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https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/668104/
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https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/668104/
Restoring Light.
-
Ashanne✭✭✭✭Well ZOS a new habit to boost unused skills in the past like : wreaking blow /healing ritual.
How about make healing ritual uninterruptable like Wreaking blow was "tweaked" (now every one spams it more than the impulse spam in the past) and increase our defense while we are casting it.
1 -
Vandril✭✭✭✭Fizzlewizzle wrote: »@Vandril
Could you please us all and write down the synergies Templars have with other skill trees and playstyles, since you seem to be so confident about them being able to do everything decent (besides healing).
I don't recall stating that the Templar class can do everything well. That would be implying that they are balanced and in no need of tweaks, and I highly doubt that's the case. If it sounded like I was implying that somewhere, then I apologize for the confusion.
I take it the point which you thought I meant this by was in my first post. My final point there was not that Templar could do anything, but that every class, Templar included, has skills that ultimately fit into the two combat niches of the broadest level. Of course, I had to explain those niches, thus the body of my first post. Where other classes seem to have these skills spread out, more or less evenly, amongst their skill lines, Templars seem to have nearly all of their "healing"-niche skills in a single line. The total number of "healing"-niche spells is, give or take one, about the same as the rest of classes.
In finality, I have two points:- The Templar class is not the only class with 4-5 "healing"-niche skills.
- Even if it were, the Templar class should not just be the best healer class due to that.
That is all I mean. I am not saying that the class is balanced. I am definitely not saying it doesn't need tweaking or shouldn't be tweaked. All I am ultimately trying to express are the above two points. I am only arguing against a dangerous class design philosophy that mustn't take root in the community's minds, lest they lead to some terrible changes which ruin any hope of future class balance.Edited by Vandril on March 27, 2015 4:13PM1 -
uso245✭✭✭My main is a v14 templar and the problem with some temps I've noticed that heal rely too heavily on just class skills which with any class limits your flexibility. When I am healing I use both Restoration Staff and Restoring Light skills on my primary healing bar because seriously Healing Ward... do you really want to give up that beautiful (heal>bubble>heal) just for one templar skill that just does plain healing...My Facebook Page
My Youtube Channel(DC NA Megaserver) Beta TesterMy TwitterArt of DeathFate Stay Night
Member since February 2014
l
Strategist/Tactician0 -
timidobserver✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭
Your build is irrelevant. The mantikora is going to kill you if you are channeling healing ritual when he stomps. If you take a heavy attack in vet dsa without blocking, you are probably going to die.Fizzlewizzle wrote: »
I'm build for taking a hit, blocking or not.timidobserver wrote: »Fizzlewizzle wrote: »@Vandril DJ
Could you please us all and write down the synergies Templars have with other skill trees and playstyles, since you seem to be so confident about them being able to do everything decent (besides healing).
You do know that they boosted Healing Ritual by 70%?timidobserver wrote: »
It is clear from 1.6 that ZOS doesn't agree with this. That doesn't mean you are wrong, it just means that ZOS has made clear that they want Templar healing less powerful. Taking that into consideration, I would be in favor of removing the garbage from restoring light and adding useful stuff. Remove all of the useless morphs and useless skills and replace them with utility/buffs or even dps skills. The Radiant Aura morph and Healing Ritual skill both need to be deleted.likewow777 wrote: »Templars need better healing:
I wouldn't see that as "ZOS not agreeing with with that Templar need better healing". Maybe its because they wanted to make the skill more useful... if thats the case then i would advise them to also increase the range drastic.
As someone that uses Healing Ritual as a main healing skill i can tell them this:
A Healing Ritual user draws a lot of agro because often they need to stand in the middle of the crowd to heal everyone. Since you have idiots out there that love running away from enemies (and thus run out of Healing Ritual range) you have to constantly walk after them (with a crowd of monsters swarming around you), causing them to run again...
You only have 5 meters on each side of you to heal people. An average "melee" range is already 5-8 meters, which means that they can stand outside the healing area while still being in melee range. If you have Ranged type players within your group this range grows greatly.
I'm not suggestion that HEaling Ritual needs to be 28M to each side of us (56M Total), but at least having a coverage range of 22-28M (total) would be needed to be able to stand between the Tank+Enemies and the (Long Ranged) Dps guys.
As long as it has a cast time it is garbage.
1. There are so many other things you could be doing for your group as opossed to standing in place channeling healing ritual. Dpsing, buffing, debuffing.
2. Two seconds is long enough for people to die. Your Vet DSA group would wipe regularly.
3. You can't block while channeling it as one hardheader healer learned a learned in Sanctum Ophidia group I was in shortly after 1.6 launched.
The skill is garbage. No tweaks. Replace it.
But, that aside... what would you suggest for a Replacement? Saying that it should be replaced is easy, comming up with a decent idea is a bit harder.
Meh to ideas. Healing ritual is so bad that we would be better of off it was just deleted and not even replaced. At least bad/new healers would no longer have access to it. However, I would replace it with a toggle since Templar are the only class without one. One morph would benefit dps and the other tanking.Edited by timidobserver on March 27, 2015 5:20PMV16 Uriel Stormblessed EP Magicka Templar(main)
V16 Derelict Vagabond EP Stamina DK
V16 Redacted Ep Stam Sorc
V16 Insolent EP Magicka Sorc(retired)
V16 Jed I Nyte EP Stamina NB(retired)1 -
Fizzlewizzle✭✭✭✭
I might have an idea, though maybe a bit of a strange one.timidobserver wrote: »
Your build is irrelevant. The mantikora is going to kill you if you are channeling healing ritual when he stomps. If you take a heavy attack in vet dsa without blocking, you are probably going to die.Fizzlewizzle wrote: »
I'm build for taking a hit, blocking or not.timidobserver wrote: »Fizzlewizzle wrote: »@Vandril DJ
Could you please us all and write down the synergies Templars have with other skill trees and playstyles, since you seem to be so confident about them being able to do everything decent (besides healing).
