Cookie Cutter Builds

Azalin76

Why is it when this game was first announced that one of the big deals they strived for was to not have cookie cutter builds like in WoW. But then they added the weapon and armor passives and now we all have to have the same cookie cutter builds for end gane depending on what role we want to play. They need to make the armor and weapon passives more like class skills and not have them tied to specific armor and weapon types. I think this will open up the game to a whole new world of possibilities for players and actually allow us to build our characters the way we want.

newtinmpls

You may choose to play cookie cutter builds.

I don't.

My orc battlemage is speced and played very differently than my altmer sorceress. They both do well in groups, delves and so on.

Mitchblue

Best way to enjoy a game is play what's fun for you.

newtinmpls

Mitchblue wrote: »

Best way to enjoy a game is play what's fun for you.

Yup!!

Dracane

One of my characters is an Altmer Stamina Nightblade. Simply because I would never play anything else than Altmer And none of the Altmer passives has any benefits for my stamina Nightblade

newtinmpls

@Dracane I find your tagline very disturbing...

qsnoopyjr

So if what I'm getting at.
You prefer the GW2 system, everyone equal OVER the must have a healer, magic dps, burst dps, tank, ranged dps, or melee dps.

Game is pretty close to GW2 system as it is right now. You can respect champion points, attributes, skillpoints, pretty much everything. Just like you can do in GW2 except NO COST.

While WoW and EQ... You cant just respec your ***. You're locked in for good when you made your decision.

Mitchblue

qsnoopyjr wrote: »

So if what I'm getting at.
You prefer the GW2 system, everyone equal OVER the must have a healer, magic dps, burst dps, tank, ranged dps, or melee dps.

No. We're saying, play what's fun.

qsnoopyjr

Mitchblue wrote: »

qsnoopyjr wrote: »

So if what I'm getting at.
You prefer the GW2 system, everyone equal OVER the must have a healer, magic dps, burst dps, tank, ranged dps, or melee dps.

No. We're saying, play what's fun.

This game is nowhere near GW2 Meta builds.
Not even websites like these http://metabattle.com/wiki/MetaBattle_Wiki
I wish there was websites like those in TESO.

The closest thing you'll get to in cookie cutter is.
In PvP... You MUST focus on one or more of these steel tornado, impulse, purge, healing springs, barrier, meteor, bombard..

Anything else... Unacceptable.
Just be thankful its not complex as GW2... Where YOU MUST have certain traits and your limited on the traits you can have. Playing nades?? MUST have HGH.

Maybe just maybe the Champion System will have very very critical skills in them that forces you to lock into one of them..

And with the push to limit Champion System.. Its gonna be like GW2.. MUST HAVE this if your running those skills.

Mitchblue

qsnoopyjr wrote: »

Mitchblue wrote: »

qsnoopyjr wrote: »

So if what I'm getting at.
You prefer the GW2 system, everyone equal OVER the must have a healer, magic dps, burst dps, tank, ranged dps, or melee dps.

No. We're saying, play what's fun.

This game is nowhere near GW2 Meta builds.
Not even websites like these http://metabattle.com/wiki/MetaBattle_Wiki
I wish there was websites like those in TESO.

The closest thing you'll get to in cookie cutter is.
In PvP... You MUST focus on one or more of these steel tornado, impulse, purge, healing springs, barrier, meteor, bombard..

Anything else... Unacceptable.
Just be thankful its not complex as GW2... Where YOU MUST have certain traits and your limited on the traits you can have. Playing nades?? MUST have HGH.

Maybe just maybe the Champion System will have very very critical skills in them that forces you to lock into one of them..

And with the push to limit Champion System.. Its gonna be like GW2.. MUST HAVE this if your running those skills.

Umm, JUST PLAY WHAT'S FUN. Not everyone plays to be top guy/gal in PVP. Don't cookie cutter if you don't want to. Though it seems like you want to.

Shadesofkin

Azalin76 wrote: »

Why is it when this game was first announced that one of the big deals they strived for was to not have cookie cutter builds like in WoW. But then they added the weapon and armor passives and now we all have to have the same cookie cutter builds for end gane depending on what role we want to play. They need to make the armor and weapon passives more like class skills and not have them tied to specific armor and weapon types. I think this will open up the game to a whole new world of possibilities for players and actually allow us to build our characters the way we want.

Only the lowest common denominators choose the cookie cutter builds, plenty of other people experiment and fiddle until they have what works for them.

