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Some advice for Templars and in general. (Includes videos)

Draxuul
Draxuul
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Ok so eversince i`ve joined the forums , some weeks ago, i`ve read many threads regarding Templars and in most cases , those threads were from people who think that Templars are not powerful enough.

So far the only class that i played is Templar and i absolutly love my characters .
I have two characters , one is Vr2 using heavy armor and greatsword. The other one is lvl 43 using 4 light armor and 3 heavy armor and he uses a resto staff as main and destro staff as secondary weapon.

Both are Templars , yet the gameplay is entirely different from one to the other. One is 100% melee, the other is 100% range. Both are very powerful.

Now when i say powerful, i`m not reffering to damage. In fact they are both pretty weak in the DPS departement. But when it comes to survivability, they`re both really hard to take down. They can both solo world bosses of their own lvl as well as Dark Anchors of their own lvls.

So when i see people making threads about how Templars need more of this and need more of that, i can`t help myself but to think that those people are simply unwilling to make sacrifices. In other words, they just want to be strong in every areas and have 0 weaknesses.

Well this wouldn`t be a game if you didn`t have to make choices. There is no doubt in my mind that every single class and every popular builds in the game have weaknesses . The thing is that a well built character , no matter the class, can successfully compensate for those weaknesses if said character is being played in a smart way.

My characters for example , i built them to have strong magicka regen and strong heals. In order to do that i had to sacrifice somewhere so i thouht, ok well i don`t need HP regen at all, as long as i have magicka , i can heal myself and so HP regen is absolutly useless.

I also sacrificed damage by choosing to use abilities that don`t cost too much stamina and or magicka, and i`m using a spell which i can`t remember the name but it boosts both my HP and Stam regen by 80% when cast and 15 % simply for being slotted. So yeah i`m sacrificing a skill slot for that but my HP and Stam regen problem is pretty much covered right there.

Now i also craft my own gear which is something that i absolutly recommend to everyone , no matter your class. It allows you to choose exactly which traits you want as well as which set you wish to wear and will ensure that you`ll always have all 5 pieces of your desired set. If you don`t craft your own gear then you`ll either have to spend countless gold to buy it from other players or if not then you`ll be forced to deal with whatever you find.

And finding 5 pieces of a set can be a real pain . On top of that , chances are that all 5 pieces will be of different lvls. So yeah, again, i highly recommend spending the time to research traits and gathering materials so you can craft the set that you want and that will best complement your build. There are sets for every kinds of builds. It doesn`t matter how you built your character, i promise you , just look around for set crafting stations and once you start making your own gear you`lll never wear a piece you found ever again.

Also you`ll want to focus your gear enchantments on 1 or 2 stats , not all 3. just like everything else about your build, you want to be strong in 1 or 2 areas at most. If you spread your points allover the place you`ll end up being weak allover the place and thats when you`ll come here and make threads about your class needing more of this and more of that.

When it comes to combat, if you don`t use weapon swap, then this is an absolute must learn for you. In fact you should put that on top of your priority list. Start by practicing with easy mobs. And then once you get the hang of it , practice with harder pulls and once you`re a pro, keep swaping weapons in every fights to keep your mind and your fingers sharp even when it`s not necessary to do it . That way you won`t get lazy pressing the same 4 buttons for too long and forgetting which skills are on your second bar .

Plus if you plan to do PvP at some point , if you don`t use weapon swap, you`ll be at a major disadvantage over those who use it . And in that case, you won`t be able to blame your class , the blame will be on your own unwillingess to take advantage of the tools offered to you.

Now back to templars, their major advantage is the fact that they have access to heals without having to sacrifice a weapon slot . That by itself is a huge advantage . It more than makes up for the lack of multitarget CC or their lower DPS. But then again , there are ways to build your templar to become good with DPS, just maybe not as much as a sorc or DK or NB but you can still be good at it and even if you choose to build 100% for DPS, you`ll always have access to some strong heals.

