Being knocked off a horse

demonaffinity

Greetings..

You ride along all dandy and stuff. Then an alligator (Which cannot swim in this game btw) wacks you with its tail and you fall off. Then you stand still for 1-2 seconds after getting up, then you fall down again, you get up and then you fall down again (Happened twice to me now with the 3rd falldown)

Serious Zenimax, was it REALLY that difficult to make a proper falloff mechanic, where you fall off the horse and land on your ass, then you get up and is ready to fight? Did no one test this before handing it over saying "WELL THIS WORKS NOW"?

And not only that (haters gonna hate), but why the f can we still sprint endlessly on our horses even after stamina runs out? This has been going on since release, and you STILL haven't fixed it. Appearntly intentional. Absurd if you ask me though..

Some things are just inexcusable in my opinion..

And before anyone replies, I don't care if this does not happen to you. I know people who has the same problem and it's also happening to me 100% of the time, so it's a real issue.

Daemons_Bane

Interesting :-D my horse and guar stops moving fast after stamina runs out

demonaffinity

Daemons_Bane wrote: »

Interesting :-D my horse and guar stops moving fast after stamina runs out

Just tested it and endless sprint still works.

vichoi

Happens to me also, you just keep fall down and get up and fall again, nothing you can do but die.

And why the horse keep sprinting after stam runs out? That's definitely 'rocket science'.

Siguno

The stamina is your mounts health, not for how long you can sprint. when your mount does not have any more stamina you will fall of when you are attacked

demonaffinity

Siguno wrote: »

The stamina is your mounts health, not for how long you can sprint. when your mount does not have any more stamina you will fall of when you are attacked

Then why does sprint drain stamina? It does not make sense. If it requires stamina to sprint, when it runs out, it should be unable to sprint.

Shogunami

The fall off mechanic is nice when it works the way it should, but when it loops/lags/whatever it's just .. beyond freaking annoying.

You have to balance speed and resistance to getting knocked off, it's interesting that way. Once your stamina has dropped to zero you will automatically get knocked off if you get hit, it allows you to keep running faster but at the risk of dismounting. If you stop sprinting at zero stamina you wont be able to start sprinting again until it has recharged a bit, this too I think is quite good, as it's kind of like how it is in real life when you're running. If you run up to or past your imagined/perceived boundaries and you stop running you won't be able to start running again, but if you keep running (adrenaline, commitment and what not) you can run a lot longer. Even though I kind of like it, I don't think it should be this way.

Mounts dismount randomly and for the most ridiculous reasons. My 700-1000 kg horse freaks the f*** out after being scratched by a skeever and throws me off. If anything, the skeever should be trampled to death for getting in my way.
Dismounting just because of touching some water is very annoying - let us swim with our mounts!
Give the horses some health in addition to the stamina and make it so the lower the health the greater the chance to get dismounted/thrown off if attacked. If horse health drops to zero then you should automatically get dismounted/thrown off, and maybe stamina can play a small role in dismount percentage as well.

I don't know.. I am consistently struck by this strange ambivalence regarding this game, some things are just the best in any MMO I've ever played. While some things just doesn't make sense at all and makes you wonder what kind of people ZOS has hired.


/rant

Titansteele

He may have use terminology which you can pick apart but the mechanism he explained is accurate and is working as intended.

Your mount is meant to sprint at that speed all the time, when that bar is at zero and you take a knock you fall off.

Siguno

Then why does sprint drain stamina? It does not make sense. If it requires stamina to sprint, when it runs out, it should be unable to sprint.

I agree whit you it is kinda wierd. I guess sprinting drains stamina because the mount gets tired so it cant keep you up if your attacked... but if it gets tired then it should not be able to sprint...

RainfeatherUK

demonaffinity wrote: »

Then you stand still for 1-2 seconds after getting up, then you fall down again, you get up and then you fall down again (Happened twice to me now with the 3rd falldown)

Sounds like most of my saturday mornings eek. Minus the Alligator part... well ..so far o.0

Just be glad it isnt the other way round and you arent being mounted by one instead. Decidedly worse!

Titansteele

Where I agree it is a little weird I like being able to cover large distances at speed which lets face it a mount is meant to let you do.

