How to deal with bots (fan made suggestion).

Mescalamba · May 2014

Ok, this isnt as you probably expect "community creation", but I think a lot of thinking actually is sort of "creation". Well, here you go. My solution to some TESO issues. Feel free to comment. I tried to make it easy to implement.

Light (easy) variant
Problem:
Bots make multiple characters to abuse quests/game itself.

Solution:
Cooldown on character delete. You can create 8 characters, but you cant delete them within certain period of time since creation. To be precise, you cant delete them within 24 hours (also more characters you have, longer is "cooldown").

Quest abuse solved (without need to actually change quests).

Problem:
Bots go in places where they shouldnt. Sorta low-level issue. While I like "you can explore whatever you want" way of thinking, if you go outside your "natural" zone, everything can kill you pretty fast anyway.

Solution:
So like it was with Guild creation, until you are level 10, not only you cant go to Cyrodiil, you cant go anywhere except starting area. First 10 levels are reasonably fast and easy for normal players, so it really shouldnt be an issue. Since a lot of people play for PvP and they dont have issue with that, I see no reason why others should. And no Im not exactly fan of PvP.

Problem:
Bots abuse nodes, steal from players.

Solution:
Nodes are "player only", like containers type of drawers etc. They will have 30-60 minutes cooldown (respawn timer). I leave exact time upon you, but in Skyrim, there was even hint "come back after some time, there will be flowers again". I see no reason why it shouldnt be that way. Maybe slight buff to deconstruction. Also cooldown will be "account based" not character based (like those drawers).

These solutions are I think pretty player friendly while being heavily bot unfriendly.

Hardcore variant
I will write down only changes against "light".

Player can make only 4 characters, until they reach level 50. Im against myself on this, cause Im altoholic (I have 6 chars and 1 bank char). But in this case, its simply for greater good. Yea I know, greater good is very dangerous thing, in this case its really for better. Make community vote (another suggestion) if you want.

Im still for exploring, except Coldharbour would be like VR stuff, off-limits till you have quest. No guildie teleport.
Also guildie teleport on cooldown for everyone (1 per 30 minutes or so.. nothing too drastic, just like heartstone in certain not-mentioned game). Port-on-guildie defies teleport system in game now anyway. But, keep phase syncing teleport on party. Thats pretty much needed due your design.

Now, Im not sure if bots are using multiboxing and "one account for 8 bots", or 8 separated accounts for 8 bots. If it is first case, well.. one account can have only one character active at any given time. Period. In case you think otherwise, please go and play another game. I think multiboxing is as much evil for MMOs as is goldspam.

Ugly hardcore prevention to "easy make another char". Well, not really ugly..

Tutorial area isnt skippable. Thats till you are lvl 50, then you can. It isnt that hard and frankly I think you made mistake even with skipping starter islands cause it messed up leveling for people and also made hole into the story. You should never listen to whiners. It destroys ANY game. Also starter islands are fastest way for level up and now most people is actually looking "how can I go there". That was seriously worst decision so far.

I know it wouldnt be easy now, but if it was by me "starter islands are not skippable either". After that, play as you wish.

Well, Im quite positive that if you implemented at least "light" version, you would have much less issues with bots (if any). While having grateful players on other hand.

I have also one crazy idea about gold and few fun ideas about login/character creation. Thats in case you are further interested into my ideas.

Best regards, Mescalamba (EU server .. one of them depending on phase)

Lord_Wrath · May 2014

TOO LONG DIDNT READ!

Nah jk, I like the character creation cooldown, but I would give it a week instead of 24 hours. I don't see much reason why someone can't manage 8 characters to begin with, and it really would slow the amount of bots. Combine that with more in game mods banning bots and they can get better control on the situation.

Mescalamba · May 2014

Yes, I know its long.. no way to make it short.

I had idea with either "fixed" cooldown not depending on how much chars you have or this:

1st char - 24 hours "cooldown" for delete
2nd char - 48 hours
...
7th char - 168 hours

Sorta stacking debuff. No issue for normal players, I assume rather big issue for botters or quest abusers.

