Where does ZOS stand on VR difficulty?

Dayv

This isn't intended to be another discussion about personal opinions on VR difficulty, rather what ZOS's reaction to it. Reading through the forums, it's clearly a contentious issue. Some people like, others think it's too hard. I can't see anything in any communictations from ZOS where they say they consider it to be roughly about right or currently too hard. Please direct me to anywhere they have. In the last road-ahead, they briefly alluded to improvements to VR, but with no mention of difficulty. I'm sure they cannot be ignorant of the strong views on this.

Isn't about time ZOS made some statement about this, as they have with other issues?

nerevarine1138

They've been tuning the difficulty elsewhere in the game, so one can assume that VR difficulty is where it's intended to be.

edu.journeymanub17_ESO

It started here:

forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/100599/vr-difficulty-change/p1

Craglorn patch day at NA server, and before EU patch, if you read over there you will see the staff posts and the hotfix.

Worstluck

It's not changing, at least any time soon, so I imagine the VR areas (at least during my play time) will remain a ghost town. They buffed the NPC's in 1.1.2 and really didn't put it in the patch notes. They buffed up the HP insanely, but then hotfixed it, but did nothing about the damage. There's been quite a few posts on the issue, and some have a community mod response, but after the initial appearance, they never return.

I've tried veteran content on the current PTS and it's still the same. Some NPC's still just spam special attacks and cast 2k spells randomly (it's not a death recap issue when you go from 2k health to dead).

edu.journeymanub17_ESO

Some of the guys that think it is alright played through veteran zones BEFORE Craglorn patch and don't know what happened there with the patch and with the hotfix that ZoS put the day after.

Most come and say, by their own experience, that you need L2P, unfortunately, their experience with veteran zones was not the same as it is right now.

Bromburak

Dayv wrote: »

This isn't intended to be another discussion about personal opinions on VR difficulty, rather what ZOS's reaction to it. Reading through the forums, it's clearly a contentious issue. Some people like, others think it's too hard. I can't see anything in any communictations from ZOS where they say they consider it to be roughly about right or currently too hard. Please direct me to anywhere they have. In the last road-ahead, they briefly alluded to improvements to VR, but with no mention of difficulty. I'm sure they cannot be ignorant of the strong views on this.

Isn't about time ZOS made some statement about this, as they have with other issues?

They did when it was harder after a patch by mistake so they have explained how it should be and there was no reason for further adjustements.

But they have also mentioned that they want to raise soft caps and work on balancing between certain classes carefully and that rewards will have better stats.

So basically Player Vet levels will be much stronger in the future.

Phantax

Difficulty in VR... What difficulty in VR ???

Worstluck

Yes I played through it before the 1.1.2 patch and had a really good time. Sure there were challenges with quest and solo dungeon bosses, I died a bunch trying to take on world bosses, but quests seemed balanced, they just didn't give enough reward imo (VP). I can really notice the difference as now there are many things (solo dungeons, quest areas) that even at VR12 I can't do anymore, when I did them at VR9 with MUCH worse gear and spec.

nerevarine1138

Guys, please stop hijacking the thread with complaints about the bug that was already fixed. If you think you've found a bugged VR mob that wasn't hotfixed back to its regular stats, report it in-game. I've run in to very few of those, so they certainly have no bearing on a general discussion about VR difficulty.

Sharee

edu.journeymanub17_ESO wrote: »

Some of the guys that think it is alright played through veteran zones BEFORE Craglorn patch and don't know what happened there with the patch and with the hotfix that ZoS put the day after.

Most come and say, by their own experience, that you need L2P, unfortunately, their experience with veteran zones was not the same as it is right now.

I am VR3 right now, medium armor, nightblade, dw melee. No issues.

sigsergv

In Craglorn and Cyrodiil mobs hit much less than in VR-areas, hell, I even able to solo 3-pack of giant lizard-like creatures!. I can easily clean up Ayiled ruines infested by casters in Cyrodiil, I can clear Cyrodiil dungeon from spiders/spriggans, and my character is Templar. And in VR5 area facing two casters is almost 100% death. So I think it's a bug that must be acknowledged at least.

Dayv

Bromburak wrote: »

But they have also mentioned that they want to raise soft caps and work on balancing between certain classes carefully and that rewards will have better stats.

I did see that, but it's difficult to conclude much from that. Are they perhaps sitting on the fence a bit?

Phantax

Sharee wrote: »

edu.journeymanub17_ESO wrote: »

Some of the guys that think it is alright played through veteran zones BEFORE Craglorn patch and don't know what happened there with the patch and with the hotfix that ZoS put the day after.

Most come and say, by their own experience, that you need L2P, unfortunately, their experience with veteran zones was not the same as it is right now.

I am VR3 right now, medium armor, nightblade, dw melee. No issues.

