Revised CP points

Tapio75

As far as i understood the article of MMORPG.com..

It feels a bad move as while we who invest time to game get more points and points relative to invested time the ones that were happy getting 30 points for just one vr1 character are shafted.

I cant see how it will ever be good to remove something that is allready promised to some players just to please others.. The way i see it, the thing should have been to still give 30 points to all that had just one vr1 character and add 70 to that relative to time spent playing. This way they did not had to screw those with less time playing, they could just have rewarded anyone with vr1 with 30 poi8nts to begin with to test out the new system.

http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/821/feature/9296/Elder-Scrolls-Online-Understanding-Champion-Points.html

There is the article iu base my opinions from.

fromtesonlineb16_ESO

Why read trashy third-party sites when you can read first-hand on the official forums and join existing threads rather than starting yet another one?

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/145544/feedback-to-the-champion-system/p1

Tapio75

I am concerned about one aspect of the system, not of the whole.

I_killed_Vivec

"to test out the new system" ?

Many would say that they are playing a game (with all the progression involved) rather than testing a new system.

Besides, what ESO are saying they are going to do now is more in line with what they originally said, rather than revised idea that "promised" everyone 30 points.

So your question is more accurately "Why is ZOS going back to what they originally promised?".

Tapio75

No, there is no need to question why ZOS is now keeping the system they promised first, there is a legitimate reason to ask why do they take off something they allready promised. better way would really have been to give every vr that original 30 points as reward on reaching Vet and then add to that the extra points tracked by XP. This way people who were unhapy with 30 points would be hapy and those who just still get 30 are unhapy. Now those that only get 0-1 should be unhappy.

Let me explain at my perspective.

I have been playing since beta with only being away when playing WOD for about a moth. I have invested quite a bit of my time to ESO, even though i have not reached any more than 1 vr level.

Why do i skip playing VR content? Because for me, it is still flawed. Champion or VR, the philosophy of netraying my faction makes me unhapy going to enemy/other faction territories and be friend with them, even while i have just been their enemy number one...

For that reason i have not played any VR content yet and most likely never will with more than one wanderer or mercenary character unless they actually give faction specific content to play when on Champion levels..

I was exitred to get 30 points to just try out and make a small bonuses to my characters with those points and now since they removed my priviledge to get 30 points, i am unhappy anbd champion system is suddenly just a stale window which i cant do anything with.

In my perspective, i have legitimate reason to be unhappy since i was promised something and then i suddenly get nothing instead.

Be aware that i am extremely happy for those that get points relevant to invested time but even if my playing style is minority, i hopeds they just give what they promised. Just like those others were unhappy before. I think they should at least have some understanding why i am unhappy now.

AlnilamE

Yeah, but if you were a new player starting today who only got to V1 after the Champion System was implemented, then you would get 0 CP at that point too.

Personally, I never understood why they wanted to give 30 CP to people who were V1, if that's not how the system is going to work afterwards.

Regardless, you do not have to do Silver/Gold to level VR. You can go to Cyrodiil or Craglorn, or run Undaunted pledges. There are options fo you.

Tapio75

Cyrodil, PVP.. Craplorn, well all the complaints over the time explain that not being option and undaunted, hard to get groups that are pleasing to play with.

anyways, i do not see the harm in new players getting 30 points for nothing too, even while people like me have invested time to game.

Also, the Champion point conversion that is sadly coming now is also not the one that is working after 1.6 launch. Then people will gain CP a different way with different amounbt of time invested.

I do not think people would be much against extra 30 points added to those thei are allready getting. Especially not those that will only get couple of points because choices in the game with slogan "play as you wish"

Tapio75

Also, if i wish to get any points at all, i am required to lean away from my preferred playstyle and instead go grind something i do not particularly like.

AlnilamE

You should really give Craglorn a try. It's a very fun zone. I've done all the quests there on my main character, and helped several guildies through the main questline just because it's fun.

Now my alt beat Molag Bal and she's allowed to go there to play (self-imposed barrier).