You do know that they boosted Healing Ritual by 70%?timidobserver wrote: »
It is clear from 1.6 that ZOS doesn't agree with this. That doesn't mean you are wrong, it just means that ZOS has made clear that they want Templar healing less powerful. Taking that into consideration, I would be in favor of removing the garbage from restoring light and adding useful stuff. Remove all of the useless morphs and useless skills and replace them with utility/buffs or even dps skills. The Radiant Aura morph and Healing Ritual skill both need to be deleted.likewow777 wrote: »Templars need better healing:
I wouldn't see that as "ZOS not agreeing with with that Templar need better healing". Maybe its because they wanted to make the skill more useful... if thats the case then i would advise them to also increase the range drastic.
As someone that uses Healing Ritual as a main healing skill i can tell them this:
A Healing Ritual user draws a lot of agro because often they need to stand in the middle of the crowd to heal everyone. Since you have idiots out there that love running away from enemies (and thus run out of Healing Ritual range) you have to constantly walk after them (with a crowd of monsters swarming around you), causing them to run again...
You only have 5 meters on each side of you to heal people. An average "melee" range is already 5-8 meters, which means that they can stand outside the healing area while still being in melee range. If you have Ranged type players within your group this range grows greatly.
I'm not suggestion that HEaling Ritual needs to be 28M to each side of us (56M Total), but at least having a coverage range of 22-28M (total) would be needed to be able to stand between the Tank+Enemies and the (Long Ranged) Dps guys.
As long as it has a cast time it is garbage.
1. There are so many other things you could be doing for your group as opossed to standing in place channeling healing ritual. Dpsing, buffing, debuffing.
2. Two seconds is long enough for people to die. Your Vet DSA group would wipe regularly.
3. You can't block while channeling it as one hardheader healer learned a learned in Sanctum Ophidia group I was in shortly after 1.6 launched.
The skill is garbage. No tweaks. Replace it.
But, that aside... what would you suggest for a Replacement? Saying that it should be replaced is easy, comming up with a decent idea is a bit harder.
Meh to ideas. Healing ritual is so bad that we would be better of off it was just deleted and not even replaced. At least bad/new healers would no longer have access to it. However, I would replace it with a toggle since Templar are the only class without one. One morph would benefit dps and the other tanking.
A Toggle, maybe something like summoning a "Mender".
Menders can both heal and deal damage, as you probably have noticed while fighting those guys.
The basic Skill could give you a normal mender, while the Morphs could make the Mender focus on healing only or damage only.
The Normal mender would posses the basic skills:
- Healing (not the "Radiant Destruction" like healing some often cast), sort of like Honor the Dead.
- Sun Fire.
The Healing Mender (Morph) could posses skills like:
- Healing (Honor the dead).
- Channeled Healing (The beam healing NPC's sometimes use)
- Rune Focus
The Offensive Mender (Morph) could posses skills like:
- Vampire's Bane or Reflective Light (maybe based on the morph you use yourself)
- Eclipse
- Backlash
(Not Radiant Destruction, that would be to much)
As for how the mender would/ could look:
- A yellow/ gold-ish Flame Atronach.
- An Alliance war mender (your own alliance).
- Maybe a yellow/ gold-ish Spirit/ Ghost.
Mending-The-Wounded, Aldmeri Dominion, Templar.0 -
likewow777✭✭✭timidobserver wrote: »likewow777 wrote: »
Templars need better healing:
It is clear from 1.6 that ZOS doesn't agree with this. That doesn't mean you are wrong, it just means that ZOS has made clear that they want Templar healing less powerful. Taking that into consideration, I would be in favor of removing the garbage from restoring light and adding useful stuff. Remove all of the useless morphs and useless skills and replace them with utility/buffs or even dps skills. The Radiant Aura morph and Healing Ritual skill both need to be deleted.
Oh, I agree 100%. I mentioned something similar at the beginning of that post. This whole discussion is academic, at best. Especially when it comes to Templars, ZOS does as ZOS wants, even preferring to listen to non-Templars over us. And unfortunately, they have the habit of ruining skills/passives to achieve balance rather than improving others. Which is why Healing Ritual and Radiant Aura won't get changed or deleted/replaced. Keeping them there gimps the tree, which makes class heal skills worse, which is what they want anyway.
I'll say it again: Buff resto staff skills, give me pre 1.6 Mending, and then just leave Restoring Light alone."War doesn't build character, it reveals it."0 -
timidobserver✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Fizzlewizzle wrote: »
I might have an idea, though maybe a bit of a strange one.timidobserver wrote: »
Your build is irrelevant. The mantikora is going to kill you if you are channeling healing ritual when he stomps. If you take a heavy attack in vet dsa without blocking, you are probably going to die.Fizzlewizzle wrote: »
I'm build for taking a hit, blocking or not.timidobserver wrote: »Fizzlewizzle wrote: »@Vandril DJ
Could you please us all and write down the synergies Templars have with other skill trees and playstyles, since you seem to be so confident about them being able to do everything decent (besides healing).
You do know that they boosted Healing Ritual by 70%?timidobserver wrote: »
It is clear from 1.6 that ZOS doesn't agree with this. That doesn't mean you are wrong, it just means that ZOS has made clear that they want Templar healing less powerful. Taking that into consideration, I would be in favor of removing the garbage from restoring light and adding useful stuff. Remove all of the useless morphs and useless skills and replace them with utility/buffs or even dps skills. The Radiant Aura morph and Healing Ritual skill both need to be deleted.likewow777 wrote: »Templars need better healing:
I wouldn't see that as "ZOS not agreeing with with that Templar need better healing". Maybe its because they wanted to make the skill more useful... if thats the case then i would advise them to also increase the range drastic.
As someone that uses Healing Ritual as a main healing skill i can tell them this:
A Healing Ritual user draws a lot of agro because often they need to stand in the middle of the crowd to heal everyone. Since you have idiots out there that love running away from enemies (and thus run out of Healing Ritual range) you have to constantly walk after them (with a crowd of monsters swarming around you), causing them to run again...
