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Subscription Re-Modeling

c.p.garrett1993_ESO
Before continuing allow me to outline the current subscription model:
  • 1,500 Monthly Crowns
  • Full DLC Access (Active Subscription Required)
  • 10% Bonus Character Progression

This is offered for $14.99/ Month ($13.99/ 3 Months -or- $12.99/ 6 Months). This matches the cost of 1,500 Crowns at $14.99.
The bonus DLC access and 10% character progression is absolutely free. No extra cost involved.

In order to keep all these benefits and add more the subscription cost would need to be increased.
I understand and fully support subscription bonuses but I also firmly believe that you deserve nothing more than the next customer. You cannot ask to pay the same as others and get more, especially when you may be paying less if you have bought bulk membership or the other person is regularly buying more in crowns.

The current subscription model is unappealing. I will give you that. If, like myself, you are not interested in the crown store than I can see why you feel cheated (active subscribers) or uninterested (non-subscribers). In order for more benefits to be included in the subscription bonuses you must be realistic and include one of the following, otherwise your requests are unrealistic:
  • Reduce/ Eliminate Crowns from the list of perks.
  • Increase the subscription cost if you want to keep the 1,500 monthly crowns. You can not expect more for the same cost.
  • Reduce the cost of crowns. As things presently stand I do not believe they are worth the current asking price.
Take your pick. You can't expect more for the same price.

As an example:
  • 500 Crowns
  • 10% Progression Bonus
  • DLC Access (Active Subscription Required)
  • Loyalty Bonuses
  • Exclusive Content
  • Increased Priority
Priced at $9.99 would provide some enticing bonuses, draw more players in, and help increase crown sales for those interested.

This is just a random idea and not intended as a fully thought-out concept that should be implemented. Players may be interested in alternative bonuses or more at the current $14.99 model.

TL; DR: Don't ask for more when others are paying the same. Adjust the price/ benefits of your requests fairly.
  • Heromofo
    Heromofo
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  • c.p.garrett1993_ESO
    Heromofo wrote: »
    -disagree

    I'm not sure if you're trolling or you just don't feel like contributing to the topic.
    Thanks for the free bump either way.
    If you are being serious you should elaborate.
    Do you think subscribers deserve more for less? Or do you think the current model is fine as is?
    If you're disagreeing with my suggestion for an alternative model, it was merely an example and not intended as a legitimate model that should be put into effect.
    Edited by c.p.garrett1993_ESO on April 30, 2015 2:25PM
  • Heromofo
    Heromofo
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    Heromofo wrote: »
    -disagree

    I'm not sure if you're trolling or you just don't feel like contributing to the topic.
    Thanks for the free bump either way.
    If you are being serious you should elaborate.
    Do you think subscribers deserve more for less? Or do you think the current model is fine as is?
    If you're disagreeing with my suggestion for an alternative model, it was merely an example and not intended as a legitimate model that should be put into effect.

    Well it was a free bump was waiting to see what people would say in regards to this.
    For me i would have to explain abit:
    At work me and my work partner spend alot of time reving people up for eso console mainly ps4.
    We talk alot about subbing and we even agree its not worth subbing at all atm.
    Alot of feedback came down to these suggestions if you would like to see.

    1. Each month they could give x amount of gold to the subber
    2. If someone was to sub for 6 months then any dlc in that time should become their's after it finishes also more character slots.
    3. Subscribers could be boosted by giving 2 extra slots for characters, 50 percent more bag/bank stuff and dlc becomes yours over time the more you sub.
    4. Last but not least a reward for subbing for 3 months and 6 months.
    Edited by Heromofo on April 30, 2015 2:34PM
  • Aett_Thorn
    Aett_Thorn
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    Subscription has a benefit to any company: it is stable, expected money. As such, it is BETTER than burst income. Therefore, they SHOULD get more benefits than someone just making one-time purchases.

