For Every One Person That doesn't Like the Champions System...

Brizz

...there are 10 that think it is great! Do not let the players that like to complain and that hate change sway you. Most of the players that love the new changes don't frequent the forums, and are busy PLAYING THE GAME!

I have done nothing but pvp in the months following release, but in the last week I have done more in the game then I ever thought I would - with friends that have the same drive! I have even made new friends and made more characters.

The Champion system is great, and it makes me feel like my time in-game is well spent.

Now if you were to only add a global Auction house and get rid of veteran points

YOU WOULD BE THE BIGGEST MMO OF THEM ALL

Sacadon

Re: The OP first three sentences, generally agreed.

AshySamurai

I see what you did there. Nice try. But no, please not another AH holy war.

Roechacca

Ya let's avoid the AH debate .

Psychobunni

Disagree. LOL.

I'd actually like the AH though

tplink3r1

1.6: Champion System, Justice System and Jesus Beam...
best update of all times.

Lionxoft

Should be noted that the OP is one of the most efficient XP grinders in the game that I've met. Nothing against him but it should be pointed out.

I don't think that anyone dislikes the System as a whole. I think it's the way points are earned in the system is where it fails to live up to expectation. In it's current form, the best rate of progression through this end-game system is to not do end-game content. The best method is to grind the same mobs over and over rather than excelling at end-game content.

Chesimac

I respect you Brizz, big fan of your vids and stream. But You can grind cp, and many people don't have the time. You will be one of the 1% ahead of everyone and the cp gap between grinders and non grinders that will happen pretty soon is what people are complaining about. You are right, time spent in game is more rewarding than ever and that is good, kinda like how vet 10s were ahead of everyone else for a couple months, just this time with so many cp the gap could be years....

AshySamurai

roechacca wrote: »

Ya let's avoid the AH debate .

That would be awesome.

And I would add to OP's list 10/20h hirelings timer (now 12/24). It was asked many times and AFAIK this issue never was addressed.

pecheckler

If the system cumulatively rewards those with more time to invest grinding experience without any kind of capacity limit, then the game's player population will be split. That can cause elitism and another player exodus. The last thing a struggling game like this needs is another requirement players put on other players before allowing them to participating in content.

McDoogs

Yeah the champion system is great for the guys who can grind/level CP like a full time job...

Rune_Relic

Lionxoft wrote: »

Should be noted that the OP is one of the most efficient XP grinders in the game that I've met. Nothing against him but it should be pointed out.

I don't think that anyone dislikes the System as a whole. I think it's the way points are earned in the system is where it fails to live up to expectation. In it's current form, the best rate of progression through this end-game system is to not do end-game content. The best method is to grind the same mobs over and over rather than excelling at end-game content.

^^ this
I enjoyed the skyrim skill system..and they really aren't that different.
Its just the way the point gain system I have issues with and the horizontal progression system is a rather feeble version of a horizontal progression system to the point of being vertical.

crowfl56

well the word grind is silly the grinders find a exploit and hammer it, they keep it quiet as long as possible, but anyone getting cp's in volume is using some kind of exploit, and don't try to defend your grind, you are abusing a ingame system to gain something at a faster rate.

Hoping ZOS takes a look at you guys.

pppontus

Brizz wrote: »

...there are 10 that are grinding like there's no tomorrow.

FTFY.

I wonder who will quit first, the grinders or the people who don't want an unpaid job?

Interesting times in ESO, which part of the playerbase will we lose this time

Attorneyatlawl

Brizz wrote: »

...there are 10 that think it is great! Do not let the players that like to complain and that hate change sway you. Most of the players that love the new changes don't frequent the forums, and are busy PLAYING THE GAME!

I have done nothing but pvp in the months following release, but in the last week I have done more in the game then I ever thought I would - with friends that have the same drive! I have even made new friends and made more characters.

The Champion system is great, and it makes me feel like my time in-game is well spent.

This. Haven't seen an overall positive feeling this consistent in ESO ever amongst vet players, and I've played since May 2013 betas. Forums might be full of people whining, but the game is fuller of people enjoying it.

infraction2008b16_ESO

You'll be lucky e

Brizz wrote: »

...there are 10 that think it is great! Do not let the players that like to complain and that hate change sway you. Most of the players that love the new changes don't frequent the forums, and are busy PLAYING THE GAME!

