Cheap Palomino!

NovaMarx · May 2015

Dear ZOS,

I feel like I have been had

Back in may last year (4th of may 2014, to be exact), I bought the Palomino horse for 90 DKK (12,06 EUR), because I thought it would be a limited mount.

Now, a year later, you have brought it back - now in the Crown Store. I really don't mind that it no longer is a limited item. I do however mind that I have paid much more than it is worth! It costs 900 Crowns in the Crown Store, and you can buy 750 Crowns for 53 DKK (7,10 EUR) or 1500 Crowns for 99 DKK (13,26). That is quite cheaper!

If you absolutely have to re-sell limited items, at least make sure that they are priced the same as the original offer - or else you risk, like now, that people feel cheated. I bought the senche leopard mount when it was limited, for 2500 Crowns - will you be re-selling it at half-price in the future too? If so, I see no point in buying limited over-priced items.

I love the game. I subscribe, and will keep doing so. But I must admit a bit of respect has been lost. This is no way to create a loyal fanbase!

Please take this into consideration next time you decide to do something similar. Thank you

(Now I shall return to playing the game, and try not to get annoyed at my horse...)

Valymer · May 2015

But people will argue that you paid more to have exclusive access to the mount from the time it was released until the time it was re-released.

And I'm not sure whether that is a valid argument, although it holds true in business and commerce in general.

NovaMarx · May 2015

Valymer wrote: »

But people will argue that you paid more to have exclusive access to the mount from the time it was released until the time it was re-released.

And I'm not sure whether that is a valid argument, although it holds true in business and commerce in general.

I can understand that argument, since exclusive access of course costs more.
But that shouldn't be applied to "limited" items - the word itself is indicative of it being a limited offer, so people will of course pay more to get it. But then re-releasing the item, and no longer as limited, and then cheaper.... well, it just bugs me

KanedaSyndrome · May 2015

Valymer wrote: »

But people will argue that you paid more to have exclusive access to the mount from the time it was released until the time it was re-released.

And I'm not sure whether that is a valid argument, although it holds true in business and commerce in general.

Imo, that's a weak argument. Whenever a game company re-releases an item that was supposed to be a limited offer they do wrong by their customers. As was stated in the OT, why would people invest in supposedly limited offers if they know that ZOS is likely to re-release the same item later on, just cheaper, removing the exclusivity of said item?

In my oppinion ZOS is showcasing very poor business ethics here.

Rosveen · May 2015

KanedaSyndrome wrote: »

Valymer wrote: »

But people will argue that you paid more to have exclusive access to the mount from the time it was released until the time it was re-released.

And I'm not sure whether that is a valid argument, although it holds true in business and commerce in general.

Imo, that's a weak argument. Whenever a game company re-releases an item that was supposed to be a limited offer they do wrong by their customers. As was stated in the OT, why would people invest in supposedly limited offers if they know that ZOS is likely to re-release the same item later on, just cheaper, removing the exclusivity of said item?

In my oppinion ZOS is showcasing very poor business ethics here.

The Palomino was never a one time offer and neither was the senche, despite being advertised as such. ZOS already said they might re-release it. You just know this might is as good as will, it's a matter of time.

About the OP's issue, prices change own over time, nothing new here. The game itself is now much cheaper than it used to, does it feel unfair to you too? The palomino wasn't priced in crowns before, it is now, this alone means it won't be the exact equivalent. It's priced in line with other horse skins. You say it's cheaper, I say it's more expensive if the horse is everything I want. I have to buy 1500 crowns at the minimum to buy it, making it a 13+ euro purchase. When Bioware made me use this wretched system, I had leftover points wasting on my account for years. I think they're still there, in fact.

Varicite · May 2015

Misleading and a bit shady? Yes.

The first time ZOS has done something like this? Lol, no.

Get used to it.

Nothing exclusive is ever actually going to be exclusive in this game.

NovaMarx · May 2015

I am well aware that "limited" is a fluid term. I am just annoyed at having paid more for an item, under the pretenses of it being limited. It just ruins the whole "exclusivity" thing. Either it's limited, or it's not. (Other games/MMOs have actual limited items, so why can't ESO?)

*Sigh*
It may not be the first or last time this happens, but it doesn't mean I have to like it. Accept/bear it maybe, but not like it

Turelus · May 2015

I thought the same when I saw the price of it. It used to be £9.99 here in the UK and when I saw the new value I realised how much ZOS were going to upset those who paid for it.