    This is why long-term subscriptions, even with their reduced cost per month, still get the 1,500 crown points per month, not a reduced amount.
  • c.p.garrett1993_ESO
    Heromofo wrote: »
    Heromofo wrote: »
    -disagree

    I'm not sure if you're trolling or you just don't feel like contributing to the topic.
    Thanks for the free bump either way.
    If you are being serious you should elaborate.
    Do you think subscribers deserve more for less? Or do you think the current model is fine as is?
    If you're disagreeing with my suggestion for an alternative model, it was merely an example and not intended as a legitimate model that should be put into effect.

    Well it was a free bump was waiting to see what people would say in regards to this.
    For me i would have to explain abit:
    At work me and my work partner spend alot of time reving people up for eso console mainly ps4.
    We talk alot about subbing and we even agree its not worth subbing at all atm.
    Alot of feedback came down to these suggestions if you would like to see.

    1. Each month they could give x amount of gold to the subber
    2. If someone was to sub for 6 months then any dlc in that time should become their's after it finishes also more character slots.
    3. Subscribers could be boosted by giving 2 extra slots for characters, 50 percent more bag/bank stuff and dlc becomes yours over time the more you sub.
    4. Last but not least a reward for subbing for 3 months and 6 months.

    Good idea. Completely acceptable.
    My only point is only that you cannot ask for more and request the current crown allotment stays and the price doesn't increase. It just isn't fair to those that purchase crowns or logical from the business stand-point.

    Aett_Thorn wrote: »
    Subscription has a benefit to any company: it is stable, expected money. As such, it is BETTER than burst income. Therefore, they SHOULD get more benefits than someone just making one-time purchases.

    This is why long-term subscriptions, even with their reduced cost per month, still get the 1,500 crown points per month, not a reduced amount.

    Agreed. And it already provides more benefits. I'm completely fine with this as well.
    However you cannot expect it to be massively better. If I offer you a bar of gold in one hand and a pile of *** in the other, at the same price, which would you choose?
    Current requests are asking for all of the current bonuses and more, all at the same cost (or less).
    How is that fair to other players or profitable for the company? It is not.
  • Heromofo
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    The subscription could be 20 dollars a month and it wouldn't bother me personally but it may cause one hell of a crap storm with others.
  • c.p.garrett1993_ESO
    Heromofo wrote: »
    The subscription could be 20 dollars a month and it wouldn't bother me personally but it may cause one hell of a crap storm with others.

    I don't think I would pay that much. Neither would many other players.
    However, if you are fine with it I am sure others are. As long as people are willing to pay for the additional benefits I am more than open to and willing to discuss the concept.
    In fact, I would honestly prefer to see multiple tiers of membership that can offer more benefits and crowns to those who are willing to pay for it.
  • Heromofo
    Heromofo
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    Heromofo wrote: »
    The subscription could be 20 dollars a month and it wouldn't bother me personally but it may cause one hell of a crap storm with others.

    I don't think I would pay that much. Neither would many other players.
    However, if you are fine with it I am sure others are. As long as people are willing to pay for the additional benefits I am more than open to and willing to discuss the concept.
    In fact, I would honestly prefer to see multiple tiers of membership that can offer more benefits and crowns to those who are willing to pay for it.
    @c.p.garrett1993_ESO
    Uuuum that is a brillant idea would you be willing to make a poll for that in detail because that may be the answer zos needs to this problem.
    Edited by Heromofo on April 30, 2015 3:12PM
  • Obscure
    Obscure
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    If I subscribe to a monthly magazine I want monthly content that I'm personally interested in. PERIOD.

    That's it. Sell me something I want, once a month. Crowns? I don't give a damn. Subscriber perks? I don't give a damn.