I have done nothing but pvp in the months following release, but in the last week I have done more in the game then I ever thought I would - with friends that have the same drive! I have even made new friends and made more characters.

The Champion system is great, and it makes me feel like my time in-game is well spent.

Now if you were to only add a global Auction house and get rid of veteran points

YOU WOULD BE THE BIGGEST MMO OF THEM ALL

Sorry but for every 1 that actually like these sort of grinds 10 players actually got bored of these sort of grinds (i.e. with the vet/almanac) and unsubbed hence the game now going B2P. The champion system was promised to be different from levelling vet ranks but it's still much the same, both are about grinding as much xp as possible to max out your characters rather than what you actually accomplish in game.

Ourorboros

Agreed OP. So far, this has been a fun update. I'm loving the Justice system. And as a solo sorc, my Clannfer has a one-two punch that's making the game easier. He's tougher, and gives a huge health boost when he finally does die.

About that AH, maybe you should try Master Merchant add-on.

Personofsecrets

Spending 20 minutes in a vet dungeon to get 1/20th of a point that can increase a stat by a fraction of a percent.

What a reward!

I'd rather stay v14 for years with my previous stats than have the current situation.

For those who are making the champion system out to be gods gift that everyone adores, see the following.

People are frustrated by bugs

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/154781/enlightenment-working-for-anyone/p1

75% of people who voted said that champion point gain was too slow

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/155005/do-champion-points-take-too-long-to-get/p1

Lionxoft

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

Brizz wrote: »

...there are 10 that think it is great! Do not let the players that like to complain and that hate change sway you. Most of the players that love the new changes don't frequent the forums, and are busy PLAYING THE GAME!

I have done nothing but pvp in the months following release, but in the last week I have done more in the game then I ever thought I would - with friends that have the same drive! I have even made new friends and made more characters.

The Champion system is great, and it makes me feel like my time in-game is well spent.

This. Haven't seen an overall positive feeling this consistent in ESO ever amongst vet players, and I've played since May 2013 betas. Forums might be full of people whining, but the game is fuller of people enjoying it.

It is funny that you say that because the last couple of times I logged in the population bars for any faction didn't even hit 3 bars as before there could be pop locks from at least one faction in at least 2 campaigns. Are those people that are "enjoying it" all at the grind spots?

I will say it again. The system is great in theory but the foundation it was built on for progression in the system is bad. It should have never embraced XP as it's form of point progression but a creative feat/achievement system based on end game content. The system should reward actual end game gameplay such as PvP, dungeons or trials etc instead of pointless grinding. Sure, those realms grant some form of xp but the discrepancy when it's compared to mob grinding is ultimately a problem.

I think that grinding mobs has it's place in the game as a progression method up to lv50 but I don't think it should determine end game power via the Champion System.

Audigy

Its always those who benefit from something that express their gratitude for it. Unfortunately do the numbers of those who benefit never justify the higher numbers of those that struggle.

If you can feed 10 people while 1000 are starving then the system is still a failure, no matter how much noise those 10 will make.

The promise that nobody can gain a CP under 4 hours was not kept and this is what many people with RL´s were afraid of. In reality those with RL need a day or two for a single CP; while those who have a lot of time gain 10 or more in 24 hours.

I don't join the hunt for CP´s at ESO and I would advice everyone who enjoys life to do the same. Play your 8 chars, explore the world, see the story and then if there is nothing left to explore, do something else. Alone for this adventure you will need years, I am still not even 50 with any of my toons

Rammi

I like what was added!!

I just hate the way they made you progress through it

Mikoto

Brizz wrote: »

...there are 10 that think it is great! Do not let the players that like to complain and that hate change sway you. Most of the players that love the new changes don't frequent the forums, and are busy PLAYING THE GAME!

I have done nothing but pvp in the months following release, but in the last week I have done more in the game then I ever thought I would - with friends that have the same drive! I have even made new friends and made more characters.

The Champion system is great, and it makes me feel like my time in-game is well spent.