Well there are two of your problems right away... NB and melee !
And VR is technically easier now, they nerfed the mobs remember ! Yes VR is still insainly hard but that's the whole point !

edu.journeymanub17_ESO

Worstluck wrote: »

Some NPC's still just spam special attacks and cast 2k spells randomly (it's not a death recap issue when you go from 2k health to dead).

I can illustrate that exactly in a single screenshot, one mob do 14 damage and the other 2232... one fight, dead in less than 1 second, VR9 Eastmarch, yesterday:



Pay attention to this screenshot, you can see that there are 5 NPCs over there, it was in The Hall of the Dead, a group dungeon that I was soloing to get the skyshard, the 16th in the zone. The other 3 NPCs didn't even got a chance to hit me and people say that I didn't react in time... go figure.

Sharee

Phantax wrote: »

Sharee wrote: »

edu.journeymanub17_ESO wrote: »

Some of the guys that think it is alright played through veteran zones BEFORE Craglorn patch and don't know what happened there with the patch and with the hotfix that ZoS put the day after.

Most come and say, by their own experience, that you need L2P, unfortunately, their experience with veteran zones was not the same as it is right now.

I am VR3 right now, medium armor, nightblade, dw melee. No issues.

Well there are two of your problems right away... NB and melee !
And VR is technically easier now, they nerfed the mobs remember ! Yes VR is still insainly hard but that's the whole point !

Ehm... i said i have NO issues. That means i am doing quests etc. just fine.

;-)

nerevarine1138

edu.journeymanub17_ESO wrote: »

Worstluck wrote: »

Some NPC's still just spam special attacks and cast 2k spells randomly (it's not a death recap issue when you go from 2k health to dead).

I can illustrate that exactly in a single screenshot, one mob do 14 damage and the other 2232... one fight, dead in less than 1 second, VR9 Eastmarch, yesterday:

Report. Bugs. In. The. Game.

That has nothing to do with this thread.

Dayv

Please guys, I was hoping for this thread not to be about the current difficulty and whether you like it or not, there's plenty of threads about that, but what the future direction is going to be.

Sharee

edu.journeymanub17_ESO wrote: »

Worstluck wrote: »

Some NPC's still just spam special attacks and cast 2k spells randomly (it's not a death recap issue when you go from 2k health to dead).

I can illustrate that exactly in a single screenshot, one mob do 14 damage and the other 2232... one fight, dead in less than 1 second, VR9 Eastmarch, yesterday:

I am fairly sure volley is a ground-targeted AOE ability.

You stood in the fire, so to say.

seaef

edu.journeymanub17_ESO wrote: »

Worstluck wrote: »

Some NPC's still just spam special attacks and cast 2k spells randomly (it's not a death recap issue when you go from 2k health to dead).

I can illustrate that exactly in a single screenshot, one mob do 14 damage and the other 2232... one fight, dead in less than 1 second, VR9 Eastmarch, yesterday:

Hey! Guess which one you should target first and keep them from doing that amount of damage?

Worstluck

Dayv wrote: »

Please guys, I was hoping for this thread not to be about the current difficulty and whether you like it or not, there's plenty of threads about that, but what the future direction is going to be.

It's going to be hard to do that Any thread on difficulty gets it's fair share of the l2p crowd (as seen above).

There are definitely some balance issues with VR npc's and I too would like to hear from ZoS about it.

Sharee

Dayv wrote: »

Please guys, I was hoping for this thread not to be about the current difficulty and whether you like it or not, there's plenty of threads about that, but what the future direction is going to be.

Well that future direction depends on whether there is an issue or not. I think there isn't one, at least not in the v1-v5 area (i didn't experience the v6 and above yet)

GFBStarWars

im interested too, now I'm just playing a dying simulator.

Bromburak

The screenshot doesn't show how you have started. Reflection, shields, any other proccs etc.. As well the volley is a ground target and you actually did not get out early enough so you take a lot of damage.

As well you should dodge roll on first aggro because most mobs start with a heavy attack and you want them to screw up their opener ...

Sharee

GFBStarWars wrote: »

im interested too, now I'm just playing a dying simulator.

Watch the enemies. Dodge-roll out of their AOE indicators. Block their heavy attacks. Bash their spellcasts. If that's not enough, ask for class-specific help.

For example me as a NB, i mark the most dangerous target - usually a healer, fire caster(i'm a vamp), necromancer-type(they have very low hp and can be one-shot).

Concealed weapon->heavy attack->impale, and one of 3 enemies is dead before the other two can aggro. Cloak -> get behind second target-> conc. weapon -> heavy attack , now usually the 3rd is charging a heavy attack so block, this will stun the 3rd for a few seconds, finish the 2nd. Now it's just a 1v1.

edu.journeymanub17_ESO

Worstluck wrote: »

Dayv wrote: »

Please guys, I was hoping for this thread not to be about the current difficulty and whether you like it or not, there's plenty of threads about that, but what the future direction is going to be.