    I want to see:

    • New Skills
    • New Options (enchants, traits, sets, styles, etc.)
    Episodic Monthly Content

    (ex: "Next month we're releasing a new 8 hour quest in a long line of quests we'll be releasing this year, one every month, called 'The Deep Cost', exploring the fate of the Falmer. This content is free to subscribers or $15 per installment. Each month will feature at least one new addition such as new armour or weapon styles, set bonuses, new enchantments, and so on. We will be offering season passes at a discount when we begin the next season 'Mysteries of Akavir' next year. Stay tuned!")

    I don't rightly give a damn about a digital currency system that has no reason to exist nor actually functions like a currency. Just say "your account has $15 of credits" not some juvenile "your account has 1500 crowns", it's literally no different. Not like we're out converting in game gold into crowns or trading crowns between players, it's not an ACTUAL currency and as such it is meaningless to call something other than what it is: STORE CREDIT.

    Studios make content, some of them make content I like, and I pay money for content I like. The relationship is literally that effin' simple. Ex: ZOS made a horse that's on fire, I like animals that can be lit on fire, thus I bought a horse that is permanently burning alive (and is fantastically totally cool with it).





  • c.p.garrett1993_ESO
    Heromofo wrote: »
    Heromofo wrote: »
    The subscription could be 20 dollars a month and it wouldn't bother me personally but it may cause one hell of a crap storm with others.

    I don't think I would pay that much. Neither would many other players.
    However, if you are fine with it I am sure others are. As long as people are willing to pay for the additional benefits I am more than open to and willing to discuss the concept.
    In fact, I would honestly prefer to see multiple tiers of membership that can offer more benefits and crowns to those who are willing to pay for it.
    @Zos
    Uuuum that is a brillant idea would you be willing to make a poll for that in detail because that may be the answer zos needs to this problem.

    I'd be more than happy to.
    I don't really have the time right now (at work) but when I get home I will browser the forums for already existing requests and try to work out various models that could be implemented. I'll leave pricing to ZOS but probably include some sample prices as reference to other companies that already have a similar model in place.
    Obscure wrote: »
    If I subscribe to a monthly magazine I want monthly content that I'm personally interested in. PERIOD.

    That's it. Sell me something I want, once a month. Crowns? I don't give a damn. Subscriber perks? I don't give a damn.

    I want to see:

    • New Skills
    • New Options (enchants, traits, sets, styles, etc.)
    Episodic Monthly Content

    (ex: "Next month we're releasing a new 8 hour quest in a long line of quests we'll be releasing this year, one every month, called 'The Deep Cost', exploring the fate of the Falmer. This content is free to subscribers or $15 per installment. Each month will feature at least one new addition such as new armour or weapon styles, set bonuses, new enchantments, and so on. We will be offering season passes at a discount when we begin the next season 'Mysteries of Akavir' next year. Stay tuned!")

    I don't rightly give a damn about a digital currency system that has no reason to exist nor actually functions like a currency. Just say "your account has $15 of credits" not some juvenile "your account has 1500 crowns", it's literally no different. Not like we're out converting in game gold into crowns or trading crowns between players, it's not an ACTUAL currency and as such it is meaningless to call something other than what it is: STORE CREDIT.

    Studios make content, some of them make content I like, and I pay money for content I like. The relationship is literally that effin' simple. Ex: ZOS made a horse that's on fire, I like animals that can be lit on fire, thus I bought a horse that is permanently burning alive (and is fantastically totally cool with it).

    I am in total agreement. However, it is obvious that the company does not place priority into monthly content updates. Thus subscriptions should have bonuses that justify keeping them between content releases.

    If people are satisfied with their subscriptions and keep them than ZOS will have the funding to work on more content. Eventually they could move on to regular content updates. Presently, they are walking on thin ice.
    Putting too much time and resources into adding new content could be the end of this game if it didn't go well. Than everybody would be screwed out of what they have paid into it so far.
    Edited by c.p.garrett1993_ESO on April 30, 2015 3:22PM
  • Heromofo
    Heromofo
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    Heromofo wrote: »
    Heromofo wrote: »
    The subscription could be 20 dollars a month and it wouldn't bother me personally but it may cause one hell of a crap storm with others.

