Immersive Darkness Concept

Gidorick

Through some discussion on other threads there have been some desires regarding the darkness of ESO’s game world that has come to light. (pun intended).

TL/DR
ESO could have more dynamic environmental light levels with tools and skills that can be used to cope with the darkness.

Immersive Darkness
Some players would like to have darker environments in which to play while other players do not want to have mechanics such as torches forced upon them. There can be mechanics introduced to support both types of players and would allow players to switch back and forth between the two types of play styles.

First and foremost let’s address the environmental light levels. Many players feel as if the overall darkness levels within ESO are entirely too high. Players are able to navigate and see it the darkness without much effort in ESO and a decreased light level would increase immersion and would enhance some of the gameplay mechanics.

For the purpose of this concept, the current levels of darkness are to be considered the measuring stick of the brightest it should naturally be at night.

As suggested in my Environment & Weather Systems Overhaul Concept thread, the over-world lightness levels could be governed by the weather.

• If it’s storming and raining, the light from Masser and Secunda cannot shine through, making it difficult to see.
• If it’s is overcast, the moons of Nirn peek through the clouds to gently light your way.
• If the night is clear the moons shine bright and you can see the path before you easily.

Dungeons and delves could be the areas in which most heinous of the darkened environments are experienced. The light levels of some existing and new dungeons could be lowered so players without illumination assistance would have difficulty.

Radiant Night Vision
Every player that wishes to not use any illuminators should be able to do so, but this decision should come with some consequences. With the exception of specifically designed dungeons and delves, all players should be able to make their way in the dark. A radius of dull illumination should surround the player. As the player moves, the illumination should fade and the radius should decrease. The faster the player moves the more quickly the radiant night vision should diminish. Once the player stops or slows it should take a moment for the character’s eyes to reacclimate to the night by the radius and the illumination increasing.

The radiant night vision of a normal player who is walking under a clear night sky should be very similar to ESO’s current night illumination. A player that sprints at full speed in the dark without any illumination would find themselves running blindly, unless they are under a clear night sky.

Radiant night vision would effectively encourage players to act more carefully while it's dark out and they are not using illuminators.

Night Eye Ability
Khajiit, Vampires, and Werewolves should all have an innate Night Eye ability that enables them to see more clearly in the dark. This is not an activated ability and activates when the illumination of an area is under a certain threshold.

• Khajiit: +50% Illumination / +25% Radius
• Vampire: +40% Illumination / +20% Radius
• Werewolf: +30% Illumination / +15% Radius

Night eye should cast a dull gray light into the dark making everything illuminated appear in a sort of gray-scale.

Khajiit’s Racial Passive Stealthy could be changed to:

• Night Stalker
  • 50% visibility at night (as outlined above)
  • Increases Damage done while in stealth by 3%

Illuminators
The darkness could also be kept at bay by using any of the following:

• Torches: Consumable item varies in illumination, radius, and duration. Casts natural light to illuminate the night.
• Magelight: Cast-able Mages Guild Skill, casts a piercing white light into the darkness. The greater the skill the greater the effect.
• Almalexia’s Enchanted Lantern: A trophy that creates a blue light that washes into the black abyss.
• NightEye Potion: Consumable, higher quality increases illumination, radius, and duration.
• Ring of the Night-Eye: Special rings which can grant Night Eye when worn. +20% Illumination / +10% Radius.
• Weapon Enchantments: Elemental weapon enchantments should also be able to fight back the darkness, but none as effectively as the lowest quality torch
  • Frost: Casts a soft blue glow around the character
  • Fire: Casts a warm yellow light across the ground
  • Shock: Casts a stark white light into the darkness

The most natural light available should be through the torches. A player using multiple illumination methods wouldn’t have a combined illumination effect but would instead see the effect which takes precedence.

Nighteye<Magelight<Almalexia’s Enchanted Lantern<Torches

Torches and Night Eye Potions would both be bought from merchants and through the Crown Store while Rings of the Night-Eye would only be purchased through the Crown Store.

Torches would be the most powerful of all the illumination methods and Nighteye would be the ONLY illumination method which cannot be seen by other players.

A current discussion on torches can be found here: http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/155836/the-need-for-functional-torches

Thoughts?

PKMN12

cannot happen, weather and lighting is already done, trying to fix that in an MMO is not fun.

secondly, anything that impedes combat would not be used by anyone decent so.

Eseentialy most of this would require WAY too much work for not only no gain, but also gain A LOT of hate from the MMO side of the community and/or the people on the fence of TES/MMO.

mtwiggz

This is an awesome concept.

Unfortunately lighting and shadows is something ESO got incredibly wrong from the get go. If you recall not too many months ago they released a lighting patch. As this helped with some things in the game - it also made the lag and FPS drop for many players when it was released.

Anywho, if they could properly bring a concept like this into the game, without further destroying FPS, I would be completely onboard. Also if it was optional. I'm mostly blind in one eye due to a chemical accident at work, which makes it very difficult for me to see at night. This dilemma carries over into video games as well. The darker things are the less I can see. Which would completely gimp my playing.