Cyrodiil is fun too, even if you don't PvP. I've gotten all the dungeons/skyshards/daily quests on my main and all the dungeons/skyshards on my alt, and have several lower level alts who still have to go there. I don't balk at going to Cyrodiil at level 10, and if I end up getting into PvP, so be it.

Joejudas

So if you have been playing since launch and prefer to quest and are too low to get CP points then your doing it wrong. If you just joined 2 months ago and you are too low to get CP points....put in more time. Period.

radiostar

It might have been friendlier to give the initial 30 CP as they stated and then add up to the 70 CP for the specific levels, but it's not so bad. You can log onto the PTS and try out the system, and there is still time to level up on Live for a few points too. +1 though for not using the old "slap in the face" description

Tapio75

@radiostar‌
Yes, that is the thing i was wishing for. More thoughtful aproasch to please all rather than shifting the pleased crowd to different crowd of people. Why just give joy for other crowd while you can give some for both.

I never like the "Here is a toy for you, oops sorry i will give it to that other kid" aproach ^^

Morshire

@Tapio75 - while I do not agree with the thread or your point of view, I can still see the point. I think that giving everyone with a VR1 30CP would have created problems with some other group of players. They never would have been able to do this:

Tapio75 wrote: »

@radiostar‌
Yes, that is the thing i was wishing for. More thoughtful aproasch to please all rather than shifting the pleased crowd to different crowd of people. Why just give joy for other crowd while you can give some for both.

Honestly I do not think that anything ZOS could have done would have made everyone happy. I too would have benefited more by the 30CP than under the current method. I like, and even argued, for something like what they came out with though. Personal opinion on the matter. What ZOS should have done was to not tell people they were tracking XP, not started anyone with any CP till the system came out, and introduced the system and then let everyone start gaining points at launch. Really it is too late for hindsight. As it stands, if you don't want to go and gain the CP from any of the methods you have available, then you won't be gaining them after launch either since there are no new plans for any new methods for gaining CP right at launch. (To the best of my knowledge) Since that is the case, 30CP just for showing up isn't really going to let you "test" the Champion System all that well. Best bet would be to go to PTS when it comes out and take it for a spin there.

Tapio75 wrote: »

I never like the "Here is a toy for you, oops sorry i will give it to that other kid" aproach ^^

It is more accurate to say:

"Billy work hard and I will give you a toy." After all the work is done, "Better yet, here is a toy for everyone." Then realizing the mistake and how badly Billy's feeling got hurt, "Sorry that was wrong to Billy, here is your toy and none for the rest of you unless you too earn it like Billy." (Don't flame me for jokingly trying to give a "clearer" example. I am not trying to demean anyone's stance on the issue)

Honestly @Tapio75 - you are not happy with the answer ZOS gave, some of the gamers who have 8 VR14's are still not satisfied with the response, and I am sure that there are people without VR characters that don't like it cause they feel it still creates a gap between players. No matter how the pie gets sliced, someone isn't going to get what they want.

Varicite

Eh, they told everyone that if they had a VR level toon, they'd get 30 cp. Now they're actually getting 0 at VR1 as opposed to the 30.

Of course people are gonna be mad.

But I guess the VR14s are happy now, and I'm sure they'll be chiming in to tell us all how this is more fair than when they were lied to about what they'd be receiving.

No idea why they didn't just go w/ 5 per VR1 toon and then increase it from there. Then at least all of the people who stopped leveling through the VR content in anticipation of what we were all told was going to happen would get something.

Personally, I'll have the 70 either way, but that doesn't mean that I have to agree w/ all of this constant backtracking on what's been said.

Devs, I love your game, but man... you guys are just very hard to trust these days.

radiostar

"•It is possible that a Veteran Rank 1 character may not have earned 200,000XP into Veteran Rank 1. In this case, you will not receive a Champion Point after the system goes live."

Use the time now to level if you only just hit VR1.
Don't worry, U6 is not making Live too quickly here.