    I don't think I would pay that much. Neither would many other players.
    However, if you are fine with it I am sure others are. As long as people are willing to pay for the additional benefits I am more than open to and willing to discuss the concept.
    In fact, I would honestly prefer to see multiple tiers of membership that can offer more benefits and crowns to those who are willing to pay for it.
    @Zos
    Uuuum that is a brillant idea would you be willing to make a poll for that in detail because that may be the answer zos needs to this problem.

    I'd be more than happy to.
    I don't really have the time right now (at work) but when I get home I will browser the forums for already existing requests and try to work out various models that could be implemented. I'll leave pricing to ZOS but probably include some sample prices as reference to other companies that already have a similar model in place.
    @c.p.garret1993_ESO
    Can you meesage me when you set it up because i think it may be the answer they need and with enough community support it could just happen.
  • c.p.garrett1993_ESO
    Heromofo wrote: »
    Heromofo wrote: »
    Heromofo wrote: »
    The subscription could be 20 dollars a month and it wouldn't bother me personally but it may cause one hell of a crap storm with others.

    I don't think I would pay that much. Neither would many other players.
    However, if you are fine with it I am sure others are. As long as people are willing to pay for the additional benefits I am more than open to and willing to discuss the concept.
    In fact, I would honestly prefer to see multiple tiers of membership that can offer more benefits and crowns to those who are willing to pay for it.
    @Zos
    Uuuum that is a brillant idea would you be willing to make a poll for that in detail because that may be the answer zos needs to this problem.

    I'd be more than happy to.
    I don't really have the time right now (at work) but when I get home I will browser the forums for already existing requests and try to work out various models that could be implemented. I'll leave pricing to ZOS but probably include some sample prices as reference to other companies that already have a similar model in place.
    @c.p.garret1993_ESO
    Can you meesage me when you set it up because i think it may be the answer they need and with enough community support it could just happen.

    Yeah, I can let you know when it's set up. I'm guessing it will be around 5:00 PM (EST), if I get straight to it when I get home.
  • Obscure
    Obscure
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    @c.p.garrett1993_ESO

    If ZOS wants a monthly subscription system to work they have to sell the consumer monthly content. If they don't, there will never be a reason to have a monthly subscription. No one would own a monthly subscription to a bimonthly magazine, no matter what they get as a "perk" in the off month where they get no content. It's much more feasible to just buy the magazine a-la-carte every other month.

    "Perks" won't help is what I'm getting at. They can dress it up with as many bells and whistles as they want, but the only way they can push it out the door for money is if it's actual substance (content) is what the consumer wants. Perks only create an incentive to buy what you were already going to buy anyways (ex: I recently bought a case for my tablet because I needed one, but one of the cases came with a stylus and a screen protector, so I decided to get that one. I was going to leave that store with a case for my tablet anyways, but due to the perks I left with that one in specific. Hell I even used my Flex Rewards card instead of my Debit Card, because it has the perk of cash back. I was never going to leave without paying, but due to the perks I paid with my rewards card in specific).

  • Heromofo
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    Since you're on now alan care to weigh in?
    The tier subscription service could be the answer mate.

    @ZOS_AlanG
  • jkemmery
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    Disagree

    For my 1500 crowns I can buy spare soul gems in case I run out, health potions in case I run out and armor repair kits so I don't have to spend in game gold. I can also by food that gives buffs. Useful things for any player.

