Fixing the armor lines

Lynx7386

Despite the changes that have happened recently, I'm sure many will still agree that there are massive discrepancies in the effectiveness of each armor type. Light armor is still, overall, the best option due to the fact that out of 30 combat-oriented skill lines in the game, only 9 of them - less than one third - use stamina, and among those many of the abilities still dont even scale with stamina (but rather spellpower). Medium armor is in a better spot not for stamina builds, but still not optimal. Heavy armor, as always, is at the bottom of the totem pole for every role.

It's clear that these three armor types were designed to each correlate to a specific resource pool. Light armor works with magicka, Medium armor works with stamina, and Heavy armor works with health. That setup works well, but the abilities need to reflect that link a bit more I think. Below are my proposed changes to improve that:

Generic Changes:

Crowd Control Breakout Now costs magicka, rather than stamina.
Magelight, Inner Light, and Radiant Magelight no longer provide spell critical (More explained under light armor below)



Light Armor

Active Ability: Annulment / Dampen Magic / Harness Magicka
This ability may now only be used when a minimum of 4 light armor pieces are equipped.

Evocation
Reduces the magicka cost of spells by 1%/2%/3% per piece of light armor equipped.
(No Change)

Recovery
Increases magicka recovery rate by 2%/4% per piece of light armor equipped.
(No Change)

Spell Warding -> Changes to -> Spell Weaving
Increases spell critical strike chance by 1/2/3% per piece of light armor equipped.
(Note: Along with this change, the spell critical strike chance bonus would be removed from magelight/inner light, and replaced with something different.)

Prodigy
Your spells ignore 15/30% of the target's spell resistance while at least 5 pieces of light armor are equiped.
(No longer provides critical, as that is now covered under spell weaving. Instead provides spell penetration.)

Concentration
Reduces the magicka cost of breakout by 2%/4% per piece of light armor equipped.
(With breakout now being magicka based, this is the answer to reducing it's cost - up to 28% reduction with this passive and 7/7 light armor.)



Medium Armor

Active Ability: Evasion / Shuffle / Elude
This ability may now only be used when a minimum of 4 medium armor pieces are equipped.

(New) Evasion:
Costs stamina
For 20 seconds, you gain increased stealth movement speed, become harder to detect while sneaking, and use no stamina while sneaking.
(This change is to compensate for the passive changes below, which remove the stealth bonuses medium armor currently has).

(New) Shuffle:
Costs Stamina
For 20 seconds, you gain increased stealth movement speed, become harder to detect while sneaking, and use no stamina while sneaking. While active, removes one snare or immobilizing effect every 2 seconds.

(New) Elude:
Costs Stamina
For 20 seconds, you gain increased stealth movement speed, become harder to detect while sneaking, and use no stamina while sneaking. When activated, you immediately enter stealth mode, but your damage and healing are reduced by 75% for 4 seconds.
(Overall I think these changes would be more useful than the current dodge chance bonus that the medium armor active provides. These still serve a defensive purpose, but can also be used offensively just as annulment and immovable can be.)

Deterity
Reduces the stamina cost of abilities by 1%/2%/3% per piece of medium armor equipped.
(Now matches up with light armor passives. Combined with the reduced feat cost in the weapon skill trees, this cost reduction should nearly cancel out the additional stamina used by melee combatants when dodging/blocking/interrupting, and allow stamina abilities to be used more frequently in order to match up to the safer playstyle of a magicka build.)

Wind Walker
Increases stamina recovery rate by 2%/4% per piece of medium armor equipped.
(Now matches up with light armor passives)

Improved Sneak -> Changes to -> Precision
Increases weapon critical chance by 1/2/3% per piece of medium armor equipped.
(Now matches up with light armor passives)

Agility
Your attacks ignore 15/30% of the target's armor while at least 5 peices of medium armor are equipped.
(Matches up to light armor passives, provides melee combatants with armor penetration to increase weapon damage).

Athletics
Increases sprint move speed and decreases the stamina cost of roll dodge by 2/4% per piece of medium armor equipped.
(No real change, but now in line with light armor passives)



Heavy Armor

Active Ability: Immovable / Immovable Brute / Unstoppable
This ability can now only be used when a minimum of 4 heavy armor pieces are equipped.

