The Justice System is broken...

Murderwalk

There needs to be some kind of jail that penalizes people that get caught multiple times. For example: every time you choose to flee from a guard, your bounty should be multiplied exponentially. People with loads of money are free to commit crimes as they please simply because gold is of no worry to them. Maybe implementing some kind of probation, which would prevent you from participating in dungeons or something. I don;t know I'm just saying, this Justice System does not remind me of an ESO type Justice System. WE NEED A JAIL. I feel as though bounties are so low, that long time players have no care in the world about the price of bounty. It reminds me of life on our planet Earth, where a company can spill thousands of gallons of oil into an ocean, and they simply pay pocket change for a fine and everyone forgets about it. I think like in past Elder Scrolls games, there needs to be a permanent reputation score that makes it harder for people who devote their life to crime to function in everyday society.

If we need to get skill points taken away, so be it. I think people should have to make a serious decision about whether or not they become a criminal.

Lionxoft

I'd settle for just better xp. The xp gain from the Justice System is absolutely atrocious.

Natjur

Murderwalk wrote: »

People with loads of money are free to commit crimes as they please simply because gold is of no worry to them.

Sounds like real life. Only the poor go to jail.

Shame they canned the 'Phase 2', I was looking forward to being a Player guard killing thiefs

AssaultLemming

Bounties seem fine to me, wish they would implement some sort of stealth non lethal takedown though.

Dominoid

Natjur wrote: »

Murderwalk wrote: »

People with loads of money are free to commit crimes as they please simply because gold is of no worry to them.

Sounds like real life. Only the poor go to jail.

Shame they canned the 'Phase 2', I was looking forward to being a Player guard killing thiefs

They didn't can anything. It's still coming.

Lionxoft

Dominoid wrote: »

Natjur wrote: »

Murderwalk wrote: »

People with loads of money are free to commit crimes as they please simply because gold is of no worry to them.

Sounds like real life. Only the poor go to jail.

Shame they canned the 'Phase 2', I was looking forward to being a Player guard killing thiefs

They didn't can anything. It's still coming.

We've been saying the thieves guild and dark brotherhood are still coming for a while now. Is it within reach? Nope.

Murderwalk

Let's not get off track and dive into other guilds. Stay on the topic of what can make the Justice System better.

Obscure

The current system is lazy, unsophisticated, and terribly implemented. It should be pulled from the game in the next patch, completed, and re-implemented along side the Player Guard, Dark Brotherhood, and Thieves Guild content for which this feature was intended to provide mechanics for.

As it's implemented now, I find it's cheaper to just refuse to pay fines, rack up as high of a bounty as I like, and just be naked when I turn myself in for the guards to kill and wipe my bounty. Worst case sceanrio is I'm not naked and my repair bill is still cheaper than my bounty.

Consequences? What consequences? This "Justice System" has no consequences.

ItsMeToo

The Justice System is not broken. It works.

Samadhi

Obscure wrote: »

...
As it's implemented now, I find it's cheaper to just refuse to pay fines, rack up as high of a bounty as I like, and just be naked when I turn myself in for the guards to kill and wipe my bounty. Worst case sceanrio is I'm not naked and my repair bill is still cheaper than my bounty.
...

Thought that when guards manage to kill a character it automatically removes the full bounty from their gold in bag, and if it does not cover the full price then the guards will continue to kill the character on sight.
Is that not how it works? Personally do not get caught, so have not dealt with it. Paid off my bounties to the Fence just to get the achievement dye.

Qyrk

@Murderwalk , the justice system is not complete (this is only Phase 1), hence it feels very much that they left many things out. You are new around here from the looks of it, but previous correspondence with ZOS entails that Phase 2 of the justice system is coming (the true contents of that phase or even when that is implemented is not known ).

All we can do right now is provide feedback, and I hope you input those things in the OP to ZOS.

Obscure

Samadhi wrote: »

Obscure wrote: »

...
As it's implemented now, I find it's cheaper to just refuse to pay fines, rack up as high of a bounty as I like, and just be naked when I turn myself in for the guards to kill and wipe my bounty. Worst case sceanrio is I'm not naked and my repair bill is still cheaper than my bounty.
...

Thought that when guards manage to kill a character it automatically removes the full bounty from their gold in bag, and if it does not cover the full price then the guards will continue to kill the character on sight.
Is that not how it works? Personally do not get caught, so have not dealt with it. Paid off my bounties to the Fence just to get the achievement dye.

Important Note: Keep money in the bank =P

Samadhi

Obscure wrote: »

Samadhi wrote: »

Obscure wrote: »

...
As it's implemented now, I find it's cheaper to just refuse to pay fines, rack up as high of a bounty as I like, and just be naked when I turn myself in for the guards to kill and wipe my bounty. Worst case sceanrio is I'm not naked and my repair bill is still cheaper than my bounty.
...