Great idea. I'd like to see more environmental effects in the world of Tamriel.

Psychobunni

I played TES on console and I know I got around darkness in Oblivion by the brightness slider, my husband actually pointed that out to me. I cant remember if it worked in Skyrim or not, I never finished that one....anyway sure it would be okay optionally after 100 other fixes/additions. I just don't get as immersed as some and likely never will in the Tamriel universe, but I'm not against any *optional* additions that help others immerse themselves in the game

Gidorick

Psychobunni wrote: »

I played TES on console and I know I got around darkness in Oblivion by the brightness slider, my husband actually pointed that out to me. I cant remember if it worked in Skyrim or not, I never finished that one....anyway sure it would be okay optionally after 100 other fixes/additions. I just don't get as immersed as some and likely never will in the Tamriel universe, but I'm not against any *optional* additions that help others immerse themselves in the game

I actually use the darkness slider to make the game a bit darker than it's recommended. I think that might be a good solution for those that don't want to use torches and such... just make the game brighter using the slider.

+1 insightful.

Taleof2Cities

Great idea.

I used several lighting mods in Skyrim and found this pic below to be one that illustrates many of the items OP has described.

- If the night is clear the moons shine bright and you can see the path before you easily.
- The solitary guard, here, has a torch to illuminate the immediate surroundings.
- Masser is out but setting ... still the stars are shining to a good degree.

I might add that night eye potions, spells, and racials go back through the Elder Scrolls games and lore. The concept isn't new ... so adding it to ESO would be interesting and in line with the series.

While this concept would be great for PvE ... one other poster has noted some valid PvP issues surrounding such a change. Indeed, Cyrodiil is saddled with bouts of lag at the moment. Therefore, adding lighting that might increase the lag would not be welcomed by the PvP community. In addition, others may cry foul because they are not one of the three races that have vision enhancement. Interesting discussion to pursue at least.



Please click the link ... as the image is showing a bit darker when displayed in the thread.

Gidorick

That is beautiful @Taleof2Cities. If ESO could capture that atmosphere I would be a happy camper!

KerinKor

Gidorick wrote: »

Thoughts?

Since you seem to be re-posting this subject around here let me also spam my reply I've made in your other thread about this:

No thanks, torches and dark places are a PITA that I can live without.

And please, don't plead realism, there are a million 'real' things missing in games and the games are far better without them.

Gidorick

KerinKor wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

Thoughts?

Since you seem to be re-posting this subject around here let me also spam my reply I've made in your other thread about this:

No thanks, torches and dark places are a PITA that I can live without.

And please, don't plead realism, there are a million 'real' things missing in games and the games are far better without them.

Lol. did you even read this post? The last post was about torches, this is about how the world could be darker so that torches and other forms of illumination could be a meaningful part of gameplay.

and again. I'm not pleading "Realism"... I'm pleading "Elder-Scrollsism" The only reason I stray from just saying "Make it dark... REALLY dark" is that people complain that they don't want to be bothered, so this concept enables players who don't want to deal with torches and the like to play without them.

Don't worry though... this concept has about a 0.0001% chance of ever being anything more than a silly little post on this form.

jackleminer55

While I love this concept, there are a few glaring issues that would need to be addressed.

Say you are walking around at midnight, or are in a cave. You do not have the Night Eye perk, or any of the other means of lighting, so you pull out a torch. You are walking with your torch, and then another player who clearly does not have Night Eye or any other form of lighting runs by. This is very immersion breaking as you say, "How the *&#$ can he see?" It would just be kind of weird. So would be the random glow that just seeps out of you character.

Also, what happens when you get into a fight??????? The torch will just disappear and the light will be gone?

I feel that the best solution for this would be to have a toggle for it to be automatic or manual. You could have a lantern attached to your body to provide light that would automatically go on as it gets darker, or you can pull out a torch. Obviously there would need to be some tweaks, but I think it is better than the alternative.

What do you think @Gidorick?

Gidorick

The random glow you speak of @jackleminer55, is that the aura that surrounds other players and NPCs? I turn that crap off. I hate that. but I would think that the radius that you can see that glow would be dependent on your visibility radius so, if you can't see them with nighteye/torch, then you wont see their glow. I guess that would be part of the "darkness mechanics"

As for the fighting, if torches are able to be slotted as a shield or second hand weapon then they can be held during combat and even used as a somewhat ineffective shield.

Now, you're probably thinking "but Gid, wouldn't that mean that sword and board and dual wielders have an advantage? To that I would say... not really.

There are alternative forms of illumination, I called them illuminators. I just realized, however I didn't include an illuminator! I'm going to add the following to the list.

Weapon Enchantments: Elemental weapon enchantments should also be able to fight back the darkness, but none as effectively as the lowest quality torch

• Frost: Casts a soft blue glow around the character
• Fire: Casts a warm yellow light across the ground
• Shock: Casts a stark white light into the darkness

CJohnson81

I just stumbled on this old thread and I like the idea. In Oblivion, the darkness was something you had to deal with, especially in caves. I think that could be brought into ESO as well. I like having tough decisions in my games, and deciding whether to wear a ring of night-eye versus a health boon, would be great.

