ideas for these people who "keep getting killed in towns" due to the justice system(and a few other)

Hypertionb14_ESO

These are spitballs, i personally have not really done much of anything with the justice system outside of the PTS. (hours of attacking guards from places they couldnt attack back lol)

first off, these suggestions to help the learning curve in the "you screw up too much you keep dying" side of the arguement.

1. first time you cant pay your bounty, it is wavered. everyone gets a second chance. applies if you die with a bigger bounty than you have(in which case the remaining bounty is cleared for free for one time), or choose the pay option when you dont have enough gold (a "i dont have enough gold" option when talking on your first if you are not kill on sight.)

2. add actual imprisonment option alternative to paying bounty and fleeing and community service type quests, instead of paying bounty or fleeing, you get taken to jail and do a quest to get rid of bounty. only an option when being arrested.

3. allow dying to have a positive effect on your bounty, reducing it by a % so that deaths alone cannot reduce it to 0, but close enough you can try for community service if you take it too high. 20-30% or even 50% if its above a certain point. based on how high your bounty is make this only while you are actively kill on sight

4. assaults are now reported as such, if you attack a person by accident and dont attack them any more for 5 seconds, the bounty is much less than if you keep attacking the victim, and significantly less than attacking and killing. if a guard sees you attack but not kill a NPC, they will just arrest you instead of attacking. (this helps those who forget to turn off FF and mistakenly hit a NPC, a common complaint atm) this also applies to healing a Criminal, you get a bounty but you are only put on the arrest list, and will not be attacked unless you directly attack the guard.

5. guards who witness you stealing will only attempt to arrest you, not kill on sight. (no more getting stuck in a building by god guards for stealing, but you will lose bounty gold and anything you steal)

6. bounties that are kill on sight are much higher, and directly releated to if you killed a innocent or not. Bounties that have committed no murders will not be kill on sight until the bounty hits 10k, and murderers are kill on sight above 500g. the guards are focused on the TRUELY despicable people.

all of these combined would not be nearly enough to "make it crime without punishment" as even if you have a 200k bounty and clear it for free the first time, if you die even once and keep doing it, you will find yourself with a huge bounty you can only lessen slightly by dying over and over again. mistakes are still costly, but wont instantly get you swarmed by godmode guards at all times. only the truly villainous would be susceptable to being shoved into a corner they cannot escape from. needing to either wait it out, or die 20-50 times to get their bounties low enough to no be kill on sight anymore.


for some other complaints on the justice system.

1. Add Horse Rustlers to dens, allowing criminals to upgrade and buy horses.

2. Add cooking, enchanting, and potion-crafting tables to dens.. equipment crafting tables are not needed as they can be readily found outside of city easily.

3. Add a 50% extra charge on all transactions in dens, these are thieves after all.

4. Den banks now charge 10g per item taken or placed in their banks. its hard for the lawless to move stuff in and out of tamriels banks after all.



the rest, we must wait until the other half of the justice system, where you can be on the good side of the battle for the law comes out.\

but i hope at least a few of these are implemented... i dont want to see the console release flooding the forums with "*** the justice system" posts, or the current trend to continue.

Siliconhobbit_ESO

10g to put 1 item in a bank in the Den and 10g to take 1 item out?

Might as well NOT put a banker in a Thieves Den, as NO ONE IN THEIR RIGHT MIND would pay that kind of a fee to use a banker.

Hypertionb14_ESO

Siliconhobbit_ESO wrote: »

10g to put 1 item in a bank in the Den and 10g to take 1 item out?

Might as well NOT put a banker in a Thieves Den, as NO ONE IN THEIR RIGHT MIND would pay that kind of a fee to use a banker.

dens are too cushy, these are freaking outlaws... you should be expecting wallet gauging....

Drazhar14

Sheathing your weapon should make you surrender/end combat, in case you accidentally hit someone or want to just pay your bounty.

Hypertionb14_ESO

Drazhar14 wrote: »

Sheathing your weapon should make you surrender/end combat, in case you accidentally hit someone or want to just pay your bounty.

good suggestion! that would be a good "surrender" method.

UrQuan

One thing I'd like to see is if you are caught by the guards at a time when you're not carrying enough gold to pay your bounty, have an option to immediately withdraw gold from the bank (but not deposit gold carried) in order to do so.