Manamane · May 2014

If you really want to take an extreme stance against bots. Do this. All items and gold are account bound. Only method of trade is through Friends list or guild transaction. Restrict Mailing to people only on your friends list, or within your guild(s). Now the Gold sellers can't freely trade off goods so easily. This will also stop the harassing old spam mail with titles like "Raw Materials" or "Item Sold".

Bots most of the time run on a unmonitored program. Add a button to the Report function marked "Bot", and report to character. Have this action prompt an AFK warning, and start a 10-30 second count down. To stop the auto log-off, the person behind the computer must type in the given emote to prevent an auto-log off kick. Then place in effect, a counter. For each time the account suffers this "Auto Log-off kick" you face a log in penalty. something like 1 hour suspention, compounding per strike. At the 10th strike, the account is completely ban. Course you give a cooldown time where the strikes have a chance to fall off, because accedents do happen.

As for the trains of bots that are mass murdering mobs, The only way to really address that is the have a GM show up in person to drop a Connection bomb and kick them all off line. (This would count as an Auto Log-off kick)

I know the real way to stop the bots dead in their tracks, but it's not legal, and I don't feel like going to prison and being labeled a global terrorist.

Ashenangel · May 2014

i agree level cap the world and put a cooldown on the delete char option but hopefully they will decide soon on how to deal with the bots course what they have been doing is not working all low levels are over run they need to to fix soon if not all they will have left is the bots and gold spammers

jbfroik · May 2014

I think that is the most ingenious thing i have ever read. I like your idea of the bot report that prompts the captcha to auto log them out. A button push is out of the question because that could easily be written into a macro with a pixel search but a captcha would mess them up. That is truly one of the best ideas I've seen to combat afked macroers. I think it would need to have a cooldown though other wise children will abuse this in pvp or other situations and troll spam this on folks who arent guilty.

Xnemesis · May 2014

jbfroik wrote: »

I think that is the most ingenious thing i have ever read. I like your idea of the bot report that prompts the captcha to auto log them out. A button push is out of the question because that could easily be written into a macro with a pixel search but a captcha would mess them up. That is truly one of the best ideas I've seen to combat afked macroers. I think it would need to have a cooldown though other wise children will abuse this in pvp or other situations and troll spam this on folks who arent guilty.

Just disable it in PVP. Also Bots in PVP are just free kills lol

Gigglesnort · May 2014

They could also make a self generating random code that pops up from a letter laying on the ground next to a door that you have to enter into the panel on the door in order to exit, without this code you are unable to leave the starting area, maybe instead of talking to someone at the cell door to let you out you have to search the room for this letter and use the code to get out of the stating cell. Not sure how this could be programmed, but if they can't get out of the cell, they can't kill anything.

BlutoNY · May 2014

Here is the best way. Put the game on the cloud this way no one but the company has access to the code. Without access to the code you can't create bot scripts. And for all you fans of add-ons put out a SDK. Make it so that any add-ons need to go through a team for approval. I sure they already do this but with an SDK its just an additional screening process to catch malicious scripts. Another perk of having the game on the cloud is it makes it near impossible to cheat in PVP. Like i stated earlier since you wouldn't have the game downloaded on your hard drive you wouldn't be able to manipulate the game code and add some sort of hacking script.

Mescalamba · May 2014

You guys have some good ideas, some bit too crazy to implement.

If they created something like Warden (WoW anti-hack software) it would most likely solve everything.

What I kinda dont get is why they didnt learn from industry leaders.. Someone already made those mistakes, why repeat them?

Toorlokviing · May 2014

what im wondering is what code zos is using...because apparently bots are able to manipulate this code fairly easily...bot arent farming nodes as much anymore so that a plus...but it annoys me to hell when i see them teleporting or move through graphics like there is no clipping at all. its not the fact that they farm nodes and kill mobs thats annoying me to no end...its the fact that they are cheating to do it. and yes i aggree with op...zos needs an anti-hack software similar to what blizz has...but getting information like that from bllizz would be impoosible as blizz does not like competitors.