    I think it's fair to give a commensurate amount of crowns per the subscription cost. There are useful things in the Crown store for any user, even if you're not in to pets, costumes, mount skins and armor styles. If as a non-subscription player you find yourself spending more than 1500 crowns a month, it makes sense to subscribe and get the XP and Gold bonus. I think that is entirely the intent of ZOS: to use the crown store to leverage a constant revenue stream.
  • c.p.garrett1993_ESO
    @Obscure
    I agree with you, to a degree.
    I offer you a penny a day or a dollar a month. Which do you choose?
    I would rather see quality expansions and than monthly additions. I would prefer both if they could manage but I doubt they will have the time or resources to do that for awhile.
    Perks are to encourage keeping an active subscription between here and there.
    You compare this to a magazine, where all the content is delivered at once. Of course there are not any perks that seem beneficial in the off months. Instead, think of it in another way.

    Your local gym may have a pool. That pool, if outside, will close in the winter.
    Do you drop your membership? Of course not, you keep it for the access to other equipment and services they offer.
    Why do you choose that gym over another? They probably offer some sort of perk, or they are more convenient, or you know the people who work there. Whatever your reason it isn't just because you expect something new delivered each month.

    Even as you have put it. Your case or your credit card. Perks are what help keep you paying for the product or service, even if something new isn't being offered each time you pay.

    New content is a must, but in an MMO that is not able to deliver this content at this time they need to be able to provide a reason to pay for it.

    Edit:
    @jkemmery
    Those may not be useful to others, though.
    Gold is easy enough to make that there's no need to worry about those things.
    At least not to the point that it would drive me to buying them.

    Also, the issue at hand isn't whether or not the crown store is relevant, it's the fact that people are requesting more perks and expect to keep the full 1,500 crowns at no extra cost.
    I am completely fine with crowns and them being incorporated into membership, I just do not think it should be the primary selling point or that it should offer as many as buying the crowns directly.
    Edited by c.p.garrett1993_ESO on April 30, 2015 4:14PM
  • idk
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    Disagree with the OP. Seems to lack logic and rational.
  • jkemmery
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    Those may not be useful to others, though.
    Gold is easy enough to make that there's no need to worry about those things.
    At least not to the point that it would drive me to buying them.

    Not for me. I can't make it fast enough to get all of my armor and weapons tempered up, and keep up with repairing my armor and resurrecting myself when I die. Tempers are expensive, and when you are in the Veteran ranks, they are not optional as they are the ONLY way to upgrade your armor and weapons as you level up. Galatite blacksmithing is not unlocked until VR4, and Tempering Alloy costs roughly 6000+ per in the guild stores. You normally don't pick up gold items to deconstruct any out of and you are lucky if your hireling provides one a week, if that. You will need about 45 Tempering Alloys to fully upgrade all of your gear, AFTER you have upgraded it to superior with Grain Solvent. I have not found a way to make enough money in game to keep up with the need for keeping my armor and weapons upgraded with tempers. Therefore, I am happy to pay crowns for soul gems and repairs so that I can keep the gold I have made to buy tempers. I really wish someone who has found this magical gold fountain in ESO to clue me in on the secret, because I am constantly in-game broke.

    I'm GRATEFUL I can buy useful items in the Crown store with my 1500 Crowns per month. I have a feeling this is more the rule than the exception.
    Also, the issue at hand isn't whether or not the crown store is relevant, it's the fact that people are requesting more perks and expect to keep the full 1,500 crowns at no extra cost.
    I am completely fine with crowns and them being incorporated into membership, I just do not think it should be the primary selling point or that it should offer as many as buying the crowns directly.

    The point is that a subscription is a relatively secure revenue stream for ZOS, whereas sales in the Crown store are not as secure and constant. By offering as many Crowns as you would buy with the same money, ZOS is pushing people toward the subscription because it offers the tangible perk of added gold and XP, so that they have a more dependable revenue stream, so that they can continue to develop the game. Which is what we all want. What's the problem with that? Seriously?
  • desciviib14_ESO
    desciviib14_ESO
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    I think the crowns need to stay as well as some additional perks. Im just not going to continue to pay a monthly amount on a regular basis during the famine times if there's nothing in it for me. The 10% is unnecessary for 1-50 and almost useless in the V grind so it actually isn't a selling point to me anymore since I've come to know through my play style what the real effect of it is despite what the % says. To be honest I don't have any suggestions on what to give me but I know that "as is" isn't enough anymore BUT I want to keep my monthly crowns cause I buy the mounts and pets.
    There is nothing here of interest to any nations; as a matter of fact, there is nothing here but people.
  • LucyferLightbringer
    LucyferLightbringer
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    Aett_Thorn wrote: »
    Subscription has a benefit to any company: it is stable, expected money. As such, it is BETTER than burst income. Therefore, they SHOULD get more benefits than someone just making one-time purchases.

