Professions in ESO -> OVERHAUL

Bloodfang

1. Summary


1.1 Professions in ESO

Right now we have 6 Crafting Professions:

- Alchemy
- Blacksmithing
- Clothing
- Enchanting
- Provisioning
- Woodworking

I'll be talking more about the Blacksmithing, Clothing and Woodworking. The reason I am specifically mentioning Blacksmithing, Clothing and Woodworking is because of the identical crafting process with these three professions (Also I am not very familiar /experienced with the other 3 professions). They all share the same 5 "activities", which all show up as separate tabs in the crafting window every time a player interacts with the appopriate crafting station:

- Item Creation
- Item Improvement
- Deconstruction
- Refinement
- Research

2. Expanding / Improvement Potential


2.1 Blacksmithing

By now everyone is used to running around exploring (mostly around mountains), for the all kinds of mining nodes. Going back to crafting station refining all the ore, and crafting items in whatever way you want etc. I have to say the concept is great, however it feels somewhat very basic and easy. If Crafting is letting us to create items as powerful as if we were doing Trials, it needs to be made harder. A great way for that is to intruduce professions tied to Blacksmithing - such as Mining etc.

For now I've got only 1 complain about Blacksmithing itself, and I'd like to direct you to this topic:

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/121362/master-crafter-new-perk-for-crafting


2.1.1 Mining

I was really surprised when I Beta tested ESO. Mostly because I didn't expect to be mining without actually having to buy a pickaxe, or without even having to learn "how to mine". It's not that I hate the existing system, but it feels like it's severely lacking, this is how I would like to see it changed:

- Mining Profession has been added
- Mining Trainers are now scattered around the Zones (in short caves). Guards are now giving you directions
- You can mine as long as you have Pickaxe in your inventory (You can buy it from any mining trainer)
- You can level it while mining nodes. However it stops leveling at max level for that ore (Example: Iron is currently level 1-14. If your Mining is at level 14, it stops progressing from mining Iron)
- Smithing profession is added as well
- Refining ore is now leveling your Smithing. Your Mining trainer can teach you how to refine any material (as long as your Smithing level is high enough).
- New Achievements have been added associated with Mining and Smithing.


2.2 Woodworking

The concept is fine as it is. However it should get some improvements, I'm thinking in a similar way as Blacksmithing (above). About the Woodworking itself I'd like it to be tied more to Player Housing (when it finally gets implemented).

So I'm directing you to this awesome topic:

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/136476/housing-system-a-vision/p1


2.2.1 Woodcutting

- Woodcutting Profession has been added
- Woodcutting Trainers are now scattered around the Zones (at lumbermills, sorry Bosmers you are out of this)
- You can cut wood as long as you have appropriate Axe in your Inventory (You can buy it from any Woodcutting trainer)
- You can level it while cutting wood. However it stops leveling at max level for that wood. (Example: Sanded Maple is currently level 1-14. If your Woodcutting is at level 14, it stops progressing from cutting Sanded Maple
- New Achievements have been added associated with Woodcutting


2.3 Clothing

It's not good, it really isn't. Some designes are just weird at best. I don't get it why the need to put Light and Medium Armor into same profession? Also it's kinda hard navigating through the UI to get to the Medium Armor when crafting.
I mean there are 15 items in this profession, which you can craft (Compared to only 6 at Woodworking station and 14 at Blacksmithing station, which is split into 7:7 between Apparel and Weapon category anyway. So my proposal is to just add a whole new profession for Medium Armor lovers.


2.3.1 Leatherworking

- Leatherworking Profession has been added
- Leatherworking Stations have been added
- Medium Armor apparel has been moved from Clothing to Leatherworking Station
- There are now new NPCs associated with this profession
- Crafting Writs are now associated with this profession

2.3.1.1 Skinning

Because every master Leatherworker needs to master the "art" of Skinning!
Seriously though, to me not including skinning as a profession right from the launch was a big surprise. I consider it even worse than mining where you get that "mining animation" out of nowhere, at least you get some animation!! What happens right now? You kill an animal, the said animal drops it's skin in your face? I mean come on, you can do better than that!!

