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Staff heavy attack

Mumyo
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Heavy attacks from staves are unstoppable atm.
I can't (right click, left click) them. Opponents can simply charge their magicka as often as they want.
Happens since last patch i guess!
  • Natasi
    Natasi
    Speaking from a resto staff perspective, I don't seem to get much magicka back during PvP as compared to PvE when I use Heavy Attack. I feel like I'm just holding down the left mouse button in preparation for something better to do (waiting for someone's health to drop/a stray player to make an easy target so I can switch to my 2H and rush them). Are you losing a lot of health from heavy attacks?

    I don't really see squashing someone's resources as a viable form of PvP domination. For my build, I use both magicka and stamina abilities so if I was OOM I would just switch to stamina abilities until my magicka recovery kicked in. So what's the purpose of this post?
  • Cody
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    Natasi wrote: »
    Speaking from a resto staff perspective, I don't seem to get much magicka back during PvP as compared to PvE when I use Heavy Attack. I feel like I'm just holding down the left mouse button in preparation for something better to do (waiting for someone's health to drop/a stray player to make an easy target so I can switch to my 2H and rush them). Are you losing a lot of health from heavy attacks?

    I don't really see squashing someone's resources as a viable form of PvP domination. For my build, I use both magicka and stamina abilities so if I was OOM I would just switch to stamina abilities until my magicka recovery kicked in. So what's the purpose of this post?

    because if someone uses a resto heavy attack at point blank, they should pay for it.

    its a ranged weapon, not a close up weapon(or should not be)

    at least it does not do a lot of damage
  • Lava_Croft
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    Cody wrote: »
    at least it does not do a lot of damage
    It's the Magicka regeneration that counts. I hope they fix this soon.
    Xuth.
  • Tripwyr
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    Cody wrote: »
    Natasi wrote: »
    Speaking from a resto staff perspective, I don't seem to get much magicka back during PvP as compared to PvE when I use Heavy Attack. I feel like I'm just holding down the left mouse button in preparation for something better to do (waiting for someone's health to drop/a stray player to make an easy target so I can switch to my 2H and rush them). Are you losing a lot of health from heavy attacks?

    I don't really see squashing someone's resources as a viable form of PvP domination. For my build, I use both magicka and stamina abilities so if I was OOM I would just switch to stamina abilities until my magicka recovery kicked in. So what's the purpose of this post?

    because if someone uses a resto heavy attack at point blank, they should pay for it.

    its a ranged weapon, not a close up weapon(or should not be)

    at least it does not do a lot of damage

    Resto heavy attack is interruptable, as is Lightning heavy attack.
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  • Maulkin
    Maulkin
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    Tripwyr wrote: »
    Cody wrote: »
    Natasi wrote: »
    Speaking from a resto staff perspective, I don't seem to get much magicka back during PvP as compared to PvE when I use Heavy Attack. I feel like I'm just holding down the left mouse button in preparation for something better to do (waiting for someone's health to drop/a stray player to make an easy target so I can switch to my 2H and rush them). Are you losing a lot of health from heavy attacks?

    I don't really see squashing someone's resources as a viable form of PvP domination. For my build, I use both magicka and stamina abilities so if I was OOM I would just switch to stamina abilities until my magicka recovery kicked in. So what's the purpose of this post?

    because if someone uses a resto heavy attack at point blank, they should pay for it.

    its a ranged weapon, not a close up weapon(or should not be)

    at least it does not do a lot of damage

    Resto heavy attack is interruptable, as is Lightning heavy attack.

    It wasn't last time I checked. You couldn't bash or crushing shock someone out of it. You could stop them by hard CC'ing them though, like Invasion or Fear
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  • Sypher
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    Tripwyr wrote: »
    Cody wrote: »
    Natasi wrote: »
    Speaking from a resto staff perspective, I don't seem to get much magicka back during PvP as compared to PvE when I use Heavy Attack. I feel like I'm just holding down the left mouse button in preparation for something better to do (waiting for someone's health to drop/a stray player to make an easy target so I can switch to my 2H and rush them). Are you losing a lot of health from heavy attacks?