    This is why long-term subscriptions, even with their reduced cost per month, still get the 1,500 crown points per month, not a reduced amount.

    Subscription stable and expected? Don't think so. Subscriber can cancell at any time, even on the same day he is supposed to be billed.
    Even 3 and 6 month subs are no different, you get billed whole amount at the start and then there is no telling if you will be willing to subscribe for another period.
    Its no more stable and expeced than random crown store purchases.
  • desciviib14_ESO
    desciviib14_ESO
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    Aett_Thorn wrote: »
    Subscription has a benefit to any company: it is stable, expected money. As such, it is BETTER than burst income. Therefore, they SHOULD get more benefits than someone just making one-time purchases.

    This is why long-term subscriptions, even with their reduced cost per month, still get the 1,500 crown points per month, not a reduced amount.

    Subscription stable and expected? Don't think so. Subscriber can cancell at any time, even on the same day he is supposed to be billed.
    Even 3 and 6 month subs are no different, you get billed whole amount at the start and then there is no telling if you will be willing to subscribe for another period.
    Its no more stable and expeced than random crown store purchases.

    While it is technically possible to unsub at anytime, it is generally more stable. Either out of laziness or "out of sight, out of mind", subs tend to persist and could in general be considered more stable. Only a contract can be fully counted on but subs are about the next best thing for calculating future income.

    There is nothing here of interest to any nations; as a matter of fact, there is nothing here but people.
  • c.p.garrett1993_ESO
    I have created the requested multi-tiered concept here:
    http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/168807/multi-tiered-subscription-model-requesting-feedback?new=1

    Please be sure to check it out and provide feedback. I plan on working with the community to make a plan that suits everybody of any budget.
  • Cazic
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    Disagree.

    Some of us are interested in the Crown store, especially considering it will continue to grow. The 1500 Crowns gives us incentive to keep using it. I've always been a supporter of ESO and would have been fine if the subscription was still required as opposed to being optional. Now I get to pay the sub fee that I was always okay with, while getting some added perks on top of it.

    Having the subscription cost the same amount as just buying 1500 crowns on their own gives incentive to subscribe because you get added bonuses on top of it. The more players who are subscribed, the better.

  • c.p.garrett1993_ESO
    Cazic wrote: »
    Disagree.

    Some of us are interested in the Crown store, especially considering it will continue to grow. The 1500 Crowns gives us incentive to keep using it. I've always been a supporter of ESO and would have been fine if the subscription was still required as opposed to being optional. Now I get to pay the sub fee that I was always okay with, while getting some added perks on top of it.

    Having the subscription cost the same amount as just buying 1500 crowns on their own gives incentive to subscribe because you get added bonuses on top of it. The more players who are subscribed, the better.

    - Not everybody is interested in the crown shop.
    - The base subscription is common in an MMO that offers regular content, this does not.
    - The initial subscription was ditched due to how horrible the game did at beta/ launch.
    - The incentive is not enough for many.
    - Subscriptions are being cancelled.
  • Cazic
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    Cazic wrote: »
    Disagree.

    Some of us are interested in the Crown store, especially considering it will continue to grow. The 1500 Crowns gives us incentive to keep using it. I've always been a supporter of ESO and would have been fine if the subscription was still required as opposed to being optional. Now I get to pay the sub fee that I was always okay with, while getting some added perks on top of it.

