

Elsonso

I am OK with guilds charging weekly fees to help pay for guild traders. Ultimately, this inflates the prices of the traders, but if the people want to give to the guild, that is their business.

5000 is a bit steep. I think 1000-2000 might be more typical, but a 2.5 million gold bid on a trader come out to 5k per person in a full guild.

Definitely leave a guild if they demand a weekly payment that is unacceptable, or any other terms that are unacceptable.

There are guild leaders that run the guilds like a business, and this is actually pretty cool, but it does open the door for abuse. Online society mirrors real life. Never send money to someone if you are not comfortable with it. I happened across a guild meeting in an open area on PS4 yesterday (I love proximity voice chat!) and listened in as they discussed things like raffles, auctions, guild membership fees, etc. Not all guilds are this organized or stop to collect guild member input like this.

While I am here, another popular item is raffles. I am leery of raffles, but a few guilds do it right. If they just pick a winner "randomly" and announce who it is, there is room for fraud. In these cases, it is best to just avoid the raffle unless you know and trust the people running it. Not everyone is scamming the guild, but people who are not interested in scamming the guild are usually the last to think that it looks like they might be.

With raffles, the best bet is to have guild members be able to observe the raffle drawings as they happen. This means some sort of means to see the random number generation and the ordered list of raffle ticket holders. There are websites out there that can help with this.

Never invest money in a guild that you are not willing to lose.

Igglez

On PS4 they ask for a few K a week to pay for the trader, I usually give 5k. I'm happy to pay it since the guild makes me a a lot of money (Belkarth traders on PS4 EU, where all VR8-14 gear is). When I was in guilds with no trader, or no traders consistently, my stuff didn't sell and I was running out of space. Now I can make 3-500k a week, maybe more depending on what I'm doing in game.

usrevenge

on ps4 it seems to becoming more common but most guilds don't require fees.

if they do, it normally is to pay for a good trader. on ps4 NA traders in cities are going for well over 500,000 gold. 1million gold for a trader isn't uncommon and it is only going to get higher.

Lordklinger

I would rather pay 2k gold knowing I will have a trader, then not pay and hope the guild makes enough money to get a trader. Even on a bad week I will still make 50k gold.

waterfairy

Do you plan on selling more then 5K in goods per week?

ElfFromSpace

Krayor wrote: »

I was in a guild that attempted to do the "weekly sales rule". I decided to experiment by deliberately not selling anything in that guild store. I was never kicked from the guild or even given warning. As I suspected, some "genius" came up with the idea but no one wanted to tackle the logistical nightmare of tracking member sales. The guild eventually disbanded due to inactivity of leadership.

Guilds resorting to member fees, and the thing above, is just another symptom of a broken system. It detracts from the fun in the game.

I was one of the first GMs to implement a rule like this, and I will admit that it's enforced selectively. We ask for 5K sales and or 1K donations per week. The best thing it does is scare off most people who want a trade guild for convenience, but have no intention of actually selling. However when it comes to enforcement we actually consider many factors including, how many players are on the waitlist, what were the member's sales in previous weeks and is there any history of donations. Warnings are sent out periodically, but mostly when the waitlist gets long and spots are needed.
When some guilds pay 1-3 million each week for a kiosk, you need 5K average from each member so having some sort of minimum along with contests and events to encourage donation has become the standard for most of the the major trade guilds.

starkerealm

lordrichter wrote: »

Definitely leave a guild if they demand a weekly payment that is unacceptable, or any other terms that are unacceptable.

Yeah, I kinda want to point this piece out in case anyone missed it. Really, if the guild is asking you for money, they need you far more than you need them.

If you feel you're getting your money's worth, then that's great. But, if you don't, there are at least 150 other trade guilds that want you just as badly, and most of them will treat you with more respect.

tallenn

As others have said, most use voluntary donation vehicles, like raffles. Both of the active trading guilds I am in, which have very steady traders in Windhelm and Mournhold do this. It seems to work pretty well, as far as I can tell.

If you don't like the idea of paying a weekly fee, then you should definitely not join such a guild. There's nothing intrinsically wrong with that approach, as long as it's known up front. Still, I think most people are hesitant to pay a mandatory fee when there are plenty of other guilds out there who don't charge one. I think such a guild would have a hard time keeping their guild full. Definitely if you don't think you can make more (much more, really) than 5K per week by selling, I'd steer clear. It just wouldn't make financial sense.

Established trading guilds with good locations are a lot easier to get into than a lot of people think. Most are almost always recruiting, to stay as close to the 500 member max as possible.