    I don't really see squashing someone's resources as a viable form of PvP domination. For my build, I use both magicka and stamina abilities so if I was OOM I would just switch to stamina abilities until my magicka recovery kicked in. So what's the purpose of this post?

    because if someone uses a resto heavy attack at point blank, they should pay for it.

    its a ranged weapon, not a close up weapon(or should not be)

    at least it does not do a lot of damage

    Resto heavy attack is interruptable, as is Lightning heavy attack.

    It wasn't last time I checked. You couldn't bash or crushing shock someone out of it. You could stop them by hard CC'ing them though, like Invasion or Fear

    ever since 1.5 all heavy attacks from all weapons are uninterruptable. Bug? I hope.
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  • Cody
    Cody
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    Tripwyr wrote: »
    Cody wrote: »
    Natasi wrote: »
    Speaking from a resto staff perspective, I don't seem to get much magicka back during PvP as compared to PvE when I use Heavy Attack. I feel like I'm just holding down the left mouse button in preparation for something better to do (waiting for someone's health to drop/a stray player to make an easy target so I can switch to my 2H and rush them). Are you losing a lot of health from heavy attacks?

    I don't really see squashing someone's resources as a viable form of PvP domination. For my build, I use both magicka and stamina abilities so if I was OOM I would just switch to stamina abilities until my magicka recovery kicked in. So what's the purpose of this post?

    because if someone uses a resto heavy attack at point blank, they should pay for it.

    its a ranged weapon, not a close up weapon(or should not be)

    at least it does not do a lot of damage

    Resto heavy attack is interruptable, as is Lightning heavy attack.

    not nowadays. i have bashed and venom arrowed countless people using resto heavies on me, only for them to still be hitting me with the resto heavy.

    its why you will see some people going point blank range with their resto staves a lot more often these days; it cant be interrupted anymore for whatever reason it is.

    it needs to be fixed. soon.
    Edited by Cody on November 25, 2014 1:15AM
  • Cody
    Cody
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    Tripwyr wrote: »
    Cody wrote: »
    Natasi wrote: »
    Speaking from a resto staff perspective, I don't seem to get much magicka back during PvP as compared to PvE when I use Heavy Attack. I feel like I'm just holding down the left mouse button in preparation for something better to do (waiting for someone's health to drop/a stray player to make an easy target so I can switch to my 2H and rush them). Are you losing a lot of health from heavy attacks?

    I don't really see squashing someone's resources as a viable form of PvP domination. For my build, I use both magicka and stamina abilities so if I was OOM I would just switch to stamina abilities until my magicka recovery kicked in. So what's the purpose of this post?

    because if someone uses a resto heavy attack at point blank, they should pay for it.

    its a ranged weapon, not a close up weapon(or should not be)

    at least it does not do a lot of damage

    Resto heavy attack is interruptable, as is Lightning heavy attack.

    It wasn't last time I checked. You couldn't bash or crushing shock someone out of it. You could stop them by hard CC'ing them though, like Invasion or Fear

    ever since 1.5 all heavy attacks from all weapons are uninterruptable. Bug? I hope.

    better be a bug. if this is intended, then i will have to make a gigantic flame post on the forums:D
  • Cody
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    Mumyo wrote: »
    I fought a crap Nightblade for hours! Didn't have enough burst to finally kill him. That Noob just spammed heavy attacks and shields! If this is intended i have to say good bye. This is not PvP for me.

    But i guess it's just another game breaking bug they put in.
    Every patch they do i am willing to bet real money that they put in gamebreaking bugs again.
    I'll be rich soon.

    it is pretty lame of a mechanic. i too have encountered this lame crap. this is why this issue needs to be fixed ASAP. a resto staff should not be as powerful in combat as it is now due to its heavies being uninterruptable. Block and casting is bad enough. lol
  • RinaldoGandolphi
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    Destro staffs are supposed to return magicka on heavy attacks, they outright horrible outside of crushing shock and impulse prior to this.

    I have been interrupted when using a lighting staff heavy attack, I pick and choose my times to use it for that reason. The magic return makes them viable, but they restore much less magic in pvp then they do in pve.

    Those who are maintaining shields are using tripots in conjunction and those are 10k a stack and are not cheap. Its a significant investment.

