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Weapon Damage Tweaks Needed

  • IcyDeadPeople
    IcyDeadPeople
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    Rather than nerf magicka-based aoe damage, it might be more appealing to buff the damage of some stamina-based aoe attacks.
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  • leewells
    leewells
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    Rather than nerf magicka-based aoe damage, it might be more appealing to buff the damage of some stamina-based aoe attacks.

    Stamina abilities in general need huge buffs to be honest. No nerf is necessary, but there is no reason why the 2-handed wrecking blow would only do marginal damage to another player of the same level and cost more than morphed impulse -- especially being that everything defensive costs stamina: block, roll, cc break, etc which gives casters the undoubted defensive advantage which is a pure waste being they're supposed to be at RANGE which makes them even more survivable.
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  • Aeaeren
    Aeaeren
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    well if you nerf Pulsar then solar barage has to go too, so make sure we can block that also. Also I need to be able to stop you from instant healing as that is OP also, and that Stam spell you can pop has to go also. I mean we all have to be on the same playing level right?

    Funny I have a v7 Templar that pretty much is exactly the same, except med armor :smile:

    The issue here isn't pulsar is OP, it's that he got rolled by a group using it and he feels he should be able to block it or it needs to be nerfed. Now everyone KNOWS magic is stronger then Stam builds, not going to disagree with that at all. Pulsar is a legit spell that is being used the way it is supposed to be used and he doesn't LIKE it so he comes here and complains. Now you can get your way which is fine but you getting your way just means people like me who prefer they FIX the other issues and bring them inline with Magic lines will be forced to change. Dude this game has way to many issues with it as it is right now for me to even contemplate another change because people are too lazy to figure out counters to things that are legit and not OP. This is the reason I have little patience with these nerf calls to legitimate tactics. I totally get silver bolts one shotting Vamps is OP and all that stuff but Pulsar is NOT in that category whatsoever.
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  • Aeaeren
    Aeaeren
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    leewells wrote: »
    Rather than nerf magicka-based aoe damage, it might be more appealing to buff the damage of some stamina-based aoe attacks.

    Stamina abilities in general need huge buffs to be honest. No nerf is necessary, but there is no reason why the 2-handed wrecking blow would only do marginal damage to another player of the same level and cost more than morphed impulse -- especially being that everything defensive costs stamina: block, roll, cc break, etc which gives casters the undoubted defensive advantage which is a pure waste being they're supposed to be at RANGE which makes them even more survivable.


    And everyone KNOWS this is an issue with Stam vs Magic builds, this has been posted all over this board and everyone pretty much agrees they need to tweak it. What you want is a way to block an AoE which in turns completely destroys any reason to use the AoE in the first place and makes it completely useless as everyone will be blocking from now on. This isn't a tweek this is breaking a skill completely. I used Luvboard earlier as an example, one counter to HIM is using AoE as he reflects everything else and he mows down AoE groups.
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  • leewells
    leewells
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    Aeaeren wrote: »
    well if you nerf Pulsar then solar barage has to go too, so make sure we can block that also.

    If we were talking about nerfs, indeed. Solar barrage is OP.
    Aeaeren wrote: »
    Also I need to be able to stop you from instant healing as that is OP also, and that Stam spell you can pop has to go also. I mean we all have to be on the same playing level right?

    The one that requires a fresh corpse? But yeah, that's cool. Maybe we could nerf it to not require a corpse and have a 1 second cast.
    Aeaeren wrote: »
    Funny I have a v7 Templar that pretty much is exactly the same, except med armor :smile:

    I have med armor too, maxed.
    Aeaeren wrote: »
    The issue here isn't pulsar is OP, it's that he got rolled by a group using it and he feels he should be able to block it or it needs to be nerfed.

    You think you have it all figured out don't ya? The last time I was rolled to impulse was about 2 months ago. But something like that you could say. What if I told you I would like balance because I would like an actual CHALLENGE in PVP and not he who impulses first winz?
    Aeaeren wrote: »
    Now everyone KNOWS magic is stronger then Stam builds, not going to disagree with that at all. Pulsar is a legit spell that is being used the way it is supposed to be used and he doesn't LIKE it so he comes here and complains.