- Skinning Profession has been added
- Skinning Trainers are now scattered around the Zones (at Hunting Grounds)
- You can skin animals as long as you have appropriate Skinning Dagger in your Inventory (You can buy it from any Skinning trainer)
- You can level it while skinning animals. It keeps leveling based on the level of the animals you are skinning (Example: If your Skinning level is 10, and you are skinning a level 9 animal, you won't be progressing it.)
- New Achievements have been added associated with Skinning

3. That's it! Share your thoughts!

I would like to say this didn't just come out of my head, it took me some time analyzing what all these changes would do to ESO. I've come to a conclusion that perhaps ESO really needs to expand it's profession system. Yes I know this would require some big overhaul of the existing system, but I've come to think it would be worth it in the end.

Big Thanks to everyone who spent their time reading through all of this. Let me know what you think!

Mordria

I would like to see clothier split into leather working and tailor. Also, add jeweler and carpenter - will be useful when/if player housing ever comes available.

Wizzo91

No thanks.

I like the way that it is. Why an extra profession for mining etc.? If you want to specialize in just mining you have to option to do it now.

connor_worlineub17_ESO

It sounds like you're overcomplicating the crafting system with extra useless skills and skill lines

OrangeTheCat

The current system is one of the few mmo crafting systems that I like (I usually dislike crafting in MMOs). Don't fix what isn't broken.

Siluen

I applaud you on taking time to write this all up, but I absolutely hate the idea of having gathering professions next to the existing professions. It would just be an incredible waste of skillpoints and it was something I really hated in for example WoW as it was not immersive at all. I cannot pick the flowers in the higher level zone because I did not pick enough of the flowers in the zone before that? Urgh.

This system not being in place for ESO was a huge relief to me and I really love crafting in this game. The stuff I made during leveling was useful straight away and I did not have to craft 50 of the same item to progress, it all felt pretty smooth and natural and I would not want to change a thing about it.

Bloodfang

There is nothing complicated in the system I just "made". The profession system we currently have is basic at best.

Sure it's working perfectly fine, and what it does, it does the best on the MMO market. However we are severely lacking some realism and professions. This is something we are far behind when compared to other MMOs.

1.Can someone explain me why is mining animation playing, when we don't even have a pickaxe?
2. How did we learn to mine, if we were just thrown out of Coldharbour?
3. Why is it that we can't even skin animals, where is the animation?
4. Why are they just throwing their skin at us? Why do we pick up their skin lol?

I don't know about you but there is something very wrong with these things.


I'm not sure how many of you bothered to read everything. I don't even get it what is wrong with having more things to do in a game? Right now there isn't much endgame put into the crafting system, hell I've had all 3 of those professions maxed the moment I stepped into Coldharbour.

Lord_Kreegan

What you suggest is basically to make ESO just like WoW, LotRO, and other games. Why?

While I acknowledge that the crafting system in ESO is simplistic in many ways, it's consistent with the fact that there isn't a global AH. Anything you make is pretty much just for yourself or your alts; not for sale to other players. As such, the ESO crafting system isn't a bunch of professions, it's just an alternative form of obtaining "loot"... and a money sink.

Keeping that in perspective, the crafting system is satisfactory as it is.

If we ever get a global AH, then we're going to need recipes that we get as drops so we can have unique items we can build; we're going to need unique resources that are used for those unique items; etc. Right now our "unique" sets are built using the special locations with crafting stations and the "unique" resources we need are just those built-in perks on gear that we can research. It's a parallel to most crafting implementations, but not really that different.

Bloodfang

Lord_Kreegan wrote: »

What you suggest is basically to make ESO just like WoW, LotRO, and other games. Why?

While I acknowledge that the crafting system in ESO is simplistic in many ways, it's consistent with the fact that there isn't a global AH. Anything you make is pretty much just for yourself or your alts; not for sale to other players. As such, the ESO crafting system isn't a bunch of professions, it's just an alternative form of obtaining "loot"... and a money sink.

