Nightcapping & Ganking

Olen_Mikko

Why does people complain about nightcapping or ganking, since there's no rules in cyrodiil?

War is won with overwhelming numbers and cunning tactics, where zerging and nightcapping is in big role.

Yes, it is a game, but there's no rules. So QQing about it is useless.

Araxleon

I dont know why people complain about a tug-of-war system in a videogame. Your suppose to lose stuff...Thats the point...

Now on the part of ganking, thats a valid reason for people to complain and QQ, in any game you play where someone one shots you it will make you angry, its only normal soo complaing about ganking is well a perfectly valid reason to complain.

Elsir

The term "nightcapping" is, in itself, a falehood of a label because the game doesn't stop the moment one person/group decides to go to sleep. It's day somewhere in the world and those people aren't going to wait until their night time to make things "fair play" in another's eyes. Just illogical gaming that is. On the same side of the token, the ones claiming "nightcapping" is happening to them are in fact "nightcapping" the very people they're labelling as "nightcappers"

Francis_Toliver

No offense to anyone against one shots, but anyone in a war situation understands what a sniper is and does or should. The idea of complaining about it is a bit infantile.

Want to avoid getting one-shot? Watch your horizons, travel carefully and build your riding stamina. Learn your choke points and be careful around them using your damage shields preemptively and mage-lights to see hidden attackers.

Whining about one shots is like complaining that there are spell casters on the walls of keeps. "Its no fun when you get killed by spell casters!". Well you better learn how to deal with them then. Its no fun to get killed by big o'l fighters with better armor and bigger swords but you don't hear the "thief" style players complaining that heavy armor should be taken out of pvp. Or how about those damn mages?!? Lets get rid of spell casters! Yeah! Those spells are sure not fair!

No one likes to get killed at all, but that is how the game is played. Each class and style of play has its way of fighting and each has its ways to defend against those attacks. If you don't like to practice those "ways" to defend then suffer and die. Just like a thief will die if he or she walks up to a fully armored Templar and tries to act like a fighter to win.

Everything in the game has counters. Better to use them to do well rather then whine about it because you don't want to.

Figure it out.

NukeAllTheThings

Francis_Toliver wrote: »

No offense to anyone against one shots, but anyone in a war situation understands what a sniper is and does or should. The idea of complaining about it is a bit infantile.

Yeah, everyone in a war situation knows that snipers are sitting in stealth in the middle of open fields and in the middle of active combat 20m away.

Ghostbane

Y u take mah farm, I be sleepen yo. Meh flagssss yo.

Hypertionb14_ESO

people complain when they get beat in a way they don't even have a chance to fight back.

which is the entire point of ganking

as for "night capping" thats just people being pissy about nothing.

eNumbra

NukeAllTheThings wrote: »

Francis_Toliver wrote: »

No offense to anyone against one shots, but anyone in a war situation understands what a sniper is and does or should. The idea of complaining about it is a bit infantile.

Yeah, everyone in a war situation knows that snipers are sitting in stealth in the middle of open fields and in the middle of active combat 20m away.

>2015
>Not understanding analogies

SHADOW2KK

Agree with many of the above posts, technically we all night cap, and in real warfare it happens, night raids/offensives etc.

Love how so many rant and cry about nightcapping yet we all do it haha.

In terms of ganking, get over it, if you are unskilled at the game and do not know how to counter or use even basic field craft skills, then sorry.

You deserve to be lit up.

Don`t like it, then get better or go back to boring scripted NPC mechanics in care bear land.

In PvP you are attacking and being attacked by real life players.

There is no fairness in war but victory of the strongest.

bosmern_ESO

I dont think nightcapping is much of an issue anymore, most guilds have spread out to different servers and now there is a somewhat decent population in all servers except Azuras star which is an AD buff server because no one goes on there for whatever reason, and when they do go on, they get wiped 3-4 times then they quit and go to another campaign.