    And I haven't said once it should be nerfed, I said it should be blockable. Fact is, impulse does more DPS than a freaken oil pot yet you get to carry that fire stick around with you anywhere you want with instant deployment and zero warning to your enemies. You need to get your head out of your fourth point of contact for a moment to take that in. You don't want to know some of the suggestions the devs have made such as player tagging so they can't be impulsed more than once by one player. Wonder if you would prefer a system like that instead of blocking....
    Aeaeren wrote: »
    Now you can get your way which is fine but you getting your way just means people like me who prefer they FIX the other issues and bring them inline with Magic lines will be forced to change.

    The fix is buffing the hell out of stamina abilities and either making impulse blockable or making stamina AOEs UNBLOCKABLE like impulse. Its just that simple.
    Aeaeren wrote: »
    This is the reason I have little patience with these nerf calls to legitimate tactics. I totally get silver bolts one shotting Vamps is OP and all that stuff but Pulsar is NOT in that category whatsoever.

    A one-button "i winz" is never a legitimate tactic. When you can kill 6 players with WASD 1 and there isn't a thing they can do about it because 5 of your buddies just did the same thing while you planned when everyone would press 1 to one-shot the entire 6 man group, there is nothing legitimate about it and there is no way you can bake that puppy to make it legit.
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  • Aeaeren
    Aeaeren
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    leewells wrote: »
    Aeaeren wrote: »
    well if you nerf Pulsar then solar barage has to go too, so make sure we can block that also.

    If we were talking about nerfs, indeed. Solar barrage is OP.
    Aeaeren wrote: »
    Also I need to be able to stop you from instant healing as that is OP also, and that Stam spell you can pop has to go also. I mean we all have to be on the same playing level right?

    The one that requires a fresh corpse? But yeah, that's cool. Maybe we could nerf it to not require a corpse and have a 1 second cast.
    Aeaeren wrote: »
    Funny I have a v7 Templar that pretty much is exactly the same, except med armor :smile:

    I have med armor too, maxed.
    Aeaeren wrote: »
    The issue here isn't pulsar is OP, it's that he got rolled by a group using it and he feels he should be able to block it or it needs to be nerfed.

    You think you have it all figured out don't ya? The last time I was rolled to impulse was about 2 months ago. But something like that you could say. What if I told you I would like balance because I would like an actual CHALLENGE in PVP and not he who impulses first winz?
    Aeaeren wrote: »
    Now everyone KNOWS magic is stronger then Stam builds, not going to disagree with that at all. Pulsar is a legit spell that is being used the way it is supposed to be used and he doesn't LIKE it so he comes here and complains.

    And I haven't said once it should be nerfed, I said it should be blockable. Fact is, impulse does more DPS than a freaken oil pot yet you get to carry that fire stick around with you anywhere you want with instant deployment and zero warning to your enemies. You need to get your head out of your fourth point of contact for a moment to take that in. You don't want to know some of the suggestions the devs have made such as player tagging so they can't be impulsed more than once by one player. Wonder if you would prefer a system like that instead of blocking....
    Aeaeren wrote: »
    Now you can get your way which is fine but you getting your way just means people like me who prefer they FIX the other issues and bring them inline with Magic lines will be forced to change.

    The fix is buffing the hell out of stamina abilities and either making impulse blockable or making stamina AOEs UNBLOCKABLE like impulse. Its just that simple.
    Aeaeren wrote: »
    This is the reason I have little patience with these nerf calls to legitimate tactics. I totally get silver bolts one shotting Vamps is OP and all that stuff but Pulsar is NOT in that category whatsoever.

    A one-button "i winz" is never a legitimate tactic. When you can kill 6 players with WASD 1 and there isn't a thing they can do about it because 5 of your buddies just did the same thing while you planned when everyone would press 1 to one-shot the entire 6 man group, there is nothing legitimate about it and there is no way you can bake that puppy to make it legit.

    I suggest you actual roll a toon with Impulse and find out how OP it is and you will see why your last statement is so off based. More powerful then an Oil pot really? I don't do anywhere near that amount of damage with one pulse at all even if I crit. Please show me where one person mows down 6 others with nothing but Pulse. Please show me where one person one on one using nothing but pulse wins vs almost ANY other class.
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  • leewells
    leewells
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    Aeaeren wrote: »
    What you want is a way to block an AoE which in turns completely destroys any reason to use the AoE in the first place and makes it completely useless as everyone will be blocking from now on. This isn't a tweek this is breaking a skill completely.