    Having the subscription cost the same amount as just buying 1500 crowns on their own gives incentive to subscribe because you get added bonuses on top of it. The more players who are subscribed, the better.

    - Not everybody is interested in the crown shop.
    - The base subscription is common in an MMO that offers regular content, this does not.
    - The initial subscription was ditched due to how horrible the game did at beta/ launch.
    - The incentive is not enough for many.
    - Subscriptions are being cancelled.

    - Not everybody is, but many people are, and it is one of ZOS's focuses right now so they want to promote it
    - I'm not saying the subscription should be required again. I think they made he right choice making it optional when it comes to the majority
    - The incentive is enough for just as many as it is not enough
    - Of course they are. There will always be some fluctuation in subscription numbers. Many players are also keeping their subs.

    Bottom line, I think you're reaching a bit too far with the idea. Maybe there's room to tweak the sub model a bit, but the tiered idea isn't necessary and it doesn't need to changed drastically.
  • idk
    idk
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    @jkemmery

    I have to disagree with tempers being required when leveling vet ranks. It seemed you were talking about leveling through vet ranks. I leveled my first get character with green gear without issue before they nerfed the vet content the first time.

    At end game purple quality gear is more than fine and those upgrade mats are cheap and plentiful, almost as plentiful as gold is.
  • sk8ingeckoub17_ESO
    sk8ingeckoub17_ESO
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    Cazic wrote: »
    Disagree.

    Some of us are interested in the Crown store, especially considering it will continue to grow. The 1500 Crowns gives us incentive to keep using it. I've always been a supporter of ESO and would have been fine if the subscription was still required as opposed to being optional. Now I get to pay the sub fee that I was always okay with, while getting some added perks on top of it.

    Having the subscription cost the same amount as just buying 1500 crowns on their own gives incentive to subscribe because you get added bonuses on top of it. The more players who are subscribed, the better.

    - Not everybody is interested in the crown shop.
    - The base subscription is common in an MMO that offers regular content, this does not.
    - The initial subscription was ditched due to how horrible the game did at beta/ launch.
    - The incentive is not enough for many.
    - Subscriptions are being cancelled.

    you haven't played many games lately that are optional sub games...

    the base game is base in most of these games just look at any daybreak (sony) mmorpgs (which this model seems to of copied exactly). All DLC's post are either required purchases (eq1 and 2 expansions) or required purchase content packs (DCUO). In dcuo specifically the content is free to subscribers. In EQ1 and 2 however the benefit is not being limited with chats, money, spell level, etc. id rather have a carrot ala dcuo though then the stick of eq to get me to sub.

    On top of that every f2p with a sub that i can think of swtor, dcuo, lotro, etc all give their base currency in a small amount as part of the sub. whether its for the cartel shop in swtor, or 500 sony coins for sony's games.

    initial sub being ditched due to beta/launch is just one of the prevalent theories. Another is that without xbox being willing to ditch gold it was done for the consoles prosperity.

    incentive right now is not enough as there are no DLC's or exclusives. This will change over time with each expansion that comes out. especially for people that come later down the road that end up with the option of 14.99 vs 100+ in dlc to catch up.

    people leave subs behind all the time in f2p and pick them up just as much. its still far to early to tell how well the incentives will be long term though. the biggest draw to a sub hasn't even hit yet with dlc's
    Edited by sk8ingeckoub17_ESO on April 30, 2015 6:46PM
  • Bouvin
    Bouvin
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    The funny thing is current subscribers are paying $15/month for a 10% XP Boost.

    That's because the "access to DLC" is null because there is no DLC and won't be for quite some time.

    When they release DLC the pricing on the DLC will most likely be the factor of whether people choose to subscribe or not. Thing is, they won't get away with charging more than 3,000 crowns for DLC as anything more than $30 for a single area will be met with outrage by the player base.