Zhoyzu

that

PaulScelus wrote: »

The term "nightcapping" is, in itself, a falehood of a label because the game doesn't stop the moment one person/group decides to go to sleep. It's day somewhere in the world and those people aren't going to wait until their night time to make things "fair play" in another's eyes. Just illogical gaming that is. On the same side of the token, the ones claiming "nightcapping" is happening to them are in fact "nightcapping" the very people they're labelling as "nightcappers"

is true but when you have a server for one half of the globe and one for the other, there is night on the servers.

Francis_Toliver

NukeAllTheThings wrote: »

Francis_Toliver wrote: »

No offense to anyone against one shots, but anyone in a war situation understands what a sniper is and does or should. The idea of complaining about it is a bit infantile.

Yeah, everyone in a war situation knows that snipers are sitting in stealth in the middle of open fields and in the middle of active combat 20m away.

The argument then is NOT about one shots, but about how stealth is implemented in the game. The limits of server space the lag of having a realistic battle field. Vietnam was not flat and empty and nearly all battle field environments have the capacity for stealth (just ask anyone that spent time in Iraq).

The complaint then is about the limitations of a MMO and not about one shots. Sorry but until siege engines can't be carried in your pocket, your argument is about as valid as mine that "everything" in the game is unrealistic. Every see a child sized person wielding a gigantic two handed sword effectively? Nah, didn't think so. How about rebuilding a keep wall in seconds? Nah, not that either. Hmm, how about dropping burning oil on yourself to kill an enemy while taking no damage yourself? Oh, nope, not that either.

Gee, are those things more or less realistic then hiding in clear sight? Hmmmm. Maybe you need to come up with another argument because your current one sounds a lot like "I don't like this so lets come up with a reason to complain", rather then something that holds logic.

When I was in the army, my drill Sargent managed to hide in plain sight, despite our entire platoon looking for him during an exercise about camouflage (in a gentle dip in the ground, covered in leaves). He sprang up and could have easily killed the folks he wanted to before we had a clue what was happening, and only when he wanted to.

The game is very good and many play styles are represented and represented well. Instead of complaining that a "rook gets to move differently then a bishop" try to learn to play chess.

Elsir

Zhoyzu wrote: »

that

PaulScelus wrote: »

The term "nightcapping" is, in itself, a falehood of a label because the game doesn't stop the moment one person/group decides to go to sleep. It's day somewhere in the world and those people aren't going to wait until their night time to make things "fair play" in another's eyes. Just illogical gaming that is. On the same side of the token, the ones claiming "nightcapping" is happening to them are in fact "nightcapping" the very people they're labelling as "nightcappers"

is true but when you have a server for one half of the globe and one for the other, there is night on the servers.

There are only 2 servers. US and EU. The US one is the most correct one for Oceanic (Australia, etc) so in fact, there is an overlap of night/day and what I said remains true.

NukeAllTheThings

Francis_Toliver wrote: »

NukeAllTheThings wrote: »

Francis_Toliver wrote: »

No offense to anyone against one shots, but anyone in a war situation understands what a sniper is and does or should. The idea of complaining about it is a bit infantile.

Yeah, everyone in a war situation knows that snipers are sitting in stealth in the middle of open fields and in the middle of active combat 20m away.

The argument then is NOT about one shots, but about how stealth is implemented in the game. The limits of server space the lag of having a realistic battle field. Vietnam was not flat and empty and nearly all battle field environments have the capacity for stealth (just ask anyone that spent time in Iraq).

The complaint then is about the limitations of a MMO and not about one shots. Sorry but until siege engines can't be carried in your pocket, your argument is about as valid as mine that "everything" in the game is unrealistic. Every see a child sized person wielding a gigantic two handed sword effectively? Nah, didn't think so. How about rebuilding a keep wall in seconds? Nah, not that either. Hmm, how about dropping burning oil on yourself to kill an enemy while taking no damage yourself? Oh, nope, not that either.

Gee, are those things more or less realistic then hiding in clear sight? Hmmmm. Maybe you need to come up with another argument because your current one sounds a lot like "I don't like this so lets come up with a reason to complain", rather then something that holds logic.

When I was in the army, my drill Sargent managed to hide in plain sight, despite our entire platoon looking for him during an exercise about camouflage (in a gentle dip in the ground, covered in leaves). He sprang up and could have easily killed the folks he wanted to before we had a clue what was happening, and only when he wanted to.