Resolve
Reduces all damage taken by 1%/2%/3% per piece of heavy armor equipped.
(Essentially this does the same for the health pool that the medium and light armor passives do for stamina and magicka - reduces the 'cost' of the pool. This also makes heavy armor -much- more tanky, past the minimal improvement in armor value it currently has.)

Constitution
Increases health recovery rate by 2%/4% per piece of heavy armor equipped.
(No Change, but this is now in line with the other armor types for the health pool.)

Juggernaut
Reduces your chance to be critically hit by 1%/2%/3% per piece of heavy armor equipped.
(Essentially this is doing the opposite of the medium/light armor passives. Rather than increasing critical chance, it makes you more resistant to criticals.)

Bracing -> Changes to -> Brute Strength
Increases your weapon and spell damage by 15/30% while at least 5 pieces of heavy armor are equipped.
(While medium and light armor wind up being critical-based for their damage, heavy armor gives raw power, and it needs to give a substantial amount since you're giving up resource regeneration and armor/spell penetration for it.)

Rapid Mending -> Changes to -> Bracing
Reduces the cost of blocking by 2%/4% per piece of heavy armor equipped.
(Replacing the bracing ability from before, this will now give higher block cost reduction, up to 28% (vs the current 10%). This should make blocking almost resource-free when combined with all of the 1h/shield passives.)



So now we've got 3 armor types that correspond directly to 3 resource pools and 3 different styles of play. If you want to play a spellslinging mage with high spell critical, you go light armor. If you want to be stealthy or focus on melee/physical crits, you go medium armor. If you want to play either a tank or a brute force, in-your-face damage dealer that can take hits just as well as giving them out, you go heavy armor. Mage, thief, and fighter respectively.

smeeprocketnub19_ESO

that's a massive nerf to magelight, I'd rather see it not reveal stealthed players personally.

Crowd Control Breakout Now costs magicka, rather than stamina.

^^ I like that, I think it would make a huge difference.

Lynx7386

that's a massive nerf to magelight, I'd rather see it not reveal stealthed players personally.

It's really just moving the critical boost from magelight to light armor.

Wifeaggro13

Lynx7386 wrote: »

Despite the changes that have happened recently, I'm sure many will still agree that there are massive discrepancies in the effectiveness of each armor type. Light armor is still, overall, the best option due to the fact that out of 30 combat-oriented skill lines in the game, only 9 of them - less than one third - use stamina, and among those many of the abilities still dont even scale with stamina (but rather spellpower). Medium armor is in a better spot not for stamina builds, but still not optimal. Heavy armor, as always, is at the bottom of the totem pole for every role.

It's clear that these three armor types were designed to each correlate to a specific resource pool. Light armor works with magicka, Medium armor works with stamina, and Heavy armor works with health. That setup works well, but the abilities need to reflect that link a bit more I think. Below are my proposed changes to improve that:

Generic Changes:

Crowd Control Breakout Now costs magicka, rather than stamina.
Magelight, Inner Light, and Radiant Magelight no longer provide spell critical (More explained under light armor below)



Light Armor

Active Ability: Annulment / Dampen Magic / Harness Magicka
This ability may now only be used when a minimum of 4 light armor pieces are equipped.

Evocation
Reduces the magicka cost of spells by 1%/2%/3% per piece of light armor equipped.
(No Change)

Recovery
Increases magicka recovery rate by 2%/4% per piece of light armor equipped.
(No Change)

Spell Warding -> Changes to -> Spell Weaving
Increases spell critical strike chance by 1/2/3% per piece of light armor equipped.
(Note: Along with this change, the spell critical strike chance bonus would be removed from magelight/inner light, and replaced with something different.)

Prodigy
Your spells ignore 15/30% of the target's spell resistance while at least 5 pieces of light armor are equiped.
(No longer provides critical, as that is now covered under spell weaving. Instead provides spell penetration.)

Concentration
Reduces the magicka cost of breakout by 2%/4% per piece of light armor equipped.
(With breakout now being magicka based, this is the answer to reducing it's cost - up to 28% reduction with this passive and 7/7 light armor.)



Medium Armor

Active Ability: Evasion / Shuffle / Elude
This ability may now only be used when a minimum of 4 medium armor pieces are equipped.