If they increased the stamina so a horse could sprint for longer it would make it possible for you to run through far too many mobs without getting knocked off. I like how it works despite it being a tad counter intuitive.

UrQuan

OK, first, there are 2 things that drain stamina on your mount: sprinting and getting hit with attacks.

Now, the real point of stamina on a mount is to keep you on your mount. If you're sprinting long enough for your stamina to run out, then a single hit from an enemy will knock you off your horse and you'll be vulnerable and unable to do anything for a bit as you get attacked. This is the risk of sprinting with no stamina (and it's especially a risk in PVP, where only fools sprint so much that they don't have a decent reserve of stamina to keep them from being immediately knocked off their horse by a single attack, and then slaughtered while trying to recover), and is the only reason to increase your riding skill for stamina. It's also why the cosmetic upgrade to your mount when you've increased stamina by 20+ points is armour. It's to represent that it's now harder for you to be knocked off your mount.

The endless sprint even when your mount is out of stamina was supposed to be a special ability of horses, with other types of mounts (like senches and guar) having different special abilities in place of the endless sprint (this was mentioned in a ZOS Q&A almost a year ago). Evidently they changed their mind on this when they decided to change the entire mount system and introduce the Crown Store (presumably to make the character-based riding skill more consistent and/or to avoid the possibility of Crown Store mounts becoming P2W items).

Faugaun

demonaffinity wrote: »

Greetings..

You ride along all dandy and stuff. Then an alligator (Which cannot swim in this game btw) wacks you with its tail and you fall off. Then you stand still for 1-2 seconds after getting up, then you fall down again, you get up and then you fall down again (Happened twice to me now with the 3rd falldown)

Serious Zenimax, was it REALLY that difficult to make a proper falloff mechanic, where you fall off the horse and land on your ass, then you get up and is ready to fight? Did no one test this before handing it over saying "WELL THIS WORKS NOW"?

And not only that (haters gonna hate), but why the f can we still sprint endlessly on our horses even after stamina runs out? This has been going on since release, and you STILL haven't fixed it.

Some things are just inexcusable in my opinion..

And before anyone replies, I don't care if this does not happen to you. I know people who has the same problem and it's also happening to me 100% of the time, so it's a real issue.

Umm endless sprint is not a bug and neither is falling off....

Your horse can sprint...and if he is attacked by those allogators and has stamina you will not fall off...but if you are out of stamina then its bad news for you...as for the graphics I've never seen that it sounds like a lag spike.

Snit

Ever fallen off a horse? I have, dozens of times. You're generally not back on your feet and ready for action in a millisecond.

In-game, you can avoid it entirely. Invest in stamina for your mount. Sprint sparingly in dangerous areas -- don't drain your mount's stamina. If you are taking damage, dismount on purpose, ideally by hitting some kind of defensive ability (e.g., an absorb shield). Don't wait until you take enough damage for a forcible dismount.

Lirkin

I think that the horse runs out of stamina to fast. I'd rather they didn't fix the stamina issue if it exists.

UrQuan

c00lmon wrote: »

I think that the horse runs out of stamina to fast. I'd rather they didn't fix the stamina issue if it exists.

When your riding skill is fully upgraded you can sprint for a loooong time before running out and being in danger of getting knocked off your horse. And ZOS has said that the endless sprint is intended, so I highly doubt it will be "fixed".

idk

demonaffinity wrote: »

Siguno wrote: »

The stamina is your mounts health, not for how long you can sprint. when your mount does not have any more stamina you will fall of when you are attacked

Then why does sprint drain stamina? It does not make sense. If it requires stamina to sprint, when it runs out, it should be unable to sprint.

Stamina is your horses ability to take damage. When it runs out the next damage knocks you off. Stamina does not determine how long you can sprint. The cost of sprinting (stamina drain) is you can't take damage without being dismounted and stunned. It's always been like that and works as intended.

It is a good design IMO.

demonaffinity

Snit wrote: »

Ever fallen off a horse? I have, dozens of times. You're generally not back on your feet and ready for action in a millisecond.

In-game, you can avoid it entirely. Invest in stamina for your mount. Sprint sparingly in dangerous areas -- don't drain your mount's stamina. If you are taking damage, dismount on purpose, ideally by hitting some kind of defensive ability (e.g., an absorb shield). Don't wait until you take enough damage for a forcible dismount.