The game is very good and many play styles are represented and represented well. Instead of complaining that a "rook gets to move differently then a bishop" try to learn to play chess.

My statement had nothing to do with whether I like being 1 shot or not, it was about the stupidity of comparing it to anything related to real life to justify your position

Erock25

Francis_Toliver wrote: »

NukeAllTheThings wrote: »

Francis_Toliver wrote: »

No offense to anyone against one shots, but anyone in a war situation understands what a sniper is and does or should. The idea of complaining about it is a bit infantile.

Yeah, everyone in a war situation knows that snipers are sitting in stealth in the middle of open fields and in the middle of active combat 20m away.

The argument then is NOT about one shots, but about how stealth is implemented in the game. The limits of server space the lag of having a realistic battle field. Vietnam was not flat and empty and nearly all battle field environments have the capacity for stealth (just ask anyone that spent time in Iraq).

The complaint then is about the limitations of a MMO and not about one shots. Sorry but until siege engines can't be carried in your pocket, your argument is about as valid as mine that "everything" in the game is unrealistic. Every see a child sized person wielding a gigantic two handed sword effectively? Nah, didn't think so. How about rebuilding a keep wall in seconds? Nah, not that either. Hmm, how about dropping burning oil on yourself to kill an enemy while taking no damage yourself? Oh, nope, not that either.

Gee, are those things more or less realistic then hiding in clear sight? Hmmmm. Maybe you need to come up with another argument because your current one sounds a lot like "I don't like this so lets come up with a reason to complain", rather then something that holds logic.

When I was in the army, my drill Sargent managed to hide in plain sight, despite our entire platoon looking for him during an exercise about camouflage (in a gentle dip in the ground, covered in leaves). He sprang up and could have easily killed the folks he wanted to before we had a clue what was happening, and only when he wanted to.

The game is very good and many play styles are represented and represented well. Instead of complaining that a "rook gets to move differently then a bishop" try to learn to play chess.

When I was in Nam the NBs cloak never bugged!

Francis_Toliver

NukeAllTheThings wrote: »

Francis_Toliver wrote: »

NukeAllTheThings wrote: »

Francis_Toliver wrote: »

No offense to anyone against one shots, but anyone in a war situation understands what a sniper is and does or should. The idea of complaining about it is a bit infantile.

Yeah, everyone in a war situation knows that snipers are sitting in stealth in the middle of open fields and in the middle of active combat 20m away.

The argument then is NOT about one shots, but about how stealth is implemented in the game. The limits of server space the lag of having a realistic battle field. Vietnam was not flat and empty and nearly all battle field environments have the capacity for stealth (just ask anyone that spent time in Iraq).

The complaint then is about the limitations of a MMO and not about one shots. Sorry but until siege engines can't be carried in your pocket, your argument is about as valid as mine that "everything" in the game is unrealistic. Every see a child sized person wielding a gigantic two handed sword effectively? Nah, didn't think so. How about rebuilding a keep wall in seconds? Nah, not that either. Hmm, how about dropping burning oil on yourself to kill an enemy while taking no damage yourself? Oh, nope, not that either.

Gee, are those things more or less realistic then hiding in clear sight? Hmmmm. Maybe you need to come up with another argument because your current one sounds a lot like "I don't like this so lets come up with a reason to complain", rather then something that holds logic.

When I was in the army, my drill Sargent managed to hide in plain sight, despite our entire platoon looking for him during an exercise about camouflage (in a gentle dip in the ground, covered in leaves). He sprang up and could have easily killed the folks he wanted to before we had a clue what was happening, and only when he wanted to.

The game is very good and many play styles are represented and represented well. Instead of complaining that a "rook gets to move differently then a bishop" try to learn to play chess.

My statement had nothing to do with whether I like being 1 shot or not, it was about the stupidity of comparing it to anything related to real life to justify your position

Really? So sword play's inclusion in the game, however unrealistic it is compared to "real life" has nothing to do with real life sword play or its existence in historical combat? Castle walls in the game have nothing to do with real life castle walls in history? The fact that players use siege equipment in the game to assault said castle walls in the game have nothing to do with the fact that siege equipment was used to assault castle walls in real life?