    I see, so you want them to rename this game to Elder AOEs Online. I don't like it. Blocking isn't a nerf because blocking costs stamina and if you start impulsing and see a group all holding up their shields, that should be a common sense que for you to back off and try something else. There is no reason on Earth for any one or two players to run in a group of 6 and still be able to win because they decided not to use a destro staff.

    Again, what if CC break and blocking cost magika while you were holding your destro/resto staff? Eh? What tune would you sing to that very fair suggestion. Want AOE's blockable now? You would, if the system was fair in that sense.
    Edited by leewells on July 7, 2014 4:53PM
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  • leewells
    leewells
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    Aeaeren wrote: »
    leewells wrote: »
    Aeaeren wrote: »
    well if you nerf Pulsar then solar barage has to go too, so make sure we can block that also.

    If we were talking about nerfs, indeed. Solar barrage is OP.
    Aeaeren wrote: »
    Also I need to be able to stop you from instant healing as that is OP also, and that Stam spell you can pop has to go also. I mean we all have to be on the same playing level right?

    The one that requires a fresh corpse? But yeah, that's cool. Maybe we could nerf it to not require a corpse and have a 1 second cast.
    Aeaeren wrote: »
    Funny I have a v7 Templar that pretty much is exactly the same, except med armor :smile:

    I have med armor too, maxed.
    Aeaeren wrote: »
    The issue here isn't pulsar is OP, it's that he got rolled by a group using it and he feels he should be able to block it or it needs to be nerfed.

    You think you have it all figured out don't ya? The last time I was rolled to impulse was about 2 months ago. But something like that you could say. What if I told you I would like balance because I would like an actual CHALLENGE in PVP and not he who impulses first winz?
    Aeaeren wrote: »
    Now everyone KNOWS magic is stronger then Stam builds, not going to disagree with that at all. Pulsar is a legit spell that is being used the way it is supposed to be used and he doesn't LIKE it so he comes here and complains.

    And I haven't said once it should be nerfed, I said it should be blockable. Fact is, impulse does more DPS than a freaken oil pot yet you get to carry that fire stick around with you anywhere you want with instant deployment and zero warning to your enemies. You need to get your head out of your fourth point of contact for a moment to take that in. You don't want to know some of the suggestions the devs have made such as player tagging so they can't be impulsed more than once by one player. Wonder if you would prefer a system like that instead of blocking....
    Aeaeren wrote: »
    Now you can get your way which is fine but you getting your way just means people like me who prefer they FIX the other issues and bring them inline with Magic lines will be forced to change.

    The fix is buffing the hell out of stamina abilities and either making impulse blockable or making stamina AOEs UNBLOCKABLE like impulse. Its just that simple.
    Aeaeren wrote: »
    This is the reason I have little patience with these nerf calls to legitimate tactics. I totally get silver bolts one shotting Vamps is OP and all that stuff but Pulsar is NOT in that category whatsoever.

    A one-button "i winz" is never a legitimate tactic. When you can kill 6 players with WASD 1 and there isn't a thing they can do about it because 5 of your buddies just did the same thing while you planned when everyone would press 1 to one-shot the entire 6 man group, there is nothing legitimate about it and there is no way you can bake that puppy to make it legit.

    I suggest you actual roll a toon with Impulse and find out how OP it is and you will see why your last statement is so off based. More powerful then an Oil pot really? I don't do anywhere near that amount of damage with one pulse at all even if I crit. Please show me where one person mows down 6 others with nothing but Pulse. Please show me where one person one on one using nothing but pulse wins vs almost ANY other class.

    You don't read do you?
    leewells wrote: »
    Aeaeren wrote: »
    But my point is best describe: What is your build?

    Resto Templar (out of pvp necessity)
    Destro Templar (out of pvp necessity)
    2-Hand Templar (favorite play style)
    S&B Templar (out of necessity if tank needed)
    Heavy, Medium, Light armors maxed.

