Dungeons & Group Content General Slightly decreased the power and health...

Islyn

Said scaled to vet1 and higher so...?

niocwy wrote: »

Whiners won again.

Well I guess I'm left with DSA vet for some challenge. Wait...it was nerfed too.

*sigh*

Yep people in my guild are saying the same - we got some guys on last boss now - so we see.

Islyn

Magdalina wrote: »

It's actually pretty hard even if you follow mechanics. Harder than any other bos in this dungeon(last boss hardmode is a joke, both pre and after 1.5) and most bosses in other dungeons.

*snipped because snipped*

Huh?? What was that about COH?o.O I've done COH "scaled" to vet 12, it seemed just the same as pre-1.5. Challenging without good group coordination, supersmooth once you get that part figured out. We were rather sloppy in our run and only had 3 deaths, 2 of them due to a bug. That's hardmode, too. Oh, not to forget the regular "oh damn he's ALREADY in stage 2?! Guys we need less dps" wipe, of course xD

Yeah agree all the way and with the other parts too: but one thing is true on CoH: There are definitely more rings now on the boss that picks you up and drops you in AOE rings. On the roll out - I felt like I was looking at the Olympics Logo all the time.

So that's a bit more tricksy.

PBpsy

Islyn wrote: »

Magdalina wrote: »

It's actually pretty hard even if you follow mechanics. Harder than any other bos in this dungeon(last boss hardmode is a joke, both pre and after 1.5) and most bosses in other dungeons.

*snipped because snipped*

Huh?? What was that about COH?o.O I've done COH "scaled" to vet 12, it seemed just the same as pre-1.5. Challenging without good group coordination, supersmooth once you get that part figured out. We were rather sloppy in our run and only had 3 deaths, 2 of them due to a bug. That's hardmode, too. Oh, not to forget the regular "oh damn he's ALREADY in stage 2?! Guys we need less dps" wipe, of course xD

Yeah agree all the way and with the other parts too: but one thing is true on CoH: There are definitely more rings now on the boss that picks you up and drops you in AOE rings. On the roll out - I felt like I was looking at the Olympics Logo all the time.

So that's a bit more tricksy.

Hm. It was always one 'ring on each player and one ring just about where you were before he piked you up. A total of 8 ring max if you didn't just go 1/2 dps +heals.

Alphashado

Merrak wrote: »

AhPook_Is_Here wrote: »

Some of the VR14 scaled bosses were a little weird. Hopefully this will help, I'm thinking of the 3rd in spindle with all the adds, the 2nd in BC with the electric blobs, and the last of Black Heart. Usually it wasn't the final boss that was the problem but one of the earlier bosses that scaled oddly.

I have never not been able to finish them before the patch but some of them were harder than the last 4 fights in Vet Arena.

Third boss in Spindle isn't bad if you follow mechanics and use class abilities to combat the mechanics of the fight. One Sorc with Negate, a Templar with Nova, DK with Talons, or a NB with Veil...it's all manageable. But the problem is, a lot of people didn't want to follow mechanics.

Going into a dungeon with a perfect group composition isn't following mechanics. last time I checked, you needed 2 dps, a tank, and a healer.
Nowhere do I recall seeing DK, Templar, Sorc, and NB as the dungeon requirements.

lolo_01b16_ESO

You should be able to do every dungeon with nearly every class combination. There are a few where I personally would need a templar, but I'm sure there are people out there that could do it without.

zaria

Goresnort wrote: »

Dagoth_Rac wrote: »

The first spider add in Vet Spindle (Swarm Mother Nightmare) used to have 16000 health and final spider add (Whisperer Nightmare) had 17000. Now they have 75000 health and 25000 health, respectively. And this is at VR2! And then there are multiple humanoid adds (Big Rabbu Nightmare and Widow Maker Nightmare) with 75000 health. They used to have 4000 health! Not 40,000, 4,000. So boss adds that used to have 41,000 combined health at VR5 now have 250,000 combined health at VR2!

I am sorry, but this is flat out broken. I am sure they wanted to buff Vet Dungeon mobs, but they can't have meant 4000 health adds to jump to 75000. I have no idea if this is what they fixed today, but stop whining about nerfing. The scaling is broken. This is a bug fix, not a buff/nerf issue.

Thank you for your very informative post.

Hmm, if these numbers are correct, then that is rather interesting.

A previously VR 5 boss add encounter with combined mob health of 41K, was with patch 1.5 was 'scaled' down to VR2 with 250k Health total.

Thats a 6x increase in total add HP for beeing 'scaled' down 3 vet ranks.

Would have loved to see a follow up factual thread to this. That would have formed a great basis for discussion and feedback.

- Numbers pre 1.5
- Numbers after 1.5
- Numbers after 1.5.6

Yes, this is interesting. Sounds like an pretty obvious bug to me and I also had the feeling the scaling of veteran dungeons did not work as intended.