    People are spamming shields because of bows that are hardcore op now. You have 2 choices to counter bows:

    1. You run impentrable armor, radiant magelight, and purge.

    2. You spam staff heavy attacks and stack shields maintain with staff heavy attacks and tripots.

    It is what it is, the fact bow users are complaining when snipe has a 36 meter range which outranges all other skills is kind of ironic.

    Staffs overall don't do much damage on their own...zeni giving them a small mama return on heavy attacks actually made them a decent weapon outside of their 2 skills that are any good in pvp.

    Also remember, when doing channel attacks the staff users movement is hindered big time, there are dusadvantages to it too like anything else. There is two sides of every coin.
    Edited by RinaldoGandolphi on November 26, 2014 3:44AM
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  • Xsorus
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    People were spamming damage shields long before this last patch.
  • RinaldoGandolphi
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    Also as far as I know, one handed, two handed, dual wield, and bow heavy attacks can't be interrupted, if they can be, my crushing shock spam has never done it...why should they be interruptible...they are not abilities with cast times...only abilities that use magic ir stamina with a cast time are interruptible....thats the game working as intended according to the skill and game tutorial descriptions that describe how to use interupt when escaping coldharbor in the tutorial.
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    Sorcerer's - The ONLY class in the game that is punished for using its class defining skill (Bolt Escape)

    "Here in his shrine, that they have forgotten. Here do we toil, that we might remember. By night we reclaim, what by day was stolen. Far from ourselves, he grows ever near to us. Our eyes once were blinded, now through him do we see. Our hands once were idle, now through them does he speak. And when the world shall listen, and when the world shall see, and when the world remembers, that world will cease to be. - Miraak

  • Kromus
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    Cody wrote: »
    it is pretty lame of a mechanic. i too have encountered this lame crap. this is why this issue needs to be fixed ASAP. a resto staff should not be as powerful in combat as it is now due to its heavies being uninterruptable. Block and casting is bad enough. lol

    This is not true. As stated above heavy attacks can still be interrupted, but you made me laugh saying how resto staff heavy attack is overpowered. You even stated in your own post above how it does not do a lot of damage, but in your wisdom its still somehow overpowered...

    "because if someone uses a resto heavy attack at point blank, they should pay for it. its a ranged weapon, not a close up weapon(or should not be)
    at least it does not do a lot of damage"

    It would be overpowered in case it does ton of damage and return two tons of magicka, but neither of those are true. You are saying how its a range weapon at point blank and people should "pay for it" while at the same time you pew pew people with bow in 2 seconds, miles away from it and still dont find anything overpowered in that? lol. On top of that you can clearly see when someone use resto heavy on you and from which direction, and that can't be said for arrows most of the time.

    From OP...
    "Heavy attacks from staves are unstoppable atm.
    I can't (right click, left click) them."

    You are not supposed to break-free from heavy attack. Its not a cc to break free from, its attack and attacks are to be interrupted. To be honest never thought about breaking-free from heavy attacks as I did not find logic in it, but if you were able to do so far than it was a bug that is now fixed. Also, if you interrupt them that don't means you are locking that ability, it can be casted again right away. Its same for heavy attacks from all weapons.





    Edited by Kromus on November 26, 2014 10:31AM
  • Joy_Division
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    Did I read right and see that people are saying the heavy resto attack is "powerful"?
  • ThatHappyCat
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    Kromus wrote: »
    You are not supposed to break-free from heavy attack. Its not a cc to break free from, its attack and attacks are to be interrupted. To be honest never thought about breaking-free from heavy attacks as I did not find logic in it, but if you were able to do so far than it was a bug that is now fixed. Also, if you interrupt them that don't means you are locking that ability, it can be casted again right away. Its same for heavy attacks from all weapons.

    You do know that right click > left click is also the default keybind for bashing right?

  • Insurrektion
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    Tripwyr wrote: »
    Cody wrote: »
    Natasi wrote: »
    Speaking from a resto staff perspective, I don't seem to get much magicka back during PvP as compared to PvE when I use Heavy Attack. I feel like I'm just holding down the left mouse button in preparation for something better to do (waiting for someone's health to drop/a stray player to make an easy target so I can switch to my 2H and rush them). Are you losing a lot of health from heavy attacks?