    Thing is, you have a lot of people sitting with 3k+ crowns in their account. So for them, continuing to sub is still just for a 10% XP bonus because they'll have enough crowns for the first DLC (unless ZoS does something stupid like trying to charge $50 for a single area).

    This is why you need other perks for subscribing that characters actually care about.
    • Priority PvP queue has to be the most asked for so far.
    • How about a Subscriber only PvP zone? Those non-subs could buy "passes" for X crowns that last for a period of time.
    • Structured PvP (arenas and BGs). You can either sub and get them, or buy access.
    • Special Events (Tamriel Holiday Themed). Subs get access, non-subs can buy a pass for the duration of the even.
    • Player Housing. Subs get access to a base house that they can expand or improve through in-game gold and crafting. Non-Subs can buy a house for Crowns.
    • Thieves Guild, Dark Brotherhood, Dawnguard, etc. membership for subscribers. Gated by a quest of course... Non-sub pay crowns for access.

    I guess the point it, make subbing worthwhile. Right now, even if DLC were coming it's still not worth it.

    Edit:Spelling and clarity.
    Edited by Bouvin on April 30, 2015 6:48PM
  • Cazic
    Cazic
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Bouvin wrote: »
    The funny thing is current subscribers are paying $15/month for a 10% XP Boost.

    That's because the "access to DLC" is null because there is no DLC and won't be for quite some time.

    When they release DLC the pricing on the DLC will most likely be the factor of whether people choose to subscribe or not. Thing is, they won't get away with charging more than 3,000 crowns for DLC as anything more than $30 for a single area will be met with outrage by the player base.

    Thing is, you have a lot of people sitting with 3k+ crowns in their account. So for them, continuing to sub is still just for a 10% XP bonus because they'll have enough crowns for the first DLC (unless ZoS does something stupid like trying to charge $50 for a single area).

    This is why you need other perks for subscribing that characters actually care about.
    • Priority PvP queue has to be the most asked for so far.
    • How about a Subscriber only PvP zone? Those non-subs could buy "passes" for X crowns that last for a period of time.
    • Structured PvP (arenas and BGs). You can either sub and get them, or buy access.
    • Special Events (Tamriel Holiday Themed). Subs get access, pay as you go can buy a pass for the duration of the even.
    • Player Housing. Subs get access to a base house that they can expand or improve through in-game gold and crafting. Non-Subs can buy a house for Crowns.
    • Thieves Guild, Dark Brotherhood, Dawnguard, etc. membership for subscribers. Gated by a quest of course... Non-sub pay crowns for access.

    I guess the point it, make subbing worthwhile. Right now, even if DLC were coming it's still not worth it.

    Edit:Spelling and clarity.

    Agreed that DLC will likely be a real deciding factor to sub or not when it is available. But, everything else you're suggesting is would just over complicate the things. Why would we want to separate the player base that way? Subscriber only zones, subscriber only events, blah blah blah. That's all garbage and would just hurt the game. They've done a good job so far of offering incentive to subscribe, while not putting too much emphasis on it. Players who can't or don't want to subscribe need to feel somewhat equal to those who do.
  • jkemmery
    jkemmery
    ✭✭✭✭
    @jkemmery

    I have to disagree with tempers being required when leveling vet ranks. It seemed you were talking about leveling through vet ranks. I leveled my first get character with green gear without issue before they nerfed the vet content the first time.

    At end game purple quality gear is more than fine and those upgrade mats are cheap and plentiful, almost as plentiful as gold is.
    @Giles.floydub17_ESO

    Well then tell me how to get this plentiful, easy gold, 'cuz it's not happening for me. Please.

    Also did you play solo or in a group? I can see how if you are playing in a group and/or NOT a tank how you could get by, but as a tanking player, by the time you get to the second Silver zone, my green calcinium armor was not enough. At least not for me. For me, it was not an option because without the added protection, I could not compete.
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