Forestd16b14_ESO

Play how you want. That is The Elder Scrolls way such how I play. I am a tank and I use a 2H weapon to tank with and far excell at it. You can play your way it's just a sad truth that players who make these cookie cutter builds make it so the build revolves around what every class and skills are the most powerful and what every mechanics they can abuse the most. Heance why most players use them cause there the most powerful and most players don't want to take the time like we do to make there own builds that could work. They just want the best and most powerful right now sad but true.

OrangeTheCat

Azalin76 wrote: »

Why is it when this game was first announced that one of the big deals they strived for was to not have cookie cutter builds like in WoW. But then they added the weapon and armor passives and now we all have to have the same cookie cutter builds for end gane depending on what role we want to play. They need to make the armor and weapon passives more like class skills and not have them tied to specific armor and weapon types. I think this will open up the game to a whole new world of possibilities for players and actually allow us to build our characters the way we want.

And crafted armor was supposed to be the best and there was supposed to be no gear treadmill...

The_Sadist

There will always be cookie cutter builds in any given MMO.

While some builds aren't all that viable e.g. tanking with light armour and duel wield on a Sorcerer using summons, you can still enjoy your solo play through. That being said, once you hit the endgame content there are certain instances where a DPS needs to be able to do a minimum amount of damage, a healer needs to be able to manage resources and heal effectively and a tank needs to be able to hold a lot aggro without dying. So while it's all cookies and cream to say "play how you want" it's more play "how you want within reason".

Azalin76

I like the comments on this, I'm not saying that I play a cookie cutter build, I do play what is fun for me but there is no way for me to look awesome in full Orc or Imperial plate armor while trying to play my DK mage build or my NB 2H stam build. Without the passives from the medium armor skill tree. I really love how most of the heavy armor looks and want to wear it but I can't tank, it isn't pretty. I feel like I'm forced to wear armor that I don't like the look of just to be able to play my build properly.

Akavir_Sentinel

My build is as far from cookie cutter as you can get. in PvP, I'm one of those players that 10 of you can be wailing on and not even get my health to 50%, but no one would ever be able to guess the combination that I use. I had thought of posting the build on here at one time, but it would probably be instantly followed up by 50 "that needs to be nerfed!" comments.

The_Sadist

Azalin76 wrote: »

I like the comments on this, I'm not saying that I play a cookie cutter build, I do play what is fun for me but there is no way for me to look awesome in full Orc or Imperial plate armor while trying to play my DK mage build or my NB 2H stam build. Without the passives from the medium armor skill tree. I really love how most of the heavy armor looks and want to wear it but I can't tank, it isn't pretty. I feel like I'm forced to wear armor that I don't like the look of just to be able to play my build properly.

There are always costumes you can purchase via the crown store or find while questing which can be used to cover up unsightly armour. That being said, you may struggle to find a specific type which fits your criteria.

NotSo

I used to build for max movement speed before 1.6 but now I build for max health return on attacks. Sorcerer/mage/caster/thermautergist for life.

Azalin76

The_Sadist wrote: »

There are always costumes you can purchase via the crown store or find while questing which can be used to cover up unsightly armour. That being said, you may struggle to find a specific type which fits your criteria.

I'm hoping they eventually add in the imperial and orc heavy armor styles for costumes. I just wish costumes could be dyed like normal armor.

mtwiggz

Cookie cutter builds only exist to those interested in min/max'ing. Most importantly in PvP, somewhat important in PvE. No one forces anyone to do so, except in some high teir PvP or PvE guilds.

I will admit it's funny to see Cyrodiil a few days after one of the big name PvP'ers posts a new build. Everyone running around in the same gear for several days - before most of which realize they need skill to back up the gear.

Dracane

newtinmpls wrote: »

@Dracane I find your tagline very disturbing...

Why ? Isn't it a nice tagline ?

F7sus4

newtinmpls wrote: »

You may choose to play cookie cutter builds.

I don't.

You may also choose to be a pug. I don't.

The_Sadist

Azalin76 wrote: »

The_Sadist wrote: »

There are always costumes you can purchase via the crown store or find while questing which can be used to cover up unsightly armour. That being said, you may struggle to find a specific type which fits your criteria.

I'm hoping they eventually add in the imperial and orc heavy armor styles for costumes. I just wish costumes could be dyed like normal armor.