UrQuan

I'm one of the players who is negatively impacted by the decision to give 1 CP per 200K XP above level 50 (max 70 CP) rather than a flat 30 CP to everyone with a VR character. At least I will be unless I play a lot with my couple of VR characters. As of right now I'll be sitting at 19 CP I think.

You know what though? I think ZOS made the right call with this. Frankly it's not that difficult or time consuming to get a character to VR1 - if I wasn't actively playing 16 characters I'm sure I'd have at least 4 or 5 VR toons. If the maximum anyone will get at launch is 70 CP then to my mind it's unfair to the people who have put in the work to get 70 CP (which IMO is a many times more effort than just getting a character to VR 1) to give people with any VR characters a minimum of 30 CP.

I think it's far more fair to the entire player base to do it the way ZOS has described than it is to do it the way they previously planned, or to do it the way they have now described, but with giving everyone a minimum of 30 CP if they've got a VR toon. It may be worse for me personally, but it's better for the player base as a whole, so I'm perfectly fine with it.

Audigy

AlnilamE wrote: »

Yeah, but if you were a new player starting today who only got to V1 after the Champion System was implemented, then you would get 0 CP at that point too.

Personally, I never understood why they wanted to give 30 CP to people who were V1, if that's not how the system is going to work afterwards.

They wanted to give those 30 CP to everyone as this is what the content will be balanced on.

Maria said it well in ESO live. "We want that everyone can still do what he currently does".

Sadly the whining made them change their decision and because of this we are now in that mess that we are in.

It will be very interesting to see how a player with 0 CP will do with 1.6 on. Maybe they cant kill anything or its just a tad harder, but it will be a different experience if they don't have those promised 30 CP.

At the same time, someone with 70 CP might be able to clear Dungeons and Trials much easier now and will be able to score high in the rankings.

In my opinion, everyone should get 30 CP and those with VR 14 get 70. By doing so everyone will still be able to do the content he did before, nobody is unhappy all have something and no subs will be dropped.

The decision now however is even worse than before, as it discourages non VR players and Newbies to keep playing.

To not be able to gain CPs from 1-50 is also very un-smart. I never liked talent gating in games, its like showing someone the ice cream, but then hiding it behind a door of glass with 10 locks.

Joejudas

Audigy wrote: »

AlnilamE wrote: »

Yeah, but if you were a new player starting today who only got to V1 after the Champion System was implemented, then you would get 0 CP at that point too.

Personally, I never understood why they wanted to give 30 CP to people who were V1, if that's not how the system is going to work afterwards.

They wanted to give those 30 CP to everyone as this is what the content will be balanced on.

Maria said it well in ESO live. "We want that everyone can still do what he currently does".

Sadly the whining made them change their decision and because of this we are now in that mess that we are in.

It will be very interesting to see how a player with 0 CP will do with 1.6 on. Maybe they cant kill anything or its just a tad harder, but it will be a different experience if they don't have those promised 30 CP.

At the same time, someone with 70 CP might be able to clear Dungeons and Trials much easier now and will be able to score high in the rankings.

In my opinion, everyone should get 30 CP and those with VR 14 get 70. By doing so everyone will still be able to do the content he did before, nobody is unhappy all have something and no subs will be dropped.

The decision now however is even worse than before, as it discourages non VR players and Newbies to keep playing.

To not be able to gain CPs from 1-50 is also very un-smart. I never liked talent gating in games, its like showing someone the ice cream, but then hiding it behind a door of glass with 10 locks.

Because a VR1 can still do Silver and Gold and I can't as a VR14....So I get more CP. Thats how it is !!!!!

asteldian

Personally I would have given 30 CP to VR1. They said they would then changed their mind - this is no different to why vr14 players got angry about getting 30, where are all the 'they lied!' Threads now?
Yes vr1 have silver and gold content, but that is in no way 70 CP worth, heck, depending on conversion rate after this goes live I doubt it is even 40 CP worth.
As a vr14 myself I have no personal investment in what happens to vr1, but I still think they should get the CP, they are then happy and vr14 should still be happy they got more.