But once again, if your goal is to be strong at everything and have absolutly no weaknesses, then you`ll fail everytime and it doesn`t matter which class you play.

Templars are a powerful class because of their heals and there are many ways to build him to improve magicka regen despite the fact that the class itself doesn`t really offer any passives that boost magicka regen. Heavy armor has a passive that helps, light armor has passives that help . You can use magicka regen on earrings and necklace plus you can use drinks that will boost your magicka regen for 30+ minutes. Plus there are sets of gear that give lots of magicka regen. The set of Magnus to name one. I love that set. And then there is the mundus stone of the Atronach that gives a boost to magicka regen and if you use the Divines trait on all your gear then this boost goes up by 24.5% on all white gear and can keep going up if you upgrade your gear to green or better .

So anyone who claims that their class isn`t strong enough at a certain thing, i only have one thing to say to you. You`re not trying hard enough. This game already offers you countless ways to customize your character`s build. It`s up to you to find the build that suits your needs. Keep working on it , keep trying new things , keep making small changes here and there to see if you improve or not .

Another thing i like to do with both my characters is to test myself by entering group delves and see how far i can get before i die or if i can even finish it . I also like to solo every world bosses that i come across and i also never miss a chance to try to solo a dark anchor when i see that there is no one around.

If i fail then i make a few changes to my build and then i try again. Or i can simply just try a different strategy right away.

But now enough talk . I have two videos i wanna show to prove that Templars are very powerful. One video for each character.

My Vr2 will be soloing an anchor . He does die during the fight but not for the reason that you might think lol. It`s actually rather funny .

My 43 will be fighting many battles in his video. But if you don`t feel like watching the entire video, at least do me the honor of watching the last fight . I promise you that the last fight is more than worth the watch.

Now i would never claim to be the best Templar on the server , but i am one of the good ones . I`m happy with my builds and with the things that they can do. If you`re not happy with your own Templar, i promise you that there is a way you can tweak him to make him suit your playstyle better.

But please, i beg you all, whatever you do , please stop asking Zenimax to give us more of this and that . Because this would simply ruin the game for a hell of a lot of people .

That being said, please enjoy the videos.







I seriously hope that this message will help certain people.

And to be clear, this message does not target people who are happy with their character. This post targets people who are unhappy with their characters and who think that there is no other way for them to improve their build other than to ask Zenimax to do it for them.

Draxuul
Be who you want to be , do what you want to do, play the way you want to play.

The Prophet once said :``There is no perfect choice , there are only other choices. ``

Same goes for your build. There is no perfect build, there are only other builds.

My name is Draxuul and i approve this message .

  • phaneub17_ESO
    phaneub17_ESO
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    The problem is that you're VR2 at most of the time of this posting, when you get to VR12 things get very different. It's not whether or not you are powerful, it's how others perceive you. Some non-healing templars do get into trials, but that is usually from within guilds knowing the player and how well they do. When it comes to the random groups, templars trying for a spot as a DPS in end-game grouping and trials, they almost always get kicked out or not invited at all unless they know the person from past experiences. For the most part it is other people who choose to keep you out of grouping because of the bad experiences they get with templars in general, we have to push a little harder to get the same results.

    One of the problems is that we don't have any passive class magicka recovery as other classes do, this in part makes us weaker in the Staff/LA category which is the primary DPS everyone wants for trials to clear them a fast as possible. We however have no problems in the healing and tanking categories, but those are fewer slots to fill.
  • Draxuul
    Draxuul
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    Like i said, when it comes to magicka recovery, solutions are all over the place. Whether it`s from gear, food, jewelry, mundus stone, traits or enchantements. There are even enchantements for weapons that makes you recover magicka everytime you hit . Only thing is those need to be crafted, unless there is some rare merchant somewhere i don`t know about who sells them.

    Now maybe sorc has a passive that helps with magicka recovery but it`s only fair that they have something we don`t. We have class ability heals and no other class does except for the self only heal of the DK.