    I don't really see squashing someone's resources as a viable form of PvP domination. For my build, I use both magicka and stamina abilities so if I was OOM I would just switch to stamina abilities until my magicka recovery kicked in. So what's the purpose of this post?

    because if someone uses a resto heavy attack at point blank, they should pay for it.

    its a ranged weapon, not a close up weapon(or should not be)

    at least it does not do a lot of damage

    Resto heavy attack is interruptable, as is Lightning heavy attack.

    It wasn't last time I checked. You couldn't bash or crushing shock someone out of it. You could stop them by hard CC'ing them though, like Invasion or Fear

    ever since 1.5 all heavy attacks from all weapons are uninterruptable. Bug? I hope.

    yea imo if the lightning staves and resto staves are going to channel and go through armor they should be able to be interruptable to balance out that equation.

    edit: go through block*
    Edited by Insurrektion on November 26, 2014 4:03PM
  • Kromus
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    Kromus wrote: »
    You are not supposed to break-free from heavy attack. Its not a cc to break free from, its attack and attacks are to be interrupted. To be honest never thought about breaking-free from heavy attacks as I did not find logic in it, but if you were able to do so far than it was a bug that is now fixed. Also, if you interrupt them that don't means you are locking that ability, it can be casted again right away. Its same for heavy attacks from all weapons.

    You do know that right click > left click is also the default keybind for bashing right?

    Yes, but from most comments that follow OP I understood they want to do it from range and you can't bash from range. Maybe I understood wrong in that case.
  • Mumyo
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    woodsro wrote: »
    Also as far as I know, one handed, two handed, dual wield, and bow heavy attacks can't be interrupted, if they can be, my crushing shock spam has never done it...why should they be interruptible...they are not abilities with cast times...only abilities that use magic ir stamina with a cast time are interruptible....thats the game working as intended according to the skill and game tutorial descriptions that describe how to use interupt when escaping coldharbor in the tutorial.

    The problem with melee heavy attacks is that u have to be very close to the enemy and they can simply bash it! Staves are way better for heavy attacks than melee heavy attacks.

    Anyway this thread isn't about a comparison! This mess of programming has to be fixed very cast! It destroys pvp at the moment and just opens another gate for the lamers out there! I know had so many fights never ending and most of the time the lame enemy just did that staff story and usually he would have died ages ago!

    @ZENIMAX U HAVE TO CARE ABOUT THE PVPERS THEY ARE A MAJORITY IN THIS GAME AND 90% of them left allready due to "not giving a ***" from ur side!
    BAD BAD WORK HERE!
  • Cody
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    woodsro wrote: »
    Destro staffs are supposed to return magicka on heavy attacks, they outright horrible outside of crushing shock and impulse prior to this.

    I have been interrupted when using a lighting staff heavy attack, I pick and choose my times to use it for that reason. The magic return makes them viable, but they restore much less magic in pvp then they do in pve.

    Those who are maintaining shields are using tripots in conjunction and those are 10k a stack and are not cheap. Its a significant investment.

    People are spamming shields because of bows that are hardcore op now. You have 2 choices to counter bows:

    1. You run impentrable armor, radiant magelight, and purge.

    2. You spam staff heavy attacks and stack shields maintain with staff heavy attacks and tripots.

    It is what it is, the fact bow users are complaining when snipe has a 36 meter range which outranges all other skills is kind of ironic.

    Staffs overall don't do much damage on their own...zeni giving them a small mama return on heavy attacks actually made them a decent weapon outside of their 2 skills that are any good in pvp.