You only have 5 meters on each side of you to heal people. An average "melee" range is already 5-8 meters, which means that they can stand outside the healing area while still being in melee range. If you have Ranged type players within your group this range grows greatly.
I'm not suggestion that HEaling Ritual needs to be 28M to each side of us (56M Total), but at least having a coverage range of 22-28M (total) would be needed to be able to stand between the Tank+Enemies and the (Long Ranged) Dps guys.
As long as it has a cast time it is garbage.
1. There are so many other things you could be doing for your group as opossed to standing in place channeling healing ritual. Dpsing, buffing, debuffing.
2. Two seconds is long enough for people to die. Your Vet DSA group would wipe regularly.
3. You can't block while channeling it as one hardheader healer learned a learned in Sanctum Ophidia group I was in shortly after 1.6 launched.
The skill is garbage. No tweaks. Replace it.
But, that aside... what would you suggest for a Replacement? Saying that it should be replaced is easy, comming up with a decent idea is a bit harder.
Meh to ideas. Healing ritual is so bad that we would be better of off it was just deleted and not even replaced. At least bad/new healers would no longer have access to it. However, I would replace it with a toggle since Templar are the only class without one. One morph would benefit dps and the other tanking.
A Toggle, maybe something like summoning a "Mender".
Menders can both heal and deal damage, as you probably have noticed while fighting those guys.
The basic Skill could give you a normal mender, while the Morphs could make the Mender focus on healing only or damage only.
The Normal mender would posses the basic skills:
- Healing (not the "Radiant Destruction" like healing some often cast), sort of like Honor the Dead.
- Sun Fire.
The Healing Mender (Morph) could posses skills like:
- Healing (Honor the dead).
- Channeled Healing (The beam healing NPC's sometimes use)
- Rune Focus
The Offensive Mender (Morph) could posses skills like:
- Vampire's Bane or Reflective Light (maybe based on the morph you use yourself)
- Eclipse
- Backlash
(Not Radiant Destruction, that would be to much)
As for how the mender would/ could look:
- A yellow/ gold-ish Flame Atronach.
- An Alliance war mender (your own alliance).
- Maybe a yellow/ gold-ish Spirit/ Ghost.
No, I don't want a pet. It is specifically why I chose to level a NB alt and not a Sorc alt. I'd prefer an aura/buff toggle like Inferno, Siphoning Attacks, or Bound armor. Everyone has one of these type of toggle aura/buff type skills except Templar.V16 Uriel Stormblessed EP Magicka Templar(main)
V16 Derelict Vagabond EP Stamina DK
V16 Redacted Ep Stam Sorc
V16 Insolent EP Magicka Sorc(retired)
V16 Jed I Nyte EP Stamina NB(retired)1 -
Fizzlewizzle✭✭✭✭
A "pet" seemed like the best option if you wanted offence and defense at the same time.timidobserver wrote: »Fizzlewizzle wrote: »
I might have an idea, though maybe a bit of a strange one.timidobserver wrote: »
Your build is irrelevant. The mantikora is going to kill you if you are channeling healing ritual when he stomps. If you take a heavy attack in vet dsa without blocking, you are probably going to die.Fizzlewizzle wrote: »
I'm build for taking a hit, blocking or not.timidobserver wrote: »Fizzlewizzle wrote: »@Vandril DJ
Could you please us all and write down the synergies Templars have with other skill trees and playstyles, since you seem to be so confident about them being able to do everything decent (besides healing).
You do know that they boosted Healing Ritual by 70%?timidobserver wrote: »
It is clear from 1.6 that ZOS doesn't agree with this. That doesn't mean you are wrong, it just means that ZOS has made clear that they want Templar healing less powerful. Taking that into consideration, I would be in favor of removing the garbage from restoring light and adding useful stuff. Remove all of the useless morphs and useless skills and replace them with utility/buffs or even dps skills. The Radiant Aura morph and Healing Ritual skill both need to be deleted.likewow777 wrote: »Templars need better healing:
I wouldn't see that as "ZOS not agreeing with with that Templar need better healing". Maybe its because they wanted to make the skill more useful... if thats the case then i would advise them to also increase the range drastic.
As someone that uses Healing Ritual as a main healing skill i can tell them this:
A Healing Ritual user draws a lot of agro because often they need to stand in the middle of the crowd to heal everyone. Since you have idiots out there that love running away from enemies (and thus run out of Healing Ritual range) you have to constantly walk after them (with a crowd of monsters swarming around you), causing them to run again...
You only have 5 meters on each side of you to heal people. An average "melee" range is already 5-8 meters, which means that they can stand outside the healing area while still being in melee range. If you have Ranged type players within your group this range grows greatly.
I'm not suggestion that HEaling Ritual needs to be 28M to each side of us (56M Total), but at least having a coverage range of 22-28M (total) would be needed to be able to stand between the Tank+Enemies and the (Long Ranged) Dps guys.
As long as it has a cast time it is garbage.
1. There are so many other things you could be doing for your group as opossed to standing in place channeling healing ritual. Dpsing, buffing, debuffing.
2. Two seconds is long enough for people to die. Your Vet DSA group would wipe regularly.
3. You can't block while channeling it as one hardheader healer learned a learned in Sanctum Ophidia group I was in shortly after 1.6 launched.
The skill is garbage. No tweaks. Replace it.
But, that aside... what would you suggest for a Replacement? Saying that it should be replaced is easy, comming up with a decent idea is a bit harder.
Meh to ideas. Healing ritual is so bad that we would be better of off it was just deleted and not even replaced. At least bad/new healers would no longer have access to it. However, I would replace it with a toggle since Templar are the only class without one. One morph would benefit dps and the other tanking.
A Toggle, maybe something like summoning a "Mender".
Menders can both heal and deal damage, as you probably have noticed while fighting those guys.
The basic Skill could give you a normal mender, while the Morphs could make the Mender focus on healing only or damage only.
The Normal mender would posses the basic skills:
- Healing (not the "Radiant Destruction" like healing some often cast), sort of like Honor the Dead.
- Sun Fire.