(New) Evasion:
Costs stamina
For 20 seconds, you gain increased stealth movement speed, become harder to detect while sneaking, and use no stamina while sneaking.
(This change is to compensate for the passive changes below, which remove the stealth bonuses medium armor currently has).

(New) Shuffle:
Costs Stamina
For 20 seconds, you gain increased stealth movement speed, become harder to detect while sneaking, and use no stamina while sneaking. While active, removes one snare or immobilizing effect every 2 seconds.

(New) Elude:
Costs Stamina
For 20 seconds, you gain increased stealth movement speed, become harder to detect while sneaking, and use no stamina while sneaking. When activated, you immediately enter stealth mode, but your damage and healing are reduced by 75% for 4 seconds.
(Overall I think these changes would be more useful than the current dodge chance bonus that the medium armor active provides. These still serve a defensive purpose, but can also be used offensively just as annulment and immovable can be.)

Deterity
Reduces the stamina cost of abilities by 1%/2%/3% per piece of medium armor equipped.
(Now matches up with light armor passives. Combined with the reduced feat cost in the weapon skill trees, this cost reduction should nearly cancel out the additional stamina used by melee combatants when dodging/blocking/interrupting, and allow stamina abilities to be used more frequently in order to match up to the safer playstyle of a magicka build.)

Wind Walker
Increases stamina recovery rate by 2%/4% per piece of medium armor equipped.
(Now matches up with light armor passives)

Improved Sneak -> Changes to -> Precision
Increases weapon critical chance by 1/2/3% per piece of medium armor equipped.
(Now matches up with light armor passives)

Agility
Your attacks ignore 15/30% of the target's armor while at least 5 peices of medium armor are equipped.
(Matches up to light armor passives, provides melee combatants with armor penetration to increase weapon damage).

Athletics
Increases sprint move speed and decreases the stamina cost of roll dodge by 2/4% per piece of medium armor equipped.
(No real change, but now in line with light armor passives)



Heavy Armor

Active Ability: Immovable / Immovable Brute / Unstoppable
This ability can now only be used when a minimum of 4 heavy armor pieces are equipped.

Resolve
Reduces all damage taken by 1%/2%/3% per piece of heavy armor equipped.
(Essentially this does the same for the health pool that the medium and light armor passives do for stamina and magicka - reduces the 'cost' of the pool. This also makes heavy armor -much- more tanky, past the minimal improvement in armor value it currently has.)

Constitution
Increases health recovery rate by 2%/4% per piece of heavy armor equipped.
(No Change, but this is now in line with the other armor types for the health pool.)

Juggernaut
Reduces your chance to be critically hit by 1%/2%/3% per piece of heavy armor equipped.
(Essentially this is doing the opposite of the medium/light armor passives. Rather than increasing critical chance, it makes you more resistant to criticals.)

Bracing -> Changes to -> Brute Strength
Increases your weapon and spell damage by 15/30% while at least 5 pieces of heavy armor are equipped.
(While medium and light armor wind up being critical-based for their damage, heavy armor gives raw power, and it needs to give a substantial amount since you're giving up resource regeneration and armor/spell penetration for it.)

Rapid Mending -> Changes to -> Bracing
Reduces the cost of blocking by 2%/4% per piece of heavy armor equipped.
(Replacing the bracing ability from before, this will now give higher block cost reduction, up to 28% (vs the current 10%). This should make blocking almost resource-free when combined with all of the 1h/shield passives.)



So now we've got 3 armor types that correspond directly to 3 resource pools and 3 different styles of play. If you want to play a spellslinging mage with high spell critical, you go light armor. If you want to be stealthy or focus on melee/physical crits, you go medium armor. If you want to play either a tank or a brute force, in-your-face damage dealer that can take hits just as well as giving them out, you go heavy armor. Mage, thief, and fighter respectively.

1000% Agree. 3 weeks after launch it was very very apparent Heavy was useless. Many of the community have been screaming this for 3 month. they wont even acknowledge it as they Bleed subs do to the imbalances. Many have lost fait and wont return based on the silence ZOS has taken , they have acknowledged Stamina builds are lacking but with a heavy hand in nerfing while Pissing on the on a forest fire of imbalance does not look like they intend to do anything about it.

smeeprocketnub19_ESO

Lynx7386 wrote: »

that's a massive nerf to magelight, I'd rather see it not reveal stealthed players personally.

