PvP Stalemate - NB vs. DK

reften

Anyone else have this?

My V12 NB ran into a V12 DK in Wabba...nobody else was around. The duel begins.

DK just holds block up.
I measure him up...roll past him, try to get him from behind.

Blocks blocks...

He waits for me to burn through my resources...to which I keep enough to turn invisible, and stealth/hide, and recover all my resources.

Rinse and repeat...until 3 reds come along and wipe in out while I'm hiding.

Anyone else have this? We could have done that for hours till someone changed their tactic, and died.

Any advice on tactics for a NB to drop this DK in a 1 on 1?

(As an aside, dam shield block has WAAAAY to large of a range. Got him from the "side" a few times, but it was still blocked.

pitdemon_ESO

Block is 360' man, there is no 'getting him from behind'. You're going to need an anytime CC on your bars for dealing with blocking. Fear works great for this.

Currently you can weave light or channeled abilities to destroy your opponents stam. I'd look at flurry, haste, or blood craze + siphoned attacks to accomplish this.

p.s. - Unless he's terrible he's going to be hurting you pretty bad while blocking, any instant cast ability can fire while maintaining block.

The whole block mechanic needs to be reworked but I don't see it happening anytime soon.

SBR_QuorTek

Think it is a funny situation lol.. but it also show that classes between each other can be real challenging.. love those moments, they are rare...

Armitas

Does flurry (6 hit attack) consume the stamina of the blocker 6 times or once?

pitdemon_ESO

SBR_QuorTek wrote: »

Think it is a funny situation lol.. but it also show that classes between each other can be real challenging.. love those moments, they are rare...

Honestly, anyone can pull out a shield and spam insta-cast abilities or defensive abilities and scare away most NB's.

Speaking as a solo Nightblade, the real enemy isn't whatever poor schmoe you decided to kill - it's time. Not only do you have to kill your target, you need to do it within a 10-15 second timeframe before one of their buddies happens along and turns it into a 1v2 or worse real quick.


Speaking frankly, I became good at picking my fights or avoiding them altogether a long time before I got good at actually winning them.

It goes without saying a decent Nightblade isn't just good at killing things, he's also good at being a slippery *** and disappearing in plain sight when things don't go your way.

reften

yeah learning that real quick.

pitdemon_ESO wrote: »

SBR_QuorTek wrote: »

Think it is a funny situation lol.. but it also show that classes between each other can be real challenging.. love those moments, they are rare...

It goes without saying a decent Nightblade isn't just good at killing things, he's also good at being a slippery *** and disappearing in plain sight when things don't go your way.

Agree 100%. Recent V12NB, haven't done much PvP beyond joining large raid parties till now...now I'm exclusive in PvP, darn good at surviving, but need to work on taking foes down quick, or just avoiding them all together to fight another day.

Jaxom

I find the only way I can 1v1 a DK as a NB is to have Mass Hysteria on my bar (fear). It works through block and will burn through their stamina if they keep breaking it. The strategy will not be as good once 1.3 comes due to the cc changes.

crowfl56

Ahhh isn't that the main skill of a NB, kill quick or when fight goes bad disappear, and that's in any game.

Thechemicals

A nightblade trying to hide from magelight is the real funnies.

Pchela

Thechemicals wrote: »

A nightblade trying to hide from magelight is the real funnies.

or a NB using the magelight to find the other NBs...

TheBucket

Yeah, It happen to me against a DK VR12 named Volkare or something in Wabba the other day. Every time I would fight him, he would just hold block and wait for help to arrive. We never could kill each other till I decided I was done screwing around and left.

I'm only VR8 though.

TheBucket

Thechemicals wrote: »

A nightblade trying to hide from magelight is the real funnies.

What is real funny when you think Magelight makes you safe

TheBull

Been there done that... As a NB you will not kill a DK unless you can heal or you get a 3-4 crit opener, even then he might Dragon Blood to full health.

I've seen a DK literally stand there, let the Night Blade dmg him to 20% and then Dragon Blood to full health over and over. This went on for about 30 secs until the DKs group put the poor guy out his misery.

who the hell thought it would be a good idea to give ONE class an instant self heal that can be spammed to full health...

edit- Now im pissed! (not really but yeah) NBs invis should provide a heal overtime while invis!!

pitdemon_ESO

Armitas wrote: »

Does flurry (6 hit attack) consume the stamina of the blocker 6 times or once?