Who knows what the future may hold? I don't think it's unrealistic to assume they'll make costumes adjustable in terms of colour and whatnot.. Granted it probably won't happen any time soon! I'm personally rocking a random disguise I found on my Stamina Nightblade because I'm not a huge fan of medium armour and wanted something more bulky.

Alcast

Azalin76 wrote: »

Why is it when this game was first announced that one of the big deals they strived for was to not have cookie cutter builds like in WoW. But then they added the weapon and armor passives and now we all have to have the same cookie cutter builds for end gane depending on what role we want to play. They need to make the armor and weapon passives more like class skills and not have them tied to specific armor and weapon types. I think this will open up the game to a whole new world of possibilities for players and actually allow us to build our characters the way we want.

there will always be top builds...you cannot avoid that in any way.

stojekarcub18_ESO

You're just as free as the rest of us to not play cookie cutter builds. Besides, it's delicious, their complaints on the forums when said builds get "nerfed".

SOLDIER_1stClass

I am using a hybrid Nightblade which is currently far from the current meta and I am doing more than fine in PvP and in group content.

I enjoy the way I set up my Nightblade; its a fun versatile way to play for me.

Egonieser

It very much depends on what you want to play.
My goal is pvp and i'm good at it, however to be efficient and powerful there really is only a handful of viable set/skill setups that work with my class (sorcerer) and none of them are my preferred playstyle. When i switch to PvE i instantly swap it all around to my "normal" loadout because it's simple, easy to use and powerful, but in PvP it just doesn't work at all.

Yeah, you can play the way you like, doesn't mean it will work in certain areas. PvP is pretty much about min-maxing, hybrids just get stomped most of the times, and I learned it the hard way.

Ahzek

I play an actual glass canon sorcerer in pvp (that means 9k hardened ward) I use decent stamina regen and champion passives for blockign and dodging to allow myself some more active defenses while most of my build is centered around spelldamage. (Btw im a Khajiit and i wont change that! )
I cant streak as much as others and i cant survive as much damage as others (17k leap crit oneshots ) but i do rather well in open world solo pvp and i was able to deafeat pretty much every dueler if have fought so far (not everyone consistently but it works).
In the end it is very possible to ignore the fotm/cookie cutter builds (at least in pvp) when designing your own setup, but you need to still be aware of what they can do and make up a way to compete with them.

PS: @qsnoopyjr If You really think any of these skills are needed for a decent pvp build im pretty sure you have never left the shadow of the great big blob of CHO CHO and i would advise you to consider trying out another style of pvp that doesnt consist of hammering away at your 2 buttons. You might find some enjoyment (and more " individualism") there .

eliisra

Not sure I fully agree.

For every class there's at least 20-30 skill- and gear combinations that will give good enough PvE dps for dungeons, arena and trials. Different ways to play tank to.

Maybe more cookie cutter limitations for top leaderboard scores. But that's what, like a dozen hardcore guys + their alts up there? Compared to hundred thousands of players doing PvE content with a big variety of builds.

In PvP way more limited for sure. Because "fun" for the masses is usually getting loads of kills, so effective builds comes first. Think the 2-Hander + bow NB probably covers half the PvP population at this point. Zerg blobs are dominated by magicka Proxi bombers and stamina Steel Tornado spammers. Than there's the massive amount of magicka, shield stack, Bolt Escape sorcs in PvP, all doing the same thing and build. But that class has no synergy with anything else or the option just suck, like playing Pokémon Master.

Still, I've seen way more cookie cutter in other games. Where you only had like 1 viable dps spec and everyone hammering the same google macro lol.

kevlarto_ESO

Mitchblue wrote: »

Best way to enjoy a game is play what's fun for you.

This^^^ Seems like some folks play these games and forget about the fun factor, I know fun is a subjective term and fun is different for people, but the basics are still pretty much the same.


I think there will always be cookie cutter builds as long as the passives and specials are different, I would hate to see a game where no matter what class you played it was exactly the same as the other class, that sounds boring to me. I am not a fan of cookie cutter builds, I play what I like but sometimes I have to give in if I want to have any success in the game..

newtinmpls

The_Sadist wrote: »

There will always be cookie cutter builds in any given MMO.

While some builds aren't all that viable e.g. tanking with light armour and duel wield on a Sorcerer using summons, ".

Just saw a video last week where a dude was doing this and it was working awesomely. He was soloing group content if I recall correctly; just awesome.