DanielMaxwell

Hypertionb14_ESO wrote: »

Siliconhobbit_ESO wrote: »

10g to put 1 item in a bank in the Den and 10g to take 1 item out?

Might as well NOT put a banker in a Thieves Den, as NO ONE IN THEIR RIGHT MIND would pay that kind of a fee to use a banker.

dens are too cushy, these are freaking outlaws... you should be expecting wallet gauging....

True but what was proposed is more akin to the banker having a giant standing there and picking you up by your heals to shake you until the bellybutton lint falls out .

drschplatt

Or do what I do. Stop playing the game and go watch TV, take a walk, play a different game while waiting offline for the bounty to go away while at the same time waiting for B2P so I can stop giving ZOS money to play the game with the justice system as it's currently designed.

Enodoc

UrQuan wrote: »

One thing I'd like to see is if you are caught by the guards at a time when you're not carrying enough gold to pay your bounty, have an option to immediately withdraw gold from the bank (but not deposit gold carried) in order to do so.

That's a good idea actually. You select the "Pay Bounty" option, and get a popup which says:
You do not have the necessary funds to pay your bounty. Withdraw [x] from the bank?

Hypertionb14_ESO wrote: »

5. guards who witness you stealing will only attempt to arrest you, not kill on sight. (no more getting stuck in a building by god guards for stealing, but you will lose bounty gold and anything you steal)

Is that just if it was the guard specifically that was the witness? I've never ended up KOS just by stealing one thing. Guards should have no more clout as a witness than anyone else, particularly since they can arrest you straight away.

Spottswoode

Drazhar14 wrote: »

Sheathing your weapon should make you surrender/end combat, in case you accidentally hit someone or want to just pay your bounty.

I was actually about to make that suggestion. This would address the healing problem as well.

bellanca6561n

I've gotten guard whacked for purely innocent acts. I don't like the system because it's yet another new feature than misses an opportunity to add group play to the game.

Lots of folks are loving it, however, and it's keeping folks in the game. It certainly needs improvement though.

If I can opt out of aggressing innocent NPCs then I also need to be able to opt out of stealing. The hotspot control system of the game is simply too crude to allow criminal acts to easily take place when you're trying to click on a quest advancing hotspot.

Finally, I don't trust police. And I have really good reasons for requiring police to earn my trust first. So why are guards the invulnerable good guys here? That's ludicrous or it's the most far out fantasy element in the game. Drop the invulnerable guard nonsense and that would solve an entire array of problems while creating something the game sorely needs: spontaneous, unpredictable multiplayer action outside of Cyrodiil.

Theosis

Hypertionb14_ESO wrote: »

These are spitballs, i personally have not really done much of anything with the justice system outside of the PTS. (hours of attacking guards from places they couldnt attack back lol)

first off, these suggestions to help the learning curve in the "you screw up too much you keep dying" side of the arguement.
...

1. Add Horse Rustlers to dens, allowing criminals to upgrade and buy horses.

2. Add cooking, enchanting, and potion-crafting tables to dens.. equipment crafting tables are not needed as they can be readily found outside of city easily.

not a fan of these next two.. although these are reasonable

Hypertionb14_ESO wrote: »

3. Add a 50% extra charge on all transactions in dens, these are thieves after all.

4. Den banks now charge 10g per item taken or placed in their banks. its hard for the lawless to move stuff in and out of tamriels banks after all.

in all very good suggestions

Hypertionb14_ESO

bellanca6561n wrote: »

I've gotten guard whacked for purely innocent acts. I don't like the system because it's yet another new feature than misses an opportunity to add group play to the game.

Lots of folks are loving it, however, and it's keeping folks in the game. It certainly needs improvement though.

If I can opt out of aggressing innocent NPCs then I also need to be able to opt out of stealing. The hotspot control system of the game is simply too crude to allow criminal acts to easily take place when you're trying to click on a quest advancing hotspot.

Finally, I don't trust police. And I have really good reasons for requiring police to earn my trust first. So why are guards the invulnerable good guys here? That's ludicrous or it's the most far out fantasy element in the game. Drop the invulnerable guard nonsense and that would solve an entire array of problems while creating something the game sorely needs: spontaneous, unpredictable multiplayer action outside of Cyrodiil.

another suggestion,

#? Replace "preventing attacking innocents" with "Prevent Unlawful actions" which also disables the steal prompt in addition.