Wow. If I'd only known.

Things in the game mimic (unrealistically) things in real life. Play styles in the game mimic (unrealistically) combat styles in real life. The idea that inclusion of snipers taking one shots at people (in this game) have nothing to do with the type of combat this play style mimics or the fact that this actually happens in real life is....well silly.

Even more silly is the idea that that something occurring historically in combat (from today all the way back to the invention of the bow) would not be referenced in fantasy stories, and therefore would somehow NOT show up in games that mimic real world combat. Of course it will show up. Realistically or not. And of course the reason it shows up IS because it is found (via fantasy stories) in the historical record.

No offense here, but people don't sit around creating combat in a game saying "you know, lets have people pick flowers to destroy those castle walls!" Snipers are in the game because snipers are in the real world. And again, I am not trying to start a fight, but I don't understand what in the world are you thinking?

Lack of realism in the game, because of the limitations of computer technology and needs of game play are game wide so arguing that stealth sniping shouldn't be in the game because of lack of realism doesn't hold water.

Your then (spurious) statement that your comment about stealth sniping being unrealistic was not in fact about being unrealistic but was actually an argument against my supposition that snipers in the game are appropriate because they show up (and have for as long as ranged weapons have existed) in real life combat is equally nonsensical. Of course that is why snipers are in the game. And why its appropriate that they are there. Its a natural extension of the Night Blade class and that element of historical (and fantasy) combat.

Joy_Division

Francis_Toliver wrote: »

NukeAllTheThings wrote: »

Francis_Toliver wrote: »

No offense to anyone against one shots, but anyone in a war situation understands what a sniper is and does or should. The idea of complaining about it is a bit infantile.

Yeah, everyone in a war situation knows that snipers are sitting in stealth in the middle of open fields and in the middle of active combat 20m away.

The argument then is NOT about one shots, but about how stealth is implemented in the game. The limits of server space the lag of having a realistic battle field. Vietnam was not flat and empty and nearly all battle field environments have the capacity for stealth (just ask anyone that spent time in Iraq).

The complaint then is about the limitations of a MMO and not about one shots. Sorry but until siege engines can't be carried in your pocket, your argument is about as valid as mine that "everything" in the game is unrealistic. Every see a child sized person wielding a gigantic two handed sword effectively? Nah, didn't think so. How about rebuilding a keep wall in seconds? Nah, not that either. Hmm, how about dropping burning oil on yourself to kill an enemy while taking no damage yourself? Oh, nope, not that either.

Gee, are those things more or less realistic then hiding in clear sight? Hmmmm. Maybe you need to come up with another argument because your current one sounds a lot like "I don't like this so lets come up with a reason to complain", rather then something that holds logic.

When I was in the army, my drill Sargent managed to hide in plain sight, despite our entire platoon looking for him during an exercise about camouflage (in a gentle dip in the ground, covered in leaves). He sprang up and could have easily killed the folks he wanted to before we had a clue what was happening, and only when he wanted to.

The game is very good and many play styles are represented and represented well. Instead of complaining that a "rook gets to move differently then a bishop" try to learn to play chess.

• Your Drill Sergeant OP
• Bring back ground oils!
• We rooks complain about Queens, not bishops

newtinmpls

This is exactly why I play PvE and not so much PvP.

PVP, like any version of war, is about folks trying their best to hurt/maim/kill (sudden flash to Demolition Man "murder death kill" ... er ... okay I'm better now) anyway to be as mean as possible as effectively as possible.

PvE (especially group delves) is about trying to work together as a team and compliment each other's effectiveness.

I don't like getting attacked. I even spaz out when playing Axis and Allies and my husband attacks my turf. I know my personal limitations.

But to argue that any given move or countermove in a war zone is unfair? .... Nope, don't see it.

Unfun, yes, but not unfair.

defilade__ESO

Araxleon wrote: »

I dont know why people complain about a tug-of-war system in a videogame. Your suppose to lose stuff...Thats the point...

Now on the part of ganking, thats a valid reason for people to complain and QQ, in any game you play where someone one shots you it will make you angry, its only normal soo complaing about ganking is well a perfectly valid reason to complain.

