Lazy Devs, or Bored Gamers?

Varicite

Rook_Master wrote: »

What's absolutely ludicrous is it's impossible to do some of the testing on the PTS that they want without these addons.

Want to test out ultimate gain? Take a guess at how fast your ult bar is filling.

Want to test out crit chance? Take a guess at when you crit.

Want to test out all the new buff durations? Take a guess at how long they last.


When the game launched, there were a number of inconsistencies between skill tooltips and how the skill actually performed. There is absolutely no way to tell if that's the case using the default UI.

Remember all of the NB passives that just didn't do anything at all for months?

No one (including ZOS) would have had any idea if not for testing w/ addons, and the vast majority of bug fixes that have occurred in the past year would not have happened.

Sure, it's not unplayable, but I wonder how long you'd want to continue playing a game where half the things just don't do what they say they do and nobody can even accurately test them to fix it.

Elsonso

I am not going to tell you how to play, but I am going to comment on your assertions with my own personal observations.

Goldie wrote: »

1. Resistances: There is nothing that shows your characters resistances, without using an add on.

This is true, aside from surrounding spell effects and other graphical indicators already present, but personally I am not currently in need of any add-on that tells me this in terms of numbers and timers. Static resistance needs no indicator, other than what is available on the character screen. For the dynamic stuff, I am hoping that the game can remain above the need to have visible numbers and timers.

Fair disclosure: I am running one due to PTS, but it is for the purpose of understanding what they are doing on PTS and how it differs from Live. Once I am done with PTS, I will stop using it.

Goldie wrote: »

2. Resource Bars: Really? I have to use an add-on to see my resources displayed by percentages, or to have detailed bars?

You do need an add-on to see this information, but I don't think you really have to see this information. I have seen these used in many streams and videos and have used them in the past with other MMOs. I never felt the text was a required bit of information. This always seemed like a "programmer feature" to me; done because it could be done, not because it needed to be done.

Goldie wrote: »

3. Damage Incoming/Outgoing: You would think that this information would be VITAL, but hey, Combat Cloud or FTC (both great add-ons btw) have it covered.

My feeling is that this information is not VITAL. As a matter of fact, except for the people who study this information for the purpose of crafting optimal builds or 'fact checking' what ZOS has done, I consider this information to be the opposite of VITAL. I see it as largely unnecessary.

I run the dancing numbers and DPS/HPS indicators in other MMOs. It is a lot of information and most of it comes and goes without really needing to know it.

I find myself wondering how many people actually use that information, other than for spreadsheet work to create optimal builds and to check what the developer is doing. It has a place, with certain people, but I think it is a lot more prevalent that people do not know how to use that information, even if they have it.

Goldie wrote: »

4. Buffs/Debuffs: I know that I am not the only one who thinks I should be able to see when my buffs/debuffs run out! Or which ones are even active!!

I think I should know when buffs and debuffs expire, but not a count down to when they expire. I think that the UI does present this information, if not a bit inconsistently, without any add-ons. All buffs and debuffs should have some sort of on-screen indicator, and ESO tends to use world-based indicators instead of gauges, icons, numbers, and bars for most of this.

Overall, I think that the vital information is conveyed to anyone who is paying attention, but there are some places where they could improve. I don't think more numbers, bars, and timers would be an improvement for the base UI.

Goldie wrote: »

All around the UI is meager and bare, using player created add-ons sometimes causes in-game issues such as lag, crashes, and some are even malicious and steal away your gold...

Properly written and maintained, then used in moderation, players will find that in-game add-ons are not going to be a problem.

I know that people like add-ons, particularly floaty numbers, things whizzing by during combat, colorful bars that get longer and shorter. I am not opposed to this, so long as they remain optional. If, at any time, they become required for the "MMO" part of this game, group PVE or PVP, then the functionality should be incorporated into the base game, or the API should be changed so that the add-on no longer functions.

Dave2836

I played a fair bit without any addons, and I can say for myself the immersion was intentense with a bare UI. I couldn't tell if the next hit would KO my character. I had to look around for lore books. I had to refer to maps when I got lost.

With addons and the exposure of information, gaming has become much more streamlined, however it feels more like completing chores and obligations rather than immersing myself in the game. One thing I do want to see implemented by default, a journal showing our past completed quests, what options we chose and how those decisions affected our world.

Chrithu

Rosveen wrote: »

Chrithu wrote: »

and when my ultimate is ready to fire again.

Death Stroke: damage increases as player's ultimate charge increases

This skill was changed, but before that happened, please explain to me how vanilla UI allowed you to consistently use the full damage potential of this skill.

Fair point. Then again I already covered that and any other similar edge case by saying that outside the realm of minmaxers the current official feedback from the game is enough. I absolutely see that for people caring about the actual stats it is nowhere near enough info. I even had friends of mine almost quit because they felt unable to understand what's wrong with their not working character without having access to every possible stat there is. Had to point them to the mods I do not even use myself.

So long as stuff is optional I am all for a customizable HUD with as much or as little info displayed as I desire should the devs feel that they need to implement that themselves despite the existence of the well done mods and despite other work at hand. I'm just saying that to make clear that I am not one of the delusional naysayers thinking this is an either or thing necessarily.

I merely try to explain what the dev's stance on this stuff was basically ever since they started the project and that this discussion thus might be a waste of time barking up the wrong tree.

And just to troll a bit (meaning you might as well stop reading here ):

If this particular issue bothers one this much, then maybe he is part of an audience ZOS didn't have in mind playing their game. The devs envisioning their game to be played in a particular way and sticking to that vision is not a bad thing. It isn't even a bad thing if people do not like that vision and how it came to live. Sure one can voice his opinion about it and tell the devs what he doesn't like. But gamers in general should get over the expectation that devs will always budge to loud crying in the forums and change things as the currently loudest part of a forum pleases.

Devs growing a pair and sticking to decisions once made unless they themselves really see a flaw, in my book is a good thing. It's better than changing stuff every X weeks until the game is a streamlined standard copy of WoW (just for example).

Maybe it's because I started gaming in a time where there was no communication between devs and gamers at all. I know for a fact that good games don't need communication with the audience. Heck most of the greatest classic games from the 80s and 90s are the result of realizing a clear vision rather than trying to reach as big an audience as possible by developing for the smallest common denominator.