If you actually read my OP you would know that Im not complaining about being knocked off the horse. DO people even think before replying anymore? Good lord.

runagate

On the upside, when you have 60 speed and stamina in riding skill, you can blow through hordes of enemies sieging a keep and run in the front door to save the day without incurring the debilitating 4 second stun from getting dismounted.

UrQuan

demonaffinity wrote: »

Snit wrote: »

Ever fallen off a horse? I have, dozens of times. You're generally not back on your feet and ready for action in a millisecond.

In-game, you can avoid it entirely. Invest in stamina for your mount. Sprint sparingly in dangerous areas -- don't drain your mount's stamina. If you are taking damage, dismount on purpose, ideally by hitting some kind of defensive ability (e.g., an absorb shield). Don't wait until you take enough damage for a forcible dismount.

If you actually read my OP you would know that Im not complaining about being knocked off the horse. DO people even think before replying anymore? Good lord.

Um, really? Because you say this:

demonaffinity wrote: »

You ride along all dandy and stuff. Then an alligator (Which cannot swim in this game btw) wacks you with its tail and you fall off. Then you stand still for 1-2 seconds after getting up, then you fall down again, you get up and then you fall down again (Happened twice to me now with the 3rd falldown)

Serious Zenimax, was it REALLY that difficult to make a proper falloff mechanic, where you fall off the horse and land on your ass, then you get up and is ready to fight? Did no one test this before handing it over saying "WELL THIS WORKS NOW"?

I'm not sure how that can be taken as anything other than complaining about the mechanism of being knocked off your horse... It's intended that you get knocked off your horse in one hit if you're out of horse stamina, and it's intended that being knocked off your horse leaves you unable to do anything and super vulnerable for a while. Yet from what you posted there in the OP, you're clearly complaining about that.

demonaffinity

UrQuan wrote: »

demonaffinity wrote: »

Snit wrote: »

Ever fallen off a horse? I have, dozens of times. You're generally not back on your feet and ready for action in a millisecond.

In-game, you can avoid it entirely. Invest in stamina for your mount. Sprint sparingly in dangerous areas -- don't drain your mount's stamina. If you are taking damage, dismount on purpose, ideally by hitting some kind of defensive ability (e.g., an absorb shield). Don't wait until you take enough damage for a forcible dismount.

If you actually read my OP you would know that Im not complaining about being knocked off the horse. DO people even think before replying anymore? Good lord.

Um, really? Because you say this:

demonaffinity wrote: »

You ride along all dandy and stuff. Then an alligator (Which cannot swim in this game btw) wacks you with its tail and you fall off. Then you stand still for 1-2 seconds after getting up, then you fall down again, you get up and then you fall down again (Happened twice to me now with the 3rd falldown)

Serious Zenimax, was it REALLY that difficult to make a proper falloff mechanic, where you fall off the horse and land on your ass, then you get up and is ready to fight? Did no one test this before handing it over saying "WELL THIS WORKS NOW"?

I'm not sure how that can be taken as anything other than complaining about the mechanism of being knocked off your horse... It's intended that you get knocked off your horse in one hit if you're out of horse stamina, and it's intended that being knocked off your horse leaves you unable to do anything and super vulnerable for a while. Yet from what you posted there in the OP, you're clearly complaining about that.

" Then you stand still for 1-2 seconds after getting up, then you fall down again, you get up and then you fall down again"

The falloff mechanic is cr*p. You are supposed to fall off, and get up. Not fall off, get up, fall down again, get up, fall down again.

I'm speaking about poor mechanics.

badmojo

I just went and tested it, and you're right the character isn't supposed to fall off and get up then fall down again and then get up again. But, it just looks like broken animations. When my character was dismounted he almost instantly was on his feet, then he fell down again, then got back up almost instantly, then back down again. The result was that I was vulnerable for a few seconds after being dismounted, unable to do anything until the knockdown effect ended.

The mechanic of being knocked down is still working properly, despite the buggy animations. You are not supposed to get knocked down and be back up and fighting quickly, it has always been few seconds of stun after being knocked down, before you can get up.

golfer.dub17_ESO

And not only that (haters gonna hate), but why the f can we still sprint endlessly on our horses even after stamina runs out? This has been going on since release, and you STILL haven't fixed it.