Personally I feel this is the price it should have been all along, instead of half the price of the Imperial Edition.

Darkonflare15 · May 2015

To be honest, I bought the Palomino Horse before the buy 2 play change and I kind of figure it was going to be cheaper because of the crown store and it took too long for it to pop up in the crown store. Before it was kind of sparse advertising addition to the game. Most people did not even see this horse or they felt they did not want to pay extra money for this horse. Most people either had the imperial horse because it was a cheap horse and you can easily get it at the beginning of the game if you order the imperial edition.

The simple horse(The Sorrel Horse) because it was the cheapest of horses to buy ingame without the imperial edition and the Light horse(Bay Dun Horse) because it had the best speed ingame. I felt that the palomino horse kind of looked better than most that were in game and it definitely looked better than the imperial horse. It felt special because other than imperial edition this was the only other item in the store. Now that it is in the crown store, it is along with a bunch of other horse skins. It is not that special anymore so it kind of has a depreciated price. So that is just my take on why the price is cheaper now.

Danikat · May 2015

As far as I remember they never claimed the Palomino was going to be a limited offer.

It was up for sale continuously from the time it was first added to the site, and only made unavailable briefly for the transition to the crown store. Admittedly that was longer than I expected (I thought it would be one of the first items they added) but it was still only a temporary unavailability. If they hadn't dropped subs and added the crown store it would probably have been on sale on the site the entire time.

I can see how the price drop is an issue, although it would also have looked strange if it cost more than the other horses (IMO the real issue is that it was over priced originally). But if you're disappointed that other people can get it then you misunderstood what you were buying.

Sevalaricgirl · May 2015

I paid for the palomino day one but it doesn't bother me that they now have it in the store and it doesn't bother me that I paid more than others.

Sandmanninja · May 2015

What about the people that bought and leveled 3 separate horses? Do they get a refund?
No.

It's a game. Those are cosmetic items.

If I go to a store and buy something, then it gets discontinued for a bit, then a similar item is released a few months later, do I have reason to complain?

It's a generic mount with a skin.

I have the loyalty reward mount/pets and I don't complain when a similar model is released.

Psychobunni · May 2015

NovaMarx wrote: »

I love the game. I subscribe, and will keep doing so. But I must admit a bit of respect has been lost. This is no way to create a loyal fanbase!

Let me first say I'm not trying to flame. but from a business stand point, you just negated your complaint. You basically said, I'm upset, I don't like this but I will keep paying you anyway....so why would they change anything? Things change when it costs a business money instead of earning it.

Gidorick · May 2015

Psychobunni wrote: »

NovaMarx wrote: »

I love the game. I subscribe, and will keep doing so. But I must admit a bit of respect has been lost. This is no way to create a loyal fanbase!

Let me first say I'm not trying to flame. but from a business stand point, you just negated your complaint. You basically said, I'm upset, I don't like this but I will keep paying you anyway....so why would they change anything? Things change when it costs a business money instead of earning it.

That is pretty much the thought that finally got me to unsubscribe. On one hand I want to support ZOS but the other I want the game to grow. In the end, I'm dissatisfied with the state of the game and the only true way I can voice that to ZOS is by stop committing my money to them. I'll pay for the work they do, not the work they have yet to do.

Attorneyatlawl · May 2015

Hey, you got a year of it being exclusive. Closed beta testers got a monkey promised for launch, which was then handed out to hundreds of thousands of one-night or weekend stress testers before the game came out too, making it extremely common and defeating the point of it being a "thank you" for helping in closed beta testing.

Attorneyatlawl · May 2015

Psychobunni wrote: »

NovaMarx wrote: »

I love the game. I subscribe, and will keep doing so. But I must admit a bit of respect has been lost. This is no way to create a loyal fanbase!

Let me first say I'm not trying to flame. but from a business stand point, you just negated your complaint. You basically said, I'm upset, I don't like this but I will keep paying you anyway....so why would they change anything? Things change when it costs a business money instead of earning it.

True on the surface, for sure. I agree with your signature completely... start pushing out some of the actual gameplay content we were told to expect in 2014 to us (hopefully without a cash shop cost for ones like wrothgar and the imperial city given we all subscribed while it was being made ready and it was slated for release long before the buy to play changeover) and my wallet will open for crowns. Until then, the 8900 crowns I have left over from pre existing subscription time will stay put and I wœnt be buying more... admittedly the guar mounts are cute though, but gameplay content and additions are what I want to actually buy. Prompter bug fixes would help sway me, also

NovaMarx · May 2015

Psychobunni wrote: »

Let me first say I'm not trying to flame. but from a business stand point, you just negated your complaint. You basically said, I'm upset, I don't like this but I will keep paying you anyway....so why would they change anything? Things change when it costs a business money instead of earning it.

