Why Do We Fight? Apparently to have ZeniMax Shut Down Your PvP Server

TheGrandAlliance · June 2014

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/107716/upcoming-campaign-changes

I did not start playing ESO; to establish server community, loyalty, and faction unity, only for it to all be wiped at the end. Granted: Many PvP servers are dead... but not all are. EU Dawnbreaker, for one, is still plenty active and has an established community no thanks to my tireless efforts.

I have spent 20+days /played establishing relations between players and guilds, even guild alliances, relations server-wide (even opposing factions), and even relations between servers. Due to these efforts: It is why my server has such a balanced combat between blue vs red (sometimes yellow) and battles can be hotly contested. Ebonheart might be winning (me) but Daggerfall when willing can take it all away.

The 90-day period, although long to some, makes the struggle into an epic battle for control: You simply cannot surge/night camp your way to victory. You have to hold a map for a very long time which tests the true nature of people's PvP skills. By destroying this in favor of new and only short-term campaigns: Why did I even bother with this game?

Futhermore, for my server at least (and others in theory), there is the name: Dawnbreaker, the weapon of Meridia... which of course in effect is the main "force"/Daedra who's power is used to destroy Molag Bal (combined with the player). As to why this would be removed is only for technical reasons it apppears.

Indeed I have been extremely loyal to this game given its issues: If everything I have worked for is about to get wiped off the face of the map... I do not understand the point of it all anymore, nor the 14.99USD/month fee thereof. As "server commander" (Ebonheart) of EU Dawnbreaker: I hereby protest this action of Zenimax.

Why do we Fight? It appears for no reason at all in Tamriel 2E 582.

Izatar · June 2014

I have spent 20+days /played establishing relations between players and guilds, even guild alliances, relations server-wide (even opposing factions)

You may think this is a heroic thing, but to me, when I hear you are organizing with opposing factions, I see collusion and castle trading, not legitimate warfare.

TheGrandAlliance · June 2014

@Izatar‌

IT is a 3-way War Izatar... and sometimes, especially the weakest factions, have to work together for a common purpose. If one faction has 3 bars of population and the others 1: They will never win if they don't work together.

"Legitimate Warfare" is a myth: There are no rules in War. Only Life and Death...

Futhermore... to organize tournaments and the like (such as 1v1) such communication is also possible. Just telling the army who /wipe you gj, or perhaps the other way around, promoted good relations.

Even the NPC faction leaders in-game on the main story questline talk to each other...

Igolbug · June 2014

I bought the 6 month subscription because I was having a blast and thought this game was going to be epic.

Almost the day after I found out aboot the caltrops bug, then the lag patch came, and now they are going to shut down a server where as you said I have made some friends, have my name out there and LOVE the name of.

What a waste of *** money.

Natjur · June 2014

With so many players un-subbing due to the bugs from beta still unfixed, so may bots and then finding at V12 your class is unwanted...... They have to save money so how to keep the game afloat, so they are releasing the lease on some servers.

TheGrandAlliance · June 2014

Natjur wrote: »

With so many players un-subbing due to the bugs from beta still unfixed, so may bots and then finding at V12 your class is unwanted...... They have to save money so how to keep the game afloat, so they are releasing the lease on some servers.

Yes... but there are like 8 servers at the moment: Why do they have to shut down the 2,3/8 servers per region that work? Why disrupt all communities, for no reason, instead of simply adding to the game as is?

This is like a game with fixed servers, such as WoW, to announce randomly one day that "they will shut down all servers and open up new ones". Why did we even start playing on Early Release if everything that we did will just be destroyed in the end?

Samadhi · June 2014

Wait, so they are shutting down all current campaigns and reducing the entire list to 5 campaigns?

This is great news.

TheGrandAlliance wrote: »

...Why did we even start playing on Early Release if everything that we did will just be destroyed in the end?

I don't know about you, but I was in Cyrodiil at level 10 on the first day of Early Access so that I could PvP people.
I care about the action more than the leader boards, and culling the fat with the excessive campaigns is a great way to promote that.

TheGrandAlliance · June 2014

Samadhi wrote: »

Wait, so they are shutting down all current campaigns and reducing the entire list to 5 campaigns?

This is great news.

I don't know about you, but I was in Cyrodiil at level 10 on the first day of Early Access so that I could PvP people.
I care about the action more than the leader boards, and culling the fat with the excessive campaigns is a great way to promote that.

I don't care about leaderboards, and who can exploit the game fastest, either. The point of having servers however is to have communities. Factions need them to organize and players need them to justify the MMO of the MMORPG game. There is more to Video Games then just "killing" pixels you know...