    Also remember, when doing channel attacks the staff users movement is hindered big time, there are dusadvantages to it too like anything else. There is two sides of every coin.
    it has nothing to do with the fact it returns magic.... it has to do with the fact that it can no longer be interrupted, which it should be interruptable.

    a staff is not supposed to be a close range weapon, but now, with uninterruptable heavy attacks, it can be(thankfully not as well as actual melee weapons, but it is still annoying) this new mechanic, intended or not, should not be in the game, as now you can keep up heavy attacka and keep getting magicka returns without risk(unless you get hti by a hard CC) this "mechanic" is inexcusabile, and needs to be fixed ASAP.
  • Cody
    Cody
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    [/quote]
    Kromus wrote: »
    Cody wrote: »
    it is pretty lame of a mechanic. i too have encountered this lame crap. this is why this issue needs to be fixed ASAP. a resto staff should not be as powerful in combat as it is now due to its heavies being uninterruptable. Block and casting is bad enough. lol

    This is not true. As stated above heavy attacks can still be interrupted, but you made me laugh saying how resto staff heavy attack is overpowered. You even stated in your own post above how it does not do a lot of damage, but in your wisdom its still somehow overpowered...

    "because if someone uses a resto heavy attack at point blank, they should pay for it. its a ranged weapon, not a close up weapon(or should not be)
    at least it does not do a lot of damage"

    It would be overpowered in case it does ton of damage and return two tons of magicka, but neither of those are true. You are saying how its a range weapon at point blank and people should "pay for it" while at the same time you pew pew people with bow in 2 seconds, miles away from it and still dont find anything overpowered in that? lol. On top of that you can clearly see when someone use resto heavy on you and from which direction, and that can't be said for arrows most of the time.

    From OP...
    "Heavy attacks from staves are unstoppable atm.
    I can't (right click, left click) them."

    You are not supposed to break-free from heavy attack. Its not a cc to break free from, its attack and attacks are to be interrupted. To be honest never thought about breaking-free from heavy attacks as I did not find logic in it, but if you were able to do so far than it was a bug that is now fixed. Also, if you interrupt them that don't means you are locking that ability, it can be casted again right away. Its same for heavy attacks from all weapons.





    resto heavies CANT be interrupted.... not at all these days; why dont you actually play the PvP and test it before lying on the forums.

    i said they were OP NOT because of the damage.... heck no. but now that they cant be interrupted, someone can keep on getting quick magicka returned via heavies, and can prolong a fight to ridiculous proportions. if they were interrputable, of course it would not be ridiculous. but as it stands, nowadays they are not interruptable.

    and you really think i "pew pew" people miles away in 2 seconds with my bow..... let me tell you, i dont. most people simply CC break my stealth attacks, roll, self heal, and force me to get out my melee weapons. i, in NO way, do "pew pew people miles away in 2 seconds" it is not an OP playstale, it is EASILY beatable, iv done so MANY times. find another way to justify this.
    Edited by Cody on November 26, 2014 8:55PM
  • Mumyo
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    LOL - lets interpret...

    I can't block heavy resto with my flappy spam and I am cry cry...

    interpret again°!

    PvP right now can be heavy attack followed by shield for infinity!
    Have fun killing such opponents.
    I am cry cry due to the issues that u simply cant kill people anymore that know how to spam resto heavy attack and shield as long as they wish. Enemy simply runs out of ressources or does the same which would lead to an infinite fight or u are simply a highburst class and wait for a huge mistake from the enemy.

    Average combat time in 1v1 sitation: forever!

    If thats no reason to be angry....
  • Tavore1138
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    It's a pretty limited group that can & would take that approach, they'd be destroying their own playing experience as well. And TBH if that does start to happen then it is not the heavy attack that is the problem but the prevalence & strength of the various types of shielding and how some of them are able to stack. Right now a heavy resto attack is one of very few things that can reliably damage DK tanks and can't reflected or fully blocked - I suspect that is one reason you are seeing so many people using staffs right now.
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  • Bipolo
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    Interrupting Heavy Resto Attacks was fun and brought some counter-play to PvP. As stated above several times, it has nothing to do with Heavy Attack's damage output. It however means a lot of 1v1's with players using a Restoration Staff and abilities like Harness Magicka > Healing Ward > Mutagen > Blessing of Restoration + Class Abilities can without fear of being interrupted just keep regenerating magicka and recasting these abilities, which results in seemingly endless fights (until someone makes a mistake, etc)