I understand how you may perceive it as I'm negating my complaint, but I am not going to rage like others and threaten to stop subscribing because things don't go my way.
I am only stating that I am annoyed, and that I believe that the thought process behind some of the decisions ZOS make should be reevaluated. I believe the best approach is constructive criticism of their ideas.

That being said, I do not dismiss the idea of unsubscribing in the future, if I feel I no longer am getting full value for my money, and no longer wish to support the game financially. I am just not going to use it as a part of my argument.

NewBlacksmurf · May 2015

Valymer wrote: »

But people will argue that you paid more to have exclusive access to the mount from the time it was released until the time it was re-released.

And I'm not sure whether that is a valid argument, although it holds true in business and commerce in general.

I bought it along with the Imperial horse and was very happy to have it exclusively

Not bothered by it coming back....as I'm now riding the exclusive senche (the other one) until it comes back

Carnagan · May 2015

I have to admit that I don't see this why this is unique. It's pretty much par for the course in the gaming industry. Hell, it's par for the course in the electronics industry. I don't get upset that a game/add-on/computer that I bought when it came out drops in price a year down the road.

As to why the Imperial Edition is still around the same price, well, better selling games stay at full price much longer than games that sell fewer copies. Imperial Edition sells better than the Palomino so they're dropping the price to match the market.

That's what happens for early adopters. They pay more for the same product in order to get it quickly.

MCMancub · May 2015

I will never understand why some players need this "exclusivity" aspect in video games, all for the sake of feeling more elite than another player. Not so they can be competitively better, just so they can feel better. It's a video game! Let people enjoy it for crying out loud.

pugyourself · May 2015

NovaMarx wrote: »

Dear ZOS,

I feel like I have been had

Back in may last year (4th of may 2014, to be exact), I bought the Palomino horse for 90 DKK (12,06 EUR), because I thought it would be a limited mount.

Now, a year later, you have brought it back - now in the Crown Store. I really don't mind that it no longer is a limited item. I do however mind that I have paid much more than it is worth! It costs 900 Crowns in the Crown Store, and you can buy 750 Crowns for 53 DKK (7,10 EUR) or 1500 Crowns for 99 DKK (13,26). That is quite cheaper!

If you absolutely have to re-sell limited items, at least make sure that they are priced the same as the original offer - or else you risk, like now, that people feel cheated. I bought the senche leopard mount when it was limited, for 2500 Crowns - will you be re-selling it at half-price in the future too? If so, I see no point in buying limited over-priced items.

I love the game. I subscribe, and will keep doing so. But I must admit a bit of respect has been lost. This is no way to create a loyal fanbase!

Please take this into consideration next time you decide to do something similar. Thank you

(Now I shall return to playing the game, and try not to get annoyed at my horse...)

You need to tell us what happened to exchange rates during the period if you want us to take you seriously.

Ley · May 2015

Saw this coming..

Ley wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

I really wouldn't expect the palomino horse to be priced as one of their mounts that's supposed to be special and rare. The new guar will probably be priced as the existing guars, and the palomino will probably be priced as the other regular horses.

I agree with your assumption. I am however not looking forward to all the outrage and complaining that is going to come from them lowering the price of the horse, if you're right, but see no reason why it should be any more expensive than existing horses.

Danikat · May 2015

I actually wonder how many players have taken the time to calculate the price of individual items in the crown shop. I don't think it's a straight forward conversion from most currencies (definitely not from pounds to crowns). It's not difficult with a calculator, but not something most people could do in their head quickly.

Especially since many people seem to focus on the price of the smallest crown pack they need to have enough for the item they're buying (which will vary depending on how many crowns they have left on their account, and will likely leave them with some left over again) rather than the actual price of the item.

I think that's part of why there were more negative reactions to the price of the leopard than the nightmare horse. Many people got the nightmare horse with their free crowns, so to them it was free. Whereas the leopard came out when most people had spent some/all of them and before most subscribers got their next batch, which meant far more people were looking at spending real money to get it and actually considering how much money it would cost them.