By nuking the campaigns... you destroy whatever "server loyalty" exists, and thus preclude any further attempts to restart it. Why should I care about my faction/server if ZeniMax is just gonna nuke it a few weeks/months from now? Why should I help other players (of same faction) when every week I am just gonna see a bunch of new random players?

Indeed... This game is NOT some "small group based" MOBA... it is a large scale battle that spans time. By "nerfing" it into basically a battleground of other MMORPGs: You destroy the core reason Cyrodiil exists in the first place.

If you want "Rated Battlegrounds", which make no doubt short-term campaigns are in effect, again the door to WoW's PvP (a joke that is) is <<<<<<

Samadhi · June 2014

TheGrandAlliance wrote: »

...
By nuking the campaigns... you destroy whatever "server loyalty" exists, and thus preclude any further attempts to restart it. Why should I care about my faction/server if ZeniMax is just gonna nuke it a few weeks/months from now? Why should I help other players (of same faction) when every week I am just gonna see a bunch of new random players?

Indeed... This game is NOT some "small group based" MOBA... it is a large scale battle that spans time. By "nerfing" it into basically a battleground of other MMORPGs: You destroy the core reason Cyrodiil exists in the first place.
...

I care about the well-being of my alliance rather than my campaign.
If Daggerfall puts a call out for PvPers to help in a campaign that isn't my home, I Guest to help them out.
I recognize players in the Vet zones from multiple PvP campaigns, rather than just one.

Campaign-centric loyalty doesn't mean much to me in an Alliance-based game where all my teammates have the ability to fluidly assist in other campaigns.

Can't relate to the issue you are seeing. NA server and Daggerfall alliance is my community.

TheGrandAlliance · June 2014

Samadhi wrote: »

Campaign-centric loyalty doesn't mean much to me in an Alliance-based game where all my teammates have the ability to fluidly assist in other campaigns.

Can't relate to the issue you are seeing. NA server and Daggerfall alliance is my community.

Alas... you failed to read the part of proposed changes that includes guesting 3-day lockout and massive AP cost for home transfers.

The game mechanics do not allow for easy movement socialy or mechanically (nor should it) between the servers. Are we fighting for an Alliance? Yes. But which Cyrodiil is "the real Cyrodiil"?

Furthermore allowing rapid guesting movements as is the current system only makes broken system more broken. If players can bounce between them then why do we even have server scores in the first place? The winner would only go to whomever can "bounce their guild to nightcamp the map" best and not actually who is the best PvPer faction for a server.

Perhaps if you spent some time Outside America lands it would be more clear. IN Eurozone there are many nationalities. They cannot just "bounce back and forth" as easily as Wnglish-based communities. It takes long enough just to figure out how to speak each others langauges/customs let alone organizing things.

In either case... changes to guesting disvows your logic nonetheless. Can you be "loyal" to a faction? Only for a 72 hour time periods it appears.

Samadhi · June 2014

TheGrandAlliance wrote: »

Samadhi wrote: »

Campaign-centric loyalty doesn't mean much to me in an Alliance-based game where all my teammates have the ability to fluidly assist in other campaigns.

Can't relate to the issue you are seeing. NA server and Daggerfall alliance is my community.

Alas... you failed to read the part that guesting includes 3 day lockout and massive AP cost for home transfers.

I don't need to transfer my Home around with any sort of frequency, and 3 days lock on Guesting works fine by me -- just means I need to pick my battles to help in.

As long as they don't take 100k AP to set a new Home campaign the first time after the old ones are removed, this presents me no issue.

Kronosphere · June 2014

woah so i got this idea, check it out yo. umm use your awesome communication skills (they are epic btw) aaaaaaand say this. its like prbs 5-6 words and itll solve everything, ok u ready? HEY.GUYS. LETS. JOIN. X. SERVER. <-- solved stop qqing

TheGrandAlliance · June 2014

Kronosphere wrote: »

woah so i got this idea, check it out yo. umm use your awesome communication skills (they are epic btw) aaaaaaand say this. its like prbs 5-6 words and itll solve everything, ok u ready? HEY.GUYS. LETS. JOIN. X. SERVER. <-- solved stop qqing

I will refer to you to a good post I made on another thread that explains the situation thereof:

TheGrandAlliance wrote: »

1. They are not "my players"; I do not "own" them, slavery is illegal and impractical you know. They will go where they want to.
2. Me Like me Name of me server (Dawnbreaker) and it's lore thereof.
3. Doesn't work if there is no 90 day == to go to
4. New playstyles will divert up players. Sub vets won't likely be in same as vets. Having a bunch of short term servers and one long term one will not provide such space.
4. You are still nuking 3 months +20 days /played of effort (and of me life).