    Yes, I really do have all those builds (and maxed) on one toon. And entirely possible with major alliance rank, all skyshards discovered, all/most main quests completed, and all dungeons completed.
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  • Aeaeren
    Aeaeren
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    leewells wrote: »
    Aeaeren wrote: »
    What you want is a way to block an AoE which in turns completely destroys any reason to use the AoE in the first place and makes it completely useless as everyone will be blocking from now on. This isn't a tweek this is breaking a skill completely.

    I see, so you want them to rename this game to Elder AOEs Online. I don't like it. Blocking isn't a nerf because blocking costs stamina and if you start impulsing and see a group all holding up their shields, that should be a common sense que for you to back off and try something else. There is no reason on Earth for any one or two players to run in a group of 6 and still be able to win because they decided not to use a destro staff.

    Again, what if CC break and blocking cost magika while you were holding your destro/resto staff? Eh? What tune would you sing to that very fair suggestion. Want AOE's blockable now?

    Oh so now I am supposed to change up tactics because if I see you blocking I am supposed to back off and figure out something else uh? How about if you see me pulsing you um avoid me? Shield Charge and bash the hell out of me while I am laying on the ground, range me, Siege me, negate me, the list goes on an on. You are making my argument for me. YOU WANT ME TO CHANGE BECAUSE YOU DON'T WANT TO! It's as simple as that!
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  • leewells
    leewells
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    Aeaeren wrote: »
    leewells wrote: »
    Aeaeren wrote: »
    What you want is a way to block an AoE which in turns completely destroys any reason to use the AoE in the first place and makes it completely useless as everyone will be blocking from now on. This isn't a tweek this is breaking a skill completely.

    I see, so you want them to rename this game to Elder AOEs Online. I don't like it. Blocking isn't a nerf because blocking costs stamina and if you start impulsing and see a group all holding up their shields, that should be a common sense que for you to back off and try something else. There is no reason on Earth for any one or two players to run in a group of 6 and still be able to win because they decided not to use a destro staff.

    Again, what if CC break and blocking cost magika while you were holding your destro/resto staff? Eh? What tune would you sing to that very fair suggestion. Want AOE's blockable now?

    Oh so now I am supposed to change up tactics because if I see you blocking I am supposed to back off and figure out something else uh? How about if you see me pulsing you um avoid me? Shield Charge and bash the hell out of me while I am laying on the ground, range me, Siege me, negate me, the list goes on an on. You are making my argument for me. YOU WANT ME TO CHANGE BECAUSE YOU DON'T WANT TO! It's as simple as that!

    Yes! Adapt, Improvise, and Overcome while in a dynamic fight! Who would of thunk it?! Oh, wait, you want me to do that; while you get a one-button win.
    Edited by leewells on July 7, 2014 5:02PM
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  • Snit
    Snit
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    Sword & Board is nearly as popular as staves, and for good reason.
    Snit AD Sorc
    Ratbag AD Warden Tank
    Goblins AD Stamblade

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  • leewells
    leewells
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    Snit wrote: »
    Sword & Board is nearly as popular as staves, and for good reason.

    Yeah, but you can run someone with S&B out of stamina a lot faster than they can run you out of health while they are blocking. The same can't be said for AOE's.
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  • Aeaeren
    Aeaeren
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    leewells wrote: »

    Yes! Adapt, Improvise, and Overcome while in a dynamic fight! Who would of thunk it?!

    Funny I do adapt, improvise and overcome, the problem is YOU DON'T and instead of figuring it out you want ZOS to do it for you and that is where we have a disagreement.
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  • leewells
    leewells
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    Aeaeren wrote: »
    leewells wrote: »

    Yes! Adapt, Improvise, and Overcome while in a dynamic fight! Who would of thunk it?!

    Funny I do adapt, improvise and overcome, the problem is YOU DON'T and instead of figuring it out you want ZOS to do it for you and that is where we have a disagreement.

    So, you getting a one-button win is improvising and adapting. But holding up block when 8 people run in (that will usually one shot a player) with impulse and rolling away is not? What are you smoking? Dude, have you ever tried playing without impulse? You should try it.

    But seriously, you can't adapt, improvise, or overcome 6 people whom run in, and impulse at the same time. Try rolling/running/blinking away when you're hit 500x6 (hint: 3,000dmg).
    Edited by leewells on July 7, 2014 5:10PM
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  • Aeaeren
    Aeaeren
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    leewells wrote: »
    Aeaeren wrote: »
    leewells wrote: »

    Yes! Adapt, Improvise, and Overcome while in a dynamic fight! Who would of thunk it?!