    Plus like you said, Templars don`t have any trouble getting in as healers or tanks.
    Plus you say that in some occasions , some groups will allow templars to join as DPS.

    Well from what i`ve heard, sorcs are often being refused as healers. And i`m willing to bet that NB and DK are probably also being refused as healers.

    So why should we as Templars be allowed to join any spots when NB`s DK`s and Sorc`s are being rejected from the very spot where we shine the most ?

    This brings me back to the very point that i`m trying to make people understand . There is no and there should never be a one size fits all.

    You have to make choices and sacrifices . If you wanted to be DPS so much then why choose the class that is known to be mostly healer. Yes this game allows you to choose your own playstyle no matter your class but it doesn`t mean that everyone can be as good at absolutly everything .

    You chose to play Templar but to not be a healer . So you wanted to be a DPS who can heal. Hmmm i can understand the appeal. Yet , like i keep saying , you can`t be good at everything . There is no , one size fits all. At best, you can be decent at a few things or very good at 1 thing , but you can never be the best at everything.

    Just accept it .
    Be who you want to be , do what you want to do, play the way you want to play.

    The Prophet once said :``There is no perfect choice , there are only other choices. ``

    Same goes for your build. There is no perfect build, there are only other builds.

    My name is Draxuul and i approve this message .

  • Tamanous
    Tamanous
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    This is confusing. There are videos showing Templars doing 1400 dps all the while putting out group friendly synergy and healing. They offer extra stam regen, hots and even magicka free heals which increase the dps and utility of other classes and make healing easier on a main healer.

    This makes me wonder: Is this main healer who is being helped greatly by a dps templar just standing around doing nothing when healing isn't demaned? Can they also not pick up the dps. This game is incredibly hybrid friendly yet all I hear is groups playing the game like Wow raids because they evidently can't wrap their head around any other concept.
  • Draxuul
    Draxuul
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    Tamanous wrote: »
    This is confusing. There are videos showing Templars doing 1400 dps all the while putting out group friendly synergy and healing. They offer extra stam regen, hots and even magicka free heals which increase the dps and utility of other classes and make healing easier on a main healer.

    This makes me wonder: Is this main healer who is being helped greatly by a dps templar just standing around doing nothing when healing isn't demaned? Can they also not pick up the dps. This game is incredibly hybrid friendly yet all I hear is groups playing the game like Wow raids because they evidently can't wrap their head around any other concept.

    I agree with you 100%. Now i have not done any trials yet so i cannot say anything for sure in this departement but from what i hear, there are mechanics implemented in the trials that force groups to generate a certain amount of DPS in a certain amount of time . Now if that really is the case, this pretty much goes against anything that was advertised by Zenimax before launch and that is probably due to the fact that all those older MMO veterans have put enough pressure on Zenimax for them to release such content.

    Zenimax are in it for the money , just like all other Devs out there so if the majority demands it then they have no other choice but to offer it to them. Now this is just me trying to understand why they would do something like this . Because everything i heard about this game before i started playing it was that the whole Holy Trinity thing was not necessary in this game . That there wouldn`t be such thing as a tank holding all aggro on him while the healer keeps him alive and all DPS have an easy life spamming and nuking .

    When i heard that i almost had a hard on. Finally a game where you wouldn`t get flammed by the rest of the group if you failed at keeping another player alive. Finaly a game where tanks wouldn`t get flamed for losing aggro on an add resulting in a DPS actually needing to fight. Basically , finally a game where no one gets to be lazy.

    Apparently that was just wishful thinking because that`s not what i`m seeing here . Yes the game is somewhat Hybrid friendly but the player base makes it impossible to play that way and that infuriates me.

    the fact that old MMO vets came here and took over infuriates me . The fact that they are doing here what they did in older MMO`s infuriates me . The fact that as soon as a new MMO is released they will move on to that new MMO and do it all over again , leaving the rest of us in here in a broken world . Broken by them, that infuriates me even more .