Keeping that in perspective, the crafting system is satisfactory as it is.

If we ever get a global AH, then we're going to need recipes that we get as drops so we can have unique items we can build; we're going to need unique resources that are used for those unique items; etc. Right now our "unique" sets are built using the special locations with crafting stations and the "unique" resources we need are just those built-in perks on gear that we can research. It's a parallel to most crafting implementations, but not really that different.

You can interpret this any way you want. One thing though: how come Skyrim had a more expanded crafting system? I mean you had to smelt ore there didn't you? Yep that's right an RPG and TES game "forced" you to do these "complicated things".

PS: I wrote the reasons above as to why we need to expand this system, which I'm pretty sure is only a matter of time but whatever..

Wizzo91

Adding new recipes, sets, possibilities, combinations is all fine. (They are already doing this to some degree, btw)

But please no "Gathering Professions" that you have to level up by gathering.

I love the crafting system as it is! Actually the best one I've encountered in my MMO history. I never really liked crafting in other games but here I do.

The progression is fluid and you don't have to put a lot of time in it. You just continue to quest and you should have no problem to level up the crafts. What I hated most in other mmos that you had to craft 100 of this and 200 of this between leveling to keep up.

Also this is what gathering professions would come down to. I love picking up mats as I please. I really do not want to be forced into: "You have to gather 300 flowers in zone 1 to progress your profession enough to continue gathering in zone 2".
This actually made me ignore professions in some games.
Or what if I feel like grinding one zone on an alt because I did not like the quests. You want to force me into running around the map and farm low level mats just to level up my gathering profession?

And why add something trivial to the game, where you force people to carry a axe that is worth a couple of gold pieces just to collect wood? Really no reason to do it. (Realism is no reason - 110 slots of bag space anyone?)

Bloodfang

Wizzo91 wrote: »

Adding new recipes, sets, possibilities, combinations is all fine. (They are already doing this to some degree, btw)

But please no "Gathering Professions" that you have to level up by gathering.

I love the crafting system as it is! Actually the best one I've encountered in my MMO history. I never really liked crafting in other games but here I do.

The progression is fluid and you don't have to put a lot of time in it. You just continue to quest and you should have no problem to level up the crafts. What I hated most in other mmos that you had to craft 100 of this and 200 of this between leveling to keep up.

Also this is what gathering professions would come down to. I love picking up mats as a please. I really do not want to be forced into: "You have to gather 300 flowers in zone 1 to progress your profession enough to continue gathering in zone 2".
Or what if I feel like grinding one zone on an alt because I did not like the quests. You want to force me into running around the map and farm low level mats just to level up my gathering profession?

And why add something trivial to the game, where you force people to carry a axe that is worth a couple of gold pieces just to collect wood? Really no reason to do it. (Realism is no reason - 110 slots of bag space anyone?)

Actually gathering professions would level at a much faster rate than other professions (which are leveling very very fast already).

I'd imagine only achievements being that grindy as you've described.

About inventory though, I've leveled 4 professions on my main at the same time since launch and never had a single problem with it. You just need to organize yourself and all works well. Also we are getting improvements to it in update 6.

Siluen

Despair9 wrote: »

You can interpret this any way you want. One thing though: how come Skyrim had a more expanded crafting system? I mean you had to smelt ore there didn't you? Yep that's right an RPG and TES game "forced" you to do these "complicated things".

In ESO you actually refine ore, leather, cloth-stuff and wood as well, you just press a few less buttons and do it at the same crafting station.

The biggest difference with Skyrim, is that Skyrim had a few more different environmental tools. I could argue there is still a forge near the anvils you use in ESO and "forging" leather armor did not make that much sense in Skyrim. But in neither game do you have to spend extra points in a separate gathering profession. I suppose they could add tools such as picks or whatever, but is this really such a necessary addition to the existing system?

Having separate gathering professions is not "complicated," it is just a tedious thing that judging by the posts thusfar, most people are happier without.