Guppet

Audigy wrote: »

AlnilamE wrote: »

Yeah, but if you were a new player starting today who only got to V1 after the Champion System was implemented, then you would get 0 CP at that point too.

Personally, I never understood why they wanted to give 30 CP to people who were V1, if that's not how the system is going to work afterwards.

They wanted to give those 30 CP to everyone as this is what the content will be balanced on.

Maria said it well in ESO live. "We want that everyone can still do what he currently does".

Sadly the whining made them change their decision and because of this we are now in that mess that we are in.

It will be very interesting to see how a player with 0 CP will do with 1.6 on. Maybe they cant kill anything or its just a tad harder, but it will be a different experience if they don't have those promised 30 CP.

At the same time, someone with 70 CP might be able to clear Dungeons and Trials much easier now and will be able to score high in the rankings.

In my opinion, everyone should get 30 CP and those with VR 14 get 70. By doing so everyone will still be able to do the content he did before, nobody is unhappy all have something and no subs will be dropped.

The decision now however is even worse than before, as it discourages non VR players and Newbies to keep playing.

To not be able to gain CPs from 1-50 is also very un-smart. I never liked talent gating in games, its like showing someone the ice cream, but then hiding it behind a door of glass with 10 locks.

They are true to thier word. A VR1 can still do what they were doing. They were not doing end game content before either. 30 points is what the trials and vet dungeons are scaled for not Cadwells. If that was balanced for 30 points, then new players in the future would have no content to do at 50.

Joejudas

the people who think they deserve stuff at vr1 confuse me...also i hope they just put out 1.6 so i stop reading all this crying.

Tapio75

Well, until the news of revised plans for CP gain pon launch was announcd, i was leveling my currently highest level character to vr1 to get that 30 points i was promised.

I was happy with 30, even if thats all i ever will get due my personal preference of playstyle since i can still use it from the start of new characters for small tweaks as they stated. We gain CP on old VR levels but can use it from level 1 on new characters even while they do not gain CP as CP is account wide.

Now i will get 0 to couple IF i have even will to continue that one character from now on.. I constanbtly make new toons with different bios and play them as long as they feel fun to me. I constantly have to delete older characters to create new ones and as the endgame content goes, the game is finished on character basis when i reach a level cap and all the faction and story quests are done, just like i stated before. I have litle interest in current VR content, i have plans for some "neutral" wanderer who will play through all the content with my friends similar character but i do not really know when that will happen so..

I will not have many CP point ever, in years i may have plenty but my gamestyle makes me not gasin them in current ESO. I just wanted that promised 30 points so i can use it for small tweaks on new characters and nothing more but as they now broke that promise, i have lost that oppostunity which makes me sad.

If not tracking XP was broken promise, so is this. Promises are promises and you should not broke other promise to make other promise true.

They should have tracked XP from the beginning and give points relevant to that XP, not promise everyone 30 points and then state that not all are getting 30 points but in fact some will get now none, just to make that other promise come partially true. Silence may be bad way to communicate to playerbase but i much more prefer silence than broiken promises over broken promises.

Joejudas

Tapio75 wrote: »

Well, until the news of revised plans for CP gain pon launch was announcd, i was leveling my currently highest level character to vr1 to get that 30 points i was promised.

I was happy with 30, even if thats all i ever will get due my personal preference of playstyle since i can still use it from the start of new characters for small tweaks as they stated. We gain CP on old VR levels but can use it from level 1 on new characters even while they do not gain CP as CP is account wide.

Now i will get 0 to couple IF i have even will to continue that one character from now on.. I constanbtly make new toons with different bios and play them as long as they feel fun to me. I constantly have to delete older characters to create new ones and as the endgame content goes, the game is finished on character basis when i reach a level cap and all the faction and story quests are done, just like i stated before. I have litle interest in current VR content, i have plans for some "neutral" wanderer who will play through all the content with my friends similar character but i do not really know when that will happen so..

I will not have many CP point ever, in years i may have plenty but my gamestyle makes me not gasin them in current ESO. I just wanted that promised 30 points so i can use it for small tweaks on new characters and nothing more but as they now broke that promise, i have lost that oppostunity which makes me sad.