    Why would Zenimax even listen to those people is beyond my understanding . Yes they bring in the most money in the short term but in a few years all those players will be playing other games . Yet the Elder Scrolls series fans will remain so Zenimax should stop giving old MMO vets what they want because they`re not here for long either way.

    Anyways , i`m not even sure i will be trying the Trials because it seems to me like that is Major guilds territory. They own the trials and they make the law . That is not what i signed up for and that is not the kind of experience i`m looking for .

    Draxuul
    Be who you want to be , do what you want to do, play the way you want to play.

    The Prophet once said :``There is no perfect choice , there are only other choices. ``

    Same goes for your build. There is no perfect build, there are only other builds.

    My name is Draxuul and i approve this message .

  • bertenburnyb16_ESO
    bertenburnyb16_ESO
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    I have 2 char too,
    a VR12 DK and a VR11,5 Templar
    guess which is awsome damage dealer and tank, and wich one is so-so damage and mainly healer in group content
    Haze Ramoran Dunmer Dragonknight Tank/Dps – Smoked-Da-Herb Saxheel Templar Tank/Healer

    Red Diamond, Protect us 'til the end (EU EP Thorn)
  • Draxuul
    Draxuul
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    I have 2 char too,
    a VR12 DK and a VR11,5 Templar
    guess which is awsome damage dealer and tank, and wich one is so-so damage and mainly healer in group content

    Trying to guess would simply make me look stupid lol. I think it`s pretty obvious . But the fact that your Templar is Vr11 means that you actually enjoy playing him otherwise he wouldn`t be nearly Vr12 .

    Plus the only reason why you mainly heal with your Templar is because thats what other players are looking for when they need a healer.

    If people were more open minded and willing to try something different just to see what happens, i`m sure they`d be surprised .

    Draxuul
    Be who you want to be , do what you want to do, play the way you want to play.

    The Prophet once said :``There is no perfect choice , there are only other choices. ``

    Same goes for your build. There is no perfect build, there are only other builds.

    My name is Draxuul and i approve this message .

  • runagate
    runagate
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    It cannot be overstated nor stated often enough that one can get to VR with absolutely any build, class or race,

    Evidence of what endgame differences there are, which are extremely magnified in situations like trials, theorycrafted min/max builds and especially PVP, are two entirely, is an entirely different matter and for the most part the people who claim "everything is ok" are only conversant with the limited content they prefer (which is fine, but it does not mean a thing in the overall scheme of things), and their arguments are typically absurd - but they couldn't possibly know this til they come to the forums and encounter others who have embarrassingly extensive experience with the entire game.

    I could get to VR 2 using literally no weapon, just bare hands, and mage's guild and fighter's guild abilities (barring the first couple levels where you don't have access to them yet).

    There is nothing whatsoever incorrect in the OP's impressions, there's just a LOT more going on at VR 12 where everyone finally has access to legendaries, crazy set combinations, etc. I recently rerolled 2 characters whose equipment handed down from my main, with 8 traits in most things and friends with everything else I could ever need, could basically eviscerate a naturally-grown solo player's character like tissue paper, and that has precisely nothing to do with my gaming abilities... which is much what VR 12 is like, sad to say. FOTMs absolutely rule (or at least I genuinely hope not such a large percentage of people lust after a vampire's sparkle).

    In PvP, in fact, the only thing that really, truly disconcerts me is seeing things that no one that "knows what they're doing" (read: uses what works and avoids the things we've all sadly had to abandon due to being absurdly unballanced) - werewolves in a Keep (I always, always think first, WTF is this mob doing in here!?!? until I realize it must be one of the 4 players who haven't cured their malady) or spell effects you just never see, like Daedric Mines or that sparkly orange-yellow star-glow debuff.