    Funny I do adapt, improvise and overcome, the problem is YOU DON'T and instead of figuring it out you want ZOS to do it for you and that is where we have a disagreement.

    So, you getting a one-button win is improvising and adapting. But holding up block when 8 people run in (that will usually one shot a player) with impulse and rolling away is not? What are you smoking?

    OK I am done with the stupidity of this thread there is NO ONE BUTTON WIN here whatsoever. Yes one spell with many different people casting it can mow down a bunch of others. Its the same as 10 tornado doing the same thing, or 10 Solar barrages doing the same thing or 10 meat bags, ect. This issue here is YOU can't figure out how to deal with it and are crying about it and want ZOS to hold your hand and make you all God like! Man up and slam you head together with others and figure out how to counter it as I seriously doubt ZOS will side with your arguments. I have already gave you a ton of counters to it.
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  • leewells
    leewells
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    Aeaeren wrote: »
    leewells wrote: »
    Aeaeren wrote: »
    leewells wrote: »

    Yes! Adapt, Improvise, and Overcome while in a dynamic fight! Who would of thunk it?!

    Funny I do adapt, improvise and overcome, the problem is YOU DON'T and instead of figuring it out you want ZOS to do it for you and that is where we have a disagreement.

    So, you getting a one-button win is improvising and adapting. But holding up block when 8 people run in (that will usually one shot a player) with impulse and rolling away is not? What are you smoking?

    OK I am done with the stupidity of this thread there is NO ONE BUTTON WIN here whatsoever. Yes one spell with many different people casting it can mow down a bunch of others. Its the same as 10 tornado doing the same thing, or 10 Solar barrages doing the same thing or 10 meat bags, ect. This issue here is YOU can't figure out how to deal with it and are crying about it and want ZOS to hold your hand and make you all God like! Man up and slam you head together with others and figure out how to counter it as I seriously doubt ZOS will side with your arguments. I have already gave you a ton of counters to it.

    Anytime I'm hit with impulse from another VL12, its generally 500 damage for one impulse.

    Usually, when people run impulse, they do it in groups of at least 6. You know why? Multiply 500 times 6 and you tell me, how you and your team of 6 can withstand 3,000 damage PER SECOND. BTW, oil does 160 DPS counting the cooldown, it can be mitigated with a siege shield, and it can be purified. Impulse does 500, unblockable, unmitigatable, and it crits. There you have it, Impulse does more DPS than oil.

    Here is the flaw in your logic, I agreed that solar barrage should also be blocked. But you believe by some miracle that siege for some reason is OP -- which is kinda is, but there is something about it though -- it gives you a warning by placing a big red circle on he ground letting you know "hey ***, you're about to get hit by an OP ability!" This doesn't happen for AOE spam, it just happens and if its 6 players you're dead which means they didn't have to adapt and improvise to jack -- they did a one-button win.

    Morale of the story: If you can effectively BLOCK oil with a siege shield and purity/purge -- you should be able to have an equivalent to player casted AOE's and blocking does just that.
    Edited by leewells on July 7, 2014 5:24PM
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  • Aeaeren
    Aeaeren
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    leewells wrote: »
    Usually, when people run impulse, they do it in groups of at least 6. You know why? Multiply 500 times 6 and you tell me, how you and your team of 6 can withstand 3,000 damage PER SECOND.

    The same way we do it when we are facing an impulse group. I could tell you but then I would have to .... :smile:

    It can and is being countered every day. Look through all the skill lines and find the combinations you can use to counter it. It's not difficult and once you figure it out you will OWN that pulse group! Well not you singly but your group can.
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  • leewells
    leewells
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    Aeaeren wrote: »
    leewells wrote: »
    Usually, when people run impulse, they do it in groups of at least 6. You know why? Multiply 500 times 6 and you tell me, how you and your team of 6 can withstand 3,000 damage PER SECOND.

    The same way we do it when we are facing an impulse group. I could tell you but then I would have to .... :smile:

    It can and is being countered every day. Look through all the skill lines and find the combinations you can use to counter it. It's not difficult and once you figure it out you will OWN that pulse group! Well not you singly but your group can.