Flurry is weird in that it sometimes counts as 6 different attacks, and sometimes it counts as one. For instance Haste doesn't make the duration shorter, nor does the bonus from Rapid Strikes, but if someone pops a cooldown mid-channel or starts blocking you will definitely get differing damage output.

I 'think' Rapid Strikes consumes the stam based per hit based on my personal observations, but would love to test it.
(I can't remember the amount of times I've hit (usually a sorc) with 2x Flurries and made them put down their shield)


Also, Blinding Strikes > Heavy Attack (knockdown proc) > Killer's Blade combo is absolutely phenomenal for putting down DK's and Templars who are cycling self heals and on that last 30-40% life before the execute.

FYI, Flying blade is superior in the DPS department and should be used instead of Flurry while duoing, but the sustainability and CC that Flurry/Blinding Strikes offers is too good for me to pass up while ganking solo.

I guess I'll step off of my soapbox now and let someone else have another crack at it

pitdemon_ESO

TheBucket wrote: »

Thechemicals wrote: »

A nightblade trying to hide from magelight is the real funnies.

What is real funny when you think Magelight makes you safe

It's like the camper bumbling through a dark forest in a monster movie, holding a flashlight and screaming "John. IS THAT YOU? I'm getting SCARED!" at the top of her lungs.

All it does is advertise that you have low armor and 5% less magicka to Bolt Escape away with.

-okay now I'm done lol

Samadhi

TheBucket wrote: »

Thechemicals wrote: »

A nightblade trying to hide from magelight is the real funnies.

What is real funny when you think Magelight makes you safe

No, what's really funny is when another Nightblade runs with invisibility
and I pop a Detection potion and see them as clearly as I see myself when I use Cloak.

Samadhi

pitdemon_ESO wrote: »

Armitas wrote: »

Does flurry (6 hit attack) consume the stamina of the blocker 6 times or once?

Flurry is weird in that it sometimes counts as 6 different attacks, and sometimes it counts as one. For instance Haste doesn't make the duration shorter, nor does the bonus from Rapid Strikes, ...

Haste and Rapid Strikes increase the speed of regular attacks made by clicking the left mouse button.
They do not provide bonus to skill casting speeds.

Thechemicals

TheBucket wrote: »

Thechemicals wrote: »

A nightblade trying to hide from magelight is the real funnies.

What is real funny when you think Magelight makes you safe

Magelight is for making sure you dont run away. My Blazing shield+cleansing ritual is what keeps me safe. Night blades have never given me a problem, except i guess for the ones pot shotting me with a bow from the top of a keep behind an npc with a healer healing him.

However, i have been wrecked by a NB while on my horse. Kudos.

TheBucket

Thechemicals wrote: »

TheBucket wrote: »

Thechemicals wrote: »

A nightblade trying to hide from magelight is the real funnies.

What is real funny when you think Magelight makes you safe

Magelight is for making sure you dont run away. My Blazing shield+cleansing ritual is what keeps me safe. Night blades have never given me a problem, except i guess for the ones pot shotting me with a bow from the top of a keep behind an npc with a healer healing him.

However, i have been wrecked by a NB while on my horse. Kudos.

Pfft. Still wouldn't catch me. Although, I never run from a 1v1. Sparks keeps any Blazing shield spammer at bay, and the only reason it's on my second bar.

frwinters_ESO

TheBucket wrote: »

Thechemicals wrote: »

A nightblade trying to hide from magelight is the real funnies.

What is real funny when you think Magelight makes you safe

I wear all medium armor and a khajit NB and there are many times people with magelight come very close to me and still do not see me. If you build for stealth you can get around magelight and potions.

Halrloprillalar

Why do you think everyone hates DKs... except DKs?

Honfold

I have taken out DKs alot. I am a stamina based melee NB with dual daggers. Flurry doesn't cost much and I have enough resources to hammer down a DK. As for a self heal, Drain Essence from the Vamp tree is what I use. It works really well in those fights.

Docmandu

Thechemicals wrote: »

A nightblade trying to hide from magelight is the real funnies.

Add in detection potions for added laughs!