SweetRoll

Hypertionb14_ESO wrote: »

another suggestion,

#? Replace "preventing attacking innocents" with "Prevent Unlawful actions" which also disables the steal prompt in addition.

Yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes, please

IcyDeadPeople

drschplatt wrote: »

Or do what I do. Stop playing the game and go watch TV, take a walk, play a different game while waiting offline for the bounty to go away while at the same time waiting for B2P so I can stop giving ZOS money to play the game with the justice system as it's currently designed.

Or just play a criminal character, keep a high bounty always, stop going into towns and use Cyrodiil crafting stations.

Epona222

See I think for players like me, the justice system has not been an issue. I have been here since beta, I have been eagerly following any and all news about the justice system, and I tried update 6 on the PTS.

I can see however that for new players or returning players or players who do not spend their days with their ear pressed to the development grapevine it could be problematic at first in terms of not knowing what in the "you know what" is going on. I have helped out plenty of guildmates since update 6 launched, to get them enjoying the justice system, but new players to the game won't necessarily have that support.

I suggest a "Pssst, over here..." type quest that confronts players who log in or join the game/get to the first city after the Soul Shriven quest for the first time since justice system has launched, that introduces them to all the basics, shows them the way to the refuge in their starting city, introduces them to the facilities in the refuge, and how to both avoid and deal with bounties (in terms of either paying off via fence or guard, or just legging it and living in the wilderness until it decays). Allow people to select a "I am already familiar with crime and punishment" option if they are on an alt and do not want to take the quest. Then points them back to the 'starting island' questgiver at the end, who again they can agree to help or turn down.

I am very much enjoying the justice system, but I have been here forever and follow all the news. You can't assume that of new or returning players, or even those that only play for a few hours a week - a bit of a tutorial quest would not go amiss.

I mean I am an old hand and knew what was intended in update 6, but still the first thing I accidentally did when I logged onto the PTS was hit a city guard by hitting the wrong key and rack up a large bounty - for a new player that could be offputting without some method of explaining the system.

Gidorick

Hypertionb14_ESO wrote: »

3. allow dying to have a positive effect on your bounty, reducing it by a % so that deaths alone cannot reduce it to 0, but close enough you can try for community service if you take it too high. 20-30% or even 50% if its above a certain point. based on how high your bounty is make this only while you are actively kill on sight

LOL.. I thought you meant like.. dying your armor. Like how in GTA you can go get a paint job on your car and your wanted level will go away. Run to the dye station, change your colors and the guards are less likely to notice you.

Gave me a good chuckle when I realized you were talking about dying, as in being killed.

Gidorick

Hypertionb14_ESO wrote: »

bellanca6561n wrote: »

I've gotten guard whacked for purely innocent acts. I don't like the system because it's yet another new feature than misses an opportunity to add group play to the game.

Lots of folks are loving it, however, and it's keeping folks in the game. It certainly needs improvement though.

If I can opt out of aggressing innocent NPCs then I also need to be able to opt out of stealing. The hotspot control system of the game is simply too crude to allow criminal acts to easily take place when you're trying to click on a quest advancing hotspot.

Finally, I don't trust police. And I have really good reasons for requiring police to earn my trust first. So why are guards the invulnerable good guys here? That's ludicrous or it's the most far out fantasy element in the game. Drop the invulnerable guard nonsense and that would solve an entire array of problems while creating something the game sorely needs: spontaneous, unpredictable multiplayer action outside of Cyrodiil.

another suggestion,

#? Replace "preventing attacking innocents" with "Prevent Unlawful actions" which also disables the steal prompt in addition.

mmm... I would just like to see "Prevent Theft" added. Some of us want to be thieves but not murders.

Of course, I play Justice System all the way on for all of my characters. Makes things a bit more... interesting.

Zimnel

That is, thieves, not murderers. I RP a khajiit thief in one of my alts and this justice system added lots of spice to that.
He rarely is caught "in action", but when he does, he manages to arrive at the fence unspotted.

The clue is patience. Hidden in dark spots, J'aiq studies the guards and torch bearers patterns. Once he learns, he goes unspotted all the time until he reaches the fence : 3