An easy way to fix the insta-kills is to limit the damage done for any crit to 50% of a player's max health. This way a player with 22k health does not get a stealth attack for 17k with a follow-up surprise attack and the guy is dead in under a second.

defilade__ESO

newtinmpls wrote: »

This is exactly why I play PvE and not so much PvP.

PVP, like any version of war, is about folks trying their best to hurt/maim/kill (sudden flash to Demolition Man "murder death kill" ... er ... okay I'm better now) anyway to be as mean as possible as effectively as possible.

PvE (especially group delves) is about trying to work together as a team and compliment each other's effectiveness.

I don't like getting attacked. I even spaz out when playing Axis and Allies and my husband attacks my turf. I know my personal limitations.

But to argue that any given move or countermove in a war zone is unfair? .... Nope, don't see it.

Unfun, yes, but not unfair.

PvP is also about working together with your group, complimenting each other's abilities, strengths and weaknesses, and protecting your teammates to overcome the enemy.

It's so care bear to claim pvp all about hurting and being mean. When you walk into a delve, and kill the humans inside, are you being mean and murdering them? At least in PvP our efforts to capture keeps gives you your precious Cyrodiil buffs to make it easier for you to murder all those poor people inhabiting those delves and trials.

newtinmpls

defilade__ESO wrote: »

When you walk into a delve, and kill the humans inside, are you being mean and murdering them?

When I attack in PvE the game has conveniently set up my opponents as "bad guys" (necromancers, slavers and other clearly 'evil' types). So in the words of Arnold Schwarzenegger in 'True Lies', yes I kill people - but only bad people.

War isn't about killing bad people. It's about doing enough damage to the support population, the supply trains, the resources and so on of the enemy that the country as a whole surrenders.

And as for the various delves - I personally found Toothmaul Gully, and the actions of the altmer so reprehensible that I rolled up a goblin character to be from there (what can I say, I'm a die-hard RPer); and ended up writing fanfic to explain (to myself, if no one else) what I thought should happen in terms of how this tribe were dealt with.

I think there is an important psychological difference between playing "killing bad guys" and simply enjoying killing "people". It squinks me, so I don't care to participate.

YMMV

defilade__ESO

The enemy attacking my keep are already set up as the enemy also, that's why they are red to me. Some times I have friends, even fellow guildies on the opposing faction, and we have fun trying to take keeps from each other, and keeping score.

We also have a guild event, a bi-weekly battle royal, where we have groups go 2v2, or 3v3 pvp and the last man or woman standing for their faction is the victor.

It' a game with a faction vs faction element to it, we have fun. You trying to make pvp to be all about hurting people and causing pain is silliness.

Your problem may be that you take it personally when you are defeated. If you cannot separate play fun from real life, it's your problem, not mine.

I shrug it off, rez, and get back into the fray. I've sent tells to other players who completely owned me in a perfect execution of skills and tactics. Like I said, it's a game. Today I'm in Cyrodiil on AD, and later today i may be on the DC faction - it's fun.

blabafat

Why people complain about nightcapping?
Because they are unaware of the fact that other players might have different time zones

Vizier

NukeAllTheThings wrote: »

Francis_Toliver wrote: »

No offense to anyone against one shots, but anyone in a war situation understands what a sniper is and does or should. The idea of complaining about it is a bit infantile.

Yeah, everyone in a war situation knows that snipers are sitting in stealth in the middle of open fields and in the middle of active combat 20m away.

You mean that stealth ability that EVERYONE has or do you mean cloak? In which case they expend a ton of magika on it so ya, it should work even near combat. In either case your response is... lols. And ya, a good sniper might very well be right under your nose and you'd never know it. At least in ESO you have flares, detection potions, Magelight and AOE spam to flush out those Wraskally Whabbits of the shadows. What are you complaining about again?

newtinmpls

blabafat wrote: »

Why people complain about nightcapping?
Because they are unaware of the fact that other players might have different time zones

I use that to my advantage for some skills. Harvesting nodes at a time when the servers seem to be at a low ebb (in my case, 2-4am local time) works out rather nicely.