It's really just moving the critical boost from magelight to light armor.

but then what would be the point of slotting magelight at all?

DenverRalphy

IMHO, the best fix should simply be to make the base Armor stat more effective. It's ridiculous when swapping from Heavy to Light, and seeing no extreme changes in incoming damage. When ESO first released, I made it a point to go 5 Light on my Sorcerers and 5 medium on my Nightblades, and then mix in 2 pieces of heavy for a huge boost to my base armor. Then later learned that going 7 light had no noticeable difference in survivability. Regardless of passives.

I'd like to see some serious Tankiness from the base armor stat, making Heavy more desirable, and light armors leaving you substantially more vulnerable.

Ninnghizhidda

I mostly like the suggestions and find them well thought. Especially for Heavy Armour, which currently has almost a cosmetic role, more or less as useful as wearing a (stat-less) costume.

Amsel_McKay

Heavy is not useless... I can get to max Magic or Stam and Health with Heavy armor earlier then light or medium. I can also at VR12 soft cap all regen stats, health and Magic and armor.

The problem is not the armor its the gameplay and min max players who rely on one stat to play, if you play with a multi stat player using both mana and stamina and want survivability go heavy. Try it and test it and you will see its fine.

smeeprocketnub19_ESO

Amsel_McKay wrote: »

Heavy is not useless... I can get to max Magic or Stam and Health with Heavy armor earlier then light or medium. I can also at VR12 soft cap all regen stats, health and Magic and armor.

The problem is not the armor its the gameplay and min max players who rely on one stat to play, if you play with a multi stat player using both mana and stamina and want survivability go heavy. Try it and test it and you will see its fine.

it's more that the passives suck compared to the other lines, imo.

immovable is nice though, but you don't have to wear heavy armor to use it.

Amsel_McKay

smeeprocketnub19_ESO wrote: »

Amsel_McKay wrote: »

Heavy is not useless... I can get to max Magic or Stam and Health with Heavy armor earlier then light or medium. I can also at VR12 soft cap all regen stats, health and Magic and armor.

The problem is not the armor its the gameplay and min max players who rely on one stat to play, if you play with a multi stat player using both mana and stamina and want survivability go heavy. Try it and test it and you will see its fine.

it's more that the passives suck compared to the other lines, imo.

immovable is nice though, but you don't have to wear heavy armor to use it.

They suck because of the cookie cutter builds... Its like Magic the gathering when people say a color sucks because they get killed by it all the time and then a few weeks later a person finds a build in another color that is amazing because they took the time to play it...

In ESO people have not worked with builds with heavy armor, and groups dont give them a chance.

Oh look my light armor templar has LESS mana, less crit and less armor then by heavy armor templar...

DenverRalphy

Amsel_McKay wrote: »

smeeprocketnub19_ESO wrote: »

Amsel_McKay wrote: »

Heavy is not useless... I can get to max Magic or Stam and Health with Heavy armor earlier then light or medium. I can also at VR12 soft cap all regen stats, health and Magic and armor.

The problem is not the armor its the gameplay and min max players who rely on one stat to play, if you play with a multi stat player using both mana and stamina and want survivability go heavy. Try it and test it and you will see its fine.

it's more that the passives suck compared to the other lines, imo.

immovable is nice though, but you don't have to wear heavy armor to use it.

They suck because of the cookie cutter builds... Its like Magic the gathering when people say a color sucks because they get killed by it all the time and then a few weeks later a person finds a build in another color that is amazing because they took the time to play it...

In ESO people have not worked with builds with heavy armor, and groups dont give them a chance.

Oh look my light armor templar has LESS mana, less crit and less armor then by heavy armor templar...

Heavy armor doesn't give any added magicka or crit. The only stat that heavy armor gives better is the base armor stat. Unfortunately, base armor is very insignificant with the way ESO's combat mechanics work. And that's the problem. The other armors provide much more in spell armor and crits (much more). The basic armor stat is very insignificant in ESO.

Lynx7386

but then what would be the point of slotting magelight at all?

It would still have the stealth detection, and as I mentioned in the original post a new bonus could be added to keep it useful - perhaps spell power, or magicka regen.

The point is nobody likes having to slot magelight to get the same critical boost that melee builds get out of medium armor passives. The imbalance goes both ways.