The Healing Mender (Morph) could posses skills like:
- Healing (Honor the dead).
- Channeled Healing (The beam healing NPC's sometimes use)
- Rune Focus
The Offensive Mender (Morph) could posses skills like:
- Vampire's Bane or Reflective Light (maybe based on the morph you use yourself)
- Eclipse
- Backlash
(Not Radiant Destruction, that would be to much)
As for how the mender would/ could look:
- A yellow/ gold-ish Flame Atronach.
- An Alliance war mender (your own alliance).
- Maybe a yellow/ gold-ish Spirit/ Ghost.
No, I don't want a pet. It is specifically why I chose to level a NB alt and not a Sorc alt. I'd prefer an aura/buff toggle like Inferno, Siphoning Attacks, or Bound armor. Everyone has one of these type of toggle aura/buff type skills except Templar.
Inferno, Siphoning Strikes and Bound armor are pretty one-sided buffs, its either offence or defense.
Inferno seems pretty useless... Its like a mage light, with an added fire attack (idk how strong that fire attack is though).
For a Bound armor effect i wouldn't look at Healing Ritual, but at Restoring focus (the lesser of the two Rune Focus Morphs).
Instead of being a ground defense buff they could make it that it "wraps" around you, maybe indicated with the Golden Glow you get these days while standing on a Rune Focus plus maybe a Golden Magelight to make it clear you have that buff for other players. (i like those orbs). It could be the Major Ward effect without any added bonuses, or Minor Ward with an extra bonus (extra healing received, like it currently does?)
A Siphoning Strikes effect would (my opinion) seem better for Restoring aura, but instead of a Magicka + Stamina effect the Nightblades get a Templar would get Health and Stamina. The Morphs could also work the same way, but with Magicka for "Leeching Strikes" and Health and Stamina for "Siphoning Attacks".
For Healing Ritual (the main point we started with) you could also have an Toggled aura effect.
This aura effect could use Smart healing to search out allies who have less than 100% health and heal them.
An orb like Magelight could float around the user, and ones a player falls below the health cap the orb will leave you, Pass through the target (healing them) and return, waiting for its next action.
As for the healing.
The base skill could heal 1/2/3/4% of the targets max HP ones he ducks below 100%.
One Morph could increase that to 5/6/7/8% of the target's max health.
The other Morph could increase the amount of orbs to 2/3/4/5 orbs.
(Those orbs should fly horizontal)
Another option could be that instead of healing allies those orbs go after the nearest enemy, dealing low amounts of damage and using that damage to heal yourself.
If you were to use the 1 orb vs many orbs morph suggestion, then you could give the 1 orb a huge radius and higher damage, and the many orb option a very short range, low damage but more healing.
Edited by Fizzlewizzle on March 28, 2015 1:30AMMending-The-Wounded, Aldmeri Dominion, Templar.0 -
eliisra✭✭✭✭✭
✭Well ZOS a new habit to boost unused skills in the past like : wreaking blow /healing ritual.
How about make healing ritual uninterruptable like Wreaking blow was "tweaked" (now every one spams it more than the impulse spam in the past) and increase our defense while we are casting it.
That wouldn't matter, the casting time isn't tuned or balanced to fit the high burst in this game. Healing 2 seconds later is always to late. There are no boss stomps or AoE waves where you have 2 free seconds in-between to cast in PvE. Same goes for PvP, you usually have 0.5-1 sec to heal someone before they die. Than there's the tiny radius.
They should just remove it, to prevent new players from wiping groups.
Topic: Restoring Light is basically one really strong skill: Breath of Life. Channelled Focus is pretty sweet after 1.6, but rest is situational or rubbish. I dont think templars should be way better healers than other classes, but I dont agree with having a skill tree where most things aren't worth slotting. Than there's the passives, one isn't even worth putting points in. I mean they did freshen up Daedric Summoning (used the be the worst skill tree in the game), now It's time for Restoring Light pretty please.1 -
timidobserver✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Fizzlewizzle wrote: »
A "pet" seemed like the best option if you wanted offence and defense at the same time.timidobserver wrote: »Fizzlewizzle wrote: »
I might have an idea, though maybe a bit of a strange one.timidobserver wrote: »
Your build is irrelevant. The mantikora is going to kill you if you are channeling healing ritual when he stomps. If you take a heavy attack in vet dsa without blocking, you are probably going to die.Fizzlewizzle wrote: »
I'm build for taking a hit, blocking or not.timidobserver wrote: »Fizzlewizzle wrote: »@Vandril DJ
Could you please us all and write down the synergies Templars have with other skill trees and playstyles, since you seem to be so confident about them being able to do everything decent (besides healing).
You do know that they boosted Healing Ritual by 70%?timidobserver wrote: »
It is clear from 1.6 that ZOS doesn't agree with this. That doesn't mean you are wrong, it just means that ZOS has made clear that they want Templar healing less powerful. Taking that into consideration, I would be in favor of removing the garbage from restoring light and adding useful stuff. Remove all of the useless morphs and useless skills and replace them with utility/buffs or even dps skills. The Radiant Aura morph and Healing Ritual skill both need to be deleted.likewow777 wrote: »Templars need better healing:
I wouldn't see that as "ZOS not agreeing with with that Templar need better healing". Maybe its because they wanted to make the skill more useful... if thats the case then i would advise them to also increase the range drastic.
As someone that uses Healing Ritual as a main healing skill i can tell them this:
A Healing Ritual user draws a lot of agro because often they need to stand in the middle of the crowd to heal everyone. Since you have idiots out there that love running away from enemies (and thus run out of Healing Ritual range) you have to constantly walk after them (with a crowd of monsters swarming around you), causing them to run again...
You only have 5 meters on each side of you to heal people. An average "melee" range is already 5-8 meters, which means that they can stand outside the healing area while still being in melee range. If you have Ranged type players within your group this range grows greatly.
I'm not suggestion that HEaling Ritual needs to be 28M to each side of us (56M Total), but at least having a coverage range of 22-28M (total) would be needed to be able to stand between the Tank+Enemies and the (Long Ranged) Dps guys.