It's going to be hard to do that Any thread on difficulty gets it's fair share of the l2p crowd (as seen above).

There are definitely some balance issues with VR npc's and I too would like to hear from ZoS about it.

Indeed, well, I would like they at least, pay attention to the screenshot, see the 5 undead NPCs around my corpse in the dark background, be aware that I was soloing a VR9 group dungeon (Hall of the Dead) at level to get the skyshard just because there were not a single person over there in the zone to group or follow and the other 3 NPCs din't even got a chance to hit me. It seems, it will be my fault, no matter the arguing, the facts. BTW, I got the shard, and was not gem-resurrecting and passing as ghost by them, and if you guys know the dungeon you know the skyshard is not at the entrance, to the contrary, LoL.

Daethz

Gargoyles, Ice and Storm Antronarches are rigged.
So is that one casted vine stun spell that some mobs have, it effectivly stuns you for like ten seconds allowing the mobs to beat you to death meanwhile with no way to break out of it.

firstdecan

Dayv wrote: »

This isn't intended to be another discussion about personal opinions on VR difficulty, rather what ZOS's reaction to it. Reading through the forums, it's clearly a contentious issue. Some people like, others think it's too hard. I can't see anything in any communictations from ZOS where they say they consider it to be roughly about right or currently too hard. Please direct me to anywhere they have. In the last road-ahead, they briefly alluded to improvements to VR, but with no mention of difficulty. I'm sure they cannot be ignorant of the strong views on this.

Isn't about time ZOS made some statement about this, as they have with other issues?

Is it the "difficulty" that ZOS needs to comment on, or the enjoyment. For the most part I think very few people enjoy the VR content, but they fall into one of two camps:

1 - It's too hard
2 - It's too grindy \ boring

(IMO, the only difference between group 1 and 2 is players who have figured out build synergies that work well).

I agree with you, this doesn't need to be another "VR is fine l2p" thread. Most people do not enjoy the VR content, and it would be nice to hear from ZOS as to how they're interpreting the feedback and what design changes they're contemplating to address it.

edu.journeymanub17_ESO

Sharee wrote: »

GFBStarWars wrote: »

im interested too, now I'm just playing a dying simulator.

Watch the enemies. Dodge-roll out of their AOE indicators. Block their heavy attacks. Bash their spellcasts. If that's not enough, ask for class-specific help.

For example me as a NB, i mark the most dangerous target - usually a healer, fire caster(i'm a vamp), necromancer-type(they have very low hp and can be one-shot).

Concealed weapon->heavy attack->impale, and one of 3 enemies is dead before the other two can aggro. Cloak -> get behind second target-> conc. weapon -> heavy attack , now usually the 3rd is charging a heavy attack so block, this will stun the 3rd for a few seconds, finish the 2nd. Now it's just a 1v1.

Funny thing, I do the same on my NB, unfortunately my DK lack some skills... it's a DK over there in the screenshot, I would not dare fight 5 of them with NB and would just pass the group on stealth if I was in the same situation, just get the skyshard. A vamp have more chance with that non fire based NPCs, sure.

Sharee

edu.journeymanub17_ESO wrote: »

Sharee wrote: »

GFBStarWars wrote: »

im interested too, now I'm just playing a dying simulator.

Watch the enemies. Dodge-roll out of their AOE indicators. Block their heavy attacks. Bash their spellcasts. If that's not enough, ask for class-specific help.

For example me as a NB, i mark the most dangerous target - usually a healer, fire caster(i'm a vamp), necromancer-type(they have very low hp and can be one-shot).

Concealed weapon->heavy attack->impale, and one of 3 enemies is dead before the other two can aggro. Cloak -> get behind second target-> conc. weapon -> heavy attack , now usually the 3rd is charging a heavy attack so block, this will stun the 3rd for a few seconds, finish the 2nd. Now it's just a 1v1.

Funny thing, I do the same on my NB, unfortunately my DK lack some skills... it's a DK over there in the screenshot, I would not dare fight 5 of them with NB and would just pass the group on stealth if I was in the same situation, just get the skyshard. A vamp have more chance with that non fire based NPCs, sure.

Can't comment on DK yet as mine is only level 40 atm.

However, i went to alik'r desert (mob levels 33-37) when i was level 25, and completed the zone when i was level 30. I do not expect having trouble in vet areas.(medium armor, 2H sword DK)

sigsergv

I really like to hear ZSO spokeperson. Just tell us: “It's working as intended” or “This is a bug and will be fixed”. For exactly this issue.

I've sent a few bug reports and never got any confirmation it was accepted so I'm thinking they are just ignored. And this forum is the only place where we can get an answer. And answer should be very simple, as I stated above, just two choices: feature or bug.

edit So I agree, let's not spam this thread by complaints, just wait for official answer.