Wizzo91

Despair9 wrote: »

Wizzo91 wrote: »

Adding new recipes, sets, possibilities, combinations is all fine. (They are already doing this to some degree, btw)

But please no "Gathering Professions" that you have to level up by gathering.

I love the crafting system as it is! Actually the best one I've encountered in my MMO history. I never really liked crafting in other games but here I do.

The progression is fluid and you don't have to put a lot of time in it. You just continue to quest and you should have no problem to level up the crafts. What I hated most in other mmos that you had to craft 100 of this and 200 of this between leveling to keep up.

Also this is what gathering professions would come down to. I love picking up mats as a please. I really do not want to be forced into: "You have to gather 300 flowers in zone 1 to progress your profession enough to continue gathering in zone 2".
Or what if I feel like grinding one zone on an alt because I did not like the quests. You want to force me into running around the map and farm low level mats just to level up my gathering profession?

And why add something trivial to the game, where you force people to carry a axe that is worth a couple of gold pieces just to collect wood? Really no reason to do it. (Realism is no reason - 110 slots of bag space anyone?)

Actually gathering professions would level at a much faster rate than other professions (which are leveling very very fast already).

I'd imagine only achievements being that grindy as you've described.

About inventory though, I've leveled 4 professions on my main ever since launch and never had problem with it, you just need to organize yourself and all works well. Also we are getting improvements to it in update 6.

"Would level faster" - how do you know this, are you a dev?

Just give me one valid reason why they should add gathering professions - how would it improve the crafting system as it is?

I also have no problem with inventory management and enough space. I was just referring to that there is no need to purchase gather equipment because of realism. Just like our inventory is not realistic.

Bloodfang

Siluen wrote: »

Despair9 wrote: »

You can interpret this any way you want. One thing though: how come Skyrim had a more expanded crafting system? I mean you had to smelt ore there didn't you? Yep that's right an RPG and TES game "forced" you to do these "complicated things".

In ESO you actually refine ore, leather, cloth-stuff and wood as well, you just press a few less buttons and do it at the same crafting station.

The biggest difference with Skyrim, is that Skyrim had a few more different environmental tools. I could argue there is still a forge near the anvils you use in ESO and "forging" leather armor did not make that much sense in Skyrim. But in neither game do you have to spend extra points in a separate gathering profession. I suppose they could add tools such as picks or whatever, but is this really such a necessary addition to the existing system?

Having separate gathering professions is not "complicated," it is just a tedious thing that judging by the posts thusfar, most people are happier without.

I never said the need to spend skillpoints. Gathering professions wouldn't really need that.

Also that's true, as I've said already the crafting system is perfectly fine as it is. However you get bored really fast. Max level 50, is reached at around 40. You end up spending all of the time just clicking on Research, how is that not tedious?

kelly.medleyb14_ESO

Despair9 wrote: »

1. Summary


1.1 Professions in ESO

Right now we have 6 Crafting Professions:

- Alchemy
- Blacksmithing
- Clothing
- Enchanting
- Provisioning
- Woodworking

I'll be talking more about the Blacksmithing, Clothing and Woodworking. The reason I am specifically mentioning Blacksmithing, Clothing and Woodworking is because of the identical crafting process with these three professions (Also I am not very familiar /experienced with the other 3 professions). They all share the same 5 "activities", which all show up as separate tabs in the crafting window every time a player interacts with the appopriate crafting station:

- Item Creation
- Item Improvement
- Deconstruction
- Refinement
- Research

2. Expanding / Improvement Potential


2.1 Blacksmithing

By now everyone is used to running around exploring (mostly around mountains), for the all kinds of mining nodes. Going back to crafting station refining all the ore, and crafting items in whatever way you want etc. I have to say the concept is great, however it feels somewhat very basic and easy. If Crafting is letting us to create items as powerful as if we were doing Trials, it needs to be made harder. A great way for that is to intruduce professions tied to Blacksmithing - such as Mining etc.