As long as it has a cast time it is garbage.
1. There are so many other things you could be doing for your group as opossed to standing in place channeling healing ritual. Dpsing, buffing, debuffing.
2. Two seconds is long enough for people to die. Your Vet DSA group would wipe regularly.
3. You can't block while channeling it as one hardheader healer learned a learned in Sanctum Ophidia group I was in shortly after 1.6 launched.
The skill is garbage. No tweaks. Replace it.
But, that aside... what would you suggest for a Replacement? Saying that it should be replaced is easy, comming up with a decent idea is a bit harder.
Meh to ideas. Healing ritual is so bad that we would be better of off it was just deleted and not even replaced. At least bad/new healers would no longer have access to it. However, I would replace it with a toggle since Templar are the only class without one. One morph would benefit dps and the other tanking.
A Toggle, maybe something like summoning a "Mender".
Menders can both heal and deal damage, as you probably have noticed while fighting those guys.
The basic Skill could give you a normal mender, while the Morphs could make the Mender focus on healing only or damage only.
The Normal mender would posses the basic skills:
- Healing (not the "Radiant Destruction" like healing some often cast), sort of like Honor the Dead.
- Sun Fire.
The Healing Mender (Morph) could posses skills like:
- Healing (Honor the dead).
- Channeled Healing (The beam healing NPC's sometimes use)
- Rune Focus
The Offensive Mender (Morph) could posses skills like:
- Vampire's Bane or Reflective Light (maybe based on the morph you use yourself)
- Eclipse
- Backlash
(Not Radiant Destruction, that would be to much)
As for how the mender would/ could look:
- A yellow/ gold-ish Flame Atronach.
- An Alliance war mender (your own alliance).
- Maybe a yellow/ gold-ish Spirit/ Ghost.
No, I don't want a pet. It is specifically why I chose to level a NB alt and not a Sorc alt. I'd prefer an aura/buff toggle like Inferno, Siphoning Attacks, or Bound armor. Everyone has one of these type of toggle aura/buff type skills except Templar.
Inferno, Siphoning Strikes and Bound armor are pretty one-sided buffs, its either offence or defense.
Inferno seems pretty useless... Its like a mage light, with an added fire attack (idk how strong that fire attack is though).
For a Bound armor effect i wouldn't look at Healing Ritual, but at Restoring focus (the lesser of the two Rune Focus Morphs).
Instead of being a ground defense buff they could make it that it "wraps" around you, maybe indicated with the Golden Glow you get these days while standing on a Rune Focus plus maybe a Golden Magelight to make it clear you have that buff for other players. (i like those orbs). It could be the Major Ward effect without any added bonuses, or Minor Ward with an extra bonus (extra healing received, like it currently does?)
A Siphoning Strikes effect would (my opinion) seem better for Restoring aura, but instead of a Magicka + Stamina effect the Nightblades get a Templar would get Health and Stamina. The Morphs could also work the same way, but with Magicka for "Leeching Strikes" and Health and Stamina for "Siphoning Attacks".
For Healing Ritual (the main point we started with) you could also have an Toggled aura effect.
This aura effect could use Smart healing to search out allies who have less than 100% health and heal them.
An orb like Magelight could float around the user, and ones a player falls below the health cap the orb will leave you, Pass through the target (healing them) and return, waiting for its next action.
As for the healing.
The base skill could heal 1/2/3/4% of the targets max HP ones he ducks below 100%.
One Morph could increase that to 5/6/7/8% of the target's max health.
The other Morph could increase the amount of orbs to 2/3/4/5 orbs.
(Those orbs should fly horizontal)
Another option could be that instead of healing allies those orbs go after the nearest enemy, dealing low amounts of damage and using that damage to heal yourself.
If you were to use the 1 orb vs many orbs morph suggestion, then you could give the 1 orb a huge radius and higher damage, and the many orb option a very short range, low damage but more healing.
I'd just go with something simple like Morph 1 reduces healing to anyone other than yourself by 50% and increases your spell damage by 20%. Morph two does something or other that would be useful for a tank, I don't really care what.
Edited by timidobserver on March 28, 2015 2:46AMV16 Uriel Stormblessed EP Magicka Templar(main)
V16 Derelict Vagabond EP Stamina DK
V16 Redacted Ep Stam Sorc
V16 Insolent EP Magicka Sorc(retired)
V16 Jed I Nyte EP Stamina NB(retired)0 -
Islyn✭✭✭✭✭
✭My point was: If you really want to heal - be a templar. If you really want to dps pick anything else.0 -
Islyn✭✭✭✭✭
✭
Class description - pah. Whatevs on that. I stand by my opinion.
Hmm maybe I should have said if you want to heal really well, not just wave a resto staff around.Edited by Islyn on March 28, 2015 3:19PM0 -
Fizzlewizzle✭✭✭✭
The maximum reduced healing you can give someone is 30 or 40% (Major Defile (de-)buff, not sure which one it is).timidobserver wrote: »Fizzlewizzle wrote: »
A "pet" seemed like the best option if you wanted offence and defense at the same time.timidobserver wrote: »Fizzlewizzle wrote: »
I might have an idea, though maybe a bit of a strange one.timidobserver wrote: »
Your build is irrelevant. The mantikora is going to kill you if you are channeling healing ritual when he stomps. If you take a heavy attack in vet dsa without blocking, you are probably going to die.Fizzlewizzle wrote: »
I'm build for taking a hit, blocking or not.timidobserver wrote: »Fizzlewizzle wrote: »@Vandril DJ
Could you please us all and write down the synergies Templars have with other skill trees and playstyles, since you seem to be so confident about them being able to do everything decent (besides healing).