Now if you were to only add a global Auction house and get rid of veteran points

YOU WOULD BE THE BIGGEST MMO OF THEM ALL

You started off good and then you goofed it all up by mentioning that

Attorneyatlawl

Mikoto wrote: »

Brizz wrote: »

...there are 10 that think it is great! Do not let the players that like to complain and that hate change sway you. Most of the players that love the new changes don't frequent the forums, and are busy PLAYING THE GAME!

I have done nothing but pvp in the months following release, but in the last week I have done more in the game then I ever thought I would - with friends that have the same drive! I have even made new friends and made more characters.

The Champion system is great, and it makes me feel like my time in-game is well spent.

Now if you were to only add a global Auction house and get rid of veteran points

YOU WOULD BE THE BIGGEST MMO OF THEM ALL

You started off good and then you goofed it all up by mentioning that

Agreed , that's why I removed that last section from my quote.

BigM

How come am getting that same feeling with posts on Blizzard site and right after that vanilla went bye bye. But then I loved the Vanilla WoW.

Teiji

The justice system and champion system is amazing. I like how I can go to AD VR areas, get really good exp from packs of mobs, but wait, there's more!

They also drop so many items that you can hit your Legerdemain launder and items sold cap in less than half an hour. I did a circuit three and a half, four times, came out with 15k, 120 items fenced and then the max items laundered. As well as a champion point and a half.

Took about 15, 20 minutes with the occasional alt-tab.

I shall acquire many champions points, I shall stride atop the corpses of bloody innocents, their possessions, now mine, the experience points within them, champion points to me they give.

Brothers and sisters of the Mundus, I beseech you, should thou desire strength, join me, let us reap the innocents of Tamriel and climb a top a mountain of their weak, frail and undeserving of life mangled and disfigured pixelated corpses.

For the star signs of the Thief, the Warrior and the Mage, let us carve through a family and their children, let us exchange their possessions for glorious ill-gotten coin, let us reduce them to ashes!

Join me brothers and sisters in a symphony of murder as we raise our destructions staves to the sky, the wielders of the peasant, knuckle-dragger weapon known as the "bow" will attempt to cry out "invite, pls infight 2 groop?" as we charge through the star signs embracing absolute power, with our impulse protruding out across all of Nirn, we shall speak, "Nay."

Yes to champion points, yes to absolute power. Nay to conceited "stamina peasants" that cry out for help as we acquire absolute power through the stars.

Brizz

Teiji wrote: »

The justice system and champion system is amazing. I like how I can go to AD VR areas, get really good exp from packs of mobs, but wait, there's more!

They also drop so many items that you can hit your Legerdemain launder and items sold cap in less than half an hour. I did a circuit three and a half, four times, came out with 15k, 120 items fenced and then the max items laundered. As well as a champion point and a half.

Took about 15, 20 minutes with the occasional alt-tab.

I shall acquire many champions points, I shall stride atop the corpses of bloody innocents, their possessions, now mine, the experience points within them, champion points to me they give.

Brothers and sisters of the Mundus, I beseech you, should thou desire strength, join me, let us reap the innocents of Tamriel and climb a top a mountain of their weak, frail and undeserving of life mangled and disfigured pixelated corpses.

For the star signs of the Thief, the Warrior and the Mage, let us carve through a family and their children, let us exchange their possessions for glorious ill-gotten coin, let us reduce them to ashes!

Join me brothers and sisters in a symphony of murder as we raise our destructions staves to the sky, the wielders of the peasant, knuckle-dragger weapon known as the "bow" will attempt to cry out "invite, pls infight 2 groop?" as we charge through the star signs embracing absolute power, with our impulse protruding out across all of Nirn, we shall speak, "Nay."

Yes to champion points, yes to absolute power. Nay to conceited "stamina peasants" that cry out for help as we acquire absolute power through the stars.

you are my hero

Brizz

Lionxoft wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

Brizz wrote: »

...there are 10 that think it is great! Do not let the players that like to complain and that hate change sway you. Most of the players that love the new changes don't frequent the forums, and are busy PLAYING THE GAME!

I have done nothing but pvp in the months following release, but in the last week I have done more in the game then I ever thought I would - with friends that have the same drive! I have even made new friends and made more characters.

The Champion system is great, and it makes me feel like my time in-game is well spent.