For now I've got only 1 complain about Blacksmithing itself, and I'd like to direct you to this topic:

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/121362/master-crafter-new-perk-for-crafting


2.1.1 Mining

I was really surprised when I Beta tested ESO. Mostly because I didn't expect to be mining without actually having to buy a pickaxe, or without even having to learn "how to mine". It's not that I hate the existing system, but it feels like it's severely lacking, this is how I would like to see it changed:

- Mining Profession has been added
- Mining Trainers are now scattered around the Zones (in short caves). Guards are now giving you directions
- You can mine as long as you have Pickaxe in your inventory (You can buy it from any mining trainer)
- You can level it while mining nodes. However it stops leveling at max level for that ore (Example: Iron is currently level 1-14. If your Mining is at level 14, it stops progressing from mining Iron)
- Smithing profession is added as well
- Refining ore is now leveling your Smithing. Your Mining trainer can teach you how to refine any material (as long as your Smithing level is high enough).
- New Achievements have been added associated with Mining and Smithing.


2.2 Woodworking

The concept is fine as it is. However it should get some improvements, I'm thinking in a similar way as Blacksmithing (above). About the Woodworking itself I'd like it to be tied more to Player Housing (when it finally gets implemented).

So I'm directing you to this awesome topic:

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/136476/housing-system-a-vision/p1


2.2.1 Woodcutting

- Woodcutting Profession has been added
- Woodcutting Trainers are now scattered around the Zones (at lumbermills, sorry Bosmers you are out of this)
- You can cut wood as long as you have appropriate Axe in your Inventory (You can buy it from any Woodcutting trainer)
- You can level it while cutting wood. However it stops leveling at max level for that wood. (Example: Sanded Maple is currently level 1-14. If your Woodcutting is at level 14, it stops progressing from cutting Sanded Maple
- New Achievements have been added associated with Woodcutting


2.3 Clothing

It's not good, it really isn't. Some designes are just weird at best. I don't get it why the need to put Light and Medium Armor into same profession? Also it's kinda hard navigating through the UI to get to the Medium Armor when crafting.
I mean there are 15 items in this profession, which you can craft (Compared to only 6 at Woodworking station and 14 at Blacksmithing station, which is split into 7:7 between Apparel and Weapon category anyway. So my proposal is to just add a whole new profession for Medium Armor lovers.


2.3.1 Leatherworking

- Leatherworking Profession has been added
- Leatherworking Stations have been added
- Medium Armor apparel has been moved from Clothing to Leatherworking Station
- There are now new NPCs associated with this profession
- Crafting Writs are now associated with this profession

2.3.1.1 Skinning

Because every master Leatherworker needs to master the "art" of Skinning!
Seriously though, to me not including skinning as a profession right from the launch was a big surprise. I consider it even worse than mining where you get that "mining animation" out of nowhere, at least you get some animation!! What happens right now? You kill an animal, the said animal drops it's skin in your face? I mean come on, you can do better than that!!

- Skinning Profession has been added
- Skinning Trainers are now scattered around the Zones (at Hunting Grounds)
- You can skin animals as long as you have appropriate Skinning Dagger in your Inventory (You can buy it from any Skinning trainer)
- You can level it while skinning animals. It keeps leveling based on the level of the animals you are skinning (Example: If your Skinning level is 10, and you are skinning a level 9 animal, you won't be progressing it.)
- New Achievements have been added associated with Skinning

3. That's it! Share your thoughts!

I would like to say this didn't just come out of my head, it took me some time analyzing what all these changes would do to ESO. I've come to a conclusion that perhaps ESO really needs to expand it's profession system. Yes I know this would require some big overhaul of the existing system, but I've come to think it would be worth it in the end.

Big Thanks to everyone who spent their time reading through all of this. Let me know what you think!

Love all these ideas, non crafters will hate it though bc they want everything handed to them.

Bloodfang

Wizzo91 wrote: »

Despair9 wrote: »

Wizzo91 wrote: »

Adding new recipes, sets, possibilities, combinations is all fine. (They are already doing this to some degree, btw)

But please no "Gathering Professions" that you have to level up by gathering.