IMHO, the best fix should simply be to make the base Armor stat more effective. It's ridiculous when swapping from Heavy to Light, and seeing no extreme changes in incoming damage. When ESO first released, I made it a point to go 5 Light on my Sorcerers and 5 medium on my Nightblades, and then mix in 2 pieces of heavy for a huge boost to my base armor. Then later learned that going 7 light had no noticeable difference in survivability. Regardless of passives.

I'd like to see some serious Tankiness from the base armor stat, making Heavy more desirable, and light armors leaving you substantially more vulnerable.

The passive change to give heavy armor 21% extra damage reduction (seperate from armor mitigation so as to not hit the overcharge limit) would make heavy armor far more tanky than it is now, and definitely set apart from medium or light.

Heavy is not useless... I can get to max Magic or Stam and Health with Heavy armor earlier then light or medium. I can also at VR12 soft cap all regen stats, health and Magic and armor.

The problem is not the armor its the gameplay and min max players who rely on one stat to play, if you play with a multi stat player using both mana and stamina and want survivability go heavy. Try it and test it and you will see its fine.

Capping regen isnt really as useful as you seem to think. Even if you could get double the regen rate for any of the three resource pools that you have now, you'd still be relying on abilities for your resource management.

The resource regen stat is only there as a minor boost. Recovering 100 magicka every 2 seconds is pretty useless when you're using spells that cost three times that.

That's why everyone either relies on class abilities like siphoning attacks or dark exchange, or resto staff heavy attacks, for longevity.

immovable is nice though, but you don't have to wear heavy armor to use it.

Which further compounds the armor discrepancy, because someone using light or medium armor can get that bonus.

Hence why, in the OP, I mentioned that the armor active abilities now require a minimum of 4 armor pieces of that type to use (a majority, we've got 7 pieces available).

They suck because of the cookie cutter builds... Its like Magic the gathering when people say a color sucks because they get killed by it all the time and then a few weeks later a person finds a build in another color that is amazing because they took the time to play it...

In ESO people have not worked with builds with heavy armor, and groups dont give them a chance.

Builds have nothing to do with it. Heavy armor offers far less resource management and damage bonus than either of the other two armor types, and it does not have significantly higher damage mitigation. There's a reason endgame tanks are running light or medium armor now instead of heavy.

Oh look my light armor templar has LESS mana, less crit and less armor then by heavy armor templar...

Not believing you there for a second. Light armor currently offers 21% reduced spell cost, 28% increased magicka regeneration rate, and 10% more spell critical than heavy armor offers, there's simply no way you're getting higher stats with heavy armor than you are with light.

Tankqull

in general i do agree with your changes would propose comparable changes but in threepoints points i somehow disagree.

Lynx7386 wrote: »

Magelight, Inner Light, and Radiant Magelight no longer provide spell critical (More explained under light armor below)

Deterity
(Now matches up with light armor passives. Combined with the reduced feat cost in the weapon skill trees, this cost reduction should nearly cancel out the additional stamina used by melee combatants when dodging/blocking/interrupting, and allow stamina abilities to be used more frequently in order to match up to the safer playstyle of a magicka build.)

Bracing -> Changes to -> Brute Strength
Increases your weapon and spell damage by 15/30% while at least 5 pieces of heavy armor are equipped.
(While medium and light armor wind up being critical-based for their damage, heavy armor gives raw power, and it needs to give a substantial amount since you're giving up resource regeneration and armor/spell penetration for it.)

regarding magelight having the changes to sets in mind your changes are adding a severe disadvantage to spell useres (from 15% max spellcrit with 5%melee crit to 4%spell crit and 16% melee crit with the new sets) so an unchanged magelight is essential to keep balance as it is using two skillslots on your quickbars.

dexterity
dodging blocking and interrupting is not more frequently used as a melee dps than as a range dps and thus not justified especially when having bows/daggers as an option.
so the 20% enducost reduction of wepons needs to be changed to sth else. sth like destruction expert of the destruction staff would come to my mind for dw/2h/bow and a new skill that regs health 7/15 points per second for 15 seconds for shield.
wich would leave heavy armor at a severe disadvantage that would needed to be covered. as constitution is rather useless anyway it would be predestined to be changed to an stamina cost reduction passive.

bracing
its a bit to strong having in mind that most players(mobs ahve far lower armor/resi values) will be at 2k to softcap values for resis/armor rating thus the 30% reduction by light/medium armor nets a <10% dmg increasement.
compared to the 30% base dmg increasement it is in a far inferior state.
so a possible change from my perspective would be a 30% weapondmg increasement wich is comparable to a 10% net dmg increasement.

