Pull the Plug

Nazon_Katts

Just do it. You've promised!

And then utilize the downtime to rework this game into something feasible. The system is flawed from the ground up and then some more... Building upon that pile of inconsistency leads us nowhere. Scrap it and rebuild.

Since release we're facing retention rates lower than 80%. So even in the best scenario, there's just 32% of the initial player base around. Looking at stats from STEAM we haven't gained that many folks thru that venue, to boot they suffered from a way lower retention actually, just about 30%.

While the above is general data, the anecdotal reference is me witnessing folks complaining in low level zones, in mid level zones and end level zones about not having enough people around to successfully build a group for what ever content with.

Wether that's due to population issues or phasing issues, it's killing the game . Or what's left of it. If you don't address and solve these issues, it's only downhill from now on.

Ultimately, it's going to force you to pull the plug or break your word. So rather do it now, while there's a game to salvage and to be rebuilt. Continuing to balance all effort on a flawed based will only do so much worse and never make it far.

AreoHotah

Expect alot of LOLS coming from hard minded fanbois. No matter how big and in your face the problem is, you wont get too much support here sorry l.

Rodario

Where are those percentages coming from?

What is this promise of pulling the plug you speak of?

Cite your sources.

Phinix1

OP: Did you have ANY suggestions to make, or were you just starting a thread for the sole purpose of posting a lot of non-specific gloom and doom?

You know, I think this is why doomsayers have had job security throughout human history. It's like betting on death. If you repeat the same spiel long enough, eventually you'll be right... Unless you're absolutely wrong.

Even a broken clock it right twice a day.

Still, this non-constructive broken record is getting a little tired.

I would suggest you at least put out the minimal effort to state specific grievances, offer specific suggestions, or make some specific argument.

Otherwise its kinda hard to take you seriously.

Gilvoth

the man has a valid point, i agree with him.

Phinix1

Hlaren_shortsheath wrote: »

the man has a valid point, i agree with him.

Where? I looked real hard. It sounds like "blah blah blah stuff is broken, blah blah blah hyperbole parade," but he doesn't exactly say WHY it is broken or suggest anything to fix... whatever that is.

I guess I'm off to look up the definition of "a point."

WraithAzraiel

I'm waiting for a graph to represent all this supposed data.

SHOW ME THE NUMBERS...and then the money!

Gilvoth

lol, c'mon now, seriously, you dont see how broken eso is? seriously?

Phinix1

If it was really all that broken, then it shouldn't be that hard for the OP (or yourself for that matter) to put out the minimal effort required to pick at least one single example.

Seriously, pick one thing that is so broken it would require "plug pulling."

Just seems like unnecessarily hyperbolic forum clutter to me.

david271749

TES "fanboi" here. Still not blind enough to ignore where this game is headed.

Gilvoth

pvp class imbalances in the extreme, basic functions of this game dont work, 40% of the people have left the game and eso bleeds subbs daily, this list goes on and on about problems and imbalances and improper fixes that just keep adding more problems worse with every patch.
the nightblade class especially needs rebuilt from the ground up. the whole game needs rebuilt with new management thats not incompetent.
the list is quite big with the amount of problems in eso, now i do realize it might be salvage-able but, truth is they keep ading more and more problems on top of existing problems that go unfixed and eventually it's going to be too serious to fix, it's almost there right now but in 6 more months? lol
pull the plug guys it's time fix the game, im sory

heyguyslol

Nazon_Katts wrote: »

Just do it. You've promised!

And then utilize the downtime to rework this game into something feasible. The system is flawed from the ground up and then some more... Building upon that pile of inconsistency leads us nowhere. Scrap it and rebuild.

Since release we're facing retention rates lower than 80%. So even in the best scenario, there's just 32% of the initial player base around. Looking at stats from STEAM we haven't gained that many folks thru that venue, to boot they suffered from a way lower retention actually, just about 30%.

While the above is general data, the anecdotal reference is me witnessing folks complaining in low level zones, in mid level zones and end level zones about not having enough people around to successfully build a group for what ever content with.

Wether that's due to population issues or phasing issues, it's killing the game . Or what's left of it. If you don't address and solve these issues, it's only downhill from now on.