Add to that the fact that most people probably didn't look at the store page on the website a lot after buying the game to be reminded of the price (before the crown store the only things on there were the Imperial edition upgrade and the Palomino) and I'd guess a lot of people probably don't realise the price has changed at all.

Daya · May 2015

N/A

Varicite · May 2015

MCMancub wrote: »

I will never understand why some players need this "exclusivity" aspect in video games, all for the sake of feeling more elite than another player. Not so they can be competitively better, just so they can feel better. It's a video game! Let people enjoy it for crying out loud.

See, when they advertise something as exclusive and you buy it and then they turn around and make it non-exclusive, that is called: misleading.

When I pay for something that isn't what I was told I was paying for, I'm probably going to be upset.

Ley · May 2015

Varicite wrote: »

MCMancub wrote: »

I will never understand why some players need this "exclusivity" aspect in video games, all for the sake of feeling more elite than another player. Not so they can be competitively better, just so they can feel better. It's a video game! Let people enjoy it for crying out loud.

See, when they advertise something as exclusive and you buy it and then they turn around and make it non-exclusive, that is called: misleading.

When I pay for something that isn't what I was told I was paying for, I'm probably going to be upset.

You payed for a light brown horse, you got a light brown horse. It was available for purchase for around a year? I think, at the very least for 6 months or so; hardly a limited edition. It was "exclusive" to those willing to pay real money for it, and it still is.

Danikat · May 2015

Varicite wrote: »

MCMancub wrote: »

I will never understand why some players need this "exclusivity" aspect in video games, all for the sake of feeling more elite than another player. Not so they can be competitively better, just so they can feel better. It's a video game! Let people enjoy it for crying out loud.

See, when they advertise something as exclusive and you buy it and then they turn around and make it non-exclusive, that is called: misleading.

When I pay for something that isn't what I was told I was paying for, I'm probably going to be upset.

As I said earlier I don't remember them ever claiming it was exclusive. If I'm remembering wrong please do correct me, I can't say I followed every single announcement ZOS made at the time. But the fact that it was sold on the website continuously from when it was introduced to when they made the switch to the crown store suggests to me that it wasn't intended to be exclusive. The only limitation on who could get it was who was willing to pay for it.

Varicite · May 2015

Ley wrote: »

Varicite wrote: »

MCMancub wrote: »

I will never understand why some players need this "exclusivity" aspect in video games, all for the sake of feeling more elite than another player. Not so they can be competitively better, just so they can feel better. It's a video game! Let people enjoy it for crying out loud.

See, when they advertise something as exclusive and you buy it and then they turn around and make it non-exclusive, that is called: misleading.

When I pay for something that isn't what I was told I was paying for, I'm probably going to be upset.

You payed for a light brown horse, you got a light brown horse. It was available for purchase for around a year? I think, at the very least for 6 months or so; hardly a limited edition. It was "exclusive" to those willing to pay real money for it, and it still is.

I didn't buy it, but I was referring more to the @MCMancub who was talking specifically about players who "need" exclusivity in games.

As I stated earlier, ZOS has a track record of taking "exclusives" and doling them out later on, when they did specifically say that something would be an "exclusive bonus".

In cases like that, it's entirely misleading and people who paid for what was advertised as being "exclusive" have every right to be upset that they were duped.

Mataata · May 2015

I'm glad it's cheaper. Charging that much for a pretty mount was crazy.

Acrolas · May 2015

This one's tricky. I don't think ZeniMax ever said the mount was limited when it was released. Just that it was a post-launch mount option.

But official support says the Palomino was "available for a limited time" instead of using a more accurate phrase such as "temporarily discontinued upon the release of ESO:TU." That would far more accurately describe both the Palomino and the digital Imperial upgrade.
https://help.elderscrollsonline.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/6491

I can definitely see the argument that the Palomino should be at least 1500 crowns. Even without the fire-farting appeal of the Courser, the Palomino is good-looking enough to establish its own mid-price horse category that the Imperial Horse could also be added to.

JoffyToffy69 · May 2015

There were several posts by moderators etc saying that the horse will not return. Surprise! It did.

I feel somewhat cheated too.
I hope for this game to continue for a long time, just like WoW has.
They have mounts that now, since being such a long time, are extremely rare.

I was hoping to get ahead start in the ESO exclusivity.
I hope in 10yrs time, the BETA monkeys would be rare(ish) and other more so exclusive items such as the loyalty rewards and (prior to this) the Palamino would be extreme rarities.

I guess we will see.