Tankqull

gnarf bloody quote instead of edit...

Lynx7386

dodging blocking and interrupting is not more frequently used as a melee dps than as a range dps and thus not justified especially when having bows/daggers as an option.

how do you figure that? If you're at range, none of the point blank aoe's used by enemy mobs are going to hit you. Ranged characters rely on ranged abilities for interrupts (poison arrow and crushing shock), while melee characters are having to use bash.

blocking is used by melee damage dealers almost as much as tanks in proper dungeon runs, and should be used whenever an enemy is winding back a heavy attack regardless of your role in the group.

jamie.goddenrwb17_ESO

I would like to see a synergy between a heavy armor passive and the 2h weapon line that works like 2h weapon passives that have differing effects based on the weapon type you are holding.

Perhaps a heavy armor passive that adds to damage instead of resists if you are wielding a 2h weapon?

This sort of change could allow both typical tank type characters and classical 2h knight type builds in heavy armor.

Tankqull

Lynx7386 wrote: »

dodging blocking and interrupting is not more frequently used as a melee dps than as a range dps and thus not justified especially when having bows/daggers as an option.

how do you figure that? If you're at range, none of the point blank aoe's used by enemy mobs are going to hit you. Ranged characters rely on ranged abilities for interrupts (poison arrow and crushing shock), while melee characters are having to use bash.

blocking is used by melee damage dealers almost as much as tanks in proper dungeon runs, and should be used whenever an enemy is winding back a heavy attack regardless of your role in the group.

blocking bashing is none of your buisness as a dd as it is the tanks purpose, if you have to block your tank is not doing his job properly if thats the case range dds have to block as much as a melee dd because of the same reason(boss runs havoc) and trash mobs in trials/dungeons are pbaed to death so no "range" as well.
all bosses that have some closecombat pbaes have as well range ae´s both have to be left as quick as possible if you´re not the tank so rolls are needed by every one aswell.
if you referring to solo pve range classes have to block as much(-1or 2 attacks) as a melee dd as your opponents close the gap really quick.

in short there is no reason for an additional 20% resource cost reduction for stamina if you split up the defensive options to stamina and magicka.

Crisscross

Lynx7386 wrote: »

Juggernaut
Reduces your chance to be critically hit by 1%/2%/3% per piece of heavy armor equipped.
(Essentially this is doing the opposite of the medium/light armor passives. Rather than increasing critical chance, it makes you more resistant to criticals.)

Awesome post for sure, but I'm curious about this. I don't know alot about the nitty gritty of the mechanics so I could be wrong, but I was under the impression that mobs don't really crit much.

If that's true then this trait would seem to be a waste for PVE, and for PVP it might be redundant since people tend to put Impenetrable trait on all their gear anyway.

theyancey

OP, you did a lot of nice work but your proposed uber nefing of my Inner Light abilities would destroy each and every one of my toons. Color me unhappy.

Lynx7386

in short there is no reason for an additional 20% resource cost reduction for stamina if you split up the defensive options to stamina and magicka.

It's not an additional 20%, it's 7% more than what is currently ingame.

Wifeaggro13

Amsel_McKay wrote: »

Heavy is not useless... I can get to max Magic or Stam and Health with Heavy armor earlier then light or medium. I can also at VR12 soft cap all regen stats, health and Magic and armor.

The problem is not the armor its the gameplay and min max players who rely on one stat to play, if you play with a multi stat player using both mana and stamina and want survivability go heavy. Try it and test it and you will see its fine.

Amsel. I would like to take the opportunity to point out you will never have the magic resist or the magica red/ regen /crit of light. Heavy armor does not mitigate damage. the armor value does, you can be almost 1000 over cap in light armor and still retain all the benefits of light armor.There is no extra survive ability in heavy. And there is no Xtra health or magica in heavy so i dont know where your getting that from.