Ultimately, it's going to force you to pull the plug or break your word. So rather do it now, while there's a game to salvage and to be rebuilt. Continuing to balance all effort on a flawed based will only do so much worse and never make it far.

I suspect that some rich kid is funding this operation because any other mmo/dev would have alrdy gone free to play by now. Somebody somewhere is forking out the cash to keep this game afloat cuz it certainly isn't coming from subscriptions. I personally dont want eso to go F2P but it certainly isnt worth the sub.

Woenprom

Yeah yeah.
How old "WoW is dying/dead" talkings are?
What is the N1 mmo today?

Phinix1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EjNBzyLqDPM

heyguyslol

AlienDiplomat wrote: »

If it was really all that broken, then it shouldn't be that hard for the OP (or yourself for that matter) to put out the minimal effort required to pick at least one single example.

Seriously, pick one thing that is so broken it would require "plug pulling."

Just seems like unnecessarily hyperbolic forum clutter to me.

1. How about weapon swapping that works.
2. How about being stuck in combat when you are clearly not in combat and are unable to stealth or mount.
3. How about 15 fps when engaging an all out war for a keep.
4. How about game crashing every 30-45 min due to server instability. (FYI, I play many games most of which are all new and none of them crash like eso does).

I could go on and on but whats the point the forum fanboys will still defend zos and this horribly developed game, lol.

Rodario

heyguyslol wrote: »

Nazon_Katts wrote: »

Just do it. You've promised!

And then utilize the downtime to rework this game into something feasible. The system is flawed from the ground up and then some more... Building upon that pile of inconsistency leads us nowhere. Scrap it and rebuild.

Since release we're facing retention rates lower than 80%. So even in the best scenario, there's just 32% of the initial player base around. Looking at stats from STEAM we haven't gained that many folks thru that venue, to boot they suffered from a way lower retention actually, just about 30%.

While the above is general data, the anecdotal reference is me witnessing folks complaining in low level zones, in mid level zones and end level zones about not having enough people around to successfully build a group for what ever content with.

Wether that's due to population issues or phasing issues, it's killing the game . Or what's left of it. If you don't address and solve these issues, it's only downhill from now on.

Ultimately, it's going to force you to pull the plug or break your word. So rather do it now, while there's a game to salvage and to be rebuilt. Continuing to balance all effort on a flawed based will only do so much worse and never make it far.

I suspect that some rich kid is funding this operation because any other mmo/dev would have alrdy gone free to play by now. Somebody somewhere is forking out the cash to keep this game afloat cuz it certainly isn't coming from subscriptions. I personally dont want eso to go F2P but it certainly isnt worth the sub.

I'm not commenting on your opinion, but if they receive money outside of subs, it's coming from Bethesda, not "some rich kid".

Gilvoth

AlienDiplomat wrote: »

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EjNBzyLqDPM

oh, Dont Get me wrong ESO is a awesome mmo and the only mmo i will ever play. period! eso is my favorite and i love it but it's time to be honest here about alot of very serrious problems it has from its core on up. it was definately on the right track when they made 70% of the work like all the characters and land stuff, but you can clearly see where there was a point where someone who has no business in elderscrolls took over and thats where it should not have been put into that persons hands. im sory

WraithAzraiel

Some things can be better, sure. But the game is far from unplayable, in my opinion. I enjoy the hell out of it and so does the guild to which I belong. And I've been playing since beta and for the most part I enjoy it. I did take about a month off after hitting Vet levels because the quests grew repetitive and grind-y, but I came back with renewed vigor.

And I'm not a TES fanboi either, so there's no blind devotion going on here; hell the only TES title I've ever owned was Skyrim and it's additions.

Just because the game doesn't have the reliability of older games doesn't mean it's croaking.

You can't release a finished product in the gaming industry anymore, especially if it's an MMO. You just can't. Your marketing department and the Powers That Be won't allow it because the whining masses demand their shiny new plaything.

And then they b!tch and doomsay when they realize the chuckleheads over at all the other successful and complete MMO's didn't have a hand in helping this particular MMO's release be perfect and finished.