    Strangely, the only class that can hit me first and put me on the ground and kill me before I get to do a single thing in response is templars, but that's because I play a NB and once a certain combo of abilities begins and glitches there's no counter. Even stun-locking DKs are survivable after the CC-immunity patch. But like NBs, templars have an extremely limited amount of time to do their thing or a NB will out-DPS them except in certain limited situations of min/maxed builds/set gear combos - again, having very little input from player skill unless one of the other is ignorant or just terrible... and that's the dirty secret of ESO. Regardless of what the less experienced believe from their limited point of view, or the epeen of FOTM OP build-users, there is a very strict hierarchy of what is most powerful and skill contributes far, far too little into it except in some very rare cases (for instance Ak'Nur, someone everyone should see fight to know what an enemy with true creativity and skill is like).
  • Mantic0r3
    Mantic0r3
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    Tamanous wrote: »
    This is confusing. There are videos showing Templars doing 1400 dps all the while putting out group friendly synergy and healing. They offer extra stam regen, hots and even magicka free heals which increase the dps and utility of other classes and make healing easier on a main healer.

    This makes me wonder: Is this main healer who is being helped greatly by a dps templar just standing around doing nothing when healing isn't demaned? Can they also not pick up the dps. This game is incredibly hybrid friendly yet all I hear is groups playing the game like Wow raids because they evidently can't wrap their head around any other concept.

    plz link those vids or send per pm
  • timidobserver
    timidobserver
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    It is always awesome when a VR2 thinks they have mastered the class. I read this thread as "I am VR2 and I've mastered soloing pve mobs that have been nerfed into the dirt so hard that anything should be able to solo them blind, therefore Templar are fine"
    Edited by timidobserver on September 9, 2014 12:46AM
    V16 Uriel Stormblessed EP Magicka Templar(main)
    V16 Derelict Vagabond EP Stamina DK
    V16 Redacted Ep Stam Sorc
    V16 Insolent EP Magicka Sorc(retired)
    V16 Jed I Nyte EP Stamina NB(retired)

  • Draxuul
    Draxuul
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    It is always awesome when a VR2 thinks they have mastered the class. I read this thread as "I am VR2 and I've mastered soloing pve mobs that have been nerfed into the dirt so hard that anything should be able to solo them blind, therefore Templar are fine"

    So according to you , the only aspect of the game that matters is the end game ?
    In my opinion, world bosses should not be soloable , Molag Bal should be hard as hell as well as Mannimarco and pretty much any of the strong quest bosses , Public group delves should not be soloable either .

    So yeah the fact that i'm able to solo world bosses and group delves with my Templar means that Templars are already more powerful then they should be .

    But if you want to claim that the end game is the only aspect of the game that matters then i'll just say this .

    No matter how many complaints there are now from players who have been rejected from groups for trials , there are others who have been to trials and claim that they have done fine , with any classes.

    Plus Templars are badass in pvp .

    I may only be V3 at the moment and maybe i haven't mastered the class as you say . But Veteran is Veteran , the only thing that changes from that point on is gear and enchantements. I love both my templar characters now and i know i will love them just as much at V12.

    And if Trials really are hard for themplars then all the better , i've been waiting for some challenge everysince i started this character.

    Draxuul
    Be who you want to be , do what you want to do, play the way you want to play.

    The Prophet once said :``There is no perfect choice , there are only other choices. ``

    Same goes for your build. There is no perfect build, there are only other builds.

    My name is Draxuul and i approve this message .

  • eliisra
    eliisra
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    Draxuul wrote: »

    So according to you , the only aspect of the game that matters is the end game ?
    In my opinion, world bosses should not be soloable , Molag Bal should be hard as hell as well as Mannimarco and pretty much any of the strong quest bosses , Public group delves should not be soloable either .

    So yeah the fact that i'm able to solo world bosses and group delves with my Templar means that Templars are already more powerful then they should be.

    Neither of the things listed here are "hard as hell". It's rather so ridiculously easy, that guides and advices aren't needed. All VR content have been nerfed to the ground. Molag-Bal can be done naked. You can complete 90% of all landscape content solo (including public group dungeons, Anchors and World Bosses) using any class and any build.