Mescalamba · May 2014

Toorlokviing wrote: »

what im wondering is what code zos is using...because apparently bots are able to manipulate this code fairly easily...bot arent farming nodes as much anymore so that a plus...but it annoys me to hell when i see them teleporting or move through graphics like there is no clipping at all. its not the fact that they farm nodes and kill mobs thats annoying me to no end...its the fact that they are cheating to do it. and yes i aggree with op...zos needs an anti-hack software similar to what blizz has...but getting information like that from bllizz would be impoosible as blizz does not like competitors.

Blizzard has Warden, which, well "hacks you". Its sorta anti-hack hack.

Not great to be watched, but unlike in reality, Im willing to allow them to do it.

Issue with TESO is, that too much things are player (user) based and very few are server sided. So you simply alter your client side and server accepts. Thats how you "hack".

s2firestar · May 2014

A simple way to hinder motif & item farmers in cities would be to implement the good old Morrowind - Oblivion - Skyrim theme:

Lock EVERY door, and EVERY wardrobe, pantry, whatever. With the increased frequency of lockpicks, this should not be a problem :P also, I personally like lockpicking - but that hardly matters. The main point is that this would make both bots and players fight for their stuff (and annoyed as hell, which is always good for my Thalmor blood :P).

Moreover, you should introduce a lockpicking skill line. You know. Something that hinders picking higher level locks or it is zone specific... take your shot. One could easily imagine that they use different locks and picks in different regions. OR you could trap the locks like in Morrowind. If you mess up lockpicking, you get fried. Seriously. This would give a real thrill to it. And when you advance to lockpicking 50, you can decrease the frequency or dmg of these traps.

As for cloud based game... I'm sharply against it. I have a *** net connection for most of the time, and based on my extensive World of Tanks history, I KNOW that this would be the death of it.

For the captchca... yes. In PVP, it would have to be disabled, but in PVE... it would be rather good. Also, if one sends too many reports, then one would be punished for it. You know, the guy who cried wolf. Either with temporary ban or taking away the report button. I doubt that 'smartass kids' would be playing with this, because the game & subscription is not cheap, and if one has to pay for it himself, than one will not ruin the game for him/herself. If one's father/mother pays for it, then one will obtain a serious spanking if one gets banned...

On starter islands - I agree. F whiners, right in the A. I know they have also payed for the game, but for all intents and purposes, this would be a good bot fishing net, and also, it's just part of the game. That easy.

Finally and most importantly:

BAN every account that is involved in illegal trading - not just the one who offers, but the one who accepts it too. That is, if one pays with real money for these mmowin & other types and there is evidence that such transaction have happened, BAN the account forever (forcing the player to buy the game anew, etc.). By removing demand for such things, it will not be profitable for the bot farmers to maintain accounts (which can be maintained from the money gained from such transactions, but can become very expensive, when the money source dries up). Because let's be honest - if there would not be any market, the botters would be much less frequent. As long, however, as there are players who want to go the 'easiest' way (seriously tough, obtaining gold in this game legally doesn't get much easier...), there will be *** who ruin our gametime.

s2firestar · May 2014

Oh btw. sorry for my foul language. Please, do feel free to insert ****-s where it would be appropriate.

s2firestar · May 2014

And as a last suggestion:

I do know, that these *** use special characters and extensive spacing so that their letters are not readily recognisable by programs. But you guys should give us the ability to report with their mail attached and create a dedicated category for gold spammers. I don't think that they modify their letters that much during a day. You collect a few of them letters, check for anybody who sends said letters, whether reported or not, and after 6-12-24 hours, ban EVERY account that has been detected sending them, removing their subscription. If their accounts get banned in a streamlined fashion, it might become quite expensive to buy the game every time. Also, if it would be traceable that where the sub money comes from (specific card no. etc.), said channels could be disabled somehow and no subs could be made if one is lost. They can't get *every* card number in the world, can they? Just make it tiresome to do this and they will get back to other games. Honest players don't mind fooling around a bit more if it means honest gameplay. Or do we?

Cogo · May 2014

Good suggestions.

But still the 2 best ways to stop bots its to report them and never, ever, ever buy gold.

Mescalamba · May 2014

I like that lockpicking idea a lot.

Thing is, it would need to be server sided and quite a bit complex.. Cause current issue n1 is that very much things is client sided and there is no Warden to guard client side. Thats how bots teleport and such..