It's a never-ending cycle. Sure we all want quality of life and creature comforts of older, more stable games to be present at launch. But sad to say that's never going to happen. Unless the production company doesn't care about money and is willing to foot the bill in order for their product to be as polished as it possibly could be before launch. But then you run into problems such as loss of interest, or confidence and the game arrives stillborn.

From the other launches I've experienced, this game has been pretty wonderful. It was relatively smooth when compared to older games, especially those that have gone extinct over the past few years.

Until the never-arriving day when all the game companies pool their resources and design games together and release fully finished products with wonderful customer support and new content every 2 weeks and so on and so forth, when that day (which will never come) finally comes. Then, and only then will all the spoiled gamers be happy.

Gilvoth

i spend all my free time in eso also, and as i said earlier i do love eso alot and i wont play any other mmo, but theres some very serious core issues that really need fixed badly.

WraithAzraiel

heyguyslol wrote: »

AlienDiplomat wrote: »

If it was really all that broken, then it shouldn't be that hard for the OP (or yourself for that matter) to put out the minimal effort required to pick at least one single example.

Seriously, pick one thing that is so broken it would require "plug pulling."

Just seems like unnecessarily hyperbolic forum clutter to me.

1. How about weapon swapping that works.
2. How about being stuck in combat when you are clearly not in combat and are unable to stealth or mount.
3. How about 15 fps when engaging an all out war for a keep.
4. How about game crashing every 30-45 min due to server instability. (FYI, I play many games most of which are all new and none of them crash like eso does).

I could go on and on but whats the point the forum fanboys will still defend zos and this horribly developed game, lol.

Those problems gotta be on your end. I've been playing this game on a laptop since Early Access and I've only rarely ever had any of those problems. And the majority of the time, when said problem would crop up - I'd crash, restart the game and continue playing with little to no problems.

So either you're in a country with AWFUL internet or you just have AWFUL luck.

Also, where the hell is this "40%" figure coming from? Is there some sooper-sekrit skwirrel website that has real-time figures of the apparent MASS exodus from ESO that has taken place, that I don't know about? If so, share, mother-trucker!

WraithAzraiel

Patience, my young Padawan. Rome wasn't built in a day. WoW wasn't designed in a day. (Hell, for all I know it could've been, I've personally never touched the thing)

The day will come when ESO has taken root and chugs along smoothly.

It's a child, the game is in it's toddler stages.

Give the damn thing some time to learn how to walk before you sign it up for a marathon.

Gilvoth

you have a valid point and i hope and pray i am definately wrong.

WraithAzraiel

I'm right there with you, brother. Either way, we're riding this game into the ground if need be. One thing's for certain....it'll be a helluva ride!

WraithAzraiel

See that's another thing that's missing from internet gaming in recent years, where the hell is all the gamer nerd solidarity? Instead of getting in pissing matches on the forums we should be positive and encouraging, comiserating in broken stuff.

Or something. I don't know. I'm not gonna lie I enjoy arguing on the internet cuz it's entertaining to me, but at the end of the day, I belong to the same tribe every other gamer does.

The Nerds.

Circuitous

I dunno what I expected from this thread.

ESO's got problems but I enjoy playing it. I'd prefer they not pull the plug until they have something to replace it with.

Maybe that's why the devs are so slow, they're in the background working on a complete rewrite.

Wolfshead

So what Nazon_Katts base all your info and number on how many that have use steam to buy this game wooow just wooow.

So just we don't have like 12 million player ZoS should pull the plug serious good thing with ZoS that the are private own company which mean the don't have anyone force make BIG money and if you don't like the game you can always leave for it is not like anyone hold gun to your head and force you play this game.

Gilvoth

i cant even walk into keep doors, just basic stuff. stuff that is quite serious needs fixed.
look at all these people who have been cheating in eso and have acumulated massive titles and massive leaderboard stats from cheating in pvp yet nothing is ever done about it.
look at the fact that they believe that a nightblade with high speeds was perfectly fine and then they removed it because they some how got the impresion that sneaking Outside of Combat was in need of complete removal when it had no effect on anyone at all in battle in both pve and pvp.
look at the bolt escape and the dragonights skills of extreme overpoweredness and all the very serious problems in cryodiil, lets look at the fact that each new patch brings more problems then we had previously, yet you claim eso does not need the plugg pulled for a serious rework and fixing? there are other mmo's who have done that, they shut down for a few months and rebuilt. no shame in doing that at all. it just needs serious fixes.