I dont know why you would wear heavy but i tank everything in light armor . i do more damage and have almost unlimited magica with warlock jewelry. the only thing you lose in light is that 3.5 % additional healing which is absolutely laughable, and block reduction which is somewhat useful but is far less useful then all the other benefits of light armor.Every single end game trial group is stacked with light armor and staves. you dont even really need a tank in VR four mans if your skilled. and if you do have a tank ,all is required is sword and shield with one taunt. The rest of your two bars are DPS with 1 CC. As far as capping your stats that comes form glyphing and AP points. The only stat i don't even worry about is stamina as its useless really. the extra 300 armor heavy provides is nothing when your already 1100 over soft cap in light armor with a buff.Most of the end game PVE community kinda chuckles when a DK shows up in heavy armor and says he is tanking.

Wifeaggro13

[delete

NobleX35

I made a similar thread with my thoughts on how to potentially balance out the armor lines, but I must say I like some of your changes a lot more. Anyway who doesn't realize that there is an inherent imbalance in the armor line passives is just ignorant/ blind to the truth. Personally I feel that a lot (not all, but a significant amount) of the imbalances in this game can all be attributed to the imbalances in the armor lines. If they would fix the armor lines the game would be in a much better state.

Here was my thread on the topic.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/111591/armor-passives-and-imbalance#latest

Kalman

I agree something needs to be done.

Kego

Sounds nice but Spell Penetration should be completly removed, as well as Armor Penetration.

These are Debuffs and should be debuffed IN-fight and not through a Passive on Armors.

Tankqull

Lynx7386 wrote: »

in short there is no reason for an additional 20% resource cost reduction for stamina if you split up the defensive options to stamina and magicka.

It's not an additional 20%, it's 7% more than what is currently ingame.

you will have a 20% reduction via weapon skills + your "newly" introduced 3%per piece wich gives you a 20% higher reduction of what a magickauser is able to get.
wich is simply unbalanced.
what needs to be done is making skills like restoring aura(radiant aura) worthwhile to equalize the gap created by equilibrium. or make the evil hunter stamina proc procable vs every target (but change it to be a toggle than) on a weaponhit while the dmg proc kept to be restricted vs deadra/undead/(WW).
and adding a comparable effect of destructionstaffs destruction expert to all weaponlines wich could easily substitute the 20% weapon reduction.

Lynx7386

you will have a 20% reduction via weapon skills + your "newly" introduced 3%per piece wich gives you a 20% higher reduction of what a magickauser is able to get.

Right now medium armor already gives 14% stamina cost reduction, and you still can stack it with the 20% from feat passives.

Tankqull

Lynx7386 wrote: »

you will have a 20% reduction via weapon skills + your "newly" introduced 3%per piece wich gives you a 20% higher reduction of what a magickauser is able to get.

Right now medium armor already gives 14% stamina cost reduction, and you still can stack it with the 20% from feat passives.

and i dont agree with that change aswell
it was given because of all defensive abilities consume stamina one of your key changes is splitting them up, so that 14% wich will be 20% with your changes would be no longer justified. thats all im saying.

MasterSpatula

I personally think all bonuses to crits--spell, heals, and melee--should go to Medium Armor (leaving magelight alone). I also think Heavy Armor should give a higher bonus to heals received as well as a bonus to heals cast. Increase the mitigation of MA and HA, and maybe give some Stamina resource management abilities to HA. This encourages mix-and-match armor, makes healing viable for more than just Light Armor, and makes Heavy the tank armor it always should have been.

Wifeaggro13

MasterSpatula wrote: »

I personally think all bonuses to crits--spell, heals, and melee--should go to Medium Armor (leaving magelight alone). I also think Heavy Armor should give a higher bonus to heals received as well as a bonus to heals cast. Increase the mitigation of MA and HA, and maybe give some Stamina resource management abilities to HA. This encourages mix-and-match armor, makes healing viable for more than just Light Armor, and makes Heavy the tank armor it always should have been.

the armor system in this game is beyond broken . passives soft caps and buff's completely make Light armor the only choice. you can have 1200 past armor and spell resist cap in one buff .I dont think they are gonna make any changes to heavy they are to in love with what they thing is revolutionary design. In reality its lazy bull *** that makes everyone DPS with a taunt for tanking.

mrkaco_ESO

The only change I really want to see is the Immovable, Annulment, Evasion skills require to be wearing a minimum 5 pieces of the associated armor.

The other OP ideas look interesting, however.