Kalifas

jackleminer55 wrote: »

While I love this concept, there are a few glaring issues that would need to be addressed.

Say you are walking around at midnight, or are in a cave. You do not have the Night Eye perk, or any of the other means of lighting, so you pull out a torch. You are walking with your torch, and then another player who clearly does not have Night Eye or any other form of lighting runs by. This is very immersion breaking as you say, "How the *&#$ can he see?" It would just be kind of weird. So would be the random glow that just seeps out of you character.

Also, what happens when you get into a fight??????? The torch will just disappear and the light will be gone?

I feel that the best solution for this would be to have a toggle for it to be automatic or manual. You could have a lantern attached to your body to provide light that would automatically go on as it gets darker, or you can pull out a torch. Obviously there would need to be some tweaks, but I think it is better than the alternative.

What do you think @Gidorick?

Easy fix, have lantern amulets that provide torch light. Then you wouldn't have to drop it to fight. You don't need any glow seeping out of your character. All that matters is whether he sees you and that could be shown with the eye symbol dimming or brightening based off lighted surroundings.

I would like to see this concept go beyond normal lighting and perhaps have special magic that allow you to see hidden doors, puzzles, writings, or footsteps of previous travelers.



Any environmental subtleties that come into play add replayability and make each environment have a unique flavor that a static world lacks. Keep the ideas coming Gidorick!

NotSo

Why haven't you been hired by the ESO team yet?

JamilaRaj

At some point, Gidorick stopped using the word "monetization" in his Whatever Concept or Whatever Overhaul threads. Whether this means he has abandoned his silly idea, that ZOS's problem is just lack of money and that more monetization = more money = better game, remains unclear, but certainly "monetization" would have more likely landed him a job at ZOS.

Ra'Shtar

Gidorick wrote: »

Khajiit’s Racial Passive Stealthy could be changed to:

• Night Stalker
  • 50% visibility at night (as outlined above)
  • Increases Damage done while in stealth by 3%

But i don't wanna be a stalker!

shugg

Love the concept, reminds me of dragons dogma and hell yer I would love to do a dungeon like this however like others have said lights are already done.

Gidorick

JamilaRaj wrote: »

At some point, Gidorick stopped using the word "monetization" in his Whatever Concept or Whatever Overhaul threads. Whether this means he has abandoned his silly idea, that ZOS's problem is just lack of money and that more monetization = more money = better game, remains unclear, but certainly "monetization" would have more likely landed him a job at ZOS.

Pretty much all my concepts include crown store suggestions at the end of the post. I haven't given up that ZOS needs to make money. It's the nature of the beast after all. That being said, it still saddens me that they abandoned the sub model.

NotSo wrote: »

Why haven't you been hired by the ESO team yet?

And nope @NotSo . No job offers. I'm probably too "passionate" for them. Heheh.

RAGUNAnoOne

I thought weather was on the client end not the server this may be unfair if someone gets a storm and someone else gets clear skies.

Gidorick

You are right @RAGUNAnoOne , that is why in my Environment & Weather Systems Overhaul Concept thread (that I made sure to link in the OP of this thread) the very first thing I suggest is:

Gidorick wrote: »

1. Synchronization of Weather: The weather for one player really should be the weather for all players in the zone. Gone should be the days of playing in a group and one member is experiencing a thunderstorm and another is experiencing a bright and sunny day. Having this simple enhancement would open the game up for some game-changing mechanics such as…

This thread really is an expansion of one of the bullet points of that parent thread.

MornaBaine

I love these ideas Gid! But honestly, I'd be excited if they'd just do TWO things.
1. Make day and night in the game of equal length! This 2 hours of "darkness" to 4 hours of daylight is just stupid.
2. Move the weather to server side rather than client side! Countless are the times I've been experiencing a sunny day only to look over at my husband's screen while are characters our right next to each other just to see it be raining for him or vice versa! Since we, the players, have ZERO control over the weather we are experiencing there is absolutely no excuse for this. It's...just stupid.

Gidorick

MornaBaine wrote: »

I love these ideas Gid! But honestly, I'd be excited if they'd just do TWO things.
1. Make day and night in the game of equal length! This 2 hours of "darkness" to 4 hours of daylight is just stupid.
2. Move the weather to server side rather than client side! Countless are the times I've been experiencing a sunny day only to look over at my husband's screen while are characters our right next to each other just to see it be raining for him or vice versa! Since we, the players, have ZERO control over the weather we are experiencing there is absolutely no excuse for this. It's...just stupid.

Check out the Environment & Weather Systems Overhaul Concept thread I linked in the OP @MornaBaine Many of the tangential themes of having immersive darkness are covered in that thread, including the problem with the length of day/night... I have a different suggestion that you may like. Check it out under the "Day/Night Length Adjustment" section of that thread.

altemriel

this tread can not be necroed, it is never outdated as it is a brillant idea