I love the crafting system as it is! Actually the best one I've encountered in my MMO history. I never really liked crafting in other games but here I do.

The progression is fluid and you don't have to put a lot of time in it. You just continue to quest and you should have no problem to level up the crafts. What I hated most in other mmos that you had to craft 100 of this and 200 of this between leveling to keep up.

Also this is what gathering professions would come down to. I love picking up mats as a please. I really do not want to be forced into: "You have to gather 300 flowers in zone 1 to progress your profession enough to continue gathering in zone 2".
Or what if I feel like grinding one zone on an alt because I did not like the quests. You want to force me into running around the map and farm low level mats just to level up my gathering profession?

And why add something trivial to the game, where you force people to carry a axe that is worth a couple of gold pieces just to collect wood? Really no reason to do it. (Realism is no reason - 110 slots of bag space anyone?)

Actually gathering professions would level at a much faster rate than other professions (which are leveling very very fast already).

I'd imagine only achievements being that grindy as you've described.

About inventory though, I've leveled 4 professions on my main ever since launch and never had problem with it, you just need to organize yourself and all works well. Also we are getting improvements to it in update 6.

"Would level faster" - how do you know this, are you a dev?

Just give me one valid reason why they should add gathering professions - how would it improve the crafting system as it is?

I also have no problem with inventory management and enough space. I was just referring to that there is no need to purchase gather equipment because of realism. Just like our inventory is not realistic.

I'm not a dev, I wrote this topic as I feel it should be. But if you check pretty much any game, all gathering professions are leveling at a much faster rate than the "Main" professions. And well the "Main" professions in ESO are leveling really really fast already.

1. Immersion
2. More things to do
3. A fair reason why crafting should be competitive with PvE Endgame. (Right now it's not fair, as it's very easy)

Wizzo91

Despair9 wrote: »

Wizzo91 wrote: »

Despair9 wrote: »

Wizzo91 wrote: »

Adding new recipes, sets, possibilities, combinations is all fine. (They are already doing this to some degree, btw)

But please no "Gathering Professions" that you have to level up by gathering.

I love the crafting system as it is! Actually the best one I've encountered in my MMO history. I never really liked crafting in other games but here I do.

The progression is fluid and you don't have to put a lot of time in it. You just continue to quest and you should have no problem to level up the crafts. What I hated most in other mmos that you had to craft 100 of this and 200 of this between leveling to keep up.

Also this is what gathering professions would come down to. I love picking up mats as a please. I really do not want to be forced into: "You have to gather 300 flowers in zone 1 to progress your profession enough to continue gathering in zone 2".
Or what if I feel like grinding one zone on an alt because I did not like the quests. You want to force me into running around the map and farm low level mats just to level up my gathering profession?

And why add something trivial to the game, where you force people to carry a axe that is worth a couple of gold pieces just to collect wood? Really no reason to do it. (Realism is no reason - 110 slots of bag space anyone?)

Actually gathering professions would level at a much faster rate than other professions (which are leveling very very fast already).

I'd imagine only achievements being that grindy as you've described.

About inventory though, I've leveled 4 professions on my main ever since launch and never had problem with it, you just need to organize yourself and all works well. Also we are getting improvements to it in update 6.

"Would level faster" - how do you know this, are you a dev?

Just give me one valid reason why they should add gathering professions - how would it improve the crafting system as it is?

I also have no problem with inventory management and enough space. I was just referring to that there is no need to purchase gather equipment because of realism. Just like our inventory is not realistic.

I'm not a dev, I wrote this topic as I feel it should be. But if you check pretty much any game, all gathering professions are leveling at a much faster rate than the "Main" professions. And well the "Main" professions in ESO are leveling really really fast already.

1. Immersion
2. Much more things to do
3. A fair reason why crafting should be competitive with Endgame. (Right now it's not)

1. Not sure what's more immersive about having extra professions. Maybe they could add some animations when refining. Can't really comment, because immersion was never on the top of my priority list.