This. Haven't seen an overall positive feeling this consistent in ESO ever amongst vet players, and I've played since May 2013 betas. Forums might be full of people whining, but the game is fuller of people enjoying it.

It is funny that you say that because the last couple of times I logged in the population bars for any faction didn't even hit 3 bars as before there could be pop locks from at least one faction in at least 2 campaigns. Are those people that are "enjoying it" all at the grind spots?

I will say it again. The system is great in theory but the foundation it was built on for progression in the system is bad. It should have never embraced XP as it's form of point progression but a creative feat/achievement system based on end game content. The system should reward actual end game gameplay such as PvP, dungeons or trials etc instead of pointless grinding. Sure, those realms grant some form of xp but the discrepancy when it's compared to mob grinding is ultimately a problem.

I think that grinding mobs has it's place in the game as a progression method up to lv50 but I don't think it should determine end game power via the Champion System.

Your ideas for champion progression would be great, but the population bars in cyrodiil is not an accurate representation of the populatioin playing the game. Many players are outside of Cyrodiil, doing whatever they can to get more champion points to be able to take back to pvp.

I feel that there are very strong, and arguably necessary passives around the 90 Champion Rank (12% crit chance for me personally) that I want to get ASAP to take back to Cyrodiil with me. After I get those I will play the game as normal and quest/grind in my offtime when we aren't pvping.

I think that experience isn't a bad champion point progression so long as there are no exploits in acquiring the experience. And from the looks of it (after this hotfix to the new popular grind spots) ZOS is on top of keeping them in check.

Smeag

Lets see how much you like it in a months time when the grinders emerge from the depths of skyreach, covered in acne and armed with the power of over 9000 champion points MUAHAHAHAHA

Animal_Mother

Brizz wrote: »

...there are 10 that think it is great! Do not let the players that like to complain and that hate change sway you. Most of the players that love the new changes don't frequent the forums, and are busy PLAYING THE GAME!

I have done nothing but pvp in the months following release, but in the last week I have done more in the game then I ever thought I would - with friends that have the same drive! I have even made new friends and made more characters.

Why aren't you enjoying PvP right now? Could it be the lack of incentive (XP) in which to earn CPs.

Lionxoft

Brizz wrote: »

Lionxoft wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

Brizz wrote: »

...there are 10 that think it is great! Do not let the players that like to complain and that hate change sway you. Most of the players that love the new changes don't frequent the forums, and are busy PLAYING THE GAME!

I have done nothing but pvp in the months following release, but in the last week I have done more in the game then I ever thought I would - with friends that have the same drive! I have even made new friends and made more characters.

The Champion system is great, and it makes me feel like my time in-game is well spent.

This. Haven't seen an overall positive feeling this consistent in ESO ever amongst vet players, and I've played since May 2013 betas. Forums might be full of people whining, but the game is fuller of people enjoying it.

It is funny that you say that because the last couple of times I logged in the population bars for any faction didn't even hit 3 bars as before there could be pop locks from at least one faction in at least 2 campaigns. Are those people that are "enjoying it" all at the grind spots?

I will say it again. The system is great in theory but the foundation it was built on for progression in the system is bad. It should have never embraced XP as it's form of point progression but a creative feat/achievement system based on end game content. The system should reward actual end game gameplay such as PvP, dungeons or trials etc instead of pointless grinding. Sure, those realms grant some form of xp but the discrepancy when it's compared to mob grinding is ultimately a problem.

I think that grinding mobs has it's place in the game as a progression method up to lv50 but I don't think it should determine end game power via the Champion System.

Your ideas for champion progression would be great, but the population bars in cyrodiil is not an accurate representation of the populatioin playing the game. Many players are outside of Cyrodiil, doing whatever they can to get more champion points to be able to take back to pvp.

The bold should never have to happen. That is the only reason why I disapprove of the system and think it is ultimately flawed.

I just want to PvP for my progression and for that progression to at least be on equal ground with grinding or PvE content. If I get that one request then I'm sold on the system but right now that one thing I request flat out sucks.

The above is a compromise but I still think that the best system for Champion progression is through feats/achievements for excelling at end game content. It's the only way for ZOS to be able to balance the progression among all the realms of play style. They haven't been able to balance xp since the game has been launched.