ZoS claims that's intentional, despite all the obvious evidence to the contrary like the description of the stamina upgrade itself, or how you can't start running again if you stop then start with no stamina.

People will buy their bogus explanation, so why fix I guess.

you fall off. Then you stand still for 1-2 seconds after getting up, then you fall down again, you get up and then you fall down again (Happened twice to me now with the 3rd falldown)

That happens to me all the time.

qsnoopyjr

demonaffinity wrote: »

Siguno wrote: »

The stamina is your mounts health, not for how long you can sprint. when your mount does not have any more stamina you will fall of when you are attacked

Then why does sprint drain stamina? It does not make sense. If it requires stamina to sprint, when it runs out, it should be unable to sprint.

Think of it like a human.

Your sprinting and out of breath and something wacks you... Your out of breath, its lights out for you.

Now if your walking, your energy/stamina level is full, something wacks you... You lose your breath at most. Depending on how hard it hits you, it could lead to loss of breath and lights out.

Another way of thinking,
When your sprinting and using all your energy, the slightest touch will put you off balance and fall down.
If your jogging, using 50% of your energy, your not likely to fall down as easily as you would be if your sprinting, due to 'still having something left in the tank'.

demonaffinity

qsnoopyjr wrote: »

demonaffinity wrote: »

Siguno wrote: »

The stamina is your mounts health, not for how long you can sprint. when your mount does not have any more stamina you will fall of when you are attacked

Then why does sprint drain stamina? It does not make sense. If it requires stamina to sprint, when it runs out, it should be unable to sprint.

Think of it like a human.

Your sprinting and out of breath and something wacks you... Your out of breath, its lights out for you.

Now if your walking, your energy/stamina level is full, something wacks you... You lose your breath at most. Depending on how hard it hits you, it could lead to loss of breath and lights out.

Another way of thinking,
When your sprinting and using all your energy, the slightest touch will put you off balance and fall down.
If your jogging, using 50% of your energy, your not likely to fall down as easily as you would be if your sprinting, due to 'still having something left in the tank'.

Okay Ill think of it like a human. Sprinting til I'm out of breath, then keep sprinting the same speed for eternity. But if a rough wind hits my forehead while I sprint at full speed, despite my lungs collapsing, I fall down.

UrQuan

demonaffinity wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

demonaffinity wrote: »

Snit wrote: »

Ever fallen off a horse? I have, dozens of times. You're generally not back on your feet and ready for action in a millisecond.

In-game, you can avoid it entirely. Invest in stamina for your mount. Sprint sparingly in dangerous areas -- don't drain your mount's stamina. If you are taking damage, dismount on purpose, ideally by hitting some kind of defensive ability (e.g., an absorb shield). Don't wait until you take enough damage for a forcible dismount.

If you actually read my OP you would know that Im not complaining about being knocked off the horse. DO people even think before replying anymore? Good lord.

Um, really? Because you say this:

demonaffinity wrote: »

You ride along all dandy and stuff. Then an alligator (Which cannot swim in this game btw) wacks you with its tail and you fall off. Then you stand still for 1-2 seconds after getting up, then you fall down again, you get up and then you fall down again (Happened twice to me now with the 3rd falldown)

Serious Zenimax, was it REALLY that difficult to make a proper falloff mechanic, where you fall off the horse and land on your ass, then you get up and is ready to fight? Did no one test this before handing it over saying "WELL THIS WORKS NOW"?

I'm not sure how that can be taken as anything other than complaining about the mechanism of being knocked off your horse... It's intended that you get knocked off your horse in one hit if you're out of horse stamina, and it's intended that being knocked off your horse leaves you unable to do anything and super vulnerable for a while. Yet from what you posted there in the OP, you're clearly complaining about that.

" Then you stand still for 1-2 seconds after getting up, then you fall down again, you get up and then you fall down again"

The falloff mechanic is cr*p. You are supposed to fall off, and get up. Not fall off, get up, fall down again, get up, fall down again.

I'm speaking about poor mechanics.