    Being able to interrupt Staff Heavy Attacks was an important part of PvP and should be reintroduced on live. I do agree that making melee Heavy Attacks uninterruptible makes sense, since they after all are melee attacks, forcing you in to melee range (even though i personally thought that doing a Heavy Attack was exciting having a risk vs reward aspect in Melee, risk: Interrupted / reward: Stamina Regen)
    Edited by Bipolo on November 28, 2014 2:31AM
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  • Joy_Division
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    I feel dumber participating in this thread. If you ever see me in Cyrodiil, by all means please use a heavy restoration attack against me. If that is your main "tactic," I can assure you that you won't have to worry about a long fight.
  • Kromus
    Kromus
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    Cody wrote: »
    resto heavies CANT be interrupted.... not at all these days; why dont you actually play the PvP and test it before lying on the forums.

    i said they were OP NOT because of the damage.... heck no. but now that they cant be interrupted, someone can keep on getting quick magicka returned via heavies, and can prolong a fight to ridiculous proportions. if they were interrputable, of course it would not be ridiculous. but as it stands, nowadays they are not interruptable.

    Before accusing someone of lying try to think "out-of-box" a bit, like other people do...
    Wait, what? You have difficulty killing someone who is using a heavy attack?

    I shouldn't have to explain this...

    Heavy attack means:

    1 - they aren't blocking. Knock them on their ass (defense shield does not stop this).

    2 - they aren't using a high damage/CC attack that you have to worry about. your options for attack are too numerous to list.

    3 - they have prioritized resource recovery over defense. an opponent not actively defending is vulnerable to your strongest skills and is easily susceptible to a lethal combo.

    To summarize, in case you still don't understand... if you want to interrupt casting player you can do it in two ways. One is with your own ability that includes interrupt as effect and other is to cc them. If one don't work, other will. When you cc casting enemy you are effectively interrupting them, no? If they have Immovable on them and casting resto heavy, read 2nd and 3rd bullet above again.
    Cody wrote: »
    and you really think i "pew pew" people miles away in 2 seconds with my bow..... let me tell you, i dont. most people simply CC break my stealth attacks, roll, self heal, and force me to get out my melee weapons. i, in NO way, do "pew pew people miles away in 2 seconds" it is not an OP playstale, it is EASILY beatable, iv done so MANY times. find another way to justify this.

    Reading your response I'm more sure you are the "sneaky ganker" archetype of player. What you stated is simply not true. Most people will die from it and only minority from experienced players will act as you stated, thus its not easily beaten for most people as you claim. Throw bugged healing debuff into equation along with horse dismounting time and glitches and you get free kills from safety of shadows.
  • Mumyo
    Mumyo
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Mumyo wrote: »
    LOL - lets interpret...

    I can't block heavy resto with my flappy spam and I am cry cry...

    interpret again°!

    PvP right now can be heavy attack followed by shield for infinity!
    Have fun killing such opponents.
    I am cry cry due to the issues that u simply cant kill people anymore that know how to spam resto heavy attack and shield as long as they wish. Enemy simply runs out of ressources or does the same which would lead to an infinite fight or u are simply a highburst class and wait for a huge mistake from the enemy.

    Average combat time in 1v1 sitation: forever!

    If thats no reason to be angry....

    Wait, what? You have difficulty killing someone who is using a heavy attack?

    I shouldn't have to explain this...

    Heavy attack means:

    1 - they aren't blocking. Knock them on their ass (defense shield does not stop this).

    2 - they aren't using a high damage/CC attack that you have to worry about. your options for attack are too numerous to list.

    3 - they have prioritized resource recovery over defense. an opponent not actively defending is vulnerable to your strongest skills and is easily susceptible to a lethal combo.



    U ever heard of damage mitigation?

    1) U hardcore pro must assume that the enemy stays there not using any mitigation skills or have no protection active during the heavy attack

    2) They dont prepare that u attack them

    3) They dont save any ressources for emergency

    U sir never fought a good enemy and i assume u are simply a talker.

    Are u playing on EU? I hope so. lets meet.
  • Natasi
    Natasi
    So, are people saying they're actually dying from this? I'm confused. Maybe some death recap screenshots with Heavy Attack all over it would help. Otherwise, the idea that not interrupting a heavy staff attack is PvP-breaking is just ludicrous. Stop worrying about what every little mechanic can and can't do and just enjoy the game!
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