Thought that when guards manage to kill a character it automatically removes the full bounty from their gold in bag, and if it does not cover the full price then the guards will continue to kill the character on sight.
Is that not how it works? Personally do not get caught, so have not dealt with it. Paid off my bounties to the Fence just to get the achievement dye.

Important Note: Keep money in the bank =P

And if the gold is in the bank it wipes bounty with no cost?

Qyrk

Samadhi wrote: »

And if the gold is in the bank it wipes bounty with no cost?

If you don't have any money on you to pay the full bounty, you will still have a bounty with you regardless.

Samadhi

Qyrk wrote: »

Samadhi wrote: »

And if the gold is in the bank it wipes bounty with no cost?

If you don't have any money on you to pay the full bounty, you will still have a bounty with you regardless.

Okay, that was what I had figured.

Thank you for clarifying.

TheShadowScout

Personally it also vexes me that people don't have any lasting effects from having been caught once or a dozend times, once they pay their bounty.

It would be neat to have a "criminal reputation" that tracks how often and for what (in terms of bounty) the guard caught you - pay a fance to clear your bounty, no problem, get nabbed by the guards (or later, player enforcers) and your "bad rep" rises.
And with some effects if it goes high enough... your name is remembered, both among the underworld, and the city guard, I could see some advantages in criminal activities, and some disadvantages with the law...
...the fence/guard bounty payments could be the first step, higher rep means pay less to clear your bounty with the fence, but more if the guard gets to you... perhaps similar effects on merchants, who'd charge extra for dealing with a "known criminal", while the merchants in the outlaw refugee might giove you special discounts for being a person in bad standing. Or there could even be special merchants with interesting criminal gear you only get access too if you are well known to be up to no good... (solemnly swearing it may not be enough)

I_killed_Vivec

I'm disappointed that when I'm very naughty, I get told I'm kill on sight. No sooner have I thought to myself "Better not get caught then" when I'm told I'm now merely despicable.

Makes me so angry I go killing more temple acolytes!

Sotha_Sil

I_killed_Vivec wrote: »

Makes me so angry I go killing more temple acolytes!

How dare you !

TheShadowScout wrote: »

Or there could even be special merchants with interesting criminal gear you only get access too if you are well known to be up to no good... (solemnly swearing it may not be enough)

This is a great idea, it must happen.

Seth_Black

I never get caught, never pay bounty or fight guards ...and still make 20-30k+ gold daily on stealing.
Looks like some of you don't deserve to join Thieves Guild

P.S. If I do pay bounty or get caught it's only for the achievements

Chuggernaut

Jails don't work in MMOs, so no. Also the rich and the poor can both rob there hearts out. Just keep your money in the bank and go nuts, guards can only take cash on hand.

Evandus

Think there's a lot of tweaking that needs to be done. For example I ran a quest on a lowbie alt in Glenumbra yesterday and was genuinely shocked to learn I had a 'kill on sight' rep suddenly. I forget the name of it, but its the one with the Aldmeri setting up to invade.

In the process of doing that quest, I found that AOE effects were damaging the Lion Guard Members. They immediately aggro on you as well. Took a moment initially for me to realize that Lightning Form was the culprit. There have been other cases where effects have caused me to gain a KOS rep as well that were perplexing.

This and the hitting 'e' to talk to an npc and learning I accidentally stole something sitting in the environment are kinda nerve wracking.

Anoteros

Murderwalk wrote: »

There needs to be some kind of jail that penalizes people that get caught multiple times. For example: every time you choose to flee from a guard, your bounty should be multiplied exponentially. People with loads of money are free to commit crimes as they please simply because gold is of no worry to them. Maybe implementing some kind of probation, which would prevent you from participating in dungeons or something. I don;t know I'm just saying, this Justice System does not remind me of an ESO type Justice System. WE NEED A JAIL. I feel as though bounties are so low, that long time players have no care in the world about the price of bounty. It reminds me of life on our planet Earth, where a company can spill thousands of gallons of oil into an ocean, and they simply pay pocket change for a fine and everyone forgets about it. I think like in past Elder Scrolls games, there needs to be a permanent reputation score that makes it harder for people who devote their life to crime to function in everyday society.

If we need to get skill points taken away, so be it. I think people should have to make a serious decision about whether or not they become a criminal.

Yep. In it's current state the Justice system is half assed.

There should be jail time instead of unkillable guards smashing you down or at the very least allow players to fight back. I'm hoping they improve it in coming patches and not have to wait for the DLC -_-

whvice

I'm running around with 110k bounty and 14k gold in my pocket for 9 days now.

what does this make me?

Ysne58

A show off? That it's possible to do that, at least for awhile?