Before 1.5 we tried to get the death challenge in BC, requirement was 5 daedrots alive at end not 3 as today and we did not manage, however the dungeon itself was easy, you could die if messing up but not else.
You got speed challenge unless you took breaks.

After 1.5, it became much harder even as VR2 dungeon. Same for other dungeons but BC is easy to compare as its low level and have done it so many times.

I have no problem with them increasing the difficulty in the veteran dungeons as you can also do normal ones scaled up however has not seen any information about this, and still the scaling should make sense, VR2 should be significantly easier than VR12,

killedbyping

Well, it simple to understand how sightly it is.
There are 2 ways to determine the potency of the sightly change.
Does this concern Stamina changes or Rare drop rates ?

Yes - sightly reduced = Greatly reduced / sightly increased = Veeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeery sightly increased (probably didnt even actualy happen or made it to live server from PTS like those Poison Arrow and Cleave damage over time changes which supposed to sightly decrease DoT duration, but sightly increase DoT tick's. That change didnt happen if some1 forgot. They even removed it from PTS patch notes.).

No - sightly reduced = average reduce / sightly increased = Buffed to hell. You probably need a whole raid of 24 people to kill a single mob like you were trying to kill a DragonKnight.

P.S. Does this changes concern Dragon Knight's ?

Yes - sightly reduced - No, you cant reduce DK's power / sightly Insreased - Buffed to hell. Whole Cyrodiil population are now required to group up in order to kill a single DK.

killedbyping

Magdalina wrote: »

Huh?? What was that about COH?o.O I've done COH "scaled" to vet 12, it seemed just the same as pre-1.5. Challenging without good group coordination, supersmooth once you get that part figured out. We were rather sloppy in our run and only had 3 deaths, 2 of them due to a bug. That's hardmode, too. Oh, not to forget the regular "oh damn he's ALREADY in stage 2?! Guys we need less dps" wipe, of course xD
I didn't really watch boss's health, but I'm not sure COH scales at all. It was vet 12 originally, that's as high as they go.

No CoH didnt scaled. It was stated in patch notes that dungeons wont scale above VR12. Also they stated that CoH and CoA wont scale aswell for now (MB they meant that VR rank will be increased once again soon or later).

Merlin13KAGL

zaria wrote: »

Goresnort wrote: »

Dagoth_Rac wrote: »

The first spider add in Vet Spindle (Swarm Mother Nightmare) used to have 16000 health and final spider add (Whisperer Nightmare) had 17000. Now they have 75000 health and 25000 health, respectively. And this is at VR2! And then there are multiple humanoid adds (Big Rabbu Nightmare and Widow Maker Nightmare) with 75000 health. They used to have 4000 health! Not 40,000, 4,000. So boss adds that used to have 41,000 combined health at VR5 now have 250,000 combined health at VR2!

I am sorry, but this is flat out broken. I am sure they wanted to buff Vet Dungeon mobs, but they can't have meant 4000 health adds to jump to 75000. I have no idea if this is what they fixed today, but stop whining about nerfing. The scaling is broken. This is a bug fix, not a buff/nerf issue.

Thank you for your very informative post.

Hmm, if these numbers are correct, then that is rather interesting.

A previously VR 5 boss add encounter with combined mob health of 41K, was with patch 1.5 was 'scaled' down to VR2 with 250k Health total.

Thats a 6x increase in total add HP for beeing 'scaled' down 3 vet ranks.

Would have loved to see a follow up factual thread to this. That would have formed a great basis for discussion and feedback.

- Numbers pre 1.5
- Numbers after 1.5
- Numbers after 1.5.6

Yes, this is interesting. Sounds like an pretty obvious bug to me and I also had the feeling the scaling of veteran dungeons did not work as intended.

Before 1.5 we tried to get the death challenge in BC, requirement was 5 daedrots alive at end not 3 as today and we did not manage, however the dungeon itself was easy, you could die if messing up but not else.
You got speed challenge unless you took breaks.

After 1.5, it became much harder even as VR2 dungeon. Same for other dungeons but BC is easy to compare as its low level and have done it so many times.

I have no problem with them increasing the difficulty in the veteran dungeons as you can also do normal ones scaled up however has not seen any information about this, and still the scaling should make sense, VR2 should be significantly easier than VR12,

@Goresnort, @zaria numbers are accurate, I was there for that particular run, too.

We then discussed it with the VR14 Templar we picked up to do the other daily ('normal' Tempest Island) as he was getting one shot by AoE while standing well outside the red.

This is why I say it's not the same from instance to instance. This was true prior to 1.5, but it was usually, painfully more obvious (Vet EH Twilight summoning about 4x as many mind controllers as normal, for instance).

Now, at least sometimes, the runs feel ok. Other times, I wonder if the numbers you see (HP/Damage/Boss Level) are what is truly server side.

There should be some random aspects to the fights - who gets targeted, etc, but they should be similar enough with the same group, at the same level, with the same gear that the results, whatever they may be, should be repeatable.