You do know that they boosted Healing Ritual by 70%?timidobserver wrote: »
It is clear from 1.6 that ZOS doesn't agree with this. That doesn't mean you are wrong, it just means that ZOS has made clear that they want Templar healing less powerful. Taking that into consideration, I would be in favor of removing the garbage from restoring light and adding useful stuff. Remove all of the useless morphs and useless skills and replace them with utility/buffs or even dps skills. The Radiant Aura morph and Healing Ritual skill both need to be deleted.likewow777 wrote: »Templars need better healing:
I wouldn't see that as "ZOS not agreeing with with that Templar need better healing". Maybe its because they wanted to make the skill more useful... if thats the case then i would advise them to also increase the range drastic.
As someone that uses Healing Ritual as a main healing skill i can tell them this:
A Healing Ritual user draws a lot of agro because often they need to stand in the middle of the crowd to heal everyone. Since you have idiots out there that love running away from enemies (and thus run out of Healing Ritual range) you have to constantly walk after them (with a crowd of monsters swarming around you), causing them to run again...
You only have 5 meters on each side of you to heal people. An average "melee" range is already 5-8 meters, which means that they can stand outside the healing area while still being in melee range. If you have Ranged type players within your group this range grows greatly.
I'm not suggestion that HEaling Ritual needs to be 28M to each side of us (56M Total), but at least having a coverage range of 22-28M (total) would be needed to be able to stand between the Tank+Enemies and the (Long Ranged) Dps guys.
As long as it has a cast time it is garbage.
1. There are so many other things you could be doing for your group as opossed to standing in place channeling healing ritual. Dpsing, buffing, debuffing.
2. Two seconds is long enough for people to die. Your Vet DSA group would wipe regularly.
3. You can't block while channeling it as one hardheader healer learned a learned in Sanctum Ophidia group I was in shortly after 1.6 launched.
The skill is garbage. No tweaks. Replace it.
But, that aside... what would you suggest for a Replacement? Saying that it should be replaced is easy, comming up with a decent idea is a bit harder.
Meh to ideas. Healing ritual is so bad that we would be better of off it was just deleted and not even replaced. At least bad/new healers would no longer have access to it. However, I would replace it with a toggle since Templar are the only class without one. One morph would benefit dps and the other tanking.
A Toggle, maybe something like summoning a "Mender".
Menders can both heal and deal damage, as you probably have noticed while fighting those guys.
The basic Skill could give you a normal mender, while the Morphs could make the Mender focus on healing only or damage only.
The Normal mender would posses the basic skills:
- Healing (not the "Radiant Destruction" like healing some often cast), sort of like Honor the Dead.
- Sun Fire.
The Healing Mender (Morph) could posses skills like:
- Healing (Honor the dead).
- Channeled Healing (The beam healing NPC's sometimes use)
- Rune Focus
The Offensive Mender (Morph) could posses skills like:
- Vampire's Bane or Reflective Light (maybe based on the morph you use yourself)
- Eclipse
- Backlash
(Not Radiant Destruction, that would be to much)
As for how the mender would/ could look:
- A yellow/ gold-ish Flame Atronach.
- An Alliance war mender (your own alliance).
- Maybe a yellow/ gold-ish Spirit/ Ghost.
No, I don't want a pet. It is specifically why I chose to level a NB alt and not a Sorc alt. I'd prefer an aura/buff toggle like Inferno, Siphoning Attacks, or Bound armor. Everyone has one of these type of toggle aura/buff type skills except Templar.
Inferno, Siphoning Strikes and Bound armor are pretty one-sided buffs, its either offence or defense.
Inferno seems pretty useless... Its like a mage light, with an added fire attack (idk how strong that fire attack is though).
For a Bound armor effect i wouldn't look at Healing Ritual, but at Restoring focus (the lesser of the two Rune Focus Morphs).
Instead of being a ground defense buff they could make it that it "wraps" around you, maybe indicated with the Golden Glow you get these days while standing on a Rune Focus plus maybe a Golden Magelight to make it clear you have that buff for other players. (i like those orbs). It could be the Major Ward effect without any added bonuses, or Minor Ward with an extra bonus (extra healing received, like it currently does?)
A Siphoning Strikes effect would (my opinion) seem better for Restoring aura, but instead of a Magicka + Stamina effect the Nightblades get a Templar would get Health and Stamina. The Morphs could also work the same way, but with Magicka for "Leeching Strikes" and Health and Stamina for "Siphoning Attacks".
For Healing Ritual (the main point we started with) you could also have an Toggled aura effect.
This aura effect could use Smart healing to search out allies who have less than 100% health and heal them.
An orb like Magelight could float around the user, and ones a player falls below the health cap the orb will leave you, Pass through the target (healing them) and return, waiting for its next action.
As for the healing.
The base skill could heal 1/2/3/4% of the targets max HP ones he ducks below 100%.
One Morph could increase that to 5/6/7/8% of the target's max health.
The other Morph could increase the amount of orbs to 2/3/4/5 orbs.
(Those orbs should fly horizontal)
Another option could be that instead of healing allies those orbs go after the nearest enemy, dealing low amounts of damage and using that damage to heal yourself.
If you were to use the 1 orb vs many orbs morph suggestion, then you could give the 1 orb a huge radius and higher damage, and the many orb option a very short range, low damage but more healing.
I'd just go with something simple like Morph 1 reduces healing to anyone other than yourself by 50% and increases your spell damage by 20%. Morph two does something or other that would be useful for a tank, I don't really care what.
The spell damage buff would be a bit negative, since it won't stack with other spell damage buffs (Major Sorcery) like Entropy gives.
Having a skill like Inferno that, instead of inflicting damage, pelts enemies with bolts that inflict Major Defile and Major Empower, making it that the targeted enemy receives 20% more damage from the next attack, as well as receive less healing.
The orb hitting 1 enemy every second would be more then enough for something like this.