Anoteros

Evandus wrote: »

Think there's a lot of tweaking that needs to be done. For example I ran a quest on a lowbie alt in Glenumbra yesterday and was genuinely shocked to learn I had a 'kill on sight' rep suddenly. I forget the name of it, but its the one with the Aldmeri setting up to invade.

In the process of doing that quest, I found that AOE effects were damaging the Lion Guard Members. They immediately aggro on you as well. Took a moment initially for me to realize that Lightning Form was the culprit. There have been other cases where effects have caused me to gain a KOS rep as well that were perplexing.

This and the hitting 'e' to talk to an npc and learning I accidentally stole something sitting in the environment are kinda nerve wracking.

use http://www.esoui.com/downloads/info943-NoAccidentalStealing.html
the end

rager82b14_ESO

does bounty scale to how much money you have? because my bounties on low level chars are so cheap, I am making bank.

Evandus

Anoteros wrote: »

Evandus wrote: »

Think there's a lot of tweaking that needs to be done. For example I ran a quest on a lowbie alt in Glenumbra yesterday and was genuinely shocked to learn I had a 'kill on sight' rep suddenly. I forget the name of it, but its the one with the Aldmeri setting up to invade.

In the process of doing that quest, I found that AOE effects were damaging the Lion Guard Members. They immediately aggro on you as well. Took a moment initially for me to realize that Lightning Form was the culprit. There have been other cases where effects have caused me to gain a KOS rep as well that were perplexing.

This and the hitting 'e' to talk to an npc and learning I accidentally stole something sitting in the environment are kinda nerve wracking.

use http://www.esoui.com/downloads/info943-NoAccidentalStealing.html
the end

This is an interesting solution. But it doesn't address the first part of my post.

For example, if you run the quest in Glenumbra Moors, where friendlies are fighting with other npc's - they don't have a white halo around them. The friendlies in other quests do. This is inconsistent, and is in sore need of attention.

That addon looks to be worth checking out though.

fromtesonlineb16_ESO

Lionxoft wrote: »

We've been saying the thieves guild and dark brotherhood are still coming for a while now. Is it within reach? Nope.

Precisely, PLAYERS have been speculating and rumour mongering for most of the game's life, I don't recall a SINGLE ZOS POST which gave any hint of a timescale.

Anoteros

Evandus wrote: »

Anoteros wrote: »

Evandus wrote: »

Think there's a lot of tweaking that needs to be done. For example I ran a quest on a lowbie alt in Glenumbra yesterday and was genuinely shocked to learn I had a 'kill on sight' rep suddenly. I forget the name of it, but its the one with the Aldmeri setting up to invade.

In the process of doing that quest, I found that AOE effects were damaging the Lion Guard Members. They immediately aggro on you as well. Took a moment initially for me to realize that Lightning Form was the culprit. There have been other cases where effects have caused me to gain a KOS rep as well that were perplexing.

This and the hitting 'e' to talk to an npc and learning I accidentally stole something sitting in the environment are kinda nerve wracking.

use http://www.esoui.com/downloads/info943-NoAccidentalStealing.html
the end

This is an interesting solution. But it doesn't address the first part of my post.

For example, if you run the quest in Glenumbra Moors, where friendlies are fighting with other npc's - they don't have a white halo around them. The friendlies in other quests do. This is inconsistent, and is in sore need of attention.

That addon looks to be worth checking out though.

I can see how the damaging friendlies is a problem. Silly ZOS

At least there's a solution for the accidental stealing :P

Eiron77

Evandus wrote: »

Think there's a lot of tweaking that needs to be done. For example I ran a quest on a lowbie alt in Glenumbra yesterday and was genuinely shocked to learn I had a 'kill on sight' rep suddenly. I forget the name of it, but its the one with the Aldmeri setting up to invade.

In the process of doing that quest, I found that AOE effects were damaging the Lion Guard Members. They immediately aggro on you as well. Took a moment initially for me to realize that Lightning Form was the culprit. There have been other cases where effects have caused me to gain a KOS rep as well that were perplexing.

This and the hitting 'e' to talk to an npc and learning I accidentally stole something sitting in the environment are kinda nerve wracking.

Evandus - While in the game:

> Settings > Gameplay (Combat) > Prevent Attacking Innocents > On


If you use Auto Loot, this will help prevent Auto-Looting Stolen items:
(NOTE: This will not prevent you from manually looting stolen items. The addon mentioned above will help further if you require it.)

> Settings > Gameplay (ITEMS) > Auto Loot Stolen Items > Off

WraithAzraiel

There have been several threads devoted to the addition of a prison system, I've posted one, @Gidorick has posted one. We've both submitted them through the /feedback feature in game.

Ball's in ZOS' court. If they listen, awesome, if they don't? Meh. Either road, we won't see anything of anything until after June.