If not tracking XP was broken promise, so is this. Promises are promises and you should not broke other promise to make other promise true.

They should have tracked XP from the beginning and give points relevant to that XP, not promise everyone 30 points and then state that not all are getting 30 points but in fact some will get now none, just to make that other promise come partially true. Silence may be bad way to communicate to playerbase but i much more prefer silence than broiken promises over broken promises.

The fact you were leveling your toon to VR1 to get " your " 30 cp is the problem. Alot of people did this....So I'll ask the question....WHAT WERE YOU DOING BEFORE THIS ????? It wasn't leveling a character I guess. None of you guys could take the time to level a toon and collect skyshards before....then they said hey you get cp points for doing the minimum. So everyone did the minimum....now you get nothing. Jokes on you

Tavore1138

I sort of sympathise with this but also, given the comments of some of the players upset by this latest decision on the way we VR14's all exploited etc you'd really have to have a heart of stone not to laugh at the same people now complaining they won't get 30CP.

But I'll be the better person and agree that it would be better if they gave you guys the 30CP and just gave the VR14s proportionally more and if that means a total of 80 or 90 instead of 70 out of the 3,600 available then I really doubt that's going to cause a huge separation of power either short or long term.

This is one of the few instances in which they probably can make everyone relatively content without breaking the game.

P.S. Irony marks to the poster who made a massive whine post to criticise how other people whined - you know who you are.

Tapio75

@Joejudas‌
Please kindly read, i am always leveling new characters and making room for new toons by deleting old ones. I love the journey on my factions side and so forth. I also take time to collect all shards, all lorebooks, do all stuff that is not needed to do, i take time walking instead of running and list goes on.. I consume massive amounts of time playing rthis game as it is fantastic, living Tamriel to adventure with other people bringing life to world instead of jus NPC's.. Thats that

To you who did not like getting just 30 points for your time used to level vr characters, i am happy for you, i really am. I just hoped they keep both promises now and not break this promise when giving you XP relevant CP points. Give everyone that 30 CP and add to that according to XP gained with VR characters and i think most are somewhat happy if not completely happy. I have hard time believing anyone can much argue that giving something useful to everyone is a bad thing.

Joejudas

You are getting CP for the exp earned on VR though....and it's 0 cause you don't have enough. That's fair.

Tapio75

@Joejudas‌
So you are ok of them breaking one promise to give 30 points. Were you also ok when they broke a promise to track XP?

Joejudas

They promised in October to track exp until Jan....then they announced out of the blue that a VR1 gets 30 cp and like 7 days later that a VR1 wasn't. It's not even close to being that same thing. Also it takes like 1 day to level from 1 to 50.

Tapio75

Oh now i see where you are coming from hapy days Joejudas ^^

Nijjion

I was thinking they have either lost or not recorded the XP of players after VR14 but actually what they have done is favour casuals over the hardcore... which is clever for a business point of view. They saw they would *** over majority of their playerbase if they kept to their original promise.

It's just a shame the past 4 months of XP is wasted really, which they said would be useful.

I'm just a bit disappointed they are making mistakes amature companies make by promising stuff they cannot keep. Keep quiet like everyone else does or do what you actually say. I'm not asking for a possibility of 1000s of CP head start but maybe make the cap 100 and then when you reach VR14 you get the 65CP as stated in their current system but XP carries on till you reach the 100CP mark (with every 200k xp you get 1cp to the cap). Though still lots of people would reach this cap... which in their original post said very few people would reach the cap with the skillpoints they would give.

alkoriak

I think they need to take other factors into account when making the conversion, like the achievements, the number of quests done, the number of skill points, etc,... A VR14 that only grinded to this level will have max CP points but will still have all quests available to gain CP while one with everything almost maxed will receive the same but only can do repeteable content now to gain CP. Well, personally I'm happy with my Vr2, just having fun doing quests and not grinding and in the end I think the initial difference will be negligible but I wanted to clarify this anyway.