Tandor

The worst thing about the game is the way the PvP crowd conned themselves into believing that this was going to be a PvP-centric game. They do it every time. Every new MMO is going to be DAoC 2, and it never is.

It's all too apparent that 99.99% of the complaints about TESO are to do with PvP. The other player's skill is over-powered, my skill doesn't work, we hear those things all the time in PvE MMORPGs with PvP. People don't like dying to another player, nor do they like admitting it was down to their relative lack of ability compared to the other player - it's always the game's fault!

I understand that there are performance issues in Cyrodil, and clearly they will be fixed. What I do note, however, is that when the discussion is about the game's success it's claimed that there's nobody playing, everyone has quit, but when the discussion is about the game's performance it's claimed there are swathes of players being disconnected everywhere you turn.

I'm not for a moment denying that there are some issues with the game, but show me the game that is perfect after several years, let alone one that was perfect at launch. The issues are, in any event, greatly over-stated, and primarily limited to one facet of the gameplay. Compare them to Wildstar, which most players do seem to have left already, and ArcheAge where most players haven't yet had a chance to leave because they're still queuing to get in! TESO plays pretty well compared to other 2014 releases.

What is clear is that there aren't going to be any major changes any time soon, the game is only a few months old and the development team is wisely making small adjustments a step at a time rather than over-reacting to every critical forum post. If someone doesn't like the game on that basis, there are plenty of others to move on to, no point hanging around in a game that isn't providing any enjoyment. However, every time I go into a bank in any of the alliance areas, I'm reminded that an awful lot of people are having fun with the game, myself included.

raglau

I am interested in where the OP gets the retention figures, as I have been looking for them and came to the conclusion they are not published.

Could you link them please?

ErykGrimm

Tandor wrote: »

The worst thing about the game is the way the PvP crowd conned themselves into believing that this was. going to be a PvP-centric game. They do it every time. Every new MMO is going to be DAoC 2, and it never is.

It's all too apparent that 99.99% of the complaints about TESO are to do with PvP. The other player's is over-powered, my skill doesn't work, we hear those things all the time in PvE MMORPGs with PvP. People don't like dying to another player, nor do they like admitting it was down to their relative lack of ability compared to the other player - it's always the game's fault!

I understand that there are performance issues in Cyrodil, and clearly they will be fixed. What I do know, however, is that when the discussion is about the game's success it's claimed that there's nobody playing, everyone has quit, but when the discussion is about the game's performance it's claimed there are swathes of players being disconnected everywhere you turn.

I'm not for a moment denying that there are some issues with the game, but show me the game that is perfect after several years, let alone one that was perfect at launch. The issues are, in any event, greatly over-stated, and primarily limited to one facet of the gameplay.

What is clear is that there aren't going to be any major changes any time soon, the game is only a few months old and the development team is wisely making small adjustments a step at a time rather than over-reacting to every critical forum post. If someone doesn't like the game on that basis, there are plenty of others to move on to, no point hanging around in a game that isn't providing any enjoyment. However, every time I go into a bank in any of the alliance areas, I'm reminded that an awful lot of people are having fun with the game, myself included.

Yea I am sure that only 0.01% of the issues with ESO are not pvp issues. Recurring memory leaks for the client, filthy pvpers. Weapon swapping issues, that was the pvpers oh and bugged sets too, etc. Etc. Also telling people to give up on a game they are obviously passionate about is not is going to do nothing for the health of the game. Don't forget that this game was, in fact, marketed to have epic pvp.

Vahrokh

Tandor wrote: »

The worst thing about the game is the way the PvP crowd conned themselves into believing that this was going to be a PvP-centric game. They do it every time. Every new MMO is going to be DAoC 2, and it never is.

That's because every new MMO wants those PvPer subs so they tease them with: "we hired DAoC PvP maps designer" or "we hired DAoC gameplay team" and so on.

Then people start playing the new "DAoC gold-finger-touched" MMO and discover it's just the umpteenth piece of crap.