A defensive structure could be exactly the same, but instead of Defile and Empower it could inflict Minor/ Major Maim (reduced damage dealt) and maybe steal some health from the target/ put the same sort of health steal effect on the target as you get with Quick Siphoning (Restoration staff), which could constantly trigger by the orb hitting the target (again).Mending-The-Wounded, Aldmeri Dominion, Templar.0 -
timidobserver✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Fizzlewizzle wrote: »
The maximum reduced healing you can give someone is 30 or 40% (Major Defile (de-)buff, not sure which one it is).timidobserver wrote: »Fizzlewizzle wrote: »
A "pet" seemed like the best option if you wanted offence and defense at the same time.timidobserver wrote: »Fizzlewizzle wrote: »
I might have an idea, though maybe a bit of a strange one.timidobserver wrote: »
Your build is irrelevant. The mantikora is going to kill you if you are channeling healing ritual when he stomps. If you take a heavy attack in vet dsa without blocking, you are probably going to die.Fizzlewizzle wrote: »
I'm build for taking a hit, blocking or not.timidobserver wrote: »Fizzlewizzle wrote: »@Vandril DJ
Could you please us all and write down the synergies Templars have with other skill trees and playstyles, since you seem to be so confident about them being able to do everything decent (besides healing).
You do know that they boosted Healing Ritual by 70%?timidobserver wrote: »
It is clear from 1.6 that ZOS doesn't agree with this. That doesn't mean you are wrong, it just means that ZOS has made clear that they want Templar healing less powerful. Taking that into consideration, I would be in favor of removing the garbage from restoring light and adding useful stuff. Remove all of the useless morphs and useless skills and replace them with utility/buffs or even dps skills. The Radiant Aura morph and Healing Ritual skill both need to be deleted.likewow777 wrote: »Templars need better healing:
I wouldn't see that as "ZOS not agreeing with with that Templar need better healing". Maybe its because they wanted to make the skill more useful... if thats the case then i would advise them to also increase the range drastic.
As someone that uses Healing Ritual as a main healing skill i can tell them this:
A Healing Ritual user draws a lot of agro because often they need to stand in the middle of the crowd to heal everyone. Since you have idiots out there that love running away from enemies (and thus run out of Healing Ritual range) you have to constantly walk after them (with a crowd of monsters swarming around you), causing them to run again...
You only have 5 meters on each side of you to heal people. An average "melee" range is already 5-8 meters, which means that they can stand outside the healing area while still being in melee range. If you have Ranged type players within your group this range grows greatly.
I'm not suggestion that HEaling Ritual needs to be 28M to each side of us (56M Total), but at least having a coverage range of 22-28M (total) would be needed to be able to stand between the Tank+Enemies and the (Long Ranged) Dps guys.
As long as it has a cast time it is garbage.
1. There are so many other things you could be doing for your group as opossed to standing in place channeling healing ritual. Dpsing, buffing, debuffing.
2. Two seconds is long enough for people to die. Your Vet DSA group would wipe regularly.
3. You can't block while channeling it as one hardheader healer learned a learned in Sanctum Ophidia group I was in shortly after 1.6 launched.
The skill is garbage. No tweaks. Replace it.
But, that aside... what would you suggest for a Replacement? Saying that it should be replaced is easy, comming up with a decent idea is a bit harder.
Meh to ideas. Healing ritual is so bad that we would be better of off it was just deleted and not even replaced. At least bad/new healers would no longer have access to it. However, I would replace it with a toggle since Templar are the only class without one. One morph would benefit dps and the other tanking.
A Toggle, maybe something like summoning a "Mender".
Menders can both heal and deal damage, as you probably have noticed while fighting those guys.
The basic Skill could give you a normal mender, while the Morphs could make the Mender focus on healing only or damage only.
The Normal mender would posses the basic skills:
- Healing (not the "Radiant Destruction" like healing some often cast), sort of like Honor the Dead.
- Sun Fire.
The Healing Mender (Morph) could posses skills like:
- Healing (Honor the dead).
- Channeled Healing (The beam healing NPC's sometimes use)
- Rune Focus
The Offensive Mender (Morph) could posses skills like:
- Vampire's Bane or Reflective Light (maybe based on the morph you use yourself)
- Eclipse
- Backlash
(Not Radiant Destruction, that would be to much)
As for how the mender would/ could look:
- A yellow/ gold-ish Flame Atronach.
- An Alliance war mender (your own alliance).
- Maybe a yellow/ gold-ish Spirit/ Ghost.
No, I don't want a pet. It is specifically why I chose to level a NB alt and not a Sorc alt. I'd prefer an aura/buff toggle like Inferno, Siphoning Attacks, or Bound armor. Everyone has one of these type of toggle aura/buff type skills except Templar.
Inferno, Siphoning Strikes and Bound armor are pretty one-sided buffs, its either offence or defense.
Inferno seems pretty useless... Its like a mage light, with an added fire attack (idk how strong that fire attack is though).
For a Bound armor effect i wouldn't look at Healing Ritual, but at Restoring focus (the lesser of the two Rune Focus Morphs).
Instead of being a ground defense buff they could make it that it "wraps" around you, maybe indicated with the Golden Glow you get these days while standing on a Rune Focus plus maybe a Golden Magelight to make it clear you have that buff for other players. (i like those orbs). It could be the Major Ward effect without any added bonuses, or Minor Ward with an extra bonus (extra healing received, like it currently does?)
A Siphoning Strikes effect would (my opinion) seem better for Restoring aura, but instead of a Magicka + Stamina effect the Nightblades get a Templar would get Health and Stamina. The Morphs could also work the same way, but with Magicka for "Leeching Strikes" and Health and Stamina for "Siphoning Attacks".
For Healing Ritual (the main point we started with) you could also have an Toggled aura effect.
This aura effect could use Smart healing to search out allies who have less than 100% health and heal them.
An orb like Magelight could float around the user, and ones a player falls below the health cap the orb will leave you, Pass through the target (healing them) and return, waiting for its next action.
As for the healing.
The base skill could heal 1/2/3/4% of the targets max HP ones he ducks below 100%.
One Morph could increase that to 5/6/7/8% of the target's max health.
The other Morph could increase the amount of orbs to 2/3/4/5 orbs.
(Those orbs should fly horizontal)
Another option could be that instead of healing allies those orbs go after the nearest enemy, dealing low amounts of damage and using that damage to heal yourself.