Noooo, you're supposed to fall off and be unable to do anything for long enough that you could be killed (or at least badly hurt) by whatever knocked you off your mount. The mechanic isn't cr*p as you claim, it's intended to make sprinting while out of stamina a legitimate risk that can get you killed. That's the risk associated with the reward of being able to endlessly sprint. That's why if you're smart you don't keep sprinting long enough for your stamina to run out, unless you're sure you're not going to get attacked.

golfer.dub17_ESO

UrQuan wrote: »

Noooo, you're supposed to fall off and be unable to do anything for long enough that you could be killed (or at least badly hurt) by whatever knocked you off your mount. The mechanic isn't cr*p as you claim, it's intended to make sprinting while out of stamina a legitimate risk that can get you killed. That's the risk associated with the reward of being able to endlessly sprint. That's why if you're smart you don't keep sprinting long enough for your stamina to run out, unless you're sure you're not going to get attacked.

Twice now you've missed his point.

You will get knocked off.
You will stand up. Then fall as if you were knocked off again. Then stand up.
Then possibly even repeat the process further.

It's glitched.

What should happen:

You get knocked off, then after a short period of time you stand up. Not get glitched into a constantly falling down dilemma.

UrQuan

golfer.dub17_ESO wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

Noooo, you're supposed to fall off and be unable to do anything for long enough that you could be killed (or at least badly hurt) by whatever knocked you off your mount. The mechanic isn't cr*p as you claim, it's intended to make sprinting while out of stamina a legitimate risk that can get you killed. That's the risk associated with the reward of being able to endlessly sprint. That's why if you're smart you don't keep sprinting long enough for your stamina to run out, unless you're sure you're not going to get attacked.

Twice now you've missed his point.

You will get knocked off.
You will stand up. Then fall as if you were knocked off again. Then stand up.
Then possibly even repeat the process further.

It's glitched.

What should happen:

You get knocked off, then after a short period of time you stand up. Not get glitched into a constantly falling down dilemma.

The animation may be glitched, but the effect is what it's supposed to be, and he keeps talking about the mechanic not about the animation. You're vulnerable and unable to do anything for a significant enough period of time that it could get you killed. That's what is supposed to happen.

Robotmafia

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

demonaffinity wrote: »

Siguno wrote: »

The stamina is your mounts health, not for how long you can sprint. when your mount does not have any more stamina you will fall of when you are attacked

Then why does sprint drain stamina? It does not make sense. If it requires stamina to sprint, when it runs out, it should be unable to sprint.

Stamina is your horses ability to take damage. When it runs out the next damage knocks you off. Stamina does not determine how long you can sprint. The cost of sprinting (stamina drain) is you can't take damage without being dismounted and stunned. It's always been like that and works as intended.

It is a good design IMO.

when explained like this it makes sense and I agree is a good design... just wish they would've explained that ingame like a year ago xD

Valymer

Robotmafia wrote: »

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

demonaffinity wrote: »

Siguno wrote: »

The stamina is your mounts health, not for how long you can sprint. when your mount does not have any more stamina you will fall of when you are attacked

Then why does sprint drain stamina? It does not make sense. If it requires stamina to sprint, when it runs out, it should be unable to sprint.

Stamina is your horses ability to take damage. When it runs out the next damage knocks you off. Stamina does not determine how long you can sprint. The cost of sprinting (stamina drain) is you can't take damage without being dismounted and stunned. It's always been like that and works as intended.

It is a good design IMO.

when explained like this it makes sense and I agree is a good design... just wish they would've explained that ingame like a year ago xD

But if that is true then you should be able to active sprinting with zero stamina, which you can't. So stamina is indeed tied to sprinting in some way.

Merlin13KAGL

Think of it more as endurance. It's not so much that your horse gets 'winded,' but rather it can can some a hit or two based on the stamina remaining.

You can probably walk/jog at a brisk pace almost indefinitely, unimpeded. If bystanders start tossing golf balls at you while you pass, it will wear you down. Next group starts throwing them at you...

Next baseballs, finally sledgehammers...can you see why you'd notice a considerable drop in your ability to maintain that same pace?

The longer you've kept that pace in the first place, the faster it will wear you (your horse) down.

For what it's worth, if you increase the Stamina skill, the rate at which it loses stamina goes down considerably, making the current mechanic make even more sense.

The dismounts could use some love, though, knocking the horse down or getting blasted off the side, for instance.