2. What actually is there more to do? Maybe add gathering achievements. But actually creating gathering professions will just force people to gather more to level the skill. The current implementation is perfect for most players. If you love gathering, you can gather all day if you want to. If you just want to gather enough to craft a set of armour in every level range you have the possibility.
What you describe, adds nothing substantial to the game.

3. TBH, if you have full crafted gear, fitting your build, upgraded to epic with good enchantments you are fully competitive in endgame. Some of dropped sets are a bit better of course (not all of them!), as it should be IMO.
You won't be excluded out of any endgame content because your gear is "only crafted". (Maybe in the top 0,5% min/maxer speedrun guilds). Of course it should be in line with your build and role.

Beerbill

Despair9 wrote: »

Wizzo91 wrote: »

Despair9 wrote: »

Wizzo91 wrote: »

Adding new recipes, sets, possibilities, combinations is all fine. (They are already doing this to some degree, btw)

But please no "Gathering Professions" that you have to level up by gathering.

I love the crafting system as it is! Actually the best one I've encountered in my MMO history. I never really liked crafting in other games but here I do.

The progression is fluid and you don't have to put a lot of time in it. You just continue to quest and you should have no problem to level up the crafts. What I hated most in other mmos that you had to craft 100 of this and 200 of this between leveling to keep up.

Also this is what gathering professions would come down to. I love picking up mats as a please. I really do not want to be forced into: "You have to gather 300 flowers in zone 1 to progress your profession enough to continue gathering in zone 2".
Or what if I feel like grinding one zone on an alt because I did not like the quests. You want to force me into running around the map and farm low level mats just to level up my gathering profession?

And why add something trivial to the game, where you force people to carry a axe that is worth a couple of gold pieces just to collect wood? Really no reason to do it. (Realism is no reason - 110 slots of bag space anyone?)

Actually gathering professions would level at a much faster rate than other professions (which are leveling very very fast already).

I'd imagine only achievements being that grindy as you've described.

About inventory though, I've leveled 4 professions on my main ever since launch and never had problem with it, you just need to organize yourself and all works well. Also we are getting improvements to it in update 6.

"Would level faster" - how do you know this, are you a dev?

Just give me one valid reason why they should add gathering professions - how would it improve the crafting system as it is?

I also have no problem with inventory management and enough space. I was just referring to that there is no need to purchase gather equipment because of realism. Just like our inventory is not realistic.

I'm not a dev, I wrote this topic as I feel it should be. But if you check pretty much any game, all gathering professions are leveling at a much faster rate than the "Main" professions. And well the "Main" professions in ESO are leveling really really fast already.

1. Immersion
2. More things to do
3. A fair reason why crafting should be competitive with PvE Endgame. (Right now it's not fair, as it's very easy)

Because running trials and doing quests is a fair and hard for PvE endgame rewards? As most people said already the craft system is "fine" as it is.

I agreed it could have some improvements, not aiming to increase its realism, difficulty or make it more complex but, to make it easier to use and allow filtering or preview the itens you are crafting or sort of.

Another awesome addition would be able to craft sets using boss dropped materials. Something like the helms of the undaunted but you could only craft it with materials dropped by bosses like scales, skins or heads

Sord

This isn't every other game, I am glad to see ESO branching out and getting rid or gathering professions. I love crafting gear and being able to sell stuff. I very much dislike how other games, which what you suggest is simply WOW all over again, always have mining for blacksmithing and this system is much simpler and non repetitive or over redundant.

I like the ESO crafting system, I like that I don't have to waste space on a skinning knife or a pick axe or a needle and thread box. I like that they made it so that if you work with metal you know how take a pickaxe to a node and can harvest it. If I forget to pick axe certain material while I am focused on leveling my toon I don't have to go back to a different zone just to relevel my mining skill (waste of time). Sometimes I get caught up in the story line and don't want to deal with worrying about mining. The two skills are hand in hand why make a whole separate skill line (even if you don't spend points) when you pretty much have to do one to do the other?