    It's not your Templar that's god-mode. It's solo PvE content not fighting back any more. You just sort of plough through it. All classes are to powerful solo v.s. current NPC's.

    I do encourage and enjoy reading class advices and guides, but please try harder, come back when you learned more. Try to be competitive in PvP, do some 1v1 and show your Templar powers. Or write an in-depth guide over Templar dps or tanking in endgame PvE. I would love to read and see that. But no one (besides a total beginner) needs to learn how to drop weaksauce NPC's.
  • timidobserver
    timidobserver
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    Draxuul wrote: »
    It is always awesome when a VR2 thinks they have mastered the class. I read this thread as "I am VR2 and I've mastered soloing pve mobs that have been nerfed into the dirt so hard that anything should be able to solo them blind, therefore Templar are fine"

    So according to you , the only aspect of the game that matters is the end game ?
    In my opinion, world bosses should not be soloable , Molag Bal should be hard as hell as well as Mannimarco and pretty much any of the strong quest bosses , Public group delves should not be soloable either .

    So yeah the fact that i'm able to solo world bosses and group delves with my Templar means that Templars are already more powerful then they should be .

    But if you want to claim that the end game is the only aspect of the game that matters then i'll just say this .

    No matter how many complaints there are now from players who have been rejected from groups for trials , there are others who have been to trials and claim that they have done fine , with any classes.

    Plus Templars are badass in pvp .

    I may only be V3 at the moment and maybe i haven't mastered the class as you say . But Veteran is Veteran , the only thing that changes from that point on is gear and enchantements. I love both my templar characters now and i know i will love them just as much at V12.

    And if Trials really are hard for themplars then all the better , i've been waiting for some challenge everysince i started this character.

    Draxuul

    Nope, your post came off as referring to the Templar as a whole throughout all content not Templar in regard to VR3/VR2 content.
    V16 Uriel Stormblessed EP Magicka Templar(main)
    V16 Derelict Vagabond EP Stamina DK
    V16 Redacted Ep Stam Sorc
    V16 Insolent EP Magicka Sorc(retired)
    V16 Jed I Nyte EP Stamina NB(retired)

  • Draxuul
    Draxuul
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    eliisra wrote: »
    Draxuul wrote: »

    So according to you , the only aspect of the game that matters is the end game ?
    In my opinion, world bosses should not be soloable , Molag Bal should be hard as hell as well as Mannimarco and pretty much any of the strong quest bosses , Public group delves should not be soloable either .

    So yeah the fact that i'm able to solo world bosses and group delves with my Templar means that Templars are already more powerful then they should be.

    Neither of the things listed here are "hard as hell". It's rather so ridiculously easy, that guides and advices aren't needed. All VR content have been nerfed to the ground. Molag-Bal can be done naked. You can complete 90% of all landscape content solo (including public group dungeons, Anchors and World Bosses) using any class and any build.

    It's not your Templar that's god-mode. It's solo PvE content not fighting back any more. You just sort of plough through it. All classes are to powerful solo v.s. current NPC's.

    I do encourage and enjoy reading class advices and guides, but please try harder, come back when you learned more. Try to be competitive in PvP, do some 1v1 and show your Templar powers. Or write an in-depth guide over Templar dps or tanking in endgame PvE. I would love to read and see that. But no one (besides a total beginner) needs to learn how to drop weaksauce NPC's.

    Only reason i created this thread is because of all the complaints i was seeing on Templars over the few days before i posted this.

    So many people were complaining that Templars need more of this and more of that .

    From what i understand , you're on the same side i am here . The game is too easy and Templars are fine as is and don't need more power than they already have.

    No point in you and i arguing over this any longer .

    Draxuul
    Be who you want to be , do what you want to do, play the way you want to play.

    The Prophet once said :``There is no perfect choice , there are only other choices. ``

    Same goes for your build. There is no perfect build, there are only other builds.

    My name is Draxuul and i approve this message .

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