I guess migrating Jewish popultions out of Gaza, or Muslim populations out of, well, everwhere is such an easy concept. Middle East Crisis? Solved. Lets just move all minorities out of where we don't want them because; well, they should just stop whining. True in a global sense as well.

Lets just stop using Windows and move to Macs, because they are SOO better. Stop whining. Lets just stop eating food we have been for 1000s of years, because O NO some dude thinks it isn't healthy for you, but cannot provide any proof thereof. O wait... lets just bail planet Earth all together; you know, its pointless, Global Warming is just gonna turn it into Venus anyways.

Logic like yours is a dangerous concept. Even if ESO IS a Video Game: It shall never be tolerated by Honorable and Noble peoples of the Realms...

nukeyoo · June 2014

Kronosphere wrote: »

woah so i got this idea, check it out yo. umm use your awesome communication skills (they are epic btw) aaaaaaand say this. its like prbs 5-6 words and itll solve everything, ok u ready? HEY.GUYS. LETS. JOIN. X. SERVER. <-- solved stop qqing

No you see this won't work because....
a.) There's new servers and all the community that was built and available to be communicated with will be there up until the changes...
b.) We just learned how to communicate with each other but with the upcoming changes we will forget how to.
c.) I've worked so hard to make a name for myself. At the character creation screen I typed 7 letters and now there's a COMPLETELY NEW SERVER. ALL MY WORK IS LOST.
d.) When the changes come and my server is gone and we tell each other where to go there will be so much confusion in figuring out which one of the servers we originally decided to because its hard to remember things like that with less choices to choose from.

So you see your idea won't work because it would only work if my listed reasons weren't making it not work like its unemployed and looking for welfare checks. Geez acquire a clue...

TheGrandAlliance · June 2014

Apparently you did just fine in Middle>High School. Or so you claim of course.

Communities don't work like that... your ideas of them are a fantasy. Not everyone particpates at the "same degree of Hard Core ness". Some players are casual. If the server shuts down they are more likely just to quit. Some will spend time exploring other servers. Being that there is only one 30 day one.. IDK how you can even fit EU's population into one server in either case.

All I can say is that your understanding of the Universe is a Most Naive One Indeed...

ThyIronFist · June 2014

Why do you keep saying that its "your" campaign. That "oh I have worked so hard for eveything". So have I, and many of my fellow guildies have done the same.

I am on Dawnbreaker as well. Hell, the Emperor on the EP side of EU Dawnbreaker is a greedy AP ***. There, I said it. He has... what now, 11 million AP? And is #1 on the leaderboards and he does not want anyone but him to be Emperor. AD has dozens of Former Emperors, DC has dozens of them, and the EP...? I think there was 1 dude with Former Emperor, but I don't think he's still around.

BUT... Some of us ex-Dawnbreakers even went to a different campaign (Celarus) to get Emperor there - and we succeeded. We left everything behind, some of us were in the top leaderboards at Dawnbreaker - we left all our progress behind us just so we could recieve our Former Emperor buffs, and even out the odds. We have no-lifed 15+ hours a day for the past 2 weeks, just to get our buffs, and then go back to Dawnbreaker and kick some smurf arse.

We have all worked hard, and I appreciate it. Protest all you want, it wont accomplish anything.

- Sainur Ironfist

TheGrandAlliance · June 2014

...Yes I am aware "The Renegades" guild /ragequit and went emperor farming. However the Emperor title wasn't designed to be farmed, and having a current one who understand this and also understands the reward of finishing first, is appreciated.

Alas... not all of us are quick to bail because you couldn't get your way like your guild is.

nukeyoo · June 2014

reported

who's naive in the universe? cuz if you're talking about me I know all about the multi-verse. I will be the one.

frwinters_ESO · June 2014

TheGrandAlliance wrote: »

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/107716/upcoming-campaign-changes

I did not start playing ESO; to establish server community, loyalty, and faction unity, only for it to all be wiped at the end. Granted: Many PvP servers are dead... but not all are. EU Dawnbreaker, for one, is still plenty active and has an established community no thanks to my tireless efforts.

I have spent 20+days /played establishing relations between players and guilds, even guild alliances, relations server-wide (even opposing factions), and even relations between servers. Due to these efforts: It is why my server has such a balanced combat between blue vs red (sometimes yellow) and battles can be hotly contested. Ebonheart might be winning (me) but Daggerfall when willing can take it all away.