If you were to use the 1 orb vs many orbs morph suggestion, then you could give the 1 orb a huge radius and higher damage, and the many orb option a very short range, low damage but more healing.
I'd just go with something simple like Morph 1 reduces healing to anyone other than yourself by 50% and increases your spell damage by 20%. Morph two does something or other that would be useful for a tank, I don't really care what.
The spell damage buff would be a bit negative, since it won't stack with other spell damage buffs (Major Sorcery) like Entropy gives.
Having a skill like Inferno that, instead of inflicting damage, pelts enemies with bolts that inflict Major Defile and Major Empower, making it that the targeted enemy receives 20% more damage from the next attack, as well as receive less healing.
The orb hitting 1 enemy every second would be more then enough for something like this.
A defensive structure could be exactly the same, but instead of Defile and Empower it could inflict Minor/ Major Maim (reduced damage dealt) and maybe steal some health from the target/ put the same sort of health steal effect on the target as you get with Quick Siphoning (Restoration staff), which could constantly trigger by the orb hitting the target (again).
I didn't say the skill would grant Major Sorcery. I said it would buff spell damage. Similar to how Sorc's can receive a number additional spell damage buffs beyond Major sorcery.
But, this isn't worth continuing to debate. I'll just leave it with this. I don't see any value in healing ritual. Slightly tweaking the heal it does or slightly tweaking the cast time will not fix the skill. I personally don't care what they change it to as long as they change it to something else.
Edited by timidobserver on March 28, 2015 5:20PMV16 Uriel Stormblessed EP Magicka Templar(main)
V16 Derelict Vagabond EP Stamina DK
V16 Redacted Ep Stam Sorc
V16 Insolent EP Magicka Sorc(retired)
V16 Jed I Nyte EP Stamina NB(retired)1 -
Lockles✭A lot of complaints here...
You realize no one forced you to be a templar? >.>
Anyway..
The Templar is a support class.
It's actually difficult to be a templar that doesn't support others in some way. Contrary to say a Nightblade who goes for all-out damage. You don't get jack from that guy.
We have a buff that increases resource regeneration for 15 seconds for everyone around us. That increases the sustained healing, tanking and dpsing of the group. For you personally it'll suck, but the bigger the group the more powerful the effect.
Then there's a rune people can just stand in to increase survival chances with some very nice buffs and also adds more Magicka Regeneration. And people standing in it get more healing from all templars using their healing abilities.
Not just healers mind you, but how many templars with big swords run around without at least 1 healing skill on their bar?
Casting anything from Dawn's Warth gives everyone a little more spell power. You know, more damage and healing to their spells, which they can cast more because of all the magicka regen you're giving.
And I know for big fights it's not as impressive because you could be capping off potential damage on the target. But if people are just tossing aoe's about spam this at a few enemies. Backlash can increase the DPS of an entire group by 33% for 6 seconds. You could just refresh it every 6 seconds, cause why not? It'll refresh the Dawn's Wrath passive spell power buff for everyone.
Now for fun you could toss a Luminous Shards under a melee partymember's feet. Give him some resource regeneration as well.
Wait, so how much did you improve everyone at their job?
A whole damn lot?
Lets add to that an AoE debuff to enemy healing. Not sure, can other classes cripple healing received like that? Hang on I'll check before I keep typing...
Right, the DK and Nightblade can give the same debuff. But only in a melee range radius and only when their ultimate is up. When can you do it?
Whenever you damn well feel like it, from maximum range.
A 3 person snare effect, sure it's not the entire raid, but it's coming from maximum range, so try using it on people who are kiting or fleeing from the fight in PvP to let your warriors catch up and bring the pain.
Our ultimates aren't all that great in PVP, that much I'll admit.... So maybe use War Horn? Seems to go well with what we're doing here. And for the other one.. I think I'd go with Ice Comet. Just to have something big to toss at enemies shooting from a wall or something. Probably never going to use it, but it's nice to have something and not need it, right?
Do the zerg a favour, put Retreating Manouver on your bar too. Everyone and their mom's are using Charging Manouver already to keep punting while running. But sometimes your warriors need a hand closing gaps.
When it's time to run, some one else is bound to give you Charging Manouver anyway, so you don't need it.
Lets see, by my estimate we're still 3 abilities short of filling up the entire bar..
Soul Splitting Trap maybe? Stack up some filled soul gems so you can get fallen people up. Cause, you know, no one resses as fast as you. You got that passive no other class can have.
For the last 2 I'd take Radiant Shield and I prefere a 1h and shield for Absorb Magic. Just so you survive a little longer, fleeing isn't your best option after all.
But you could put some healing skills on there. Depends a bit on how many healers there are around already. Healing does drain your magicka quite a bit, making you unable to sustain all the buffs you're tossing out. So only do it when people are in serious trouble.
Now I know what you're thinking.. You're not going to have fun watching your friends kill stuff while you're just standing there making them better at it.
But exactly that thought is why you shouldn't have rolled a Templar in the first place.
If you don't like Support, be a Dragon Knight, punch stuff with a big sword and not a single working braincell. Or sneak around as a Nightblade and go "trollolol I ganked you and you didn't even see me coming. Cause you couldn't. Cause I'm lame like that."Edited by Lockles on March 31, 2015 4:39PM0 -
jopeymonster✭✭✭A lot of complaints here...
You realize no one forced you to be a templar? >.>
Except that the class is far different now, then it was back at release. And was NEVER, EVER what was described in the character class.
Complaints are justified, since these are the same complaints we've had for a full year, and there is still no balance resolution. But holy *** - nerf a Sorc heal and ZOS bends over *** backward to compensate the class.
#justTemplarthings
#nerfkeyboards2 -
jopeymonster✭✭✭@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JessicaFolsom - This one isn't about Charge, or Strikes.... maybe since this was suppose to be a "better" skill in 1.6, you maybe, ya know, might want to come in here and tell us what's up?
Or you won't... which is pretty much standard policy by now.
@ZOS_AlexD - Almost done - I promise! I'll try and do this earlier tomorrow so some other mod can deal with me. =D#nerfkeyboards0