As a fellow crafter I totally disagree and I don't see how this would add more to the crafting system when you said we won't have to spend more skill points on it, then what is the point if we don't gain something from it, just another inhibiting thing when my time is already limited? I like that I can smelt down old armor and re purpose it, reduce, reuse recycle LOL

LtCrunch

Complexity simply for complexity sake is what this all sounds like to me. It doesn't make it more difficult, but more tedious. The original crafting system was more like other MMOs and it was scrapped during the beta phase due to tester feedback and revamped to what it is now.

The majority don't like the type of empty complexity you propose, that's why crafting in most MMOs is hated or dreaded by most.

That all being said the crafting could use some additions but does not by any means need an overhaul.

Heishi

Despair9 wrote: »

Lord_Kreegan wrote: »

What you suggest is basically to make ESO just like WoW, LotRO, and other games. Why?

While I acknowledge that the crafting system in ESO is simplistic in many ways, it's consistent with the fact that there isn't a global AH. Anything you make is pretty much just for yourself or your alts; not for sale to other players. As such, the ESO crafting system isn't a bunch of professions, it's just an alternative form of obtaining "loot"... and a money sink.

Keeping that in perspective, the crafting system is satisfactory as it is.

If we ever get a global AH, then we're going to need recipes that we get as drops so we can have unique items we can build; we're going to need unique resources that are used for those unique items; etc. Right now our "unique" sets are built using the special locations with crafting stations and the "unique" resources we need are just those built-in perks on gear that we can research. It's a parallel to most crafting implementations, but not really that different.

You can interpret this any way you want. One thing though: how come Skyrim had a more expanded crafting system? I mean you had to smelt ore there didn't you? Yep that's right an RPG and TES game "forced" you to do these "complicated things".

PS: I wrote the reasons above as to why we need to expand this system, which I'm pretty sure is only a matter of time but whatever..

Skyrim also completely dumbed down the attribute/skill system, dumped the "complicated" class system, the whole unarmed line found in previous TES games. Skyrim isn't really the best example of making game mechanics more robust.

I get we're just talking about the crafting system specifically... but really x needs to be more like y is just,eh.

I'm glad they did the system the way they did. Sure it's not as immersive, but I also would rather spend my time out actually going through quest than trying to make sure my mining was high enough to get the resources I needed. The example of being unable to pick the flower was a great one.

Running into the whole "you don't have the skills to gather ____" is more immersion breaking than everything being automated in the back ground. What you mined iron but you see steel and suddenly forget how the pickax works? The flowers in higher level areas are too heavy to pull? Or maybe you forget how to scrape that last bit of meat from a hide even though you did it 300 times before on other hides.

Maybe one day ZOS will implement this. Then on that glorious day we can bash our face against the rock wall forgetting how to use that pickax.

RainfeatherUK

I'm with you Despair, at least some of the way.

Is the current game climate/trend dealing with people who likely have ADD, goldfish concentration span - and about about as much enthusiasm for effort, as a mangled corpse though? You bet. So pitching a case wasnt ever going to be fun.

That said; I also agree with the people that say the solution here doesnt lie in time sinks. The wider game just isnt built that way.

As a non-crafter (but one who accompanies several females who are huge craft enthusiasts), its always been chalk and cheese.

One loves the likes of the systems currently present in FFXIV (which are hugely popular, to the point of having full time crafter players) and another hates it and prefers the simplicity of this game.

From my own perspective looking in on them both, I honestly do think its too simplistic though. Why? Because over time both of them are bored with it. People who enjoy little more than craft, and want to focus on that aspect shouldnt be shut out because of a lack of voice in the area they enjoy. Theres a difference between streamlined and barebones boring.

I'd happily see the system expanded. Making that something that integrates simply with the broader game and systems though, rather than just presenting a time hurdle.

The fishing thing for example, expanding it to connect to the other systems is one thing I think is worth emmulating elsewhere. Rather than add time consuming things we need to add more to the depth and immersion that befits the game style.

Easier said then done, yes. But as someone who doesnt craft personally, yet has seen the smiles of people who do enjoy a good craft system first hand - I think the sentiment of improving what we have (depth wise) is a good one.