LunaRae

This situation happens to me all the time. I only ever attempt to 1v1 dk (vr12) if I can initiate and dismount them from their horse. Sometimes I get enough burst to kill before they get up and heal / throw up block. If they do I just go invis and walk away, stalemates are boring.

Xsorus

Heated Blade the DK, spam light attacks or flurry to drop stamina.... Keep doing it till ya remove all his stamina, then kill him.

In fact this pretty standard for every single block class except for the Templar who'll just blazing shield you if ya try it.

Cody

happened to me quite a bit. I either just flee, or I will keep away from him, and fire some arrows at him/her every now and then. at some point, either MY allies will come, and we will steamroll him/her, Or the DKs allies will come, and they will steamroll me. one of the two. don't try hitting em from behind, block is full circle, every direction will be blocked. they do need to change it. it is pretty ridiculous that you can block something, when your shield is not actually blocking it

runagate

Notice how everyone just says, "NBs don't give me a problem"?

Covenant medium armor and covenant two-handed sword and rings + sneak set bonus armor at least gives me an odd and unexpected edge that shield-blocking tanks (who nevertheless out DPS NBs) as the light attacks I do to get magicka back (leeching strikes, still necessary despite the awful nerf) while trying to beat the clock before they can self-heal all the way back up yet again (in the case of DKs mostly; templars often make the mistake of using blazing shield) works about 1/3 of the time, which is the best NBs can expect. Trickery as opposed to OP skills. Not much of a tradeoff.

Whereas magicka regen-based builds can use Drain Essence which I rarely use due to the cost/benefit ration but is one of the only ranged NB abilities and almost no one ever counters, and seemingly sometimes don't even notice.

Timing magicka regen with one's Teleport Stikes can be very effective, as well. Our lowly CC ability just feels silly when doing it right in their face, and gets one in trouble in PvP just as often as it helps (missing the targeted player in the chaos of battle and flying off a balcony and into the oil farm, or falling off a cliff with a suicidal sorc's blink, using the last of your magicka to hit a freaking RAT way across the room from the fight that you could seemingly not intentionally target from so far away had you been trying to on purpose).

Course, teleport strike + rapid maneuvers + refreshing path is great at catching blinking sorcs who think they'll get away to put down an FC.

ecitraffic_ESO

A lot of interesting info here. I am VR5 vamp NB. Yesterday I had this exact scenario with a VR6 DK. We battled for what seemed like 2-3mins, before I lagged out and died. Might have to swap something for the fear (sparks) ability. Cause the block is tough to trick.

TheBucket

xsorusb14_ESO wrote: »

Heated Blade the DK, spam light attacks or flurry to drop stamina.... Keep doing it till ya remove all his stamina, then kill him.

In fact this pretty standard for every single block class except for the Templar who'll just blazing shield you if ya try it.

Flying dagger ftw for those pesky shields

timidobserver

NBs definitely have an issue with DKs. I once saw a really high ranked NB completely wreck a pretty good DK. Literally my DK bud was dead before the animation on my heal went through. I really want to know precisely what he did to make it happen, but I've only ever seen something like that happen once. Usually it goes as the OP describes.

Varicite

TheBull wrote: »

Been there done that... As a NB you will not kill a DK unless you can heal or you get a 3-4 crit opener, even then he might Dragon Blood to full health.

I've seen a DK literally stand there, let the Night Blade dmg him to 20% and then Dragon Blood to full health over and over. This went on for about 30 secs until the DKs group put the poor guy out his misery.

who the hell thought it would be a good idea to give ONE class an instant self heal that can be spammed to full health...

edit- Now im pissed! (not really but yeah) NBs invis should provide a heal overtime while invis!!

Hmm, if only a NB had some kind of tool to gut the DK's healing.... They could call it something cool like.. Death Stroke. Or maybe Incapacitating Strike. Just a thought. : P

As for the OP, I like to deal w/ blocking DKs by fearing them through Mass Hysteria or dropping my shades and watching them eat his stamina bar up.

When he gets to around 35%, I fear him, Ambush in and hit him w/ Incap Strike and go to town w/ LA / Funnel Health or LA / Impale, depending on where his health is.

This generally does the trick against most DKs.

Dragon's Blood is not really anything to fear if you're running Incap Strike on your NB. The DK will usually just die w/out any magicka left. It's not like they can do anything to escape, lol.