    Oh you mean barrier stacking exploit? No thanks. I'd rather not exploit unintended features, but one barrier stands no chance in hell against 6 impulsers and guess what? you just burned your ulti, they likely have theirs ready still which could be something like a standard, nova, you know, more aoes.

    But besides barrier, please do explain what ability defense there is (oh and might I mention don't try the aoe knockdown argument such as fire-runes which are blockable, susceptible to immunity and very counter-intuitive to your argument -- I saw you try to make that fallacious argument earlier)

    You still forget that if in a 6v6, the side that impulses first while the other side doesn't suspect impulse gets an instant win. There is no ifs ands or buts about it.
    Edited by leewells on July 7, 2014 5:33PM
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  • Aeaeren
    Aeaeren
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    leewells wrote: »

    Oh you mean barrier stacking exploit? No thanks. I'd rather not exploit unintended features, but one barrier stands no chance in hell against 6 impulsers and guess what? you just burned your ulti, they likely have theirs ready still which could be something like a standard, nova, you know, more aoes.

    Is it an exploit? Show me where they said it is unintended as I am curious and I am not attacking you just curious. Look I get your point but I don't think this is an exploit at all and surely your idea of a fix for pulse is not the answer because as I said it completely kills the AoE spells and that would really make DKs WAY WAY OP. And once I whip your ass using bat wings, talons ect we will be right back here screaming about another adjustment. You could toss in Templars in that crowd as they can also cause reflecting. Impulse allows me to counter reflects as it isn't blocked. Luvboard is a complete pain in the ass to kill because he reflects almost everything ect but he can't reflect impulse and he still requires a group to bring him down. One or 2 people impulsing him is not going to win that battle.

    Also Negate magic destroys an impulse group and you don't have to stack that.
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  • leewells
    leewells
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    Aeaeren wrote: »
    leewells wrote: »

    Oh you mean barrier stacking exploit? No thanks. I'd rather not exploit unintended features, but one barrier stands no chance in hell against 6 impulsers and guess what? you just burned your ulti, they likely have theirs ready still which could be something like a standard, nova, you know, more aoes.

    Is it an exploit? Show me where they said it is unintended as I am curious and I am not attacking you just curious. Look I get your point but I don't think this is an exploit at all and surely your idea of a fix for pulse is not the answer because as I said it completely kills the AoE spells and that would really make DKs WAY WAY OP. And once I whip your ass using bat wings, talons ect we will be right back here screaming about another adjustment. You could toss in Templars in that crowd as they can also cause reflecting. Impulse allows me to counter reflects as it isn't blocked. Luvboard is a complete pain in the ass to kill because he reflects almost everything ect but he can't reflect impulse and he still requires a group to bring him down. One or 2 people impulsing him is not going to win that battle.

    http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/79356/pvp-bugs-balance-that-need-attention-now/p2

    Discussed right there and I think there is a link floating around in reddit that has ZOS saying that barrier stacking was addressed but not entirely in a patch when they found that the different "types" of barriers still stack.
    Aeaeren wrote: »
    Also Negate magic destroys an impulse group and you don't have to stack that.

    No, but it only takes one smart impulser to break the negate (its CC like a knockdown) while yelling in teamspeak "break cc", and, congrats, you successfully stopped impulse for 0.5 seconds. You still cannot survive 2.8K dps.

    Facts:
    1. Yes you can run impulsers out of stamina
    2. Yes you can run impulsers out of mana
    3. Impulsers will ALWAYS kill your group in a 6v6 before you achieve 1-2.
    Edited by leewells on July 7, 2014 5:51PM
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  • thelg
    thelg
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    Give Impulse 1.5 sec channel and make it hit 12 targets. No spammbale AOE should be instacast. Problem solved. Or nerf it to make it do same damage as whirlwind lol
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  • leewells
    leewells
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    thelg wrote: »
    Give Impulse 1.5 sec channel and make it hit 12 targets. No spammbale AOE should be instacast. Problem solved. Or nerf it to make it do same damage as whirlwind lol

    LOL you're really asking for the QQ fest.