The 90-day period, although long to some, makes the struggle into an epic battle for control: You simply cannot surge/night camp your way to victory. You have to hold a map for a very long time which tests the true nature of people's PvP skills. By destroying this in favor of new and only short-term campaigns: Why did I even bother with this game?

Futhermore, for my server at least (and others in theory), there is the name: Dawnbreaker, the weapon of Meridia... which of course in effect is the main "force"/Daedra who's power is used to destroy Molag Bal (combined with the player). As to why this would be removed is only for technical reasons it apppears.

Indeed I have been extremely loyal to this game given its issues: If everything I have worked for is about to get wiped off the face of the map... I do not understand the point of it all anymore, nor the 14.99USD/month fee thereof. As "server commander" (Ebonheart) of EU Dawnbreaker: I hereby protest this action of Zenimax.

Why do we Fight? It appears for no reason at all in Tamriel 2E 582.

You come across as having a god complex with severe narcissism in all of your posts. Your not better then anyone here. Zenimax is fixing a well known problem with population and the majority of the people here are on board. If you have a great relationship with other commanders on the server, and that you all talk to each other in the reg, then start talking on which place you want to go, then go. Very simple.

Your not important. Stop acting like it.

Vampiresbane · June 2014

TheGrandAlliance wrote: »

By nuking the campaigns... you destroy whatever "server loyalty" exists, and thus preclude any further attempts to restart it. Why should I care about my faction/server if ZeniMax is just gonna nuke it a few weeks/months from now? Why should I help other players (of same faction) when every week I am just gonna see a bunch of new random players?

Indeed... This game is NOT some "small group based" MOBA... it is a large scale battle that spans time. By "nerfing" it into basically a battleground of other MMORPGs: You destroy the core reason Cyrodiil exists in the first place.

If you want "Rated Battlegrounds", which make no doubt short-term campaigns are in effect, again the door to WoW's PvP (a joke that is) is <<<<<<

While I sometimes can't read your writing half the time, don't agree with most of your comments, and I think you are a tad on the crazy side, I and the guild Old Guard from EU Dawnbreaker Daggerfall, agree completely with the fact that the EU Dawnbreaker campaign should be left the F alone.

Don't fix what ain't broke Zenimax. EU Dawnbreaker campaign is just fine.

TheGrandAlliance · June 2014

frwinters_ESO wrote: »

You come across as having a god complex with severe narcissism in all of your posts. Your not better then anyone here. Zenimax is fixing a well known problem with population and the majority of the people here are on board. If you have a great relationship with other commanders on the server, and that you all talk to each other in the reg, then start talking on which place you want to go, then go. Very simple.

Your not important. Stop acting like it.

Look: You are making stuff up. Wars need Generals to lead. Factions need commanders. Else you have a bunch of headless chickens running around doing nothing.

I somehow doubt Allies would have won WWII without various generals that lead them to victory. Rome would just be a puny country without its Emperors. So on so forth.

In terms of my role in all of this... I have offered many times in-game such leadership to others; but either because they don't want it, or because they don't think it is necessary, nobody answers the call.

So please... Nuking my server, or even the other ones on EU, to make a bunch of crybaby Americans feel better, is a waste of time alas INdeed...

TheGrandAlliance · June 2014

Vampiresbane wrote: »

While I sometimes can't read your writing half the time, don't agree with most of your comments, and I think you are a tad on the crazy side, I and the guild Old Guard from EU Dawnbreaker Daggerfall, agree completely with the fact that the EU Dawnbreaker campaign should be left the F alone.

Don't fix what ain't broke Zenimax. EU Dawnbreaker campaign is just fine.

Thanks... I do appoglize if my style is a bit hard to understand... although that is intentional sometimes.

Kaytlin · June 2014

Here we go again!
"TheGrandAlliance" is all you do start new threads complaining about how the poor European players are being trampled on? It would seem that is your goal in life whine!
The game was not designed only for European players, so if the developers are trying to encourage more people to play by trying to find a mix that will please the majority of players give them a chance!

TheGrandAlliance · June 2014

Kaytlin wrote: »

Here we go again!
"TheGrandAlliance" is all you do start new threads complaining about how the poor European players are being trampled on? It would seem that is your goal in life whine!
The game was not designed only for European players, so if the developers are trying to encourage more people to play by trying to find a mix that will please the majority of players give them a chance!

...and who said US/EUROPE HAD to share the same model for everything?...