DPS Balance in MMO's

Pmarsico9

I got into a solid discussion last night about how DPS potential should work with some guildies on TS and I was interested in what people thought.

The way I see it, melee should always have higher standing DPS than ranged. Why? Because very few mechanics can punish ranged but not melee.

In fact, having played both, I find that the increased uptime of ranged provides higher DPS for me, even when I'm not playing a decent ranged class (my Templar.)

In this game, with very few hardcasted spells and much more reaction time granted to ranged DPSers due to travel time of boss abilities and so forth, I think the matter is exemplified.

For example, in Veteran Wayrest, Malubeth the Scourger has a higher possibility of dropping a red circle on you if you are near somebody else. But if you are ranged this is much less of an issue. The Grand Healing diameter is wide enough to hang at the edge, get heals, and have miles more real estate to get "un-redded" area.

Whereas, as melee, there's essentially no coping with this. The tank and you are always going to be in melee range, so you get plastered with red circles.

You can say it's a flaw with encounter design, but doing anything in my mind beside giving melee a higher standing DPS when they can get in range will ultimately limit encounter design.

This is even worse in PVP, which I personally haven't participated in because getting two-shot by invisible archers repeatedly without any means to react is absolutely horrible..........and yet another example why anybody with a two hander should be able to decapitate those people in one blow, or at the very least, be able to debuff the crap out of them.

Please also note that most evidence shows that ranged are doing more damage in melee range than melee anyway. I am not ignoring that fact, but that's a balance issue, not an issue with the encounters themselves.

What do you think?

ers101284b14_ESO

I see where you are coming from but if your a melee and up that close you should build for survival. If you can take twice as much punishment as a ranged then you should not be able to do the same DPS.

Other games who do the holy trinity but are not skill based can do this with having melee DPS. This game skews it so bad that you have to pick Heal, Damage, Survival. So a melee can build for damage but then the tank better be keeping that hat up.

Hope this made sense if not I will edit it to sound less rambley

Pmarsico9

ers101284b14_ESO wrote: »

I see where you are coming from but if your a melee and up that close you should build for survival. If you can take twice as much punishment as a ranged then you should not be able to do the same DPS.

Other games who do the holy trinity but are not skill based can do this with having melee DPS. This game skews it so bad that you have to pick Heal, Damage, Survival. So a melee can build for damage but then the tank better be keeping that hat up.

Hope this made sense if not I will edit it to sound less rambley

Melee is arguably even more reliant on damage gear than ranged. In fact, it's not arguable.

Kraven

It's been a frequent topic of discussion in the differing TS channels I'm in. Melee atm is punished HARD. Had a guild mate, who has quit playing entirely because he had absolutely no interest in range. He wanted to 2h and DW full on melee and thought that by jousting in and out to avoid certain mechanics he's be on par with other dps. Unfortunately this is not the case, the game itself forces you to have either a bow or a staff for some range damage.

That range damage, at least from staves is superior to melee damage. Even with recent changes and hitting between 12-1500 with DW this doesn't approach the 2-3k numbers of staff builds. Mage builds have no need to joust they have to avoid mechanics sure but they are doing dps the entire time. Bows at range sorely needed the change to snipe, it may be crazy in PvP but prior to the change it was absolutely useless in PvE. Which is why PvX balance should happen separately but that is a whole different subject.

As it is Bows are behind magicka builds in terms of dps, melee is (with the exception of stack and burn fights) behind bows. Even stack and burn on a bosses tail melee moves up to second when it should be in first. It's quite annoying for those of us who have no interest in playing a mage. Haven't enjoyed a mage since EQ necro, and if I'm not enjoying a character what is the point in playing it?

Pmarsico9

I don't think they've gone far enough with stamina based abilities nor have they fixed passive class ability synergy with weapons.

Having just rolled a DK, it's downright mind-boggling how much synergy exists between any weapon or playstyle choice and the class abilities.

My Templar has one ability that works well with stamina: Radiant Aura. Which is a regen buff and not a damage modifier essentially at all.

Yes, Vamp's bane and Spear Shards are used in PVE DPS Stam templar builds, but they have no synergy with their weapon attacks. I guess Power of the Light is supposed to, but it's a DPS loss in essentially every single use.

Jack-0

ers101284b14_ESO wrote: »

I see where you are coming from but if your a melee and up that close you should build for survival. If you can take twice as much punishment as a ranged then you should not be able to do the same DPS.

Not every melee build = tank! If we're building for survival we're not optimised for dps any more! Melee and ranged dps should be on a par for surivability, albeit with different ways to cope with the mechanics. We can't take twice as much punishment as a ranged dps.