    But I think you're on to something there... a cast time that can be interrupted, and make things that set you off balance like blinding light aoe interrupt and -- yes that makes me happy.
    Edited by leewells on July 7, 2014 6:00PM
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  • arnaldomoraleseb17_ESO
    Aeaeren wrote: »
    leewells wrote: »

    Oh you mean barrier stacking exploit? No thanks. I'd rather not exploit unintended features, but one barrier stands no chance in hell against 6 impulsers and guess what? you just burned your ulti, they likely have theirs ready still which could be something like a standard, nova, you know, more aoes.

    Is it an exploit? Show me where they said it is unintended as I am curious and I am not attacking you just curious. Look I get your point but I don't think this is an exploit at all and surely your idea of a fix for pulse is not the answer because as I said it completely kills the AoE spells and that would really make DKs WAY WAY OP. And once I whip your ass using bat wings, talons ect we will be right back here screaming about another adjustment. You could toss in Templars in that crowd as they can also cause reflecting. Impulse allows me to counter reflects as it isn't blocked. Luvboard is a complete pain in the ass to kill because he reflects almost everything ect but he can't reflect impulse and he still requires a group to bring him down. One or 2 people impulsing him is not going to win that battle.

    Also Negate magic destroys an impulse group and you don't have to stack that.


    Dude... Really... you are like the people that said shield bash was OK before Zenimax nerf it. You should try different builds and see the big difference.
    Debon Templar VR14 Thorn Blade (EU)
    Gaunnes DK VR14 Haderus (EU)
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  • Kewljag_66_ESO
    Kewljag_66_ESO
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    leewells wrote: »
    Dear ZOS,

    Have you looked at your PVP metrics lately? Have you wondered why everyone is carrying a resto or destro staff? Have you wondered why so many people wear cloth? Read this closely. This one issue is the root of most weapon balance issues. While I'm no expert, nor do I have your numbers and privy to your metrics, this seems to be both the issues of balance and my recommendations on how to start fixing them.

    As it stands the DPS of a destro staff is BETTER than the DPS of any other weapon in the game. That's right, any other weapon, including a 2handed sword, a dual wield, and of course sword and board.

    Lets not go into the shenanigans that this isn't the case and I'm not going to bore you with parses or the finer details (such as aoe damage vs single target and efficiency)

    ZOS is well aware that when it comes to DSP and efficiency, destro staves win the gold medal in every metric. This means most people and guilds in PVP lean heavily on the most OP items so you don't see swords in PVP any longer in elite guilds and groups (its very rare actually) and you don't see medium or heavy armor, you see only light.

    The reason these metrics are like this is because melee weapon damage is so weak; sure the attack and abilities are only say 20 less DPS, but look at the one major advantage of a destro staff -- RANGE. This trickles down to why heavy armor is useless -- which is because its just not needed, at all because most fights in PVP are at range and if they're not at range, you can't find a fight that doesn't have impulse spam on-going.

    The proposal is this: Sword and Board serves its purpose as providing the wielder with the sole purpose of tanking. However dual wield and two-handed weapons are SEVERELY lacking in damage. To be honest a two-handed weapon should be the best damage and dps in the game however requiring the wielder to be toe-to-toe with his/her foes.

    How does one go about balancing this without really screwing up the numbers? Its actually a lot simpler than one might think.

    TWO HANDED WEAPONS
    1) Grant a base critical chance of 10%
    2) Grant a critical bonus of 100% (a crit is 2x the damage)
    3) Abilities should be increased in damage by a factor of 30% <-- this is huge and needed
    4) Increase armor penetration of abilities and weapon damage by 5%
    5) Unsoftcap weapon damage -- this is dumb, nuff said
    6) Allow for a secondary enchantment (this is in the works I believe)

    DUAL WIELD
    1) Grant a base critical chance of 15%
    2) Grant a critical bonus of 50% (a crit is 1.5x the damage)
    3) Abilities should be increased in damage by a factor of 30%
    4) Real Flurries (a type of "critical" that will unleash 2 additional light attacks also capable of critting)

    BLOCKING
    1) Allow AOE's to be blocked
    2) Reduce DPS momentarily after blocking

    WHAT ABOUT SWORD AND BOARD?
    QQ more. As someone who wields this, you have the highest capability for armor; you can block effortlessly.
    1) Leave it as is.

    The Balance
    We must first of all attempt to quantify the benefits of ranged attacks. I'm not going to do that, but to be fair, any time you are at range, your survivability increases exponentially. Once you can quantify this, you have to factor this into why melee weapons and skills need such a large buff.

    The Trickling Down of Fixes
    Guess what? This would also FIX Nightblades and give them a reason to build on stamina.

    This would also likely fix many DK issues -- as they would likely want to gravitate back to stamina builds and have less magika for things like dragon blood and talon spam.

    This one little issue, again is the root of so many problems of balance in the game. It is the reason why people push so far from the cookie cutter with outlandish builds such as a nightblade that looks like a sorc and it can be fixed with these few simple tweaks.

    The problem is only light armor has magic resists and not many think to add magic resists on jewelry.

    If you gear yourself correctly you can run any armor with soft capped magic resists, you just need to get an enchanter to put it on your rings. A purple V1 enchantment is 410 magicc restist. Do this to 2 rings and your medium or heavy armor is a few hundred way over cap and your survivability is like night and day. All the sudden D staff is hurting you nearly as bad, and melee weapons are on par with it.

    I am a DW NB and while i would love those things you listed i would feel OPd then. Its all about Armor debuff comboes and procs. I use suprise attack which debuffs my targets armor by 40% then i have 2 weapon debuff procs of 600. So when i use my flurry i dishes out ALOT of damage.
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  • Aeaeren
    Aeaeren
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    Aeaeren wrote: »
    leewells wrote: »

    Oh you mean barrier stacking exploit? No thanks. I'd rather not exploit unintended features, but one barrier stands no chance in hell against 6 impulsers and guess what? you just burned your ulti, they likely have theirs ready still which could be something like a standard, nova, you know, more aoes.

    Is it an exploit? Show me where they said it is unintended as I am curious and I am not attacking you just curious. Look I get your point but I don't think this is an exploit at all and surely your idea of a fix for pulse is not the answer because as I said it completely kills the AoE spells and that would really make DKs WAY WAY OP. And once I whip your ass using bat wings, talons ect we will be right back here screaming about another adjustment. You could toss in Templars in that crowd as they can also cause reflecting. Impulse allows me to counter reflects as it isn't blocked. Luvboard is a complete pain in the ass to kill because he reflects almost everything ect but he can't reflect impulse and he still requires a group to bring him down. One or 2 people impulsing him is not going to win that battle.

    Also Negate magic destroys an impulse group and you don't have to stack that.


    Dude... Really... you are like the people that said shield bash was OK before Zenimax nerf it. You should try different builds and see the big difference.

    NO not really, I could care less if you want to play the easy way and nerf it. I will just make sure that I start my own nerf threads just as soon as they do it. OMG BLOCKING IS SOOO OP IT"S INSANE and if you ZOS don't fix it I am going to huff and puff and bluff my way out!

    Honestly you don't want to see my point about making AoE completely useless but hey I have 1h&b and in fact it will make me more powerful to use it then pulsar anyways.
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  • Aeaeren
    Aeaeren
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    ON second thought nerf it all as it is unplayable anyways and I am not renewing my sub at this time. This FPS bug is to over the top, 10 restarts in 30 minutes. Dead when I get the drop on the enemy because skills not work, name it. It's no longer any fun whatsoever so NERF the pulsar until it's useless.
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  • Bashev
    Bashev
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    Some players like AoE others don't. Currently AoE groups are more powerful than single target groups. Thats why I would like to have a campaign where no AoE skills are allowed --> http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/114541/can-we-have-a-campaign-where-all-aoe-dps-skills-are-disabled
    You can chose where you want to PvP.
    Because I can!
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  • Aeaeren
    Aeaeren
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    Bashev wrote: »
    Some players like AoE others don't. Currently AoE groups are more powerful than single target groups. Thats why I would like to have a campaign where no AoE skills are allowed --> http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/114541/can-we-have-a-campaign-where-all-aoe-dps-skills-are-disabled
    You can chose where you want to PvP.

    Now I can agree with this one.
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  • MightyHarken
    MightyHarken
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    I agree. two handers need a really big buff. either defensively, or offensively
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  • Soris
    Soris
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    Dat necro
    ThreadNecromancer.